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Re: Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Stanley Valiulis
 

Thanks,? I’ll try it next weekend.?



Stanley Valiulis

Co-Founder Totesbabies.com

815-608-0884









From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "Alexander Botrie alexander488@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Friday, October 18, 2019 at 1:11 PM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit





Thanks Stan!



Fyi there is an error on the first page of the manual. You have to hit the red button 2 times in succession to enter midi program mode, once and hold to enter transpose mode.



Alex

On Oct 17, 2019, at 3:18 PM, Stanley Valiulis scvaliulis@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:



Thanks,

I’ll be home next weekend and will try it.

Stanley Valiulis

Co-Founder Totesbabies.com

815-608-0884

From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "Alexander Botrie alexander488@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Thursday, October 17, 2019 at 3:01 PM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Ok thanks Stan!

Here is a link for the manual if you don’t have a copy:



On Oct 17, 2019, at 10:55 AM, Stanley Valiulis scvaliulis@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:

Hi Alex,

I have the midi control in mine but never used it. I will try it and let you know what mine does. It will be about a week.

Stan

From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "alexander488@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 10:57 AM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Hello everyone,

I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80.. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not.. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down.. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?

Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Best regards,

Alex

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

 

开云体育

Thanks Stan!?

Fyi there is an error on the first page of the manual. You have to hit the red button 2 times in succession to enter midi program mode, once and hold to enter transpose mode.

Alex


On Oct 17, 2019, at 3:18 PM, Stanley Valiulis scvaliulis@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:

Thanks,

I’ll be home next weekend and will try it.??

Stanley Valiulis?

Co-Founder?

815-608-0884

From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "Alexander Botrie?alexander488@...?[yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Thursday, October 17, 2019 at 3:01 PM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Ok thanks Stan!?

Here is a link for the manual if you don’t have a copy:



On Oct 17, 2019, at 10:55 AM, Stanley Valiulis?scvaliulis@...?[yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:

Hi Alex,

I have the midi control in mine but never used it. I will try it and let you know what mine does. It will be about a week.??

Stan

From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "alexander488@...?[yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 10:57 AM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Hello everyone,

I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80.. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not.. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down.. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?

Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Best regards,

Alex

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Migrating the group

 

Thanks for the heads up. Would have been nice if Yahoo had notified me. I’ve only been the group owner for 15 years. Anyway, I’ve wanted to get this off of there for a long time to a better forum platform. I looked into it a few years ago but didn’t get too far.

I’ll have to look into alternatives including groups.io. Is anyone here interested in helping with this? Preferably someone with experience in forums? I’ll also have to see what my email/web hosting company (bluehost) has available these days.

David

On Oct 17, 2019, at 3:32 PM, Nigel Cruickshank nigelc@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:

?As some of you may know, as of December 14th Yahoo will delete any files or images uploaded or attached to the groups. Also, I believe they are moving to permanently end the Yahoo groups site from what I have read.

It would be heartbreaking to lose the valuable info on this group. It’s invaluable for owner based repairs, especially in the case of the CS80 where moving the unit is risky and most techs wouldn’t want to take the job of repair on anyhow.

It seems like 开云体育 might be worth looking into but we’ll need to do something for sure.


------------------------------------
Posted by: Nigel Cruickshank <nigelc@...>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links
Migrating the group

 

As some of you may know, as of December 14th Yahoo will delete any files or images uploaded or attached to the groups. Also, I believe they are moving to permanently end the Yahoo groups site from what I have read.

It would be heartbreaking to lose the valuable info on this group. It’s invaluable for owner based repairs, especially in the case of the CS80 where moving the unit is risky and most techs wouldn’t want to take the job of repair on anyhow.

It seems like 开云体育 might be worth looking into but we’ll need to do something for sure.
Re: Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Stanley Valiulis
 

Thanks,



I’ll be home next weekend and will try it.?



Stanley Valiulis

Co-Founder Totesbabies.com

815-608-0884









From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "Alexander Botrie alexander488@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Thursday, October 17, 2019 at 3:01 PM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: Re: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit





Ok thanks Stan!



