¿ªÔÆÌåÓý


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Hello Jeff,

Any plans for the holiday? Just wondering if you would like to go pound sand with me?

By the way Tom, you forgot to give your call sign like us respectable hams do!

Mick - W7CAT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Cole"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2025 10:50:58 AM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit


On May 23, 2025, at 10:33?AM, Teton Amateur Radio Repeater
Association (TARRA) wrote:

?
Have you ever read Part 97? Do you know what it is about?


¡ì 97.119 Station identification.

(a) Each amateur station, except a space station or telecommand
station, must transmit its assigned call sign on its transmitting channel at the end of each communication, and at least every 10 minutes during a communication

There isn't anything in the rules that says you are supposed to
transmit every ten minutes that a repeater is available.

There is also nothing that says you can¡¯t. Now go pound sand with
your buddy Jeff.






--
Untitled Document


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

"There isn't anything in the rules that says you are supposed to transmit every ten minutes that a repeater is available"

There probably isn't anything in the rules about me wearing a red t-shirt, but I'm doing it anyway.
If something isn't prohibited, it is allowed.


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

On May 23, 2025, at 10:33?AM, Teton Amateur Radio Repeater Association (TARRA) <tarra@...> wrote:

?
Have you ever read Part 97? Do you know what it is about?


¡ì 97.119 Station identification.

(a) Each amateur station, except a space station or telecommand station, must transmit its assigned call sign on its transmitting channel at the end of each communication, and at least every 10 minutes during a communication

There isn't anything in the rules that says you are supposed to transmit every ten minutes that a repeater is available.

There is also nothing that says you can¡¯t. Now go pound sand with your buddy Jeff.


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Have you ever read Part 97? Do you know what it is about?


¡ì 97.119 Station identification.

(a) Each amateur station, except a space station or telecommand station, must transmit its assigned call sign on its transmitting channel at the end of each communication, and at least every 10 minutes during a communication

There isn't anything in the rules that says you are supposed to transmit every ten minutes that a repeater is available.

"We¡¯ve been running our repeaters for well over 40 years this way." Maybe they have been "grandmothered in".

Since you are doing everything proper and legal, then there is nothing to worry about with giving your call sign (do you have one?). And the call signs for these legal repeaters.

Maybe all of us should turn on our "email CTCSS decoders" and then we won't see him again!

Mick - W7CAT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Cole"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2025 08:11:41 AM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit



Transmitting your ID is not the same as beaconing.
I said I was going back the original subject of DMR beacons. I
wasn't talking about ID's.

Clearly you were.

Until then, go pound sand.
Rephrasing: "I don't like you pointing out the errors of my ways so
I'll ignore you". Nice attitude, especially in amateur radio where we are supposed to be self-policing. Clearly you can't even police yourself.

I was quite clear. YOUR INTERPRETATION of the rules are irrelevant.
We¡¯ve been running our repeaters for well over 40 years this way. If it were illegal, we would have gotten a notice in that time. Smarter people than you set our systems up initially. I trust THEIR judgement. We police ourselves quite well. You just don¡¯t like the fact that we don¡¯t take your comments as gospel. Have a blessed day Jeff.




--
Untitled Document


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Jeff,
Since you obviously think you must have the last word, go ahead. I¡¯m through dealing with your arrogance and stupidity. Have a blessed day.


Re: Using HF rig or 6M repeaters

 

Between ensuring they are using FM, best amplitude for mic gain, and when possible a vertical antenna - these things have greatly helped those doing this

Jason


On Fri, May 23, 2025, 9:41?AM Joe via <k1ike_mail=[email protected]> wrote:
Mike audio gain can be much different between SSB, AM and FM operation.
They may have to remember what the optimum setting for mike gain is for
each mode and reset the control.

73, Joe, K1ike

On 5/22/2025 9:26 PM, Chuck Kelsey via wrote:
> I have some potential users of my 6M FM repeater that want to use their
> HF rigs for that purpose. Unfortunately most that have tried have
> terrible audio - over driven and distorted. What do they need to pay
> attention to with their rigs? FWIW, I do not have an HF radio because I
> have zero interest, so I'm no help to them.
>
> Chuck
> WB2EDV
>







OT: Hytera MD652U DMR Radio

 

Hi Guys:

I am looking for the software and a programming cable for the Hytera MD652U DMR radio.

