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Further to the recent issues regarding 14mm axles I am finding that some kits do not allow the distance between the frames to be adjusted to match the gauge and maintain the correct relationship between cranks, motion and cylinders etc. For example with my Backwoods K1 Garratt it means that the flycranks etc, are too close to the frames by 1.25 mm each side (16.5 - 14) / 2. In 4mm many kit manufacturers supply different frame spacers to suit OO, EM and P4. With the rise in 14mm gauge perhaps the kit manufacturers should be encouraged to do the same. On my K1 I am now considering whether to make new longer axle extensions (probably in steel) to which I could attach the flycranks directly instead of using the plastic bushes. This would mean another complete dismantle and restart, with completion even further away. At least it will be a respite from the Xmas telly repeats! John C

14mm Gauge Standards I note that a set of standards, copied from NG&I REVIEW issue 14 are published in the 'Files' section for this group. These were tentative, and a revised set of standards, based on experience, have been part of the RCL 'Product Handbook' (page T14) for some time. A copy, together with an explanation of the way the dimensions work to make reliable turnouts is attached, as a PDF. These standards are derived from the old British Railway Modelling Standards Bureau (BRMSB) document 'Standard Dimensions'. When, in the 1980s, I was developing proper wheels for 7mm scale narrow gauge rolling stock, the best commercial profile available was (and remains) that for 'EM'. I took the BRMSB dimensions for EM (18.00mm gauge), deducted 4mm as appropriate and made a few slight adjustments in the light of experience. The 'EM' profile, as made by Alan Gibson, Maygib etc., represents a profile (in 7mm scale) part way between the Festiniog Railway 'Coach' and 'locomotive' wheel profiles as drawn in 'Vignes Atlas'. The flange is a little overscale, but not as much as Romfords. With regard the latter, the 'RP' is not, if I understand Mark Arscott of Romford correctly, 'Recommended practice (NMRA) but stands for 'Romford Profile'. It follows NMRA RP-25 standards to an extent, but should not be considered interchangeable with that profile. The Romford wheels are entirely at home, however, with my modified standards - note that recent i.c. loco kits use solid turned nickel silver wheels made for us by Romford. The trick is getting the back to back measure correct. I have a small layout built using these standards, with three turnouts (see recent issues of NG&IRM REVIEW). All the stock have EM profile wheels, machined in steel, those on the locos being polished out to aid current collection. none of the rolling stock has any additional weight. Rakes of six skips can be propelled at the top speed (a scale 20mph) through turnouts without any fear of derailment. The 'trick' is solely one of keeping to the standards and not deviating. Additional reliability comes from having locos and stock where the overall lengths and wheelbases are near identical. The 'Rugga' chassis helps too, as the ends are rounded. non-industrial prototypes, with varying lengths, wheelbases etc., will always be more difficult to resolve in terms of good running. Mixing disparate prototypes is another cause of problems, in the real and model world. Please bear in mind that I developed these standards to ensure my range of 7mm scale, 14mm gauge kits worked reliably, given that no set standards existed at the time of development. I have always felt that, for 'larger' two-foot gauge equipment, a development of the NMRA standards for 'On2' would be more appropriate. Roy C Link

Amongst all these unmade kits, can anyone help me to find a 7mm DJB BR Class 4 Tank kit to purchase please? I have a Gibson Lynton & Barnstaple "LEW" 7mm NG unmade kit to exchange or for sale. Many thanks Tony Spencer

Frank, All, Question time sounds like a great idea. We have 50 members, and I know for sure that several don't model in O-14. It would be nice to know who does. The group poll feature won't work for these types of questions, so an email poll it is. Please remember to delete everything except the questions when you reply. Non O-14 modellers please answer too! My answers (with a new question 6): (1) Are you actually working to 14mm gauge? Yes (although progress is slow) (2) if so are you using the RCL standard, if not what variation are you using? Using RCL standards, although exact scale sounds like a great challenge-standards would come from the museum I belong to. (3) What are you modelling? small town/wharf/warehouse light railway with mining as a later expansion. (www.geocities.com/mark_the_train_brain/layout.htm) (4) Are you on DC or DCC or thinking of the latter? DC, not considering DCC unless sound gets some bass (Ossynths steam has caught my eye though) (5) Be as vague as you choose, but roughly where are you? (I suppose you mean geographically) Carlingford, Sydney Australia (6) If you answered yes to (1), how long have you been modelling in O-14? About 9 months Frank, its not MY site, those who use it own it-I'm only here to stop spamming and other undesirable occurences from happening. Regards, Mark K SydOz

(1) Are you actually working to 14mm gauge? No not yet, have one 16.5 loco and four items of rolling stock, I have a plan but no layout yet. (2) if so are you using the RCL standard, if not what variation are you using? Intend using RCL standards. (3) What are you modelling? Initially a quarry, then something Festiniog like. (4) Are you on DC or DCC or thinking of the latter? No (5) Be as vague as you choose, but roughly where are you? Essex, Thames Estury (6) If you answered yes to (1), how long have you been modelling in O-14? N/A Peter Whitehead