Here is a link for the manual if you don’t have a copy:



On Oct 17, 2019, at 10:55 AM, Stanley Valiulis scvaliulis@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:





Hi Alex,



I have the midi control in mine but never used it. I will try it and let you know what mine does. It will be about a week.



Stan













From: <yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "alexander488@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To: <yamahacs80@...>
Date: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 10:57 AM
To: <yamahacs80@...>
Subject: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit





Hello everyone,



I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80.. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down.. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?



Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?



Any help would be greatly appreciated!



Best regards,



Alex









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

 

开云体育

Ok thanks Stan!?

Here is a link for the manual if you don’t have a copy:



On Oct 17, 2019, at 10:55 AM, Stanley Valiulis scvaliulis@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:


Hi Alex,

?

I have the midi control in mine but never used it.? I will try it and let you know what mine does.? It will be about a week.??

?

Stan

?

?

?

?

?

?

From:?<yamahacs80@...> on behalf of "alexander488@...?[yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...>
Reply-To:?<yamahacs80@...>
Date:?Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 10:57 AM
To:?<yamahacs80@...>
Subject:?[yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

?

??

Hello everyone,

?

I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80.. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down.. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?

?

Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?

?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

?

Best regards,

?

Alex
Re: Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

Stanley Valiulis
 

开云体育

Hi Alex,

?

I have the midi control in mine but never used it.? I will try it and let you know what mine does.? It will be about a week.?

?

Stan

?

?

?

?

?

?

From: on behalf of "alexander488@... [yamahacs80]"
Reply-To:
Date: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 10:57 AM
To:
Subject: [yamahacs80] Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

?

?

Hello everyone,

?

I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?

?

Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?

?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

?

Best regards,

?

Alex
Questions About Kenton Midi Kit

 

Hello everyone,


I recently had a Kenton Midi Kit installed into a CS80. It looks like something was not done correctly during the installation, since the mod and pitch wheels are not working. I have tried 2 different controllers; notes are being triggered, aftertouch and program changes work, but the wheels do not. It does not matter if the toggle switch is up or down. I have tried to reset the midi mode, which returns everything to the default settings, but no success. Has anyone else had a similar experience?


Also I am not sure if the red button is working properly. I spoke with Harry at Kenton, and when you enter midi program mode (by hitting the button 2 times in succession) there should be no sound being triggered in the CS80 when you play different keys on the controller, to assign different midi settings. But when I am in the midi program mode, the CS is still playing notes from the controller. The transpose mode does seem to be working. Harry was not 100% sure there should be no sound, since he did not have a CS80 in the shop. Can anyone tell me if I should here notes triggered from the CS while its in midi program mode?


Any help would be greatly appreciated!


Best regards,


Alex
Re: Roland vp330 mk2

 

Hi Federico,

No, Kent cancelled my trip this week as he’s ben too busy to finish all the things I needed from him to warrant a trip to him in Surrey, so we’ve pushed it over to next week.

As promised, I will contact you once I have the VP330 and have sorted out the pictures.

Thanks for the heads-up on the SH101 - I’m not looking to take one of these into stock at this time, but thanks for the offer.

All the best.

Richard
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK




Tel: +44 (0) 1189 472474
Mobile: +44 (0) 7986 470853
Skype: dickthedealer
FaceTime: richslawson@...

On 4 Oct 2019, at 10:19, Federico Perale <fedeperale@...> wrote:

Hi Richard
Any news? Did you get hold of the VP330?
I also wanted to check your interest for a partial part exchange with a mint Roland SH-101, red with matching grip. Pristine condition. M
Best
Federico

On 28 Sep 2019, at 08:21, RL Music (L) <rlmusic@...> wrote:

?Hi Federico,

I’m waiting on Kent to finish some other work for me (a Korg DV800) before going down to Surrey to make a larger collection from him, so I've not got hold of the VP330 as yet.

The plan is to have this with me next Thursday, so I’ll get some pictures sorted once I have it in my possession.

Sorry for the small delay, and thanks for your patience.

All the best.

