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Hello Everyone, This question is a general question and a one for me to figure out what is out on the market today for voters.????
- With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for voters still being made new or ones that you can still get parts for is the first question.???
- Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your VHF or UHF system who would it be?
- Last but not least,? I have I have seen on the market JPS makes a voter system and it seems to use a private network such as microwave from site to the main site.?? Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks! Steven Harvey N8RLW Mount Vernon, Ohio
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Well, for your first question, many of the newer repeater systems have internal voting now. Kenwood can do it, but it's a add-on option.
Simoco has it, but we've put in two systems now, and I am not impressed. Seems like a lot of misvoting, plus they have squelch issues.
For myself, I'll stick with a GE voter. Lots of them out there. The black ones are better.
New? Idk. It'd have to be Kenwood I guess...works well, but more than I would spend on my own stuff...unless I won the lottery or something...lol.
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On 11/15/2022 4:40 PM, steven harvey wrote: Hello Everyone,
This question is a general question and a one for me to figure out what is out on the market today for voters.
1. With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for voters still being
made new or ones that you can still get parts for is the first
question.
2. Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your VHF or UHF
system who would it be?
3. Last but not least,? I have seen system that JPS makes and it seems
to use a private network such as microwave from site to the main
site.?? Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
_._,_._,_
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Puget Sound Repeater Group () has built two different voted systems using Allstar and RTCMs.? This IP based technology has been working brilliantly here in Seattle.? Our 2m repeater system has 6 active receivers.? The 6m system has 2, and each can trivially grow as needed. -Doug- KD7DK, PSRG President and Tech Lead
On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 1:47 PM Jim Barbour < wd8chl@...> wrote: Well, for your first question, many of the newer repeater systems have
internal voting now. Kenwood can do it, but it's a add-on option.
Simoco has it, but we've put in two systems now, and I am not impressed.
Seems like a lot of misvoting, plus they have squelch issues.
For myself, I'll stick with a GE voter. Lots of them out there. The
black ones are better.
New? Idk. It'd have to be Kenwood I guess...works well, but more than I
would spend on my own stuff...unless I won the lottery or something...lol.
On 11/15/2022 4:40 PM, steven harvey wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>
> This question is a general question and a one for me to figure out what
> is out on the market today for voters.
>
>? 1. With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for voters still being
>? ? ?made new or ones that you can still get parts for is the first
>? ? ?question.
>? 2. Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your VHF or UHF
>? ? ?system who would it be?
>? 3. Last but not least,? I have seen system that JPS makes and it seems
>? ? ?to use a private network such as microwave from site to the main
>? ? ?site.?? Are there ones that can use the public internet?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Steven Harvey
> N8RLW
> Mount Vernon, Ohio
> _._,_._,_
|
Steven, I designed and built a TDV but it does not sample S/N, just a cheap way to go. Details on the web site.
In my job the Motorola or GE one works nicely however, needs a status tone.? But I am researching ways to get around this.
LDG Electroncs made one but now is no longer. It does not need status tone. I have two. They are nice however, has an issue with unsquelched audio.
I have a write-up on the web site. They are for sale.
Doug hall was a great voter, but it's also no longer. I does not need a status tone.
Raytheon makes a very nice one and does not need a status tone. It works well even for a flat repeater.
Only downside is it's expensive to maintain; the factory wants $600 just to take a look at it.? New they go for over $5,000.?
If you have deep pockets (like government agencies do) that's the one to get.
Status tone for the Motorola is used for two things, reference S/N and signaling (indication of carrier activity). I can't say if GE is the same.
I assuming you are asking for an analog system??? I don't know any for the digital stuff other than what Doug said, above.
If you do get used gear keep in mind you will need to support it. That means understanding how it works and hopefully find replacement parts, especially the ICs.
--
-
Regards, Karl Shoemaker
To contact me, please visit SRG's web site at?
for the current email address.
|
Raven Communications has a voter that's compact and does ok allegedly?
