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https://phys.org/news/2021-02-quantum-entire-radio-frequency-spectrum.html

I suggest you read the Wiki to learn about how to get into terminal mode (serial USB) and issue console commands.? Also watch the excellent videos by the developer Erik.

https://www.tinysa.org/wiki/


Roger

Hello Roger, the answer to your questions is no, I has had this for about 2 months, and this is the first time I had time to play with it. I am going to use it on CB's, when I read on how to use it. One question for you, how do I get into the?
( clearconfig1234 ) still learning and reading on how to use this. I am going to use it for aligning the CB's and setting the frequencies on the radios. I have a Oscilloscope and Signal Generator, so I have most of the battle won, but need to understand the tinaSA a bit more. How to reset this is my main concern, Thank you for your help,Mark

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 10:49 AM, Roger Need wrote:

The one that Steve posted, that is made by Infineon, is one example and they are only a few cents in volume.? I suspect that if these were installed on the TinySa input mixing products would not be seen and therefore? no effect on performance when operating in Spectrum Analyzer and Signal Generator output mode.

There needs to be some sort of ESD protection on the connectors of the TinySA.? Walking around with the supplied antenna attached is just looking for ESD failure.? Years ago I owned a MFJ-259B antenna analyzer and attached a small whip for some measurements.? It was a dry winter day and ESD destroyed the front end.

? ?The transient suppressors purchased from Agilent were $400 devices rated from dc -10GHz, yet their documentation still warned (big black letters) that they were subject to generating signals in the presence of complex modulated signals.?

? ?I agree that if all you are measuring is unmodulated carriers or simple AM/FM carriers that mixing components will not likely be an issue.? For those situations, if you want accurate measurements, you just need to characterize the back to back diodes across the range you intend to use them at.? If you only need relative measurements then this is not important.

? The other consideration is that if either diode fails because of an ESD event, you have no indication? and are not protected from future ESD events of a similar nature.? Commercial transient suppressors also have a 3dB series network that fails open if the diode fails.? Your front end is protected and the series open devices gives a visual indication (no signals passed) that a catastrophic event has occurred.

? Grabbing an antenna attached to a receiver without first grounding yourself was a big no-no in our shop and quickly got you put on the remedial training list.

- Herb??

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 08:24 AM, hwalker wrote:

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 01:18 AM, Stephen Laurence wrote:

There have been a lot of postings on the various nanovna groups, saa2 in particular, about static discharge damage, and adding an esd diode diodes across each input. The?ESD101B102ELE6327XTMA1, seems popular, (and cheap) with a bilateral breakdown voltage of 5.5v.

Would this give any protection from input overload to the Tinysa? It is a tiny device and cannot dissipate much power but the very low capacitance is not so important for a spectrum analyser and maybe a physically bigger one, but with a 5v (or lower) breakdown voltage would be better.

Steve,? ??
........
? ? The thing we learned about limiters is that since a diode is a non-linear device it is subject to acting as a mixer when subjected to pulse signals and creating signals that really aren't there.? Its very embarrassing failing a device because of signals created by your test set-up.? We eventually just annually ordered new 2W 6/10/20dB attenuators that were sacrificial elements against accidental frontend overload.? Much cheaper than replacing the front end attenuator inside the spectrum analyzer.

Back to back limiting diodes a the front-end of a receiver or spectrum analyzer can generate mixing products but their level depends on the voltage where the diodes begin to have any significant conduction.? Historically they have been avoided at the front end of a high-performance communication receiver with a low noise floor because they affect the spurious free dynamic range(SFDR) and lower the OIP3.? And the high capacitance of these diodes limited their application to HF/VHF applications.

Today there are many vendors manufacturing ESD protection devices with much higher conduction and clamping voltages and shunt capacitance? that is a? fraction of a pF. They solve the problems described above in many applications.? The one that Steve posted, that is made by Infineon, is one example and they are only a few cents in volume.? I suspect that if these were installed on the TinySa input mixing products would not be seen and therefore? no effect on performance when operating in Spectrum Analyzer and Signal Generator output mode.

There needs to be some sort of ESD protection on the connectors of the TinySA.? Walking around with the supplied antenna attached is just looking for ESD failure.? Years ago I owned a MFJ-259B antenna analyzer and attached a small whip for some measurements.? It was a dry winter day and ESD destroyed the front end.