Richard
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK <>
<unknown.gif>


Tel: +44 (0) 1189 472474
Mobile: +44 (0) 7986 470853
Skype: dickthedealer
FaceTime: richslawson@... <mailto:richslawson@...>




On 27 Sep 2019, at 20:33, Federico Perale <fedeperale@... <mailto:fedeperale@...>> wrote:

Hello Richard
I haven’t heard from you in a week.
do you have any updates/photos for me?
Best
Federico

On 20 Sep 2019, at 14:50, RL Music (L) <rlmusic@... <mailto:rlmusic@...>> wrote:

?Hi Federico,

Thanks for your calls/voicemail and email. I’m out and about today so not easy to reach, but email is best.

As I have yet to pick the VP330 Mk2 up from Kent and then sort out the pictures, I will just have you own as ‘first refusal’ for this as taking a deposit without you having seen it would’nt be right, but you have a ’notional' reserve in any case.

I’ll contact you as soon as the VP330 is back with me in Reading, and email you some pictures, but to answer your question about power; This VP330 is a EU220~240V. In addition, this has a Kenton MIDI kit fitted. :)

I’ll be back to you next week, and thanks again for your interest in this.

All the best.

Richard
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK <>
<unknown.gif>


Tel: +44 (0) 1189 472474
Mobile: +44 (0) 7986 470853
Skype: dickthedealer
FaceTime: richslawson@... <mailto:richslawson@...>




On 20 Sep 2019, at 13:03, Federico Perale <fedeperale@... <mailto:fedeperale@...>> wrote:

Hi Richard
Sure I’m going to pay a deposit ASAP please let me know how.

Best
Federico

On 20 Sep 2019, at 10:56, RL Music (L) <rlmusic@... <mailto:rlmusic@...>> wrote:

?
Hi Federico,

I’ve just had an email in from my Client about his VP330 - he has changed his mind again and now wants me to Broker it.

Sorry for the confusion, I certainly am a little confused, but the price is going to be ?2600 GBP

If this is of interest still then please get back to me by email as soon as you can as I can reserve it for you with a 20% deposit. If you want to go for this then I’d advise to move sooner than later, in case my Client changes his mind again.

The VP330 is currently at Kent’s place being serviced, so should be ready for me to collect from him within the next week. I’ll get some photo’s sorted out once I have it in my hands and back home with me in Reading.

All the best.

Richard
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK <>

On 19 Sep 2019, at 07:43, RL Music <richard@... <mailto:richard@...>> wrote:

Hi Federico,

I hope you are well.

Thanks for your call and email enquiry on the VP330.

Unfortunately, I had an email from my Client who owns the VP330 overnight and they have now decided to not sell it now, so I have withdrawn it, and removed the Facebook post.

It’s annoying when Clients suddenly change their minds like this as it wastes my time and the time of potential buyers like yourself, so apologies for this.

I don’t have any other VP330 in my radar, but if anything is likely to come into stock then I’ll be sure to drop you a line first.

All the best.

Richard
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK <>
<unknown.gif>


Tel: +44 (0) 1189 472474
Mobile: +44 (0) 7986 470853
Skype: dickthedealer
FaceTime: richslawson@... <mailto:richslawson@...>




On 18 Sep 2019, at 18:47, Federico Perale <fedeperale@... <mailto:fedeperale@...>> wrote:

Hi Richard I hope you are well.
I just left your voicemail I’m quite interested in yourVP330 mark 2. could you please let me know the price and give me half a day of option to buy it if possible. I will look forward to hearing back from you
thank you
Federico




Richard Lawson
Proprietor

WWW.RLMUSIC.CO.UK <>
<unknown.gif>


Tel: +44 (0) 1189 472474
Mobile: +44 (0) 7986 470853
Skype: dickthedealer
FaceTime: richslawson@... <mailto:richslawson@...>
MIDIBoard for sale near San Diego

 

开云体育

Hi all! Just wanted to give the group first chance at the MIDIBoard I'm selling. It seems to be all working. I checked velocity and aftertouch on every key. Case has a bunch of little dings - mostly on the wood sides. Also including a set of V3.0 ROMs I never had time to install.

Too big/heavy to ship so only for pickup in Vista, CA - north San Diego County - near LegoLand?:)


Photos (hope the link works!) ?


