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This might be one for the nice Mr Link...? In the bumper 100th NGI Review, Roy wrote about the use of ultrasonic cleaners and pumice blasting for model preparation?and again mentioned it in these very pages on line.? Up to now I have cleaned my brass models with a fibreglass stick (also now impossible to source - any ideas) then scrubbed them in a? strong solution of Cillit Bang before rinsing, drying?and spraying with Railmatch self etch primer. The paint is still not really as well stuck as I would like though.?
I have been looking?for a reasonably priced blast gun and have found an expensive Paasche model and a cheap and cheerful ebay sourced model HS178 at around 25 quid.? This is called an aero-eraser.? Is this the same thing?? Where does one source the grit? What is best to use etc etc.? ? Then to the Ultrasonic cleaner.? Is another ebay source going to be reliable for the occasional clean - I am not building models?for a living.? The big problem is the prospect of 4 more Leek and Manifold carriages as they are 31cm long and the 6.5 litre models seem to be 30cm long.? To get one in properly would mean a 15 litre tank model and that is getting silly.? There is a 6.5 litre model available at ?125 from smartbuy.fromuk on Ebay which will take virtually everything else that I am likely to build as it has a 30cm length tank - the current build?is a rake of three Welshpool carriages which come in at 28cm.? Then to the solutions.? What does one use?
Some advice here and then a nice article in the next Review please!!!
Cheers Paul
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Paul, ? First buy is a decent industrial type face mask. You don't want to be breathing in grit. ? I bought a Bottle Blaster 100 and some fine grit. I forget where I got the BB100, a UK supplier though had to wait while for it to come from the USA. I used it outside, into an old blanket it a big cardboard box, driven by an airbrush compressor. It just about managed. Grit everywhere. The grit came off e-bay, it is I think fine silica. ? I then bought a much more capable compressor, Aldi or Lidl, about ?60. On wheels with a tank. That sorted air supply. but grit blew about even more. So I then went to Machine Mart and bought their smallest grit blasting cabinet, but altered it to use the BB100. When the BB100 ceramic tip wore away I used the Machine Mart gun, I give the model a fairly quick blast at about 2 bar. I have an old vac hooked up to the air vent That pulls the lid tight shut and as long as you don't try to use continuous flow on the air keeps negative pressure in the cabinet so there's no tendency to push grit out of any poor seals. ? So that's it grit blasted. Ultrasonic tank was a fortunate buy. I was in Farnells in Leeds, they had one on offer, ?50 if I remember correctly, list price ?350. The timer was faulty. I opened it up to bypass the timer, but spotted a loose solder joint (lead free solder no doubt) and fixed it. It isn't that big, a coach would need doing an end at a time. Despite the fact that it is a proper industrial model, it doesn't take everything. Tesco universal cleaner probably works better than the fluid that came with the tank. ? Frank ?
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From: O14@... [mailto:O14@...]
Sent: 21 February 2015 10:35
To: O14@...
Subject: [O14] Ulrasonic cleaning and pumice blasting? ? This might be one for the nice Mr Link...? In the bumper 100th NGI Review, Roy wrote about the use of ultrasonic cleaners and pumice blasting for model preparation?and again mentioned it in these very pages on line.? Up to now I have cleaned my brass models with a fibreglass stick (also now impossible to source - any ideas) then scrubbed them in a? strong solution of Cillit Bang before rinsing, drying?and spraying with Railmatch self etch primer. The paint is still not really as well stuck as I would like though.? ? I have been looking?for a reasonably priced blast gun and have found an expensive Paasche model and a cheap and cheerful ebay sourced model HS178 at around 25 quid.? This is called an aero-eraser.? Is this the same thing?? Where does one source the grit? What is best to use etc etc.? ? Then to the Ultrasonic cleaner.? Is another ebay source going to be reliable for the occasional clean - I am not building models?for a living.? The big problem is the prospect of 4 more Leek and Manifold carriages as they are 31cm long and the 6.5 litre models seem to be 30cm long.? To get one in properly would mean a 15 litre tank model and that is getting silly.? There is a 6.5 litre model available at ?125 from smartbuy.fromuk on Ebay which will take virtually everything else that I am likely to build as it has a 30cm length tank - the current build?is a rake of three Welshpool carriages which come in at 28cm.? Then to the solutions.? What does one use? ? Some advice here and then a nice article in the next Review please!!! ? Cheers Paul
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Paul,
My first purchase was the Paasche ‘air eraser’ - for cleaning up brass masters prior to sending away for casting. The small container for the blasting medium did not, at that stage, matter much. When I came to use it for cleaning completed models however, its shortcomings showed up - you need a lot of medium for even a smallish 7mm loco body or chassis. I changed to the Badger 260 abrasive gun - and have used it ever since (nearly 20 years). It blocks less often than the Paasche unit and the jar is easily undone and re-filled when wearing the heavy gloves that most blasting cabinets are fitted with. When you are going to clean up something like a Manifold coach, you need to be able to contain and collect all that abrasive medium - not to mention stop it swirling around everywhere. Also you need a good face mask capable of dealing with very fine particles. Using pummice, or really fine grade aluminium oxide, the gun will leave the brass a matt ‘honey’ colour - and clean up solder joints to an extent no excuse though, for sloppy soldering). Once cleaned of any remaining blasting medium and flushed with etch primer thinners to ‘wet’ the surface, the primer will stick like the proverbial.
