Anyone using FM mode on the Repeater Builder STM32 MMDVM board with an MSF5000?
Now that FM mode is available on the V3 card, I'm thinking about using it as an external controller on my MSF5000 repeater.? I just updated my V3 card with the latest software, and upgraded to the latest Pi-Star image and am ready to build an interface cable for the MSF 5000.
I'm finding little data online about the FM mode, so reaching out here.
Has anyone got these 2 devices connected together and working FM plus digital modes?? Any info on how difficult it is to integrate and how well it works would be appreciated.
Ron
KA3JIJ
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Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
I haven’t done it with the HT1000 radios but I did create a back to back link one time using MT1000 radios.? IIRC the MT1000 put a DC voltage on the speaker output when the audio was being passed and I used it as the COR. Just an FYI - I would not recommend using any portable radio for a high duty transmit application. ? Andy / NC4AB ? ?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Troy Lousen
Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2021 3:56 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [repeater-builder] COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver? I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)? Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
--
Troy Lousen
N7KAM
Spokane? WA
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Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
Hi Troy,?
I dont know about the HT1000 or any other radio that would fit perfectly your project but I have a few point that could help you.
If you are a bit savy with electronics I would recommend to use your own controler that shut down the parts of the repeater system that dont need to be powered when in standby.
Like if you use 2 radio, the transmiter side dont need to draw any curent if not in use, so cuting the whole power to it will go? long way into keeping the supply on the lite side. You can do this with a simple circuit that use a N-channel Mosfet with a very low on resistance and high power enough to drive the radio. Just feed a positive signal to the gate and it will drive the power to the radio without a problem. Use it as a sink ( in serie with the negative line of the radio. Also make sure that the Max voltage is under 75% of the max power supply voltage. Make sure to check how the radio react to go into ptt when just powered on. most digital radio wont like that, but any old stuff that works with xtal wont care much or it will not be perfectly on frequency for the very start of the transmission. also keep the Transmitter? on for some time and cut it back after a few minute of no activity. Such circuit can be a simple large resistor (in value) in parallel with a large capacitor at the gate of the mosfet. That way the gate will still be saturated for a few minute before going low enough for the mosfet to open.
On the receiving section. the audio circuit of a small receiver pull the most power of the circuit. So if you get your audio source from the discriminator or not too far from it, you can disable the final audio power amplifier, even at no output at all you have a few hundred miliamp drawn by the circuit.?
I know it is sometime hard surgery to do. but you can have a nice receiver that will draw so little current in standby that your setup will keep on going, on long winter night.
The ID-o-Matic controler can also be a power drain.? removing the led from the controler will help. Also check if the pic controler into the ID-O-Matic have the deep sleep mode enabled when waiting for a cor signal to triger it. I dont remember if they use it, and if not look at a small controler that do. 15nanoamps is what the pic micro controler draw in that mode. Pretty nice I must say.
One last comment. Be carfull about the voltage controler you will use for the solar panel. Some are very noisy.
For the rest many people here have good info for the choice of radio that you can use.? I never taken a look at such thing for a repeater but I did do some remote monitoring of distant site for my work (security system) and that was a few of the stuff I did.
Pierre
VE2PF
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Re: COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
How much power does the UHF require on transmit? ? How noisy is the site?
Andy
WJ9J
On Sun, Feb 21, 2021 at 4:02 PM Troy Lousen < tlousenrb@...> wrote:
I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)?
?
Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
?
Thanks,
?
Troy
N7KAM
?
?
?
?
--
Troy Lousen
N7KAM
Spokane? WA
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COR Signal from HT1000 (or similar) for Remote Receiver
I am looking at options for a remote receiver project (receive on VHF - link to primary transmitter on UHF).? The project requires very low power consumption since there is no utility power at the site.?? I have seen some references indicating that a pair of Motorola HT1000 Radios could work well for this.? Has anyone done this and found a good way to obtain the COR indication to be sent to a controller (possibly an ID-O-Matic)?
?
Any other thoughts on what people have done similar to this even with different radios are welcome.? Cost is an issue, but probably could spend a couple hundred dollars per radio if there is a better approach.
?
Thanks,
?
Troy
N7KAM
?
?
?
?
-- Troy Lousen N7KAM Spokane? WA
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Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
I wondered what became of Michael, Tom. That answers that! He was always a pleasure to deal with. I haven't been back since he retired & they stopped doing LMR crystals for a while. I've had one rock go bad after 15 years, the rest are still chugging along. I don't think that one ever was right, but I blamed it on the element & it seemed to behave in another. ICM was always the gold standard, but most of my orders were with Bomar for half the price. Really helped stretch the dollars then. QuartsLab was showing real promise, though their 2x price hike is a real turn-off. Bob D & I are really hoping Krystaly comes through. And Matt's experience with the delivery issues is just awful.