Appreciate any info!

Thanks,

Ramesh, VA3UV, WA3UV


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

I said I was going back the original subject of DMR beacons. I wasn't talking
about ID's.

Clearly you were.
I quote myself: "Going back to the original discussion regarding DMR beaconing,"

Perhaps your problems understanding the rules is related to your inability to read what has been written very clearly.

We¡¯ve been
running our repeaters for well over 40 years this way. If it were illegal, we would
have gotten a notice in that time.
"I've been stealing toilet paper from the Walmart bathroom for 40 years and have never been caught so it must be legal."

Smarter people than you set our systems up initially.
Really? Who were they? I enjoy meeting people smarter than me and having intellectual discussions with them, it's a great way to learn new things.

--- Jeff WN3A


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 


Transmitting your ID is not the same as beaconing.
I said I was going back the original subject of DMR beacons. I wasn't talking about ID's.
Clearly you were.

Until then, go pound sand.
Rephrasing: "I don't like you pointing out the errors of my ways so I'll ignore you". Nice attitude, especially in amateur radio where we are supposed to be self-policing. Clearly you can't even police yourself.
I was quite clear. YOUR INTERPRETATION of the rules are irrelevant. We¡¯ve been running our repeaters for well over 40 years this way. If it were illegal, we would have gotten a notice in that time. Smarter people than you set our systems up initially. I trust THEIR judgement. We police ourselves quite well. You just don¡¯t like the fact that we don¡¯t take your comments as gospel. Have a blessed day Jeff.


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Not at all. Transmitting the repeater ID every 10 minutes is not only legal, but
required.
It is required that you ID during and at the end of activity.

It is not required that you identify every 10 minutes when there is no activity. In fact, it is not permitted. Transmitting an ID for no reason repeatedly is a one-way transmission. It is not permissible as evidenced by FCC warning letters over the years. There are several people *on this list* that have received such warnings, and no, I'm not going to rat them out.

Your interpretation.
Nope, fact. Your interpretation is that if you don't get caught doing something that's wrong that it's fine to do it.

The purpose is that the FCC states we must ID every ten minutes.
That's not what the rules say, read them again.

Again, your interpretation. Why are you so concerned about your supposed ¡°RF
±è´Ç±ô±ô³Ü³Ù¾±´Ç²Ô¡±?
Because you're not the only repeater in the planet on the channel. Even if your coordinator gives you something akin to geographic exclusivity on the channel doesn't mean there aren't distant users that can hear your pointless ID's, or even potentially interfere with their use or reception of another co-channel or adjacent-channel repeater if they are on the fringes.

Transmitting your ID is not the same as beaconing.
I said I was going back the original subject of DMR beacons. I wasn't talking about ID's.

Until then, go pound sand.
Rephrasing: "I don't like you pointing out the errors of my ways so I'll ignore you". Nice attitude, especially in amateur radio where we are supposed to be self-policing. Clearly you can't even police yourself. You have the shoplifter's attitude of "as long as I don't get caught I may as well keep doing it."

--- Jeff WN3A


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Even if it was legal to id every ten minutes, I wouldn't monitor
a repeater that did that. Just no need for that.

Butch Bussen
wa0vjr
wa0vjr@...
irlp 7135
allstar 56023
echolink 790800
new home phone 785 852-1102

----- Original Message -----
From: "John S via groups.io" <johns@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2025 7:33 AM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit


I would have used a different term other than ignorant.

On 2025-05-23 00:32, Teton Amateur Radio Repeater Association
(TARRA)
wrote:
Can't argue with the ignorant!

Mick - W7CAT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Cole"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2025 09:48:35 PM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

So, you are going to monitor the frequency 24/7 and testify
that
something didn¡¯t key the repeater to trigger the ID? Of course
you
aren¡¯t. The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the
repeater is
in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359. The only way the
FCC would
even check on when a repeater IDs is if a sad ham complains.
Don¡¯t be
that Sad Ham.



Re: Using HF rig or 6M repeaters

 

Mike audio gain can be much different between SSB, AM and FM operation. They may have to remember what the optimum setting for mike gain is for each mode and reset the control.