Ultrasonic baths are great for cleaning off all the flux traces, oil and finger marks etc., getting on that accommodates really big/long models such as a 7mm scale Manifold coach is not easy - and likely to be very expensive. You could try, prior to blasting, just placing the model in a plastic tub (preferably lidded) filled with a dilute acid - acetic, phosphoric or similar, and agitating from time to time. Really, this stage is just getting the model free of grease etc., which would interfere with the blasting . . .
If you do get a suitable ultrasonic cleaner, get a suitable fluid from a clock/watchmakers suppliers, not one of the types commonly available for jewellery cleaning, which are not aggressive enough for our particular purpose.
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This might be one for the nice Mr Link...? In the bumper 100th NGI Review, Roy wrote about the use of ultrasonic cleaners and pumice blasting for model preparation?and again mentioned it in these very pages on line.? Up to now I have cleaned my brass models with a fibreglass stick (also now impossible to source - any ideas) then scrubbed them in a? strong solution of Cillit Bang before rinsing, drying?and spraying with Railmatch self etch primer. The paint is still not really as well stuck as I would like though.?
I have been looking?for a reasonably priced blast gun and have found an expensive Paasche model and a cheap and cheerful ebay sourced model HS178 at around 25 quid.? This is called an aero-eraser.? Is this the same thing?? Where does one source the grit? What is best to use etc etc.? ?
Then to the Ultrasonic cleaner.? Is another ebay source going to be reliable for the occasional clean - I am not building models?for a living.? The big problem is the prospect of 4 more Leek and Manifold carriages as they are 31cm long and the 6.5 litre models seem to be 30cm long.? To get one in properly would mean a 15 litre tank model and that is getting silly.? There is a 6.5 litre model available at ?125 from smartbuy.fromuk on Ebay which will take virtually everything else that I am likely to build as it has a 30cm length tank - the current build?is a rake of three Welshpool carriages which come in at 28cm.? Then to the solutions.? What does one use?
Some advice here and then a nice article in the next Review please!!!
Cheers Paul
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Paul,
I use one of the cheap & cheerful air erasers.? I bought mine from an auto parts chain store, but it is the same as the eBay unit, just repackaged.
The same chain store "Supercheap Auto" sold the fine abrasive powder.? It works quite OK.
Regards
Rod Hutchinson
Australia
?
This might be one for the nice Mr Link...? In the bumper 100th NGI Review, Roy wrote about the use of ultrasonic cleaners and pumice blasting for model preparation?and again mentioned it in these very pages on line.? Up to now I have cleaned my brass models with a fibreglass stick (also now impossible to source - any ideas) then scrubbed them in a? strong solution of Cillit Bang before rinsing, drying?and spraying with Railmatch self etch primer. The paint is still not really as well stuck as I would like though.?
I have been looking?for a reasonably priced blast gun and have found an expensive Paasche model and a cheap and cheerful ebay sourced model HS178 at around 25 quid.? This is called an aero-eraser.? Is this the same thing?? Where does one source the grit? What is best to use etc etc.? ? Then to the Ultrasonic cleaner.? Is another ebay source going to be reliable for the occasional clean - I am not building models?for a living.? The big problem is the prospect of 4 more Leek and Manifold carriages as they are 31cm long and the 6.5 litre models seem to be 30cm long.? To get one in properly would mean a 15 litre tank model and that is getting silly.? There is a 6.5 litre model available at ?125 from smartbuy.fromuk on Ebay which will take virtually everything else that I am likely to build as it has a 30cm length tank - the current build?is a rake of three Welshpool carriages which come in at 28cm.? Then to the solutions.? What does one use?
Some advice here and then a nice article in the next Review please!!!
Cheers Paul
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Gents,
A?'knock off' version of the otherwise rather expensive Badger abrasive air gun was available from Machine Mart - branches in many towns and cities and online. MM also do an absolutely satisfactory?'knock off' of the Badger double action airbrush (Model 200?) at about a third of the price.