I have posted a folder of "under construction" photos of my Wrightlines Baldwin slowly being finished as 590 from the WHR- follow the link: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/O-14/files/WDLRBaldwin/ I am ashamed to admit that the receipt in the kit's box revealed that I bought it in 1994! Slow worker or what? I will finish it one day Roy, honest! Regards Steve

Please excuse me cross posting to three groups - apologies to those who receive this more than once... I have built myself a (very) small number of narrow gauge goods wagons in 1/4" scale - 2' gauge prototypes modelled in On30. However I remain uncommitted to 1/4" scale, and am contemplating moving to 7mm scale and 14mm gauge to better represent the appearance of the 2' gauge. Whilst at first glance making models to 7mm scale instead of 1/4" sounds easy, I have begun to realise I don't know whether I can source equivalent materials in the larger scale. My wagons have scale sized lumber - about 8 different sizes in the open wagon. For example, the sides and ends have a length each of 8x2 and 6x2 timber, while the decking has 24 planks of the 8x2 dimension (for the 16' total length). This is easy in 1/4" scale, as there are (at least) two manufacturers of scale sized lumber in 1/4" scale. If I need a piece of 8x2, I go to the little pack labeled 8x2 and there it is. Does anybody make scale size lumber in 7mm scale? What do people do when faced with the need for 24 pieces of 7mm scale 8x2? Wheels are another issue. My prototype uses 21" wheels, which are within 1% of HO 36" wheels, and readily available. In 7mm that wheel diameter becomes 12.3mm - any suggestions for 21" wheels in 7mm scale? The passenger car for which I am finalizing drawings now in 1/4" scale is easier. The prototype had 3" wide boards, 90 of them. I can do this in 1/4" by using .060" scribed styrene and am about 3% narrow. That doesn't worry me too much - more important to get the number of boards between each pair of windows correct, I think. Fortunately I can buy "Freight Car Siding" with a groove spacing of 0.067" (1.69mm) which is just as close to the scale dimension of 0.069" (1.75mm). So, the big issue for me seems to be the use of scale sized lumber and 21" wheels. What do the 7mm modellers do for this? John ========================================================== John Dennis jdennis@... Melbourne,Australia Home of the HOn30 Dutton Bay Tramway and the Australian Narrow Gauge Web-Exhibition Gallery Dutton Bay URL: http://members.optusnet.com.au/duttonbay WebX http://members.optusnet.com.au/jdennis/ng_webex.html

Roy - I've been trying to get several publications related to brickworks from you for about four months. Initially you seemed willing to sell these to me, but for the past two months you've been ignoring my emails. Since you're in communication with this group, I thought I'd try an email here. Could you tell me what's going on? Charles Hansen

Here's what I am up to, work permitting: (1) Are you actually working to 14mm gauge? Yes, but I also get distracted by Bachmann On30 and 16mm finescale (2 rail electric, not live steam high speed caricatures). Also working to 1432mm gauge, 304.8mm/ft, but that pays the bills and gets in the way of hobbies:-) (2) if so are you using the RCL standard, if not what variation are you using? Using Roy's standards. (3) What are you modelling? Ffestiniog and Welsh Highland with industrial thrown in for good measure - that and On30 plus the 16mm scale probably explains why I have not finished a layout yet! (4) Are you on DC or DCC or thinking of the latter? DC - can't see how a decoder would go in a Lister, although it would be no problem in the FR stuff. I have no plans to play with DCC in the near future though. (5) Be as vague as you choose, but roughly where are you? Sutton Coldfield, Birmingham UK (that should upset some of the locals who think Sutton should declare "UDI" from Brum) (6) If you answered yes to (1), how long have you been modelling in O-14? Ever since Roy Link introduced his range of kits. Regards Steve

John, If you switch to 7mm you can use HO scale lumber by Mt Albert or Kappler Mill & Lumber. Kappler do an HO 16x4 which is exactly 8x2 in O scale. Kappler can be obtained in Australia from Trains & Tracks (Christmas Every Day). Sorry I cannot help with a source for the wheels, Regards, Grant

Dear Charles, Sincere apologies, I got thoroughly confused with our dealings, to the point where I put my head in the sand. Please confirm EXACTLY what you want, plus how you want to pay, and I will get the order out after Christmas. Regards, Roy

I believe that Paragon supplies all of Roy's stuff. They were very helpful to me on a recent order of his manual but I believe the binder is out of stock so I received a plain one instead. I can't find the address but I am sure somebody here has it. Vincent