Roger

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 01:18 AM, Stephen Laurence wrote:

There have been a lot of postings on the various nanovna groups, saa2 in particular, about static discharge damage, and adding an esd diode diodes across each input. The?ESD101B102ELE6327XTMA1, seems popular, (and cheap) with a bilateral breakdown voltage of 5.5v.

Would this give any protection from input overload to the Tinysa? It is a tiny device and cannot dissipate much power but the very low capacitance is not so important for a spectrum analyser and maybe a physically bigger one, but with a 5v (or lower) breakdown voltage would be better.

Steve,? ??
Most of those postings are guessing that its ESD damage in the absence of any other logical explanation.? I worked in EMC for a number of years and we used R&S and Agilent spectrum analyzers costing in the tens of thousands of dollars. The Agilent spectrum analyzers had a fused input in the coaxial connector that limited power.? We purchased transient? ?limiters for all our analyzers.? The commercial limiters from Agilent costed 9x the price of a tinySA.

? ? The thing we learned about limiters is that since a diode is a non-linear device it is subject to acting as a mixer when subjected to pulse signals and creating signals that really aren't there.? Its very embarrassing failing a device because of signals created by your test set-up.? We eventually just annually ordered new 2W 6/10/20dB attenuators that were sacrificial elements against accidental frontend overload.? Much cheaper than replacing the front end attenuator inside the spectrum analyzer.

? I have 3 other USB spectrum analyzers (RFExplorer, Anrinst SSA-TG, and TSA4G1) that all cost much more than the tinySA.? Only the Anrinst device has a power warning label on it and it is pretty much the same as what hugen intends to use.? The fact that hugen is being proactive and adding the warning label says a lot about his commitment to his products and user base.? Add the technical support that Erik has continued to provide and the tinySA is an absolute bargin.

- Herb?

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 02:30 AM, Roger Need wrote:

On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 08:02 AM, Hugen wrote:

I will continue to pay attention to community feedback and actively improve production.

Hugen,

I have a suggestion for you.? Why not add one of these SMA 20 dB attenuators to the TinySA package?? They are available in China for only a few dollars and would only raise the price of the TinySA package a little bit. ? This would mean signals up to 1 watt could be safely be used with the TinySA and if a higher level was used it would damage the attenuator but probably save the TinySA.

Thanks for your suggestion, it is now available.

It is recommended to add it to the shopping cart and purchase with tinySA to avoid expensive shipping.

On Fri, Feb 5, 2021 at 12:33 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote:

On 2021-02-04, at 17:02, Hugen <hugen@...> wrote:

SA-20020001

Is that the first one from the batch that was made in the year 2002?

SCNR.

Grü?e, Carsten

Sorry, I made a stupid mistake, it's 2021. The serial number should be in SA-YYMMxxxx format, and the correct serial number should be 2101xxxx.??Except for the 137 units that have been sold, the ones produced later will be revised.

Yup
Also "software, a product that is never completed"

When using as a bandscope connected to a receiver IF the tinySA (like all heterodyne swept spectrum analyzers) radiates and care must be taken to avoid ingress of the tinySA radiation into the IF of the receiver. The actual effect will depend on your receiver so no general guidance can be provided.
--

Surely it is better to pick off an if signal from the receive path of your transceiver or receiver. It does mean opening the case and working out where to put the coax ending in a tiny capacitor. If you have a very fancy set, there might be a suitable output provided through a socket on the back.

You will not have to adjust the sa when changing bands, and as long as there is no rf flying around the shack you will not have to worry about damage during transmit.

The sa is not sensitive enough to pick up weak signals direct off the aerial without a preamplifier anyway.

Steve L

Dear Erik,

There have been a lot of postings on the various nanovna groups, saa2 in particular, about static discharge damage, and adding an esd diode diodes across each input. The?ESD101B102ELE6327XTMA1, seems popular, (and cheap) with a bilateral breakdown voltage of 5.5v.

Would this give any protection from input overload to the Tinysa? It is a tiny device and cannot dissipate much power but the very low capacitance is not so important for a spectrum analyser and maybe a physically bigger one, but with a 5v (or lower) breakdown voltage would be better.

Steve L

For those who are using the TinySA as a bandscope and/or panadapter: how are you connecting it to your antenna without having to constantly plug and re-plug when you want to transmit or receive?

Are you using a directional coupler or an antenna switch?

Things I have used are either end (retracted) of an ink pen, my fingernail, an orange wood stick, either end of a pencil, the tip of a key, the guitar pick stylus that came with the unit, the handle of a fingernail clipper, and a BST126 plastic pry bar with the pointy end filed to be more blunt. There may have been others but that's all that come to mind.

73

-Jim
NU0C

On Thu, 04 Feb 2021 17:08:49 -0800
"Jim Allyn - N7JA" <jim@...> wrote:

I use a variety of items as styluses, depending upon what's closest to me, but it's usually one of those shown below.? On the left is a stylus I bought at Dollar Tree for, you guessed it, a dollar.? Besides being a stylus, it has a pen in it, plus a red pointer LED and? white flashlight LED.? Unfortunately, they tend to come apart unless you crimp it to make it tighter, or tape them together, or whatever.

In the middle is another stylus I bought at Dollar Tree, again, one buck.? No lights, but it does have a pen in it.

On the right is a mechanical pencil, of which I use the eraser as a stylus.? I probably got it either at Dollar Tree, or possibly at Office Depot.? If I got it at Dollar Tree, it was, of course, a dollar.? If I got it at Office Depot, I probably bought a package of several of them for a few dollars.? I kind of like this one because the eraser is small enough that I'm not likely to hit several buttons at once, or hit the wrong button by mistake.

In any case, I usually buy several - or a bunch - of them at once and scatter them all over the house, so there's usually one within sight no matter where in the house I happen to be.

One would hope, buy you have to remember the old saying: "Nothing can be made foolproof because fools are so ingenious".

73

-Jim
NU0C

On Thu, 04 Feb 2021 11:47:58 -0800
"Erik Kaashoek" <erik@...> wrote:

We added a link to the wiki in the box in the hope people would read the specification:
--
------------------------------------------
For more info on the tinySA go to

Here's a better view. :)

73

-Jim
NU0C


On Thu, 4 Feb 2021 20:19:26 +0100
"Carsten Bormann" <cabocabo@...> wrote:

On 2021-02-04, at 19:16, John Cunliffe W7ZQ <n2nep@...> wrote:

Anyone who would assume the input not to be 50 ohms better not play with RF test equipment and go back playing in his sand castle…

Yeah, but at least HP caters to the denizens of the sand castle.
(The max power warning label is the yellow thing on the lower side of the N connector.)

Grü?e, Carsten

On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 04:45 PM, waltcates wrote:

I have a DSA705 on the way.

Good for you!? Spectrum analyzers are wonderful toys to have.? I have a Siglent SSA3021X spectrum analyzer here, which I really like. I also have a Siglent SDS1104X-E oscilloscope that will do FFTs so it can be used as a spectrum analyzer, too.? It's only a 100 MHz scope, but since it samples at 1 GHz, it will play spectrum analyzer quite a bit higher than that.? (Not really convenient to use as a spectrum analyzer, but usable.)? I think the highest I have ever displayed on it is about 250 MHz.? I have been looking out for an old HP or Tek spectrum analyzer that will go up to 20 GHz or thereabouts, but with the virus going around, all the hamfests have been canceled, so that will probably have to wait.? And of course I have 3 tinySAs here!

I use a variety of items as styluses, depending upon what's closest to me, but it's usually one of those shown below.? On the left is a stylus I bought at Dollar Tree for, you guessed it, a dollar.? Besides being a stylus, it has a pen in it, plus a red pointer LED and? white flashlight LED.? Unfortunately, they tend to come apart unless you crimp it to make it tighter, or tape them together, or whatever.

In the middle is another stylus I bought at Dollar Tree, again, one buck.? No lights, but it does have a pen in it.

On the right is a mechanical pencil, of which I use the eraser as a stylus.? I probably got it either at Dollar Tree, or possibly at Office Depot.? If I got it at Dollar Tree, it was, of course, a dollar.? If I got it at Office Depot, I probably bought a package of several of them for a few dollars.? I kind of like this one because the eraser is small enough that I'm not likely to hit several buttons at once, or hit the wrong button by mistake.

In any case, I usually buy several - or a bunch - of them at once and scatter them all over the house, so there's usually one within sight no matter where in the house I happen to be.

On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 01:36 PM, waltcates wrote:

Is there any way to get the RBW down to 200Hz with a center freq of 3.9MHz and a scan width of 8KHz?

Keep it simple please.

Not on the TinySA.?

But if you want a low cost solution use an SDRplay RSP1A and the free Spectrum Analyzer program that was written for it.? A little over $100 USD

Roger