I have found that it is A Good Thing to have plenty of air pressure when using my grit blaster so I bought a proper compressor with large air tank, to use in place of my diaphragm air brush pump which wasn't man enough.
No connection with MM other than as a satisfied customer.
Adrian
---In O14@..., <rodhutchy@...> wrote : Paul, I use one of the cheap & cheerful air erasers.? I bought mine from an auto parts chain store, but it is the same as the eBay unit, just repackaged. The same chain store "Supercheap Auto" sold the fine abrasive powder.? It works quite OK. Regards
Rod Hutchinson
Australia
On Feb 21, 2015 9:35 PM, " heatonwood@... [O14]" < O14@...> wrote:
?This might be one for the nice Mr Link...? In the bumper 100th NGI Review, Roy wrote about the use of ultrasonic cleaners and pumice blasting for model preparation?and again mentioned it in these very pages on line.? Up to now I have cleaned my brass models with a fibreglass stick (also now impossible to source - any ideas) then scrubbed them in a? strong solution of Cillit Bang before rinsing, drying?and spraying with Railmatch self etch primer. The paint is still not really as well stuck as I would like though.?
I have been looking?for a reasonably priced blast gun and have found an expensive Paasche model and a cheap and cheerful ebay sourced model HS178 at around 25 quid.? This is called an aero-eraser.? Is this the same thing?? Where does one source the grit? What is best to use etc etc.? ? Then to the Ultrasonic cleaner.? Is another ebay source going to be reliable for the occasional clean - I am not building models?for a living.? The big problem is the prospect of 4 more Leek and Manifold carriages as they are 31cm long and the 6.5 litre models seem to be 30cm long.? To get one in properly would mean a 15 litre tank model and that is getting silly.? There is a 6.5 litre model available at ?125 from smartbuy.fromuk on Ebay which will take virtually everything else that I am likely to build as it has a 30cm length tank - the current build?is a rake of three Welshpool carriages which come in at 28cm.? Then to the solutions.? What does one use?
Some advice here and then a nice article in the next Review please!!!
Cheers Paul
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?
Hi Paul
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Try either of?these
?
?
or
?
?
Hope this helps
?
?
Regards
?
Colin Rainsbury
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Nope, Colin. None if those, I have several of them and they all shed tiny shards that stick into my fingers.
I had an 8" stick of glassfibres tightly bound in blue plastic tape which wore down till it was only half an inch long and no good. Not the AWEFUL string bound one either.
I have since sourced a red bound stick but that is disappearing too and was very expensive.
Paul
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Paul,
One tip I read, which I use to minimise the fibreglass shard problem is to dip the fibreglass brushes in PVA glue and let them set before using them, this reduces the effect surprisingly well so you get dust rather than shards.
Cheers,
Andrew
From: "heatonwood@... [O14]" To: O14@... Sent: Monday, 16 March, 2015 7:28:11 PM Subject: [O14] Re: Ulrasonic cleaning and pumice blasting
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Nope, Colin. None if those, I have several of them and they all shed tiny shards that stick into my fingers.
I had an 8" stick of glassfibres tightly bound in blue plastic tape which wore down till it was only half an inch long and no good. Not the AWEFUL string bound one either.
I have since sourced a red bound stick but that is disappearing too and was very expensive.
Paul
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Andrew,
That is so useful that it deserves to be submitted to Peter Page as a space filler for Narrow Lines!!
I have just planted both my fibreglass brushes in a dish of slightly diluted PVA and will take them out after breakfast. I've gone for slightly diluted glue in the hope that it will improve capillary action up the brush so I don't have to dunk again too soon!
Cheers,
Adrian
---In O14@..., <andrewyoung@...> wrote : Paul,
One tip I read, which I use to minimise the fibreglass shard problem is to dip the fibreglass brushes in PVA glue and let them set before using them, this reduces the effect surprisingly well so you get dust rather than shards.
Cheers,
Andrew
From: "heatonwood@... [O14]" <O14@...> To: O14@... Sent: Monday, 16 March, 2015 7:28:11 PM Subject: [O14] Re: Ulrasonic cleaning and pumice blasting ?Nope, Colin. None if those, I have several of them and they all shed tiny shards that stick into my fingers.
I had an 8" stick of glassfibres tightly bound in blue plastic tape which wore down till it was only half an inch long and no good. Not the AWEFUL string bound one either.
I have since sourced a red bound stick but that is disappearing too and was very expensive.
Paul
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Back to the ultrasonics again. My new 6litre tank and cheap air eraser have arrived this week.