Steve and All, I said I would report on progress with RCL Lister and DCC. I've spend another afternoon playing with it, and I have got a DCC chip in. I've used the Digitrax DZ123, though with a bit more filing the ZTC 217 might just go in the same place. It shows, you can see it, but when painted black I bet no-one ever spots it. Assemble the floor, frames and ends. Roy suggests holding it together with florists wire whist soldering with a small gas torch. I used a torch, but assembled the bits in a Skamulex block (Vermiculite) from Squires with map pins. Drowned it in Bakers No. 3 flux, put bits of solder where required and applied torch. It means it is well soldered together, which it needs to be. Only then take a piercing saw and cut out the flat plate between the chequer plate and where the motor cover fits. On the chequer plate side there is a plain strip about 2mm wide, file away all except the outer 3mm at each end. On the other side file away the same strip up to the vertical edge of the angle section which runs across the floor, leave the same 3mm ends. On the chassis block, file or mill down the top of the chassis, just where it is under the opening you have created in the floor. Take it down until the shaft between the worms is only just clear of the file. Don't file with the shaft in place, keep cleaning out the brass dust and trying it. Assemble chassis block to floor/frame assembly, the chip will JUST fit into the recess formed in the floor. You need to file some of the underside of the gearbox away so it will seat down properly on top of the chip. You lose most of the open space either side of the flat plate, but only a few are going to notice. I bought the chip, and the ZTC one to see if they would fit in the back of a portly driver, with the wires let into the back of the legs. I still think this could be done. I can fit isolated pickups on both sides, but I am worried about the clearance of the brushes and the engine cover. I need to be sure they are isolated and stay isolated. I have a Branchlines new micromotor and it will fit with much more space to get the wires in, I just wonder if it has the power for two worm gear sets. Sorry Roy, but next job is to find a way of fitting some cut down Kadee's. Once I've got that sorted I'll post some pictures. Frank

How well does she run on DCC? I am using DCC with 0-9 have just used a couple of Lenz decoders and a couple of TCS - the TCS are OK the Lenz are very good - I also model in HO and have Digitrax DCC systems BUT I prefer Lenz decoders - why think of ZTC? Bill

Here are my answers (for what it's worth!): (1) Are you actually working to 14mm gauge? Yes - ish - I have a number of Roy Link's kits, but nowhere to run them at the moment (2) if so are you using the RCL standard, if not what variation are you using I am using Roy Link's standards and Romford 'RP25' with the back-to-back and check gauge (back of one wheel to the outside of the other wheel's flange) 'tweaked' to suit Roy's standards. I have done this by carefully reducing the back of each wheel boss to suit the axle - not easy as I have found a bit of variation in the axles! (3) What are you modelling It's a secret - even I don't know but it is likely to be a forrestery line set on the Welsh/English border (4) Are you on DC or DCC or thinking of the latter Good old 'Digit'-al operation - I push the controller with my digit (finger). (5) Be as vague as you choose, but roughly where are you Up to my neck (as usual) near Gloucester Regards and Merry Christmas to all, Robin Edwards

In response to Mr Clutterbuck's query regarding the Ossynths sound system and DCC I can confirm that the two are mutually incompatible. The Ossynths unit puts out pure DC (so you need locos with coreless motors). The sound provided by both the IC and steam systems is superior in every way to that provided by DCC, which, as the sound chip is in the loco, does not benefit from the auxiliary speakers, nor the powerful output Otto has cleverly contrived. As far as I am aware, Otto's diesel system is the only one to offer 'diesel mechanical' sound, with a choice of 1, 2, 3 or 4 cylinder units. No DCC system I know of offers 'wheel and rolling stock' sound options either. Hearing a loco running 'light engine' rumbling over light rails, buffing up to a train, then the whole moving off with the clatter of skips or groan of timber wagons is a treat DCC owners can only dream of. DCC though, does have benefits, particularly with large systems, where multiple train movements are required. This aspect is of less importance for narrow gauge operations where often, only one loco is 'in steam' as a matter of course. I know Otto can make systems that cope with more than one loco, my own diesel system provides 2 or 3 cylinder modes (for a Ruston LAT & LBT). My steam system will cope with either UK, European or US narrow gauge steam. Roy

--On 19 December 2004 12:47 +0000 Frank Sharp <Frank.J.Sharp@...> wrote: No. I have gone too far down the path of larger narrow gauge railways on 16.5. Very little of my stock would be suitable for conversion. But then, if I suddenly get the urge to start again..... Imaginary "general carrier" in West Dorset, The Marshwood Vale Railway, centred on Bridport. Using various features from the Welshpool & Llanfair, Southwold, Manx, Irish lines, etc. DC. Have given much thought to DCC, and can see the advantages, especially at shows, when we can get a bit tied up with two operators. No plans to take the plunge though. Definitely! Dave.T

--- Frank Sharp <Frank.J.Sharp@...> wrote: (1) Are you actually working to 14mm gauge? Yes--for about 8 months on and off. (2) if so are you using the RCL standard, if not what variation are you using? I'm using Roy's standards. (3) What are you modelling A sand pit in Argentina interchanging with the 75cm FICA. (4) Are you on DC or DCC or thinking of the latter No DCC at this time. Unless I can figure a way to mount it into an RCL Lister. (5) Be as vague as you choose, but roughly where are you Redmond, Washington, USA (10 km east of Seattle). Dave Eggleston __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail