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Good morning,
When I was asking earlier about Moab SOTA recommendations, Dean K2JB made mention of making sure to take a self-supporting mast as the park officials don't want you attaching things to the parks.
In Colorado, I either? A) Use my KH1 B) Use this:?? ? ?to hold up my SOTAbeams Carbon 6 by attaching it to a branch or something C) Throw the wire on the ground and not worry about it
I've really never had any issues just tossing the antenna on the ground, with the very poor conductivity of our rocky mountains, I don't think it's negatively?affected things much.? ?But I was curious... do any of you use a self-supporting stand of some sort to hold a mast without tying it to something natural on the hill? If so, what do you use?
Thanks for sharing! 73 James KI0KN
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Hi James,
I have been using my Sotabeams 4.1 meter telescopic mast for years.? It extends to about 13', and collapses to 20" which carries nicely?inside of my backpack.? A lot of guys use longer masts, but I traded off size, weight, and cost for a smaller version - which I have been successful?(and happy) with.? Usually I can tie it to a tree branch, or similar, or cram the bottom into a 'hole' on a rocky summit, but that sounds like it might not be an option for you in Moab.
While I don't have a self-supporting stand, there have been times I had to guy my mast where there were no trees or suitable rocks nearby.? For times like that I sometimes use paracord?with friction knots to make guys, and I'll tie them off in three directions to those thin, lightweight aluminum tent stakes pushed into the ground when necessary (if not TOO rocky) - sometimes tying?off to rocks works on the rocky summits...you know the deal.??
As my mast is not that tall or heavy, it can also be propped against something and I can weight down the bottom with a rock in a pinch.? I recall one time doing that by propping it against my backpack sitting on the ground.? The tip of the mast wasn't?very high, but if you're already on a summit.....good enough.? Also, nobody says you HAVE to extend the mast fully....
I'm not necessarily advocating for low antennas - I'm just saying that this is what I typically use - as you know, sometimes you have to get creative.
Good luck in Moab, James - I hope to work you.? Maybe you can email a pic of your setup after your successful activation!
73,
Dave, N0DET?
On Thu, Feb 27, 2025 at 8:24?AM James KI0KN via <james.m.cizek= [email protected]> wrote: Good morning,
When I was asking earlier about Moab SOTA recommendations, Dean K2JB made mention of making sure to take a self-supporting mast as the park officials don't want you attaching things to the parks.
In Colorado, I either? A) Use my KH1 B) Use this:?? ? ?to hold up my SOTAbeams Carbon 6 by attaching it to a branch or something C) Throw the wire on the ground and not worry about it
I've really never had any issues just tossing the antenna on the ground, with the very poor conductivity of our rocky mountains, I don't think it's negatively?affected things much.? ?But I was curious... do any of you use a self-supporting stand of some sort to hold a mast without tying it to something natural on the hill? If so, what do you use?
Thanks for sharing! 73 James KI0KN
|
James,
If you set up as an inverted V there are two guy wires right there. Now this presumes you've anchored the far end to something, and the near end to something heavier than your radio.
All you need now is a third guy which can be tied to your pack set off to one side. Or you can use your pack as a pile of rocks and erect the mast in or through the pack as a base.
?
Another option is a vertical whip. Either a Wolf River Coil or Elecraft's AX1, both of which have tripod mounts. I've had great success with both those verticals, they just require you to get up off your lazy boy rock to change bands.
--
JIm Stinson
N0IPA
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I am ashamed to say?I never thought of using my pack as a support :)? ?There are just so many rocks and trees in our mountains here there's never been a need really.? I have stuffed a hiking pole in the rocks and used it as a tie off, set the mast against a short pine tree, stuffed the mast in the rocks, laid the mast against a rock face, there are so many possibilities.
My normal antenna pretty much ends up being an inverted V because of its length.? I use a 20/30/40 trapped EFHW 99% of the time and with the Carbon6 mast, it's a pretty perfect Inverted V size.? ?I do have an AX1 and tripod as well, but I kinda quit using it much after I got the KH1 as it was just easier all around.
Thanks for the tips.? I am looking?forward to the trip and hopefully logging as many CO stations as possible.? Also looking forward to hooking up with N8XMD and
KF0JTT? while down there. Have a great weekend.
James KI0KN
James,
If you set up as an inverted V there are two guy wires right there. Now this presumes you've anchored the far end to something, and the near end to something heavier than your radio.
All you need now is a third guy which can be tied to your pack set off to one side. Or you can use your pack as a pile of rocks and erect the mast in or through the pack as a base.
?
Another option is a vertical whip. Either a Wolf River Coil or Elecraft's AX1, both of which have tripod mounts. I've had great success with both those verticals, they just require you to get up off your lazy boy rock to change bands.
--
JIm Stinson
N0IPA
|
James, you will have a hiking?partner, yes?? If so I'm sure they can assist as an antenna anchor/wire-holder-upper...some rubber gloves and rubber soled shoes, and you probably have an ATU that can adjust for any impedance mis-match.
Just a suggestion. :-)
sjc
On Fri, Feb 28, 2025 at 10:23?AM James KI0KN via <james.m.cizek= [email protected]> wrote: I am ashamed to say?I never thought of using my pack as a support :)? ?There are just so many rocks and trees in our mountains here there's never been a need really.? I have stuffed a hiking pole in the rocks and used it as a tie off, set the mast against a short pine tree, stuffed the mast in the rocks, laid the mast against a rock face, there are so many possibilities.
My normal antenna pretty much ends up being an inverted V because of its length.? I use a 20/30/40 trapped EFHW 99% of the time and with the Carbon6 mast, it's a pretty perfect Inverted V size.? ?I do have an AX1 and tripod as well, but I kinda quit using it much after I got the KH1 as it was just easier all around.
Thanks for the tips.? I am looking?forward to the trip and hopefully logging as many CO stations as possible.? Also looking forward to hooking up with N8XMD and
KF0JTT? while down there. Have a great weekend.
James KI0KN
James,
If you set up as an inverted V there are two guy wires right there. Now this presumes you've anchored the far end to something, and the near end to something heavier than your radio.
All you need now is a third guy which can be tied to your pack set off to one side. Or you can use your pack as a pile of rocks and erect the mast in or through the pack as a base.
?
Another option is a vertical whip. Either a Wolf River Coil or Elecraft's AX1, both of which have tripod mounts. I've had great success with both those verticals, they just require you to get up off your lazy boy rock to change bands.
--
JIm Stinson
N0IPA
|
I have always used a 20ft telescopic got off Ebay.collapses to 16 in . Have a couple.? Cheap, quality carbon. Collapses nicely for backpack. More than once the guy system has been between the knees or under the arm standing but usually better. Often holes in the rocks, and even my rg174 wrapped under a rock. Have done that with the rg174 off and on for over 300 activations (300 unique now) so lets not go on about how the rg174 cant take it. ? its still fine. I am the crowd oddball, never a efhw, always a 20 m dipole. Cap W0CCA
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Hang on Steve,? I'll go tell my wife you suggested I use her as a tripod and see how that goes... I'll get back to you shortly. :)
J/K, but honestly, that's a valid idea!? Probably could leave my pack on and stuff the mast between me and it and hold it up myself.
James
James, you will have a hiking?partner, yes?? If so I'm sure they can assist as an antenna anchor/wire-holder-upper...some rubber gloves and rubber soled shoes, and you probably have an ATU that can adjust for any impedance mis-match.
Just a suggestion. :-)
sjc
On Fri, Feb 28, 2025 at 10:23?AM James KI0KN via <james.m.cizek= [email protected]> wrote: I am ashamed to say?I never thought of using my pack as a support :)? ?There are just so many rocks and trees in our mountains here there's never been a need really.? I have stuffed a hiking pole in the rocks and used it as a tie off, set the mast against a short pine tree, stuffed the mast in the rocks, laid the mast against a rock face, there are so many possibilities.
My normal antenna pretty much ends up being an inverted V because of its length.? I use a 20/30/40 trapped EFHW 99% of the time and with the Carbon6 mast, it's a pretty perfect Inverted V size.? ?I do have an AX1 and tripod as well, but I kinda quit using it much after I got the KH1 as it was just easier all around.
Thanks for the tips.? I am looking?forward to the trip and hopefully logging as many CO stations as possible.? Also looking forward to hooking up with N8XMD and
KF0JTT? while down there. Have a great weekend.
James KI0KN
James,
If you set up as an inverted V there are two guy wires right there. Now this presumes you've anchored the far end to something, and the near end to something heavier than your radio.
All you need now is a third guy which can be tied to your pack set off to one side. Or you can use your pack as a pile of rocks and erect the mast in or through the pack as a base.
?
Another option is a vertical whip. Either a Wolf River Coil or Elecraft's AX1, both of which have tripod mounts. I've had great success with both those verticals, they just require you to get up off your lazy boy rock to change bands.
--
JIm Stinson
N0IPA
|
My wife actually has been the support a few times in rough wind etc. I bet all of you a few times
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All,
?
On alpine peaks above the trees, or elsewhere when needed, I guy a telescoping mast with dacron cord about 1/10 to 1/8" in diameter.? Often only two lines are needed, with the antenna being the third - depends on the wind and what's on the peak.? Sometimes 3 are needed to make sure.? Usually you can start with 2 lines.? It's an art to get it up in the wind.? ??
?
I tie the cords to rocks.? Rocks the right size can be moved for adjustment.?
?