Contact me with questions / offers. ?I’ll give it a few days before I put it on eBay.

Thanks,

?David
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

Scott Rodriguez
 

So, nothing at all coming out of Pin 7 on the 00153's?


On Tue, Apr 9, 2019 at 3:10 AM pepeisnotadog@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:
?

Hi guys,


the review of the CS-80 -on behalf of a friend- is at a stop point.?
There are 4 (!!!) dead Yamaha IG00153 VCO chips .. I don't know the history of this precise model, it arrived in conditions that are not exactly optimal, something will have caused the death of these chips .. I know they are nowhere to be found, but if for some reason someone you sell someone i'm here.
Too bad for the huge work done previously, including capacitors, op-amp, 4000 cmos series etc...?You warned me that i would find some yamaha chips to replace, but the oscillators...what a pity!
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

[email protected]
 

Mark:

I was in a rush and for that voltage backward, apologies. I deleted that message and corrected my error below. Thanks for calling me out on that, the manual voltages are correct.

When calibrating, the Brilliance lever should be centered and the Resonance should be at maximum (pulled fully toward you). All related sliders (filter types, initial level etc) should be at 0 or fully low.

When setting up the HPF, the two LFP sliders next to it on the panel (cutoff and resonance) should be fully up. Conversley, when setting up the LPF, the two HPF sliders next to it should be fully down. When setting up either filter, resonance for that filter should be fully up.?

For HPF, the voltage at the FH terminal on the R6 board should be +4.0 VDC . Once you set this exactly , measure the voltage at the wiper terminal on the filter slider. You can now use the wiper voltage to measure when setting up each voice. Mine is 4.625 VDC at the wiper when 4.0 on the R6 board. Do the same thing for the 3.3 VDC setting at the FL terminal for the low pass filter slider. My LPF wiper measures 3.925 VDC.

For the HPF, I set up max amplitude at 7.6 V p-p per the CS-50 setup sheet, not 4.3 VDC as on the CS-80 setup sheet which I believe is incorrect. The 4.3 setting just doesn't give you enough resonance. There's a blog on the web that says 8.4 V p-p is correct, but I found that too high. 7.6 is nice, 4.3 is anemic. Read the signal using the oscilloscope at the CP7 terminal on the M card for HPF and at the CP8 terminal for the LPF.

It is very important to make sure the wiper voltage is set exactly when adjusting each voice. If your pot is dirty and jumps around, even a little, take the time to tear it down and clean it. You will never have a CS-80 with even sounding resonance between voices if you don't have the wiper voltage the same exactly for each one, shoot for ± 0.020 VDC.
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

[email protected]
 

When I wrote 'filter types' above I meant the filter envelope type sliders (IL, AL, A, D, R) should be fully down.

Also note that bobbins CP2 and CP7 on the M cards are the same thing (they are connected through the wire harness) likewise CP3 and CP8 are connected and carry the same signal.

You have to read either CP2 or CP7 when setting up the HPF. The manual says CP3, that is incorrect for the HPF, but is correct for the LPF.?

If you're trying to read levels at CP3 for the HPF, you're never get the right reading, it's a typo error in the manual.
Selling mine Yamaha CS80

[email protected]
 

I'm seeling my "almost working" CS80 from S?o Paulo, Brazil.?? U$15,000 plus shipping.



From the last technical guy who worked on it:
When I got this synth to restore, (restore is very different from "fix" and goes a lot further) it was almost totally dead, only one oscillator running, with presets totally altered by problems in logic circuits, etc. . I identified the defective oscillators, repaired them, identified the problem VCFs, noticed, changed ALL caps from ALL modules, ALL logic and operational chips, getting everything up and running. "

Bests!


Selling/Trading Mine (not working)

Murilo Faria
 

Hi, guys!
I wanna trade my CS80 for an ARP2600 plus one Juno 106 or similiar.
I'm from S?o Paulo, Brazil and the cost to sell U$15.000 (Plus Shipping). Please understeand that shipping from Brazil is quite a pain, but "doable".

From the last technical guy who worked on it:
When I got this synth to restore, (restore is very different from "fix" and goes a lot further) it was almost totally dead, only one oscillator running, with presets totally altered by problems in logic circuits, etc. . I identified the defective oscillators, repaired them, identified the problem VCFs, noticed, changed ALL caps from ALL modules, ALL logic and operational chips, getting everything up and running. "

Bests!
--
Murilo Faria (Mura)
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

 

开云体育

It’s not difficult to obtain an obscene amount of?ig00151 ICs cheaply, if you are willing to kill off certain electone organ models. At least one model also has the VCFs (but not many). A kind soul in Montreal pointed me to this solution via this list many years ago….

Whatever happened to Old Crow’s project where he was actually making new?replacement?ICs (or at least M boards) for the CS series? Does anyone know?

Also - I agree about not replacing things that do not need to be replaced. But are there any parts that are time bombs that could potentially take out huge sections of a CS? I have a CS that got blown up in a recording studio years ago. Something went wrong and some diodes in the PSU went and then took out a lot of ICs on my M-boards along with them. I have this synth working now, and it has all new caps in the PSU and some new diodes, but I’m nervous about what might do similar damage next time...

best,

DT
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

Scott Rodriguez
 

As a follow-on, I do understand the "don't fix it if it ain't broke" mentality, and have certainly gravitated more toward that position over the years, but in the case of the CS-80 it's a beast, and a beast I don't want to crack open any more than I have to. Toward that end, I wanted to make it as solid as possible so I took the position of all-new logic chips with decoupling sockets, all-new electrolytics and a total power supply rebuild. The only two 4000-series chips I couldn't source new were the (2) 4006 chips on the KBC boards, and even those now have late-80's chips with decoupling sockets. Haven't had a moment's problem with any of it, as hoped and expected.

Outside the copious M-board problems, I had a one bad HA1452 and a few bad 2SK30A's on the OE1 card (lots of bad crackling in the outputs). Also had lot's of bad violet Matsushita capacitors with corroded leads that were about to take a serious toll throughout the synth. I did a swap?due to corrosion?on (2) M-boards using spare CS-50 cards I had, but that was it.


Scott - synthRodriguez


On Wed, Jan 9, 2019 at 1:54 PM Scott Rodriguez <synthrodriguez@...> wrote:

>> In short, it’s a moral duty to bring it back to life.

Yes it is.

>> 1) start with power supply, replace old electrolytics cap. Are there any other parts that you recommend to change?

Because my unit was in the same situation, and because I couldn't find drop-in replacements, I removed and reformed the big electrolytics over a 4 day period and got them down to a leakage rate of 8 uA, better than many new ones. I wouldn't just fire them up after sitting so long, I'd reform the layer. I'd replace all the other electrolytics (use high ripple spec on the rectifiers and low impedance spec on the decouplers), the power transistors (the 4 big ones and the 6 little ones) and the two 4558 op amps.?


2) go to the five boards (KAS, SH, TKC and the two TSB) under the keyboard:

- replace all the electrolytics? ?Yes Go to 25 volt units instead of the 16 volt units installed, especially on the OE1, OE2, and PRA boards in the rack

- replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets) Yes, using the expensive sockets with built-in decoupling caps

- add decopuling cap for the IC (based on your experience is it better to buy “built-in sockets with caps” or solder the caps separately?)?As above, but the built-in socket type are for the 4000-series chips only.

?Given that I am still defining the plan, do you also recommend these operations (or just some of them) for these five boards?

- replace old op amp?Yes, for those items not in the audio signal chain, and any 4558's that are in the audio signal chain.

- replace old bjt? Do not do this. You risk losing the synth's character

- replace all the ceramic disc capacitor (with dipped ceramic) No need to do this unless they are physically damaged or have corrosion on the leads.

- replace all the "famous" tantalum capacitor (with polystyrene or polypropylene or aluminum electrolytics, same value obviously)? There's only one or two in the synth, but sure, replace those too. Use a heat sink on the leads when doing so to prevent loss of capacitance, tant's don't like heat.

- replace all the mylar capacitor with polypropylene or polystyrene Absolutely not, you risk losing character bit time, especially on the filters. Only replace if you have a bad one, and then try to find an old good one. Take my advice from experience.