73, Joe, K1ike

On 5/22/2025 9:26 PM, Chuck Kelsey via groups.io wrote:
I have some potential users of my 6M FM repeater that want to use their HF rigs for that purpose. Unfortunately most that have tried have terrible audio - over driven and distorted. What do they need to pay attention to with their rigs? FWIW, I do not have an HF radio because I have zero interest, so I'm no help to them.
Chuck
WB2EDV


Re: Using HF rig or 6M repeaters

 

For 10 and 6 FM I use commercial Motorola Maxtrac/Radius, GE RANGR, GE Orions, Vertex FTL1011, Modified WULFSBERG RT30 and Motorola CDM1250's and I never receive a poor audio complaint for any of these commercial models as would be expected.
?
For 6/10 commercial FM Handhelds I use GE PE's, Maxon MGP300's, Motorola P200/MT1000 and recently my favorite Motorola HT is the HT1250 on 6 FM.
?
In the ham made models I use a Kenwood TS690S a Yaesu FT100D and an Elecraft K3S and for ham made Ht's i use a Yaesu VX-5R and an Azden AZ61 and all of these work very well on 6 and 10 FM repeaters and simplex without any complaints and no mods required.
?
The only complaint that I had was with the Kenwood TS690s and this was 32 years ago when I enabled the speech processor which doubles the audio in FM mode to where it is over driven so whenever using any the Kenwood ham models, Ts690S/TS450S do not turn the speech processor on, I do not see this? audio over drive issue with the Yaesu ham models? thasat I have used if the processor is on or off only with the above mentioned Kenwoods.
?
After using all of these mobile and handheld radios on, Australian, Swiss,? Canadian, New York, Texas, North Carolina, Washington, Oregon, California and Arizona 6 and 10 meter VHF Low band repeaters and numerous simplex frequencies I have never had an audio complaint on any of these? radios except for that one time with the Kenwood TS690S.
?
?


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

I would have used a different term other than ignorant.

On 2025-05-23 00:32, Teton Amateur Radio Repeater Association (TARRA) wrote:
Can't argue with the ignorant!
Mick - W7CAT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Cole"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2025 09:48:35 PM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

So, you are going to monitor the frequency 24/7 and testify that something didn¡¯t key the repeater to trigger the ID? Of course you aren¡¯t. The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the repeater is in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359. ?The only way the FCC would even check on when a repeater IDs is if a sad ham complains. Don¡¯t be that Sad Ham.


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

On May 23, 2025, at 7:45?AM, Jeff DePolo WN3A via groups.io <jd0@...> wrote:

So, you're admitting that what you're doing is wrong, but as long as nobody complains then it's OK?
Not at all. Transmitting the repeater ID every 10 minutes is not only legal, but required.

The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the repeater is in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359.
If you have continuous activity (USER activity) for 18 hours straight my hat is off to you, God Bless, keep doing what you're doing. If you're saying that the repeater is ENABLED for 18 hours, only during and following a period of activity should the repeater ID every 10 minutes.
Your interpretation.

"If the FCC doesn't know about it then I can get away with it." Again, you're demonstrating that you know that it's not proper yet you're doing it anyway.
Again, your interpretation.

What is the reason for ID'ing every 10 minutes? To pollute the channel with more RF? To remind everybody what the repeater's callsign is? What exactly is the purpose?
The purpose is that the FCC states we must ID every ten minutes.

Likewise, what is the purpose of 'grandfather clock' ID's? Doesn't everybody have a watch, a cell phone, a clock, or some other timekeeping device with or near them at all times already? More RF pollution, more FCC violations.
Again, your interpretation. Why are you so concerned about your supposed ¡°RF ±è´Ç±ô±ô³Ü³Ù¾±´Ç²Ô¡±?

Going back to the original discussion regarding DMR beaconing, that, too, has already been "addressed" by the FCC in several instances in my area. The relevant rule section is 97.203(d):

(d) A beacon may be automatically controlled while it is transmitting on the 28.20©\28.30 MHz, 50.06©\
50.08 MHz, 144.275©\144.300 MHz, 222.05©\222.06 MHz or 432.300©\432.400 MHz segments, or on the 33
cm and shorter wavelength bands.
Transmitting your ID is not the same as beaconing. Get over yourself Jeff. When YOU become head of the FCC, then you get to dictate to others. Until then, go pound sand.


Re: Using HF rig or 6M repeaters

 

Totally agree with Jeff WN3A recommendations.??
I own several radios that operate on 6M, Kenwood TS-690, TS-2000, Yaesu FT-991A, IC-7300.? They all provide good audio when audio enhancements are set with moderation or in the case of the FT-991A turned-off. This has
been my experience at WA3GIN.

