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Re: Oldest Dalton has been found.


 

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John

Send me an e-mail as I am also is southeastern CT so we can get off this thread

ronaldpeeler@...



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of guy.gloor chesilton.com <guy.gloor@...>
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2021 10:38 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [DaltonLathes] Oldest Dalton has been found.
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I think 2 threads are confused here.

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I am Guy Gloor, I was not the one who asked if you were in CT.? I am the person with Lot 2 No. 5.

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Guy

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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of John Hinton via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2021 10:33 AM
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [DaltonLathes] Oldest Dalton has been found.

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Hey Guy,

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Your email comes up as 'Ron Peeler'. You go by Guy then?

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JH

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On Wednesday, January 6, 2021, 10:30:29 AM EST, John Hinton via groups.io <johnhinton66@...> wrote:

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Yes Ron, I'm in southeastern CT.

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On Wednesday, January 6, 2021, 10:25:03 AM EST, Ron Peeler <ronaldpeeler@...> wrote:

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Hi John

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Are you in Connecticut?


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of John Hinton via groups.io <johnhinton66@...>
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2021 9:51 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>; [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [DaltonLathes] Oldest Dalton has been found.

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All,

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I'm so glad to see these historical machines resurfacing! Ron, I totally agree with your plan to restore the machine. I recently completed a restore on an early Lot 4 with both the intent of preservation and hobby use. I also volunteer for the Mystic Seaport Museum restoring / documenting early boats, ships and machinery. I have a suggestion on a museum we might reach out to as a group in an effort to see some of the

Dalton history preserved is in VT. The American Precision Museum has an amazing collection of early machines and tools, housed in a historic mill. Horace Smith was an apprentice here. Have a look and see what you think.

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Respectfully,

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John Hinton

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On Tuesday, January 5, 2021, 11:49:12 AM EST, Dennis Turk <dennis.turk2@...> wrote:

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One other thing Ron that I find odd in your grandfathers Dalton.? The half nut is controlled by a large round knob rather than a lever that we see on all other Daltons.? Also notice you have the same spindle bearing oil cups that serial number 4 has and these are not what we see on later Daltons. I also see that the right side back gear guard has been damaged at some time and it has an odd way of securing it at the lower front of the head stock casting.? I see a hole in the guard casting and wonder if at one time the guard was moved so it did? not rub on the back gear or the cone pulley.? Have seen Daltons were the guard had to be moved before.? I find one other odd feature on your lathe Ron and that is the front bed way back by the tail stock.? It looks like the underside of the front bed way has been relieved just past the gear rack.? Never seen this before.? There is anti lift shoes under the saddle on both sides and the one on the right side would become ineffective once the saddle moves to the extrema right end of the bed.? Also the spring clip that holds the end door closed we do not see on other early Lot 2 lathes but do on later Lot 3 a nd 4 lathes? One thing I will caution you about Ron is both ends of the bed were the threading lead screw mount bushings are bolted on are very fragile and have seen any number of these broken usually from a fall.? Love this lathe:-))))

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Dennis

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On Tuesday, January 5, 2021, 08:34:56 AM PST, Dennis Turk <dennis.turk2@...> wrote:

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This is so odd that the two oldest Daltons show up about the same time.? I got my first one in 1998 and it took me to 2001 to find a second one that one being Andy Sargent of Cincinnati.? Your lathe is also the most complete Lot 2 we have seen.? Yours is the very first one to have its original compound slide in tack and functional.? The compound slide on the Lot 2 was a real weak point and your lathe is a testament to being carefully used in the past as they were damaged so easily.? Speaks well of your Grandfather. There is however a bit of a puzzle.? Your end door.? This is not like any of the end doors seen on the Lot 25 and my lot 36 as well as a later lot 2 parts lathe I have.? Actually we have seen three different end doors on the Lot 2 lathes.? Your end door more resembles the end door on the Lot 3 and 4 lathes though smaller. Most Lot 2 lathes we have seen the end door is rounded at the bottom some fully enclosed some with a bit of an opening at the bottom.? Looks like they were really looking for the correct look of the end door at this time.