On the used market look for a Motorola Motobridge - these vote up to 8 sites and will work tone or COR on the same shelf
There is always the JPS SNV-12 and these show from time to time
Hardcore is still Motorola Digitac but these should be kept tone only?
On Tue, Nov 15, 2022, 17:33 Karl Shoemaker < srg734@...> wrote: Steven, I designed and built a TDV but it does not sample S/N, just a cheap way to go. Details on the web site.
In my job the Motorola or GE one works nicely however, needs a status tone.? But I am researching ways to get around this.
LDG Electroncs made one but now is no longer. It does not need status tone. I have two. They are nice however, has an issue with unsquelched audio.
I have a write-up on the web site. They are for sale.
Doug hall was a great voter, but it's also no longer. I does not need a status tone.
Raytheon makes a very nice one and does not need a status tone. It works well even for a flat repeater.
Only downside is it's expensive to maintain; the factory wants $600 just to take a look at it.? New they go for over $5,000.?
If you have deep pockets (like government agencies do) that's the one to get.
Status tone for the Motorola is used for two things, reference S/N and signaling (indication of carrier activity). I can't say if GE is the same.
I assuming you are asking for an analog system??? I don't know any for the digital stuff other than what Doug said, above.
If you do get used gear keep in mind you will need to support it. That means understanding how it works and hopefully find replacement parts, especially the ICs.
--
-
Regards, Karl Shoemaker
To contact me, please visit SRG's web site at?
for the current email address.
|
Steven, I have a Doug Hall that I no longer need and will be putting it up for sale. It¡¯s a 4 channel version.? tnx Mike / K5JR? Alpharetta GA
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On Nov 15, 2022, at 4:43 PM, steven harvey <sharvey@...> wrote: ? [Edited Message Follows]
Hello Everyone, This question is a general question and a one for me to figure out what is out on the market today for voters.????
- With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for voters still being made new or ones that you can still get parts for is the first question.???
- Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your VHF or UHF system who would it be?
- Last but not least,? I have I have seen on the market JPS makes a voter system and it seems to use a private network such as microwave from site to the main site.?? Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks! Steven Harvey N8RLW Mount Vernon, Ohio
|
Speaking of voters, does anyone have experience with Astro tac 3000s? I know they all require V.24 via the Cisco routers and the whole shabang, and the wire line cards in the quantar stations, but do they work well? Not too much documentation out there about using them in amateur applications. 73¡¯²õ, Stephen K3SEM -.. . / -.- ¡-- ¡ . --
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On Nov 15, 2022, at 22:37, Mike / K5JR <k5jr.lists@...> wrote:
? Steven, I have a Doug Hall that I no longer need and will be putting it up for sale. It¡¯s a 4 channel version.? tnx Mike / K5JR? Alpharetta GA
On Nov 15, 2022, at 4:43 PM, steven harvey <sharvey@...> wrote:
? [Edited Message Follows]
Hello Everyone, This question is a general question and a one for me to figure out what is out on the market today for voters.????
- With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for voters still being made new or ones that you can still get parts for is the first question.???
- Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your VHF or UHF system who would it be?
- Last but not least,? I have I have seen on the market JPS makes a voter system and it seems to use a private network such as microwave from site to the main site.?? Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks! Steven Harvey N8RLW Mount Vernon, Ohio
|
Only require V.24 for mixed mode or P25 only.
They are standard 2175 status tone for analog.? Them and the
Digi-TAC (analog only, but supported 12Kb DES and DVP) should be
plentiful after all the switching to full P25 all over the US.
Jim W7RY
On 11/15/2022 10:22 PM, Stephen K3SEM
via groups.io wrote:
Speaking of voters, does anyone have experience with Astro tac
3000s? I know they all require V.24 via the Cisco routers and the
whole shabang, and the wire line cards in the quantar stations,
but do they work well? Not too much documentation out there about
using them in amateur applications.
73¡¯²õ,
Stephen
K3SEM
-.. . / -.- ¡-- ¡ . --
?
Steven, I have a Doug Hall that I no longer need and will be
putting it up for sale. It¡¯s a 4 channel version.?
tnx
Mike / K5JR?
Alpharetta GA
?
[Edited Message Follows]
Hello Everyone,
This question is a general question and a one for me to
figure out what is out on the market today for voters.????
- With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for
voters still being made new or ones that you can still
get parts for is the first question.???
- Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your
VHF or UHF system who would it be?
- Last but not least,? I have I have seen on the market
JPS makes a voter system and it seems to use a private
network such as microwave from site to the main site.??
Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
--
Thanks and 73, Jim W7RY
|
If you want to vote Motorola Motrbo DMR they have a good system that uses? SLR repeaters as the remote receivers Just need a dedicated digital link between sites, better than using the internet unless you have a robust data network.
Only require V.24 for mixed mode or P25 only.
They are standard 2175 status tone for analog.? Them and the
Digi-TAC (analog only, but supported 12Kb DES and DVP) should be
plentiful after all the switching to full P25 all over the US.
Jim W7RY
On 11/15/2022 10:22 PM, Stephen K3SEM
via wrote:
Speaking of voters, does anyone have experience with Astro tac
3000s? I know they all require V.24 via the Cisco routers and the
whole shabang, and the wire line cards in the quantar stations,
but do they work well? Not too much documentation out there about
using them in amateur applications.
73¡¯²õ,
Stephen
K3SEM
-.. . / -.- ¡-- ¡ . --
?
Steven, I have a Doug Hall that I no longer need and will be
putting it up for sale. It¡¯s a 4 channel version.?
tnx
Mike / K5JR?
Alpharetta GA
?
[Edited Message Follows]
Hello Everyone,
This question is a general question and a one for me to
figure out what is out on the market today for voters.????
- With Doug Hall out of the market who is left for
voters still being made new or ones that you can still
get parts for is the first question.???
- Second, if you had to purchase a voter system for your
VHF or UHF system who would it be?
- Last but not least,? I have I have seen on the market
JPS makes a voter system and it seems to use a private
network such as microwave from site to the main site.??
Are there ones that can use the public internet?
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
--
Thanks and 73, Jim W7RY
|
Again, the GE voter does not need voter tone. It will do E&M keying standard. No mods needed.
There are cards out there, likely from some trunked systems, that use voter tone to set level, rather than having a pot on the front. I have some of those, but for normal ham use, they're a pain.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 11/15/2022 5:33 PM, Karl Shoemaker wrote: Steven, I designed and built a TDV but it does not sample S/N, just a cheap way to go. Details on the web site.
In my job the Motorola or GE one works nicely however, needs a status tone.? But I am researching ways to get around this.
LDG Electroncs made one but now is no longer. It does not need status tone. I have two. They are nice however, has an issue with unsquelched audio.
I have a write-up on the web site. They are for sale.
Doug hall was a great voter, but it's also no longer. I does not need a status tone.
Raytheon makes a very nice one and does not need a status tone. It works well even for a flat repeater.
Only downside is it's expensive to maintain; the factory wants $600 just to take a look at it.? New they go for over $5,000.
If you have deep pockets (like government agencies do) that's the one to get.
Status tone for the Motorola is used for two things, reference S/N and signaling (indication of carrier activity). I can't say if GE is the same.
I assuming you are asking for an analog system??? I don't know any for the digital stuff other than what Doug said, above.
If you do get used gear keep in mind you will need to support it. That means understanding how it works and hopefully find replacement parts, especially the ICs.
--
-
Regards, Karl Shoemaker
To contact me, please visit SRG's web site at <>
for the current email address.
|
I do appreciate everyone's reply on this thread.??? It gives me a lot of information to research and decide what I would like to do.??? It seems to me going digital would be the best way for the long run as the manufactures are doing more and more digital radios.?? Plus it seems logical to me that what you put down the link is not going to care if it came out of the receiver as analog or another digital mode.??
The mesh option does make me stop and think as we have a solid private mesh around here that I could use.
The Motorola option seems to be one that I could go with too.??? The Motorola Motobridge that Ranger Radio stated that has 8 voting slots is there a device that goes on the receiver site side? ? Can you give me what a good price might be for used and is this still a production item or has it been end of life from Motorola?
If Doug, KD7DK could PM me I would like to speak with you about the PSRG system and its gotcha's or how it works most of the time.
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
|
I would think, the biggest issue with digital over internet would be getting your audio delays to line up.?? Although, I could be wrong.?? If its continuous voting S/N, it will cause issues.
Someone educate me, if I am wrong.?? Every mode I have seen digital would not lend itself to S/N voting at the transmitter site. (At least not continuous).
Andy
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 10:15 AM steven harvey < sharvey@...> wrote: I do appreciate everyone's reply on this thread.??? It gives me a lot of information to research and decide what I would like to do.??? It seems to me going digital would be the best way for the long run as the manufactures are doing more and more digital radios.?? Plus it seems logical to me that what you put down the link is not going to care if it came out of the receiver as analog or another digital mode.??
The mesh option does make me stop and think as we have a solid private mesh around here that I could use.
The Motorola option seems to be one that I could go with too.??? The Motorola Motobridge that Ranger Radio stated that has 8 voting slots is there a device that goes on the receiver site side? ? Can you give me what a good price might be for used and is this still a production item or has it been end of life from Motorola?
If Doug, KD7DK could PM me I would like to speak with you about the PSRG system and its gotcha's or how it works most of the time.
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
|
Mike, I'm interested, what's your email address or number? Thanks Mike / K5JR
Steven, I have a Doug Hall that I no longer need and will be putting it up for sale. It¡¯s a 4 channel version.?
tnx
Mike / K5JR?
Alpharetta GA
-- - Regards, Karl Shoemaker To contact me, please visit SRG's web site at? for the current email address.
|
The problem that I see with a lot of these new voting systems is they don't interface well with external controllers. That is to say, you can't enable or disable receivers using logic lines on your controller like you can with an LDG or Doug Hall voter. Am I missing something? I've also got a stake in this is why I ask.
Stephen KG4PTO
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022, 10:51 AM wj9jrg < wj9jrg@...> wrote: I would think, the biggest issue with digital over internet would be getting your audio delays to line up.?? Although, I could be wrong.?? If its continuous voting S/N, it will cause issues.
Someone educate me, if I am wrong.?? Every mode I have seen digital would not lend itself to S/N voting at the transmitter site. (At least not continuous).
Andy
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 10:15 AM steven harvey < sharvey@...> wrote: I do appreciate everyone's reply on this thread.??? It gives me a lot of information to research and decide what I would like to do.??? It seems to me going digital would be the best way for the long run as the manufactures are doing more and more digital radios.?? Plus it seems logical to me that what you put down the link is not going to care if it came out of the receiver as analog or another digital mode.??
The mesh option does make me stop and think as we have a solid private mesh around here that I could use.
The Motorola option seems to be one that I could go with too.??? The Motorola Motobridge that Ranger Radio stated that has 8 voting slots is there a device that goes on the receiver site side? ? Can you give me what a good price might be for used and is this still a production item or has it been end of life from Motorola?
If Doug, KD7DK could PM me I would like to speak with you about the PSRG system and its gotcha's or how it works most of the time.
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
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Radio Thick Client Module just dropped.
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Allstar/RTCM deals with audio delays by applying a GPS derived timestamp to every frame of audio samples so the voter can align them.? All the RTCMs in the system have GPS receivers with 1PPS outputs to give near microsecond accuracy on the timestamps.
S/N is measured at the receivers and sent with the audio frames to the voter.
-Doug-, KD7DK
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 7:51 AM wj9jrg < wj9jrg@...> wrote: I would think, the biggest issue with digital over internet would be getting your audio delays to line up.?? Although, I could be wrong.?? If its continuous voting S/N, it will cause issues.