Also, it seems 6m enthusiastic?operators enjoy driving high power amplifiers and oftentimes forget those big amps aren't usually needed for repeater use!

73
Dave
wa3gin

On Fri, May 23, 2025 at 8:28?AM Jeff DePolo WN3A via <jd0=[email protected]> wrote:

?

  • What do they need to pay attention to with their rigs?

?

A lot of HF+6 radios will retain the voice processor settings even when switched to FM mode, so make sure they turn off the mic processor, and after doing so, set the mic gain to a reasonable level.

?

Mics, headsets, etc. tailored for ¡°DX¡± or contesting SSB audio typically have a frequency response that sounds thin (a lot of low-end rolloff) or nasally (midrange peaking) on FM.

?

Some HF radios don¡¯t have ¡°true FM¡± modulators but rather phase modulators.? Some don¡¯t sound very good regardless of what mic is used, whether that¡¯s due to the modulator or the AF circuits preceding it.

?

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????? --- Jeff

?


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

So, you are going to monitor the frequency 24/7 and testify that something didn¡¯t key the repeater to trigger the ID?
So, you're admitting that what you're doing is wrong, but as long as nobody complains then it's OK?

The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the repeater is in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359.
If you have continuous activity (USER activity) for 18 hours straight my hat is off to you, God Bless, keep doing what you're doing. If you're saying that the repeater is ENABLED for 18 hours, only during and following a period of activity should the repeater ID every 10 minutes.

The only way the FCC would even check on when a repeater IDs is if a sad ham complains.
"If the FCC doesn't know about it then I can get away with it." Again, you're demonstrating that you know that it's not proper yet you're doing it anyway.

What is the reason for ID'ing every 10 minutes? To pollute the channel with more RF? To remind everybody what the repeater's callsign is? What exactly is the purpose?

Likewise, what is the purpose of 'grandfather clock' ID's? Doesn't everybody have a watch, a cell phone, a clock, or some other timekeeping device with or near them at all times already? More RF pollution, more FCC violations.

Going back to the original discussion regarding DMR beaconing, that, too, has already been "addressed" by the FCC in several instances in my area. The relevant rule section is 97.203(d):

(d) A beacon may be automatically controlled while it is transmitting on the 28.20©\28.30 MHz, 50.06©\
50.08 MHz, 144.275©\144.300 MHz, 222.05©\222.06 MHz or 432.300©\432.400 MHz segments, or on the 33
cm and shorter wavelength bands.

Nobody has repeaters in any of those segments because none of those segments are eligible for repeater operation per 97.205(b).

--- Jeff WN3A


Re: Using HF rig or 6M repeaters

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

?

  • What do they need to pay attention to with their rigs?

?

A lot of HF+6 radios will retain the voice processor settings even when switched to FM mode, so make sure they turn off the mic processor, and after doing so, set the mic gain to a reasonable level.

?

Mics, headsets, etc. tailored for ¡°DX¡± or contesting SSB audio typically have a frequency response that sounds thin (a lot of low-end rolloff) or nasally (midrange peaking) on FM.

?

Some HF radios don¡¯t have ¡°true FM¡± modulators but rather phase modulators.? Some don¡¯t sound very good regardless of what mic is used, whether that¡¯s due to the modulator or the AF circuits preceding it.

?

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????? --- Jeff

?


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

Can't argue with the ignorant!

Mick - W7CAT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Cole"
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2025 09:48:35 PM
Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

So, you are going to monitor the frequency 24/7 and testify that
something didn¡¯t key the repeater to trigger the ID? Of course you aren¡¯t. The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the repeater is in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359. ?The only way the FCC would even check on when a repeater IDs is if a sad ham complains. Don¡¯t be that Sad Ham.




--
Untitled Document


Re: RC-210 and SLR-8000 PL Inhibit

 

So, you are going to monitor the frequency 24/7 and testify that something didn¡¯t key the repeater to trigger the ID? Of course you aren¡¯t. The FCC requires we ID every 10 minutes when the repeater is in use. It is in use from 0600 until 2359. ?The only way the FCC would even check on when a repeater IDs is if a sad ham complains. Don¡¯t be that Sad Ham.?