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As to the disposition of the lathe Ron that's up to you.? The Lot 2 I have is a bit more complete though modified by having a Atlas six inch lathe cross slide and compound slide installed on the saddle. We have seen South Bend and Atlas cross slide and compound slides installed on Daltons in the past.? Its a shame we don't have a place to show this old history.? I have a number of machines of historical significance but the only place I know of is the Heritage museum in NJ I think.? I have several lathes built before the Civil war and I really feel these need to be saved and displayed some were. Thanks you for the great description of your grandfathers lathe Ron.? Its not often we have such complete history.? I have one that I got from the son of the original purchaser and one that I know were it was purchased but not who purchased it.? These two lathes are both Lot 6 models.? One from NY and one from Washington state.? One built in 1917 and one built in 1929.

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Dennis

On Tuesday, January 5, 2021, 06:41:25 AM PST, guy.gloor chesilton.com <guy.gloor@...> wrote:

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Dear Dennis,

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If the lathe you saw is the oldest Dalton known, then I have the second oldest: Lot 2 serial number 5.? Like the one you describe it has the serial number stamped on the front bed way.? The photo is a few years old and taken just after it was removed from my father¡¯s basement prior to the sale of his house, so the lathe is a bit dusty.? I have cleaned it up a bit and can provide better pictures if you wish.

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I know quite a bit about the history of this lathe.? While I do not know the original owner, I do know that it was acquired sometime before 1930 by my Grandfather, Adolf G. (Gus) Frauenpreis of Elizabeth, and later Wyckoff NJ.? Mr. Frauenpreis was born in Stuttgart Germany, where he apprenticed as a tool and die maker.? In 1920 he came to America to pursue a career in the aviation industry.? In the 1920s he built and flew planes, gave flying lessons, worked as a machinist, and built an airfield in Clark, NJ on a bit of land which is now exit 135 of the Garden State Parkway.? From about 1931 to 1965 he worked as a machinist for Wright Aircraft in Fair Lawn NJ.? As a child (1960s) I spent a great deal of time at my grandfather¡¯s home and he had a pretty well equipped shop in his basement.

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Upon my grandfather¡¯s death in 1979, his tools went to my father, Albert Gloor of Ringwood NJ.? Although my father was a civil engineer, his father owned Hawthorne manufacturing, a machine shop in Hawthorne, NJ.? Growing up in the shop my father as well had a high level of skill as a machinist.? After my father passed away in 2014 the family¡¯s collection of tools was handed to my brother and myself.

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The lathe did not see much use while my father owned it.? We occasionally would turn some parts, a few times a year.

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The lathe is complete, including all of the change gears.? As far as I can tell the cross slide, compound, end cover and tailstock are all original, and appear to have the original finish.? The headstock bearings are excellent.? The ways are in pretty good shape, although I have not done any careful measurement of the wear. ?The leadscrews are quite worn and the compound spindle has some damage.? The tailstock has had a crack welded.? The backgear has a single slightly chipped tooth, but otherwise the drivetrain is complete and works.? The chuck in the picture is a WWII vintage Atlas chuck; I do not have the original chuck.? I also do not have, nor do I ever recall seeing, the cast iron legs and chip pan which would have accompanied the original machine.? The countershaft and support bracket is clearly not original, having modern pillow blocks.

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My original intent was to restore this to working order and use it.? Having done some research however I see that this lathe is both too fragile and too historically significant to put into normal service. ?It really should be restored to its original condition and kept as a museum piece. ?I would be interested in hearing your advice as to what I should do with it.

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Best regards and happy New Year,

Guy

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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Dennis Turk via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2020 7:39 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [DaltonLathes] Oldest Dalton has been found.

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Hi guys.? On? one of the Face book? user groups a guy came up with some pictures of a Dalton.? Turns out its a Lot 2 serial number 4.? That makes it the oldest Dalton known? of.? Its a much modified lathe unfortunately.? Riser blocks have been put under the head stock and tail stock to make it a 9 inch lathe rather than the 6 inch it started out in life as.? It also has? a Lot 4 end door cross slide and compound slide.? Funny thing is its still in all its original finish.? I will try and steal pictures of Facebook and post them if I can.? Also the lathe is so early that its has its lot and serial number stamped on the front bed way not the rear and is also stamped Lot 1 so this makes it a lathe that started out as the very first ones built and then Dalton must have decided to call the combination machine Lot 1 and the first little 6 inch lathe Lot 2.? I would love to have gotten my hands on this little lathe unfortunately its in the hands of a rank beginner and he is only interested in making parts with it and has no intentions of restoring it or bringing it back to its original condition.?

Dennis

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