- replace the few old trimmers That's a lot of work and expense, I'd only do it as required, not as a course of practice.

?Going to the boards behind the keyboard..

Regarding all M Boards:

-?????replace all the electrolytics? Yes. Use audio grade on the filters and in the signal path, low impedance for the large decouplers

-? ? ??replace all the old trimmers too? As above, only as required.


Regarding the two KBC Boards:

-??????????replace all the electrolytics? Yes.

-??????????replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets and decopuling cap for the IC (like the boards under the keys)?Yes to both. There is some decoupling on here already, but the additional ones at the chip can't hurt.

Of note:

?Be ready to find some dead ig00151 amplifiers on the M boards if you're not getting a signals. Mine (which was a basket case, admittedly) needed (45) ig00151 chips in the end. Yes, that's 45 chips, but that's not normal. Still, I had those along with one dead oscillator, one dead wsc, two dead filters, and one dead filter envelope chip. The only one on the M boards that didn't have a dead one was the amplifier envelope chips. You have to mentally either commit to owning a truly restored vintage CS80 including all the time and expense that entails, or give it to someone else that will. I made the decision to commit and have not regretted it once, quite the contrary, it's a stunningly beautiful instrument to play when hitting on all cylinders.

Also, be aware that the 151's can 'sort of' work, that is, they pass a signal, but are not controlling the envelopes properly or you can't get a full output level as you should. When everything is working properly, you should be able to calibrate the M boards per the manual. If you can 'almost' get a setting on a trimmer but run out of travel, something's wrong (and it could be the trimmer, have seen that too, there's a couple of failure modes for those).

There's a lot of errors in the manual. A major one of note I just spent a lot of time with is the VCA levels for the last two output chips on the M boards. The adjustment procedure calls out 400 mV and 80 mV respectively. That cannot possible be correct, you will have lots of 50/60 cycle hum in the output and a lot of noise in the OE effect section.

I tried several different combinations and settled on 900 mV and 250 mV pressing C4 with an 8 feet setting and a sine wave input and am happy with it. If you want a bit more bite and sizzle, the 900 mV can be increased a bit, maybe to 1200 mV. Over 1400 you will start getting some distortion on certain intense patches. I like a more mellow sound, and found the 900 mV setting to be a good compromise between output level, hum, and character.

I added led's on the M boards using the key trigger signal along with a regular diode and resistor. That mod was invaluable. I also added little hard point loops on the six main test points on the boards for grabbing them with a spring-loaded scope hook probe. WELL worth the effort.

Best of luck,

Scott

synthRodriguez


On Wed, Jan 9, 2019 at 5:55 AM pepeisnotadog@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:
?

Hi,


i have a CS-80 that needs a review. Unfortunately (not by me) has been left unused for a long time, 3 voices don’t work (and i hope they are not the Yamaha IC chips ..). In short, it’s a moral duty to bring it back to life.


My initial plan was this (but i ask you any advice):


1) start with power supply, replace old electrolytics cap. Are there any other parts that you recommend to change?

2) go to the five boards (KAS, SH, TKC and the two TSB) under the keyboard:

- replace all the electrolytics

- replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets)

- add decopuling cap for the IC (based on your experience is it better to buy “built-in sockets with caps” or solder the caps separately?)

?

Given that I am still defining the plan, do you also recommend these operations (or just some of them) for these five boards?

- replace old op amp

- replace old bjt

- replace all the ceramic disc capacitor (with dipped ceramic)

- replace all the "famous" tantalum capacitor (with polystyrene or polypropylene or aluminum electrolytics, same value obviously)

- replace all the mylar capacitor with polypropylene or polystyrene

- replace the few old trimmers

?

Going to the boards behind the keyboard..


Regarding all M Boards:

-?????r? replace all the electrolytics

-? ? ? ? ??replace all the old trimmers too?


Regarding the two KBC Boards:

-????????? replace all the electrolytics

-????????? replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets and decopuling cap for the IC (like the boards under the keys)

?

