Lot 6
and Dalton 9 thread dials.?
?
Dalton
used the same dial body shaft with face as well as the mounting bolt on?
all models of Dalton lathes.? What was different was the gear.? Lot 6
and Dalton 9 lathes have a 10 pitch lead screw and as such need to use a 40
tooth bear.? The body diameter of the gear is smaller than for the 12
pitch lead screw equipped lathes.? The tooth profile is the same and the
only difference is the flat on top of the gear tooth you see in the previous
post. The Lot 6 and Dalton 9 the flat is a bit narrower so that makes the cut
in the gear blank a bit deeper.? I need to do some looking in my picture
files (over 17,000) and see if I have pictures of Jim Bonners original Lot 6
thread dial.? Jim sent it up to me at one time so I could see what was
different.? At the time Ratshooter and me decided to make thread dials
there were only a couple of Lot 6 lathes known of and Jims was the only one
with an original thread dial.? We count a lot more Lot 6 machines and some
Dalton 9 lathes now but to my knowledge Jims Lot 6 has the only original thread
dial for that size lathe.? I do know that there is a slight modification
to the body as the smaller gear diameter moves the body closer to the lead
screw and as such it has to be modified to clear the lead screw.? Other
than the gear and the modification to the body it’s the same thread dial.?
I have two Dalton 9 lathes and a few parts left to a third but I do not have a
thread dial.?
?
I may
decide to part out the 54 inch long Dalton 9 that I got in Pennsylvania back in
08 when the wife and me made a road trip all the way to NY.? Ha on that
trip I delivered two restored South Bend 9 inch lathes do good friends.?
One in Cincinnati that went to Andy Sargent the man that started the Dalton
group on the internet.? Andy’s lathe was the second Dalton I found after
the first one I have was given to me in 1998 and I found Andy’s in 2000.?
The second lathe went to Dave Kirk also a Dalton owner who traveled all over
the North East picking up lathes I got off eBay and crated and ship them to me
including one go KartJ? So did Andy for that matter.? The long bed Dalton 9
is not complete and is just the basic lathe no accessories. Seems they went to
the scrapper before a young man saved the lathe from a similar fate. I really
have no idea of its condition but know there are no damaged gear teeth in the
head stock though the back gear guards got damaged by the way the lathe was
handled after I purchased it.? I need the upper end gear guard for my 36
inch Dalton 9 but other than that it’s all there.? I also have a very nice
Dalton 9 tail stock head stock as well as a cast iron cabinet for a 48 inch
lathe.? Again it’s not all there as one cabinet door is missing and two of
the drawers are missing? Would be a good project for someone to finish
it.? Most of it has been glass bead blasted and is in 60% semi gloss black
powder coat.? So anyone interested it any of these parts let me know.
?
Well
enough for now.? Dennis
?
?
This
is most interesting.? What I find so interesting is the thread dial looks
very close to the Dalton one in design.?? Meany thread dials use a
straight cut gear and angle the body or the vertical gear and face plate
shaft.? I don’t think my gear is any different other than the shape of the
gear tooth itself.? What Dalton did and I did also was use a 60 degree
included angle cutter much like a woodruff keyway cutter.? In the case of
the thread dial gear that engages the lead screw a gear tooth profile is not
important at all.? I have seen one a guy made by using only small diameter
pins to make the teeth.? What is important is the width of the gear
face.? Remember your Lot 5 lathes have a keyway that must be bridged by
the width of the tooth.? Lot 2 3 and 4 I have seen were a guy used a clock
gear that was made of brass and was very thin.? So on these three early
models the width of the gear is not important at all.
?
In
the case of this Grizzly thread dial I am going to guess that the angle of the gear
shaft is such that the body takes care of the angle and as such would be
mounted on a horizontal pin attached to the apron.? I would really like to
see one of these to see if it can be used on the Dalton apron.? For sure
the gear can and the vertical shaft and dial? face also.? Not
historically correct but if it functions correctly and you want to cut threads
on your Dalton this would work.? As stated only the mounting to the apron
would be the question.? I think if the mounting is way off then a small
adapter plate could be made up.? Remember only the height of the mounting
bolt is important the distance from the mounting bolt to the lead screw is not
nearly as important and could have some variance and still work.?
?
Remember
that the angle of the thread lead on the lead screw is only a few degrees and
as such a straight tooth gear can be mounted were its horizontal to the lead
screw and still work just fine.? What is more important is the shape of
the gear tooth and that is what Dalton did and I did also as the Dalton and my
dial are mounted with the gear horizontal to the lead screw and the tooth shape
takes care of the angle.
?
Including
a short video if it will go as its 3MB and maybe to big a file.? Also a
picture of an original thread dial with gear and the ones we made.
?
On
last thing Dan I have a bunch of pictures showing the process of machining the
body blank after it came off the CNC lathe.? Also a number of pictures
showing how Ratshooter made the really trick setup in his BP mill to scribe the
witness lines as we as how he held the number punch so accurately.? All
very simple setups and could be done in a drill press or a mill drill
machine.? If you would like to include these in the file section I can
send them to you-----if my email would work Grrrrrrr? Need to do a test
and see if I can get an email to you Dan as I can’t to Glen.
?
Dennis
?
?
I
don't? know if this info is useful, but I'll put it out there.
The Grizzly 602 lathe has a 12tpi lead screw if my research is accurate.?
They also offer a thread dial.? To be clear, this is not a direct fit and
may not even be useable.
That said, while you can buy the whole assembly for $116, you can also buy the
individual parts for less and I think many of them have the potential to lend
themselves to building a Dalton thread dial.
Here's the parts page:?
The pic labelled "Apron" has a rough drawing of the thread dial.
P0602027 is the gear.? It's a 48 tooth.? ?I ordered one just for
giggles since it was cheap.? It looks like it would kinda sorta work,
although probably not worth the effort as long as you can get gears from
Dennis.? Sorry my pics are awful.??
You can see on the second picture, it doesn't align perfectly perpendicular to
my lead screw, but it seems to mesh reasonably well if you were to angle the
shaft slightly from vertical.
I'm sure Dennis' gears are a way better match and as long as he makes them
available, that's definitely the way to go.??
But the reason for posting is, if you were building a thread dial from scratch,
even with Dennis' gear, some of the other bits Grizzly offers might be
useful.? I doubt the housing they sell will work without significant
modification.? But it still may be easier than building something from
scratch.? Likewise the shaft may work, the dial itself, the little arrow
might be useful to have.? Might be some cheap shortcuts there that are an
alternative to building the whole thing from scratch.? For me, I could
probably build the mechanism, (other than the gear), but I don't have a way to
etch the dial easily, so that dial would be a nice shortcut.
Also possible there may be other parts from other lathes that may fit
better? I don't know a lot about Grizzly's product lines but it appears
their parts are generally reasonably priced and the gear came in a couple days,
which these days is pretty remarkable.? They may be a source of other
parts that can be modified to fit Daltons.
Just food for thought...
Dennis Turk