Please remind me. I have had conflicting advice as to whether one should blast and then ultrasonic clean or the other way round. So little help is needed there.
In addition Roy mentioned using a good watch and clock cleaning fluid but the instructions to the ultrasonic cleaning bath suggests water or water with a little washing up liquid. If the watch and clock fluid is recommended has anyone any preferences as to brand and where one obtains stuff? I do hope I do not have to purchase 6 L of fluid!
My little Mark Clark Wren is now ready for painting. A super little kit once I had ironed out a few silly errors that I had made myself. And yes the smoke unit did fit in the smoke box, the decoder in the tank and the speaker in the boiler! Paul
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Currently, I’m using OK 2-720 from Rotajet () this is a non-ferrous metal cleaner/brightener. Mine is a 5 litre container but you dilute the fluid with water at about 1 part fluid to 9-10 parts water - so you get a lot.
You don’t of course, need to fill the ulrasonic bath container right up!
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Show quoted text
Back to the ultrasonics again. My new 6litre tank and cheap air eraser have arrived this week.?
Please remind me. I have had conflicting advice as to whether one should blast and then ultrasonic clean or the other way round. So little help is needed there.
In addition Roy mentioned using a good watch and clock cleaning fluid but the instructions to the ultrasonic cleaning bath suggests water or water with a little washing up liquid. If the watch and clock fluid is recommended has anyone any preferences as to brand and where one obtains stuff? I do hope I do not have to purchase 6 L of fluid!?
My little Mark Clark Wren is now ready for painting. A super little kit once I had ironed out a few silly errors that I had made myself. And yes the smoke unit did fit in the smoke box, the decoder in the tank and the speaker in the boiler! Paul
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One thing we routinly do in the lab is to have the ultrasonic bath full of water (often warm) and the item to be cleaned in a separate glass beaker (jar or plastic tub works just as well) full of the cleaning solution (for us, one of several nasty acids or solvents) sitting in the water.? The ultrasonic vibrations are transmitted straight through the beaker, no problem.? This A: reduces the volume of cleaning solution needed and B: (most important for us) eliminates contamination from, and damage to the lining of the bath itself.
best regards from Sweden, George!
From: "Roy Link rclpubs@... [O14]" <O14@...>
To: O14@...
Sent: Wednesday, 12 August 2015, 18:23
Subject: Re: [O14] Ulrasonic cleaning and pumice blasting
?
Currently, I’m using OK 2-720 from Rotajet () this is a non-ferrous metal cleaner/brightener. Mine is a 5 litre container but you dilute the fluid with water at about 1 part fluid to 9-10 parts water - so you get a lot.
You don’t of course, need to fill the ulrasonic bath container right up!
Back to the ultrasonics again. My new 6litre tank and cheap air eraser have arrived this week.?
Please remind me. I have had conflicting advice as to whether one should blast and then ultrasonic clean or the other way round. So little help is needed there.
In addition Roy mentioned using a good watch and clock cleaning fluid but the instructions to the ultrasonic cleaning bath suggests water or water with a little washing up liquid. If the watch and clock fluid is recommended has anyone any preferences as to brand and where one obtains stuff? I do hope I do not have to purchase 6 L of fluid!?
My little Mark Clark Wren is now ready for painting. A super little kit once I had ironed out a few silly errors that I had made myself. And yes the smoke unit did fit in the smoke box, the decoder in the tank and the speaker in the boiler! Paul
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Paul, ? Grit blast then ultrasonic. If you gb then just wash and then us you'll be amazed how much gb powder the us pulls out that the wash didn't. ? us liquid, 5% Tesco all purpose cleaner used at max temp recommended for us. The us 'vibrators' are usually just stuck to the bath wall, too hot and you risk melting the glue on some types. ? Frank ?
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From: O14@... [mailto:O14@...]
Sent: Wednesday, 12 August, 2015 15:57
To: O14@...
Subject: Re: [O14] Ulrasonic cleaning and pumice blasting? ? Back to the ultrasonics again. My new 6litre tank and cheap air eraser have arrived this week.
Please remind me. I have had conflicting advice as to whether one should blast and then ultrasonic clean or the other way round. So little help is needed there.
In addition Roy mentioned using a good watch and clock cleaning fluid but the instructions to the ultrasonic cleaning bath suggests water or water with a little washing up liquid. If the watch and clock fluid is recommended has anyone any preferences as to brand and where one obtains stuff? I do hope I do not have to purchase 6 L of fluid!
My little Mark Clark Wren is now ready for painting. A super little kit once I had ironed out a few silly errors that I had made myself. And yes the smoke unit did fit in the smoke box, the decoder in the tank and the speaker in the boiler! Paul
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Paul Holmes