My secret is to wrap a thick rubber band around the part of the mast where the guy cords will be.? Usually this is 5 or 6 feet above ground.? The cords are tied above the rubber band, so they don't slip down.? It's best to put the rubber band on the correct pole section before extending all the sections!
?
Other gadgets can be used to control where the cords belong.? Some people use a ring of plastic or rubber, with a hole in the middle, to fit on the tapered mast at the right level.?
?
I've had masts held this way in high winds - they sometimes gyrate wildly, whistle, groan, but usually manage to stay up, as long as the pole doesn't collapse onto itself.? It helps to sit next to it in case something goes wrong...
?
73? ? ? ? ? ? ?
On 02/27/2025 8:24 AM MST James KI0KN via groups.io <james.m.cizek@...> wrote:
?
?
Good morning,
?
When I was asking earlier about Moab SOTA recommendations, Dean K2JB made mention of making sure to take a self-supporting mast as the park officials don't want you attaching things to the parks.
?
In Colorado, I either?
A) Use my KH1
B) Use this:?? ? ?to hold up my SOTAbeams Carbon 6 by attaching it to a branch or something
C) Throw the wire on the ground and not worry about it
?
I've really never had any issues just tossing the antenna on the ground, with the very poor conductivity of our rocky mountains, I don't think it's negatively?affected things much.? ?But I was curious... do any of you use a self-supporting stand of some sort to hold a mast without tying it to something natural on the hill?
If so, what do you use?
?
Thanks for sharing!
73
James
KI0KN
|
The guying system I’ve made is simple… but it works!? I’ve attached a picture of it.? It’s three D-rings, held around the mast/pole by a strip of Velcro, with bright yellow cords to the ground.? For a telescoping mast, I position it just above one of the mast sections, so the lower section prevents it from slipping down.? One nice thing about using the Velcro is that I can use it on different sized masts or even a painters extension pole I sometimes use to hold up a 6m Moxon.? At the ground, I either use tent stakes or rocks, like Carey described.? The hi-vis, yellow cord, has proven to be a good idea.? And I use two half hitch knots (the same knots used to guy a tent) so that I can tighten up the guy lines.? I’ve never had it blow over.? Together, the tent stakes and guying system fit in a small zip-lock bag that I keep at the bottom of the external pocket of my pack. ? Hope that helps, ? Ray / KD8EQA ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Carey KX0R via groups.io
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2025 9:26 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [w0c-sota] Self-supported options?? On alpine peaks above the trees, or elsewhere when needed, I guy a telescoping mast with dacron cord about 1/10 to 1/8" in diameter.? Often only two lines are needed, with the antenna being the third - depends on the wind and what's on the peak.? Sometimes 3 are needed to make sure.? Usually you can start with 2 lines.? It's an art to get it up in the wind.? ?? I tie the cords to rocks.? Rocks the right size can be moved for adjustment.? My secret is to wrap a thick rubber band around the part of the mast where the guy cords will be.? Usually this is 5 or 6 feet above ground.? The cords are tied above the rubber band, so they don't slip down.? It's best to put the rubber band on the correct pole section before extending all the sections! Other gadgets can be used to control where the cords belong.? Some people use a ring of plastic or rubber, with a hole in the middle, to fit on the tapered mast at the right level.? I've had masts held this way in high winds - they sometimes gyrate wildly, whistle, groan, but usually manage to stay up, as long as the pole doesn't collapse onto itself.? It helps to sit next to it in case something goes wrong... On 02/27/2025 8:24 AM MST James KI0KN via groups.io <james.m.cizek@...> wrote: Good morning, When I was asking earlier about Moab SOTA recommendations, Dean K2JB made mention of making sure to take a self-supporting mast as the park officials don't want you attaching things to the parks. B) Use this:?? ? ?to hold up my SOTAbeams Carbon 6 by attaching it to a branch or something C) Throw the wire on the ground and not worry about it I've really never had any issues just tossing the antenna on the ground, with the very poor conductivity of our rocky mountains, I don't think it's negatively?affected things much.? ?But I was curious... do any of you use a self-supporting stand of some sort to hold a mast without tying it to something natural on the hill?
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Jim -?
Maybe you can go to Moab with James and just hold his antenna mast up for him - problem solved!? Heck, I'll volunteer to go - I can hold one end of?the Inverted Vee!
We only need one more person for the other end.....
Dave, N0DET
James,
If you set up as an inverted V there are two guy wires right there. Now this presumes you've anchored the far end to something, and the near end to something heavier than your radio.
All you need now is a third guy which can be tied to your pack set off to one side. Or you can use your pack as a pile of rocks and erect the mast in or through the pack as a base.
?
Another option is a vertical whip. Either a Wolf River Coil or Elecraft's AX1, both of which have tripod mounts. I've had great success with both those verticals, they just require you to get up off your lazy boy rock to change bands.
--
JIm Stinson
N0IPA
|
Jim N0IPA
Cap W0CCA