-W6XC
On Sat, Feb 20, 2021 at 5:35 PM Tom Parker < thp@...> wrote: Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash ?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler < no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
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Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Last order I had from Bomar got sent to another town with the same name in a totally different state never to be heard from again, then when they remade the lost order it was sent in two packages for some reason and only one showed up.
On Sat, Feb 20, 2021, 17:35 Tom Parker < thp@...> wrote: Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash ?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler < no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
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UHF and uW parts at MMARSI auction
Guys,
Anyone looking for some UHF or microwave parts or components, take a look at the MMARSI.org internet auction site.? Scan down the list of items and you'll come to a group of items that might be of interest to you.
This auction gets up-dated weekly, so keep an eye on it from time to time.
73, Gary? W3DTN
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Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Well, my 2 cents is, Michael retired... that’s when BOMAR went in the trash
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On Feb 20, 2021, at 6:33 PM, Ralph Mowery via groups.io <ku4pt@...> wrote:
?
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler <no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
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Re: Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
Years ago when most ham radios in the FM 2 meter band used crystals, they did not do very well .? They would often drift off frequency and after a while drift too much to be pulled back on frequency. We stayed away from them in this area.
Ralph ku4pt
On Saturday, February 20, 2021, 07:13:17 PM EST, Bob Dengler <no6b@...> wrote:
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: >I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
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Avoid Bomar crystals (was) Re: [repeater-builder] Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
At 2/20/2021 03:27 PM, you wrote: I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure. Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago. I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar. "That was YEARS ago" (my emphasis). See Kevin's message: Bomar is NG now. Bob NO6B
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Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
The last two Bomar crystals I got had problems. I never went back. I
can't recall exactly when this was, but it was shortly before
International went out. International was my last crystal purchase,
maybe a few months before they closed.
Chuck
WB2EDV
On 2/20/2021 6:27 PM, Ron Wright via
groups.io wrote:
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I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they
worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on
freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal
and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased
over 100 crystals from Bomar.
73, ron, n9ee/r
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Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
I have used many many Bomar crystals over the years and they worked very well, not seen a failure.? Did get one for 6m not on freq, claimed did not calculate base freq out to needed decimal and they replaced quickly, that was years ago.? I've purchased over 100 crystals from Bomar.
73, ron, n9ee/r
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Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
The correct date was 9/24/ 2019.? Len k4lfk
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I paid 46.76 pounds for the TX and RX VHF MSR2000 crystals with shipping on 9/42/2019.? Len k4lfk
At 2/18/2021 12:40 PM, you wrote:
>I have to agree with Bob and Kevin. My past experience with Bomar has been awful.
>
>With respect to Quartslab, maybe crystals for GE are less expensive than for Motorola. The quote I received for the Motorola elements was almost twice what Skipp paid for his GE elements. That or else business is booming and the price is rising in response
to increased demand.
QuartSLab prices for G.E. xtals went up over 70% in just 18 months, & that was as of a month ago.? Maybe they went up another 20% since then?
Bob NO6B
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Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
I paid 46.76 pounds for the TX and RX VHF MSR2000 crystals with shipping on 9/42/2019.? Len k4lfk
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At 2/18/2021 12:40 PM, you wrote:
>I have to agree with Bob and Kevin. My past experience with Bomar has been awful.
>
>With respect to Quartslab, maybe crystals for GE are less expensive than for Motorola. The quote I received for the Motorola elements was almost twice what Skipp paid for his GE elements. That or else business is booming and the price is rising in response
to increased demand.
QuartSLab prices for G.E. xtals went up over 70% in just 18 months, & that was as of a month ago.? Maybe they went up another 20% since then?
Bob NO6B
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Re: Krystaly Rocks for MSR2000
At 2/18/2021 12:40 PM, you wrote: I have to agree with Bob and Kevin. My past experience with Bomar has been awful.
With respect to Quartslab, maybe crystals for GE are less expensive than for Motorola. The quote I received for the Motorola elements was almost twice what Skipp paid for his GE elements. That or else business is booming and the price is rising in response to increased demand. QuartSLab prices for G.E. xtals went up over 70% in just 18 months, & that was as of a month ago. Maybe they went up another 20% since then? Bob NO6B
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Re: How to prevent repeating DTMF remote control commands on the TKR-750?
Years ago I ran a touch-tone function decoder on my Santiago Peak repeater that was fed by pre PL muted audio. No tone at all was required to send it a command. And since it didn't require PL to talk to it, it didn't key up the repeater either. So basically,
nobody knew that I even had the control system. I had a special control channel programmed that was the same freq just without PL. I would drop to low power, which back then was 200mw, do my commanding and nobody knew the difference. I was lucky that nobody
figured that out, considering we had active hackers on the band back then, really lucky.
td
wb6mie
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I have the same problem here. There are a couple of pirate stations that
have been occasionally showing up on my repeater. My response is to shut
the repeater off for a while. My codes were originally sequential, like
12340=OFF and 12341=ON. I changed the ON code to something completely
different so it would be more difficult to figure out.
My long term solution is to install an external controller (S-COM) on
the repeater that mutes DTMF and add an audio delay board to eliminate
the first DTMF digit.
I had thought of how to use the TKR-750 alone to mute DTMF, but could
not find an option to do this. A trick that I thought would work is to
program codes to disable the repeater and then channel switch to a
different receive frequency that will pass through the duplexer. You can
then do your DTMF commands on a different frequency than the input
frequency. It's just an idea, but I never figured out the details to see
if it would actually work.
My external S-Com controller will allow more flexibility, like changing
power, changing PL, switching to DCS, macros, etc that the limited
internal controller cannot do. It also adds the important option of a
control receiver.
73, Joe, K1ike
On 2/19/2021 8:23 AM, srikanth bhat via groups.io wrote:
> Hello,
> I have set up DTMF remote control for the TKR-750. The control commands are going to be repeated (and heard, copied by all users) when they are sent to the input frequency to remote control the repeater.? Is there a way to prevent this to ensure remote controls
are only accessible to the admin?
> tnx & 73
> Sri, vu2sbj
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Re: How to prevent repeating DTMF remote control commands on the TKR-750?
- Thanks Jeff - but that would mean that normal repeat function would require a tone to get through - correct?
? Are you saying that you operate the repeater carrier-squelch? ? If so, then I'd do the audio muting externally, but still use TOR to do it: ? - Program repeater for duplex instead of repeat.? In making this change, you now have to key the transmitter yourself, and route audio from RA to TA yourself.
? - Program a PL or DPL decode tone for the receiver.
? - Program an output for COR, and a separate one for TOR, both active-low.
? - Tie COR to external PTT.? Whenever COR goes active, it will key the transmitter, i.e. the repeater will repeat based on noise squelch squelch.?
? - Run RA audio through a normally closed relay (or solid state equivalent circuit) back into TA to complete the repeat audio path.? The relay coil is then driven by TOR (buffer as necessary).? When you transmit with the programmed PL tone, the normally-closed relay will open up, so no receive audio goes to the transmitter while you're sending DTMF to control the repeater.
? All of this would obviously be just as easy to do with a real repeater controller, but you could get by with the bare minimum this way. ? ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????? --- Jeff WN3A ?
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Re: How to prevent repeating DTMF remote control commands on the TKR-750?
Here is something to think about also that may help. Look at the attached file. Rather than using a CTCSS decoder, I used the COR from the control radio.
Mick - W7CAT
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----- Original Message ----- From: Jeff DePolo WN3A To: [email protected]Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 08:05:11 AM Subject: Re: [repeater-builder] How to prevent repeating DTMF remote control commands on the TKR-750? I have set up DTMF remote control for the TKR-750. The control commands
are going to be repeated (and heard, copied by all users) when they are sent to the input frequency to remote control the repeater. Is there a
way to prevent this to ensure remote controls are only accessible to the
admin?
Unless I'm mis-remembering, you should be able to uncheck the box
that says "Remote Access with QT/DQT" in the Remote Control screen. That will allow you to send DTMF to control the repeater without having to send the PL/DPL that the repeater receiver is configured for. After disabling that, you should be able to transmit with no PL tone (or any other "wrong" tone) to command the repeater, but your audio won't be repeated because you're not sending the correct tone to open up the receiver and repeat audio path. Someone listening on the input might still be able to copy your DTMF digits, but at least it won't be repeated out the repeater transmitter.
--- Jeff WN3A
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
-- Untitled Document
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Re: How to prevent repeating DTMF remote control commands on the TKR-750?
What Dan sezs.
I've installed this at our main repeater site:
<>
We have a CDM-750 that is within 100 KHz of the UHF repeater input, and it feeds this DTMF decoder. I don't even use PL to gate the audio. This way, from home or the car, we can quickly shut down the repeaters. We also have IP base AC strip controllers where we can reboot just about everything. You can for each outlet, turn it on, off? or reboot.
Warning: The outlet that controls your site Internet router? Only use the reboot option on that ac socket. Never trigger "Off" figuring you can go back in and trigger "on". Ask me how I know!
73 de Tom K8TB
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On 2/19/2021 10:17 AM, Dan Woodie wrote: Just use a separate receiver on another frequency and a DTMF controlled relay.? There is a good unit that has 8 relays that is advertised in the back of every QST magazine. You can then connect that to the programmable logic ins and TX disable, RPT Disable, change channel, etc without having to add a repeater controller in-line and without the codes being on the input frequency.
Thanks,
Dan Woodie, CETsr
KC8ZUM
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Pierre Martel
Matt Lechliter