Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
I did something similar with an MX300 years ago. Like Andy said, these radios usually have a Bridge Tied Load speaker output. They float at about 1/2 VCC when the radio unmutes and so that point can be used to drive a transistor inverter to give low going COR.
The radio wants to see a speaker load so a small audio isolation transformer would be ideal. In no case should either speaker lead go directly to ground.?
In my case with the MX300, it was bottled up in a shield with nice feedthrough LC filters and for that reason the radio had a chirp when unmuting. So I put a cap of about .05 uF across the speaker leads to balance them and it was happy.
--
The Real RFI-EMI-GUY
|
Re: The passing of an icon
Although I didn't personally know Ted, I did
business with him, and he was a great, knowledgeable guy.? He,
like a lot of us, will be greatly missed when we are gone... I
have a 38 yr old, EE, working in my shop and it is scary as hell
to think of him being a "go to guy" for our shop, not today, not
tomorrow, or any other day.? I feel for our industry and our
county.
On 2/21/2021 5:46 PM, TGundo 2003 via
groups.io wrote:
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Show quoted text
Sad news- Ted was a fixture
of the industry, especially here in the Chicago area. I always
enjoyed my visits with him.
73's OM.
Tom
W9SRV
On Sunday, February 21, 2021, 05:30:06 PM CST, Howard
<n9ktw@...> wrote:
It
is with great sadness that I have to report the
passing of Ted Bleiman, K9MDM, AKA Lefty due to
complications from CoVid-19, on Saturday February 20,
2021.
?
Those
of us in the ham and radio communications community
remember him for his days at SPECTRONICS and later MDM
radio. Ted was the “go to guy” for almost all the hard
to find 2-way and repeater parts in the Chicago area
(and maybe the country). His company motto was “ if
it’s in stock, we’ve got it”
?
I
knew Ted personally for quite a number of years, and
he was the guy that was willing to help anyone any
time with an electronic problem. Ted “officially”
retired from the business about 5 years ago, but some
of us knew he still had information to share, and
occasionally a few VERY obscure parts!
?
Ted
will be greatly missed by the electronics community as
a whole and me personally (as my adopted uncle).
?
?
De
Howard, N9KTW
|
Circuit-wise, in an FM transmitter you are modulating an
oscillator and are directly changing its frequency. In a
PM transmitter you do not modulate the oscillator -- it outputs a
constant frequency. But it's followed by an inductance or
capacitance value that changes with modulation, thus the audio is
changing the phase of the signal. Using a reactance in
this way introduces pre-emphasis. So, we add pre-emphasis to FM to
make it compatible with PM.
73,
Bob
On 2/21/2021 4:46 PM, Mike Fahmie via
groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
True FM is achieved by
actually modulating the carrier's FREQUENCY. 'UnTrue FM' is
usually achieved by modulating the PHASE of a fixed carrier
and properly shaping the audio frequency response of the mic
amplifier.? The two methods should be indistinguishable over
the normal voice spectrum but 'UnTrue FM' becomes impractical
at very low audio frequencies.
-Mike-
WA6ZTY
On Sunday, February 21, 2021, 03:31:38 PM PST, KA9QJG
<ka9qjg@...> wrote:
?
?
As?? Ham radio
operators, some people getting into Amateur
radio and others for some reason think We know
everything WOW I wonder where? they? get that
from, LOL that’s almost as? bad as saying Ham
Radio operators are cheap too
?
Well, over the
years, with all the neighbors seeing? Me
climbing trees and putting up antennas and? Me
telling all about the great things we do in
ham radio trying to save the world from all
the disasters providing Emergency
Communications,
?
?? I ask if I can
use their trees too. Everyone said, ok. ?Then
they see me and ask me to fix everything from
toasters, microwaves. Wifes curling iron, tv,
cell, tablets and computers, and the list go
on and on. I refuse? some and will not even
post what they were, LOL
?
So, After all, my
rambling on a? 14 in? Snow now 14 deg winter
afternoon in N/W Indiana, ?
?
? Finally,? if you
are still here, this is ?My excuse for taking
up bandwidth... ?For over 30 yrs and thanks to
this group, I have been building and still
using repeaters; Some have to hear me say well
back in the day, some of the transmitters were
advertised as? True FM; One evening on the
repeater Tech Net, ??A newly Lic Ham ask what
is real FM. His BO-Thing must not be accurate.
Without going into the thoughts of? BO-Thing
?not being much of anything? True,
?
I honestly did not
answer this, So This is my question that
someone on here should put in layman terms for
Me. So what is True FM? Vs.? Whatever FM
?
Everyone Stay safe
and Healthy
?
Don KA9QJG
|
Hi Don,
>So
what is True FM? Vs.? Whatever FM
"True FM" is a silly term, in my opinion. It's used by folks who
want to strongly distinguish FM from PM. Why they can't simply use
"FM" or "PM" to indicate what they mean, I don't know. Both are
forms of angle modulation and they're mathematically related.
Simply put, FM is not pre-emphasized by nature and PM is. When you
add pre-emphasis to FM, it's indistinguishable from PM. However,
the way a lot of commercial radios are designed can make it tough
to get really good audio through repeaters and links without
modifications, hence all the back-and-forth over circuit values,
the "right way" to do things, etc. Hearsay and opinions have made
the whole topic more complicated than it needs to be.
73,
Bob, WA9FBO
On 2/21/2021 4:31 PM, KA9QJG wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
?
As??
Ham radio operators, some people getting into Amateur
radio and others for some reason think We know
everything WOW I wonder where? they? get that from, LOL
that’s almost as? bad as saying Ham Radio operators are
cheap too
?
Well,
over the years, with all the neighbors seeing? Me
climbing trees and putting up antennas and? Me telling
all about the great things we do in ham radio trying to
save the world from all the disasters providing
Emergency Communications,
?
??
I ask if I can use their trees too. Everyone said, ok.
?Then they see me and ask me to fix everything from
toasters, microwaves. Wifes curling iron, tv, cell,
tablets and computers, and the list go on and on. I
refuse? some and will not even post what they were, LOL
?
So,
After all, my rambling on a? 14 in? Snow now 14 deg
winter afternoon in N/W Indiana, ?
?
?
Finally,? if you are still here, this is ?My excuse for
taking up bandwidth... ?For over 30 yrs and thanks to
this group, I have been building and still using
repeaters; Some have to hear me say well back in the
day, some of the transmitters were advertised as? True
FM; One evening on the repeater Tech Net, ??A newly Lic
Ham ask what is real FM. His BO-Thing must not be
accurate. Without going into the thoughts of? BO-Thing
?not being much of anything? True,
?
I honestly did not answer this, So This is my question
that someone on here should put in layman terms for Me.
So what is True FM? Vs.? Whatever FM
?
Everyone
Stay safe and Healthy
?
Don
KA9QJG
|
True FM is achieved by actually modulating the carrier's FREQUENCY. 'UnTrue FM' is usually achieved by modulating the PHASE of a fixed carrier and properly shaping the audio frequency response of the mic amplifier.? The two methods should be indistinguishable over the normal voice spectrum but 'UnTrue FM' becomes impractical at very low audio frequencies. -Mike- WA6ZTY
On Sunday, February 21, 2021, 03:31:38 PM PST, KA9QJG <ka9qjg@...> wrote:
? ? As?? Ham radio operators, some people getting into Amateur radio and others for some reason think We know everything WOW I wonder where? they? get that from, LOL that’s almost as? bad as saying Ham Radio operators are cheap too ? Well, over the years, with all the neighbors seeing? Me climbing trees and putting up antennas and? Me telling all about the great things we do in ham radio trying to save the world from all the disasters providing Emergency Communications, ? ?? I ask if I can use their trees too. Everyone said, ok. ?Then they see me and ask me to fix everything from toasters, microwaves. Wifes curling iron, tv, cell, tablets and computers, and the list go on and on. I refuse? some and will not even post what they were, LOL ? So, After all, my rambling on a? 14 in? Snow now 14 deg winter afternoon in N/W Indiana, ? ? ? Finally,? if you are still here, this is ?My excuse for taking up bandwidth... ?For over 30 yrs and thanks to this group, I have been building and still using repeaters; Some have to hear me say well back in the day, some of the transmitters were advertised as? True FM; One evening on the repeater Tech Net, ??A newly Lic Ham ask what is real FM. His BO-Thing must not be accurate. Without going into the thoughts of? BO-Thing ?not being much of anything? True, ? I honestly did not answer this, So This is my question that someone on here should put in layman terms for Me. So what is True FM? Vs.? Whatever FM ? Everyone Stay safe and Healthy ? Don KA9QJG
|
Re: The passing of an icon
Sad news- Ted was a fixture of the industry, especially here in the Chicago area. I always enjoyed my visits with him.
73's OM.
Tom W9SRV
On Sunday, February 21, 2021, 05:30:06 PM CST, Howard <n9ktw@...> wrote:
It is with great sadness that I have to report the passing of Ted Bleiman, K9MDM, AKA Lefty due to complications from CoVid-19, on Saturday February 20, 2021.
?
Those of us in the ham and radio communications community remember him for his days at SPECTRONICS and later MDM radio. Ted was the “go to guy” for almost all the hard to find 2-way and repeater parts in the Chicago area (and maybe the country). His company motto was “ if it’s in stock, we’ve got it”
?
I knew Ted personally for quite a number of years, and he was the guy that was willing to help anyone any time with an electronic problem. Ted “officially” retired from the business about 5 years ago, but some of us knew he still had information to share, and occasionally a few VERY obscure parts!
?
Ted will be greatly missed by the electronics community as a whole and me personally (as my adopted uncle).
?
?
De Howard, N9KTW
|
? ? As?? Ham radio operators, some people getting into Amateur radio and others for some reason think We know everything WOW I wonder where? they? get that from, LOL that’s almost as? bad as saying Ham Radio operators are cheap too ? Well, over the years, with all the neighbors seeing? Me climbing trees and putting up antennas and? Me telling all about the great things we do in ham radio trying to save the world from all the disasters providing Emergency Communications, ? ?? I ask if I can use their trees too. Everyone said, ok. ?Then they see me and ask me to fix everything from toasters, microwaves. Wifes curling iron, tv, cell, tablets and computers, and the list go on and on. I refuse? some and will not even post what they were, LOL ? So, After all, my rambling on a? 14 in? Snow now 14 deg winter afternoon in N/W Indiana, ? ? ? Finally,? if you are still here, this is ?My excuse for taking up bandwidth... ?For over 30 yrs and thanks to this group, I have been building and still using repeaters; Some have to hear me say well back in the day, some of the transmitters were advertised as? True FM; One evening on the repeater Tech Net, ??A newly Lic Ham ask what is real FM. His BO-Thing must not be accurate. Without going into the thoughts of? BO-Thing ?not being much of anything? True, ? I honestly did not answer this, So This is my question that someone on here should put in layman terms for Me. So what is True FM? Vs.? Whatever FM ? Everyone Stay safe and Healthy ? Don KA9QJG
|
It is with great sadness that I have to report the passing of Ted Bleiman, K9MDM, AKA Lefty due to complications from CoVid-19, on Saturday February 20, 2021.
?
Those of us in the ham and radio communications community remember him for his days at SPECTRONICS and later MDM radio. Ted was the “go to guy” for almost all the hard to find 2-way and repeater parts in the Chicago area (and maybe the country). His company motto was “ if it’s in stock, we’ve got it”
?
I knew Ted personally for quite a number of years, and he was the guy that was willing to help anyone any time with an electronic problem. Ted “officially” retired from the business about 5 years ago, but some of us knew he still had information to share, and occasionally a few VERY obscure parts!
?
Ted will be greatly missed by the electronics community as a whole and me personally (as my adopted uncle).
?
?
De Howard, N9KTW
|
Anyone using FM mode on the Repeater Builder STM32 MMDVM board with an MSF5000?
Now that FM mode is available on the V3 card, I'm thinking about using it as an external controller on my MSF5000 repeater.? I just updated my V3 card with the latest software, and upgraded to the latest Pi-Star image and am ready to build an interface cable for the MSF 5000.
I'm finding little data online about the FM mode, so reaching out here.
Has anyone got these 2 devices connected together and working FM plus digital modes?? Any info on how difficult it is to integrate and how well it works would be appreciated.
Ron
KA3JIJ
|
Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
I haven’t done it with the HT1000 radios but I did create a back to back link one time using MT1000 radios.? IIRC the MT1000 put a DC voltage on the speaker output when the audio was being passed and I used it as the COR. Just an FYI - I would not recommend using any portable radio for a high duty transmit application. ? Andy / NC4AB ? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Troy Lousen
Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2021 3:56 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [repeater-builder] COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver? I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)? Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
--
Troy Lousen
N7KAM
Spokane? WA
|
Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
Hi Troy,?
I dont know about the HT1000 or any other radio that would fit perfectly your project but I have a few point that could help you.
If you are a bit savy with electronics I would recommend to use your own controler that shut down the parts of the repeater system that dont need to be powered when in standby.
Like if you use 2 radio, the transmiter side dont need to draw any curent if not in use, so cuting the whole power to it will go? long way into keeping the supply on the lite side. You can do this with a simple circuit that use a N-channel Mosfet with a very low on resistance and high power enough to drive the radio. Just feed a positive signal to the gate and it will drive the power to the radio without a problem. Use it as a sink ( in serie with the negative line of the radio. Also make sure that the Max voltage is under 75% of the max power supply voltage. Make sure to check how the radio react to go into ptt when just powered on. most digital radio wont like that, but any old stuff that works with xtal wont care much or it will not be perfectly on frequency for the very start of the transmission. also keep the Transmitter? on for some time and cut it back after a few minute of no activity. Such circuit can be a simple large resistor (in value) in parallel with a large capacitor at the gate of the mosfet. That way the gate will still be saturated for a few minute before going low enough for the mosfet to open.
On the receiving section. the audio circuit of a small receiver pull the most power of the circuit. So if you get your audio source from the discriminator or not too far from it, you can disable the final audio power amplifier, even at no output at all you have a few hundred miliamp drawn by the circuit.?
I know it is sometime hard surgery to do. but you can have a nice receiver that will draw so little current in standby that your setup will keep on going, on long winter night.
The ID-o-Matic controler can also be a power drain.? removing the led from the controler will help. Also check if the pic controler into the ID-O-Matic have the deep sleep mode enabled when waiting for a cor signal to triger it. I dont remember if they use it, and if not look at a small controler that do. 15nanoamps is what the pic micro controler draw in that mode. Pretty nice I must say.
One last comment. Be carfull about the voltage controler you will use for the solar panel. Some are very noisy.
For the rest many people here have good info for the choice of radio that you can use.? I never taken a look at such thing for a repeater but I did do some remote monitoring of distant site for my work (security system) and that was a few of the stuff I did.
Pierre
VE2PF
|
Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
How much power does the UHF require on transmit? ? How noisy is the site?
Andy
WJ9J
On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 4:02 PM Troy Lousen < tlousenrb@...> wrote:
I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)?
?
Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
?
Thanks,
?
Troy
N7KAM
?
?
?
?
--
Troy Lousen
N7KAM
Spokane? WA
|
COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)?
?
Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
?
Thanks,
?
Troy
N7KAM
?
?
?
?
-- Troy Lousen N7KAM Spokane? WA
|
Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
I wondered what became of Michael, Tom. That answers that! He was always a pleasure to deal with. I haven't been back since he retired & they stopped doing LMR crystals for a while. I've had one rock go bad after 15 years, the rest are still chugging along. I don't think that one ever was right, but I blamed it on the element & it seemed to behave in another. ICM was always the gold standard, but most of my orders were with Bomar for half the price. Really helped stretch the dollars then. QuartsLab was showing real promise, though their 2x price hike is a real turn-off. Bob D & I are really hoping Krystaly comes through. And Matt's experience with the delivery issues is just awful.
-W6XC
On Sat, Feb 20, 2021 at 5:35 PM Tom Parker < thp@...> wrote: Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash ?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler < no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
|
Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Last order I had from Bomar got sent to another town with the same name in a totally different state never to be heard from again, then when they remade the lost order it was sent in two packages for some reason and only one showed up.
On Sat, Feb 20, 2021, 17:35 Tom Parker < thp@...> wrote: Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash ?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler < no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
|
UHF and uW parts at MMARSI auction
Guys,
Anyone looking for some UHF or microwave parts or components, take a look at the MMARSI.org internet auction site.? Scan down the list of items and you'll come to a group of items that might be of interest to you.
This auction gets up-dated weekly, so keep an eye on it from time to time.
73, Gary? W3DTN
|
Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 20, 2021, at 6:33 PM, Ralph Mowery via groups.io <ku4pt@...> wrote:
?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler <no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
|
Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler <no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
|
Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure. Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago. I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
|
Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
The last two Bomar crystals I got had problems. I never went back. I
can't recall exactly when this was, but it was shortly before
International went out. International was my last crystal purchase,
maybe a few months before they closed.
Chuck
WB2EDV
On 2/20/2021 6:27 PM, Ron Wright via
groups.io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they
worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on
freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal
and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased
over 100 crystals from Bomar.
73, ron, n9ee/r
|
RFI-EMI-GUY
Pierre Martel
Matt Lechliter