I definitely forgot something, but i'm slowly making a plan before start any work on this beautiful machine. Of course I will surely meet some unexpected events during the overhaul;)

Sorry if i was too wordy, but this group is the right place to talk about it!

?

Best (and thanks in advance for your cooperation)


Mark
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

Scott Rodriguez
 

>> In short, it’s a moral duty to bring it back to life.

Yes it is.

>> 1) start with power supply, replace old electrolytics cap. Are there any other parts that you recommend to change?

Because my unit was in the same situation, and because I couldn't find drop-in replacements, I removed and reformed the big electrolytics over a 4 day period and got them down to a leakage rate of 8 uA, better than many new ones. I wouldn't just fire them up after sitting so long, I'd reform the layer. I'd replace all the other electrolytics (use high ripple spec on the rectifiers and low impedance spec on the decouplers), the power transistors (the 4 big ones and the 6 little ones) and the two 4558 op amps.?


2) go to the five boards (KAS, SH, TKC and the two TSB) under the keyboard:

- replace all the electrolytics? ?Yes Go to 25 volt units instead of the 16 volt units installed, especially on the OE1, OE2, and PRA boards in the rack

- replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets) Yes, using the expensive sockets with built-in decoupling caps

- add decopuling cap for the IC (based on your experience is it better to buy “built-in sockets with caps” or solder the caps separately?)?As above, but the built-in socket type are for the 4000-series chips only.

?Given that I am still defining the plan, do you also recommend these operations (or just some of them) for these five boards?

- replace old op amp?Yes, for those items not in the audio signal chain, and any 4558's that are in the audio signal chain.

- replace old bjt? Do not do this. You risk losing the synth's character

- replace all the ceramic disc capacitor (with dipped ceramic) No need to do this unless they are physically damaged or have corrosion on the leads.

- replace all the "famous" tantalum capacitor (with polystyrene or polypropylene or aluminum electrolytics, same value obviously)? There's only one or two in the synth, but sure, replace those too. Use a heat sink on the leads when doing so to prevent loss of capacitance, tant's don't like heat.

- replace all the mylar capacitor with polypropylene or polystyrene Absolutely not, you risk losing character bit time, especially on the filters. Only replace if you have a bad one, and then try to find an old good one. Take my advice from experience.

- replace the few old trimmers That's a lot of work and expense, I'd only do it as required, not as a course of practice.

?Going to the boards behind the keyboard..

Regarding all M Boards:

-?????replace all the electrolytics? Yes. Use audio grade on the filters and in the signal path, low impedance for the large decouplers

-? ? ??replace all the old trimmers too? As above, only as required.


Regarding the two KBC Boards:

-??????????replace all the electrolytics? Yes.

-??????????replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets and decopuling cap for the IC (like the boards under the keys)?Yes to both. There is some decoupling on here already, but the additional ones at the chip can't hurt.

Of note:

?Be ready to find some dead ig00151 amplifiers on the M boards if you're not getting a signals. Mine (which was a basket case, admittedly) needed (45) ig00151 chips in the end. Yes, that's 45 chips, but that's not normal. Still, I had those along with one dead oscillator, one dead wsc, two dead filters, and one dead filter envelope chip. The only one on the M boards that didn't have a dead one was the amplifier envelope chips. You have to mentally either commit to owning a truly restored vintage CS80 including all the time and expense that entails, or give it to someone else that will. I made the decision to commit and have not regretted it once, quite the contrary, it's a stunningly beautiful instrument to play when hitting on all cylinders.

Also, be aware that the 151's can 'sort of' work, that is, they pass a signal, but are not controlling the envelopes properly or you can't get a full output level as you should. When everything is working properly, you should be able to calibrate the M boards per the manual. If you can 'almost' get a setting on a trimmer but run out of travel, something's wrong (and it could be the trimmer, have seen that too, there's a couple of failure modes for those).

There's a lot of errors in the manual. A major one of note I just spent a lot of time with is the VCA levels for the last two output chips on the M boards. The adjustment procedure calls out 400 mV and 80 mV respectively. That cannot possible be correct, you will have lots of 50/60 cycle hum in the output and a lot of noise in the OE effect section.