Someone educate me, if I am wrong.?? Every mode I have seen digital would not lend itself to S/N voting at the transmitter site. (At least not continuous).
Andy
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 10:15 AM steven harvey < sharvey@...> wrote: I do appreciate everyone's reply on this thread.??? It gives me a lot of information to research and decide what I would like to do.??? It seems to me going digital would be the best way for the long run as the manufactures are doing more and more digital radios.?? Plus it seems logical to me that what you put down the link is not going to care if it came out of the receiver as analog or another digital mode.??
The mesh option does make me stop and think as we have a solid private mesh around here that I could use.
The Motorola option seems to be one that I could go with too.??? The Motorola Motobridge that Ranger Radio stated that has 8 voting slots is there a device that goes on the receiver site side? ? Can you give me what a good price might be for used and is this still a production item or has it been end of life from Motorola?
If Doug, KD7DK could PM me I would like to speak with you about the PSRG system and its gotcha's or how it works most of the time.
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
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If someone is looking at buying some of the RTCM, my want to look at doing some simulcast.
Mick - W7CAT
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Kingston" To: [email protected]Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2022 09:57:34 AM Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] Voter Systems Allstar/RTCM deals with audio delays by applying a GPS derived timestamp to every frame of audio samples so the voter can align them. All the RTCMs in the system have GPS receivers with 1PPS outputs to give near microsecond
accuracy on the timestamps.
S/N is measured at the receivers and sent with the audio frames to the
voter.
-Doug-, KD7DK
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 7:51 AM wj9jrg wrote:
I would think, the biggest issue with digital over internet would be
getting your audio delays to line up. Although, I could be wrong. If
its continuous voting S/N, it will cause issues.
Someone educate me, if I am wrong. Every mode I have seen digital would not lend itself to S/N voting at the transmitter site. (At least not
continuous).
Andy
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 10:15 AM steven harvey
wrote:
I do appreciate everyone's reply on this thread. It gives me a lot of
information to research and decide what I would like to do. It
seems to me going digital would be the best way for the long run as the
manufactures are doing more and more digital radios. Plus it seems logical to
me that what you put down the link is not going to care if it came out of the
receiver as analog or another digital mode.
The mesh option does make me stop and think as we have a solid
private mesh around here that I could use.
The Motorola option seems to be one that I could go with too. The
Motorola Motobridge that Ranger Radio stated that has 8 voting
slots is there a device that goes on the receiver site side? Can you give
me what a good price might be for used and is this still a production item
or has it been end of life from Motorola?
If Doug, KD7DK could PM me I would like to speak with you about
the PSRG system and its gotcha's or how it works most of the time.
Thanks!
Steven Harvey
N8RLW
Mount Vernon, Ohio
-- Untitled Document
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Stephen, You could build your own in case you find an older one. That's what I do (farmer thinking process). If they don't make it, I will. A simple set of flop flops (IC) lead by a DTMF signal should do the trick. Try laying in bed at night thinking / dreaming up such projects. Then jump out of bed and scribble down notes so you don't forget.? Of course, that's after wife/SO attention / chores, etc.? LOL. -- - Regards, Karl Shoemaker To contact me, please visit SRG's web site at? for the current email address. Stephen Slider
The problem that I see with a lot of these new voting systems is they don't interface well with external controllers. That is to say, you can't enable or disable receivers using logic lines on your controller like you can with an LDG or Doug Hall voter. Am I missing something? I've also got a stake in this is why I ask.
?
Stephen KG4PTO
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DCFluX
Is this a new RTCM? Details please??
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Show quoted text
On Wed, Nov 16, 2022 at 11:37 AM, DCFluX wrote:
Radio Thick Client Module just dropped.
? -- The Real RFI-EMI-GUY
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Doug Kingston, KD7DK
Karl Shoemaker
Tezza
RFI-EMI-GUY