I tried several different combinations and settled on 900 mV and 250 mV pressing C4 with an 8 feet setting and a sine wave input and am happy with it. If you want a bit more bite and sizzle, the 900 mV can be increased a bit, maybe to 1200 mV. Over 1400 you will start getting some distortion on certain intense patches. I like a more mellow sound, and found the 900 mV setting to be a good compromise between output level, hum, and character.

I added led's on the M boards using the key trigger signal along with a regular diode and resistor. That mod was invaluable. I also added little hard point loops on the six main test points on the boards for grabbing them with a spring-loaded scope hook probe. WELL worth the effort.

Best of luck,

Scott

synthRodriguez


On Wed, Jan 9, 2019 at 5:55 AM pepeisnotadog@... [yamahacs80] <yamahacs80@...> wrote:
?

Hi,


i have a CS-80 that needs a review. Unfortunately (not by me) has been left unused for a long time, 3 voices don’t work (and i hope they are not the Yamaha IC chips ..). In short, it’s a moral duty to bring it back to life.


My initial plan was this (but i ask you any advice):


1) start with power supply, replace old electrolytics cap. Are there any other parts that you recommend to change?

2) go to the five boards (KAS, SH, TKC and the two TSB) under the keyboard:

- replace all the electrolytics

- replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets)

- add decopuling cap for the IC (based on your experience is it better to buy “built-in sockets with caps” or solder the caps separately?)

?

Given that I am still defining the plan, do you also recommend these operations (or just some of them) for these five boards?

- replace old op amp

- replace old bjt

- replace all the ceramic disc capacitor (with dipped ceramic)

- replace all the "famous" tantalum capacitor (with polystyrene or polypropylene or aluminum electrolytics, same value obviously)

- replace all the mylar capacitor with polypropylene or polystyrene

- replace the few old trimmers

?

Going to the boards behind the keyboard..


Regarding all M Boards:

-?????r? replace all the electrolytics

-? ? ? ? ??replace all the old trimmers too?


Regarding the two KBC Boards:

-????????? replace all the electrolytics

-????????? replace all the CMOS (maybe installing new sockets and decopuling cap for the IC (like the boards under the keys)

?

I definitely forgot something, but i'm slowly making a plan before start any work on this beautiful machine. Of course I will surely meet some unexpected events during the overhaul;)

Sorry if i was too wordy, but this group is the right place to talk about it!

?

Best (and thanks in advance for your cooperation)


Mark
Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

 

Well stated Florian!

On January 9, 2019 at 9:48 AM "Florian Anwander fanwander@... [yamahacs80]" <yamahacs80@...> wrote:


Hi

Am 09.01.2019 um 15:38 schrieb Kyle Jarger jkjelec@... [yamahacs80]:
>
My reasons are "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"
I'd like to I agree. But I understand that Mark wants a general
refurbishing too, to make the synth future-proof. Nevertheless he should
first fix all problems. The Refurbishing can be done after the problem
solvening, when he can be sure, that there are no issues.

The basic principle is here: don't change two things at the same time.
If you would do so, you will have serious troubles to find which of the
changes caused a problem. As a concrete example: if you have ripple on a
supply voltage, the don't do a complete recapping. Just replace the
faulty capacitor and check whether the ripple disappeard. After that you
may do a complete recapping.

Florian

--




------------------------------------
Posted by: Florian Anwander <fanwander@...>
------------------------------------


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Re: CS-80: make a plan for a servicing

 

Hi

Am 09.01.2019 um 15:38 schrieb Kyle Jarger jkjelec@... [yamahacs80]:

My reasons are "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"
I'd like to I agree. But I understand that Mark wants a general refurbishing too, to make the synth future-proof. Nevertheless he should first fix all problems. The Refurbishing can be done after the problem solvening, when he can be sure, that there are no issues.

The basic principle is here: don't change two things at the same time. If you would do so, you will have serious troubles to find which of the changes caused a problem. As a concrete example: if you have ripple on a supply voltage, the don't do a complete recapping. Just replace the faulty capacitor and check whether the ripple disappeard. After that you may do a complete recapping.

Florian

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