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Re: [winfldigi] fldigi 4.2.06.18 test version available at

 

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Dave,

With the new shaping of the Thor modes is there a problem during a net of older versions of Fldigi receiving the alpha versions?

73, Ron NY3J


On 12/30/24 19:13, Dave wrote:

Hi Tobias,

I'll fix the tooltip.? I tested for Mid-Latitude-Disturbed NVIS 0 dB s/n; with 0, 1, 2 msec shaping.? Did not see any decrease in decode performance.? 4 or more msec will effect decode under stressful HF conditions.? The shaping does reduce the bandwidth for those situations where that is critical and signal is expected to be strong.

David

On 12/30/24 16:20, T? via groups.io wrote:

Hello David,

Thanks, interesting option.

Is there an expected effect on robustness worth testing or 'just' the bandwidth influence?

Note: The Tooltip in Config still shows the text of the selection above it.


73s Tobias
.-.-.
Re: [winfldigi] fldigi 4.2.06.18 test version available at

 

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Hi Tobias,

I'll fix the tooltip.? I tested for Mid-Latitude-Disturbed NVIS 0 dB s/n; with 0, 1, 2 msec shaping.? Did not see any decrease in decode performance.? 4 or more msec will effect decode under stressful HF conditions.? The shaping does reduce the bandwidth for those situations where that is critical and signal is expected to be strong.

David

On 12/30/24 16:20, T? via groups.io wrote:


Hello David,

Thanks, interesting option.

Is there an expected effect on robustness worth testing or 'just' the bandwidth influence?

Note: The Tooltip in Config still shows the text of the selection above it.


73s Tobias
.-.-.
fldigi 4.2.06.18 test version available at

 

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Added configurable tone shaping.? This is specifc to THOR.

???????????????????????????? 0 msec risetime???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? 4 msec risetime

4 msec leading/trailing edge is similar to a CW signal.

David
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

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Also be aware Neil that there are some absolute directory references in the config files;

In my fldigi_def.xml for example
<THOR_AVATAR_IMAGE_FILE>/home/user/.fldigi/avatars/vk2yqa.png</THOR_AVATAR_IMAGE_FILE>
<CTYDAT_PATHNAME>/home/user/.fldigi/</CTYDAT_PATHNAME>
<XMLRIGFILENAME>/home/user/.fldigi/rigs/IC-9100-D.xml</XMLRIGFILENAME>
<LOGBOOKFILENAME>/home/user/.fldigi/logs/logbook.adif</LOGBOOKFILENAME>
<WEFAXSAVEDIR>/home/user/.fldigi/wefax/</WEFAXSAVEDIR>
<KML_SAVE_DIR>/home/user/.fldigi/kml/</KML_SAVE_DIR>
<AUTO_PROG3_PATHNAME>/home/user/bin/logsn3</AUTO_PROG3_PATHNAME>

and in my fldigi.prefs
last_macro_file:/home/user/.fldigi/macros/macros.mdf

The upshot being that if the referenced directory vanishes then fldigi will probably revert to the default for that parameter.

I was thinking too about the change in default structure that occurred some years ago. Initially there was an fldigi and nbems directory hanging off home. More recently there is an fldigi folder then two subfolders, fldigi and nbems. A running "old" structure will work fine, but transferring/copying things may get into a mess. This maybe what happened with Doug as the macro location is one of those affected.

Cheers Bob VK2YQA

On 30/12/24 14:26, Neil Preston W0NRP via groups.io wrote:

Doug and all...

IIRC, I ran into this early on and saved a backup of my config files.? However, once I set up a dual configuration of FLDigi, one for VHF FM and one for HF, the problem goes away.

The process is detailed in message # 1797 dated 12/19/09 by Gary Wescom and forwarded by w1hkj.? While it is intended for having multiple configurations of FLDigi, it can work well to preserve configuration settings for a single configuration.

In simplest form, when you have FLDigi configured properly, COPY the folder "fldigi.files" to a new folder with a unique name.? In my case, for a dual configuration, I have a folder called "fldigi_VHF.files" and one called "fldigi_HF.files".? For a single configuration, only make one unique folder.
I don't change the original folder, but it will likely get overwritten in an upgrade.?

Next, modify the properties of your desktop shortcut for fldigi as follows:
? Right click on your new icon.
? ? Select the properties option. ?There will be line labeled "Target." ?
It should contain something like this: "C:\Program Files\Fldigi-3.13BD\fldigi.exe" ?
The actual filename may change as versions change but it should look similar to this.
? ? Add the following text to the Target line (except use the name of the directory you created in step 1 above):
(space)--config-dir C:\fldigi_VHF ?(Note that it is dash dash config dash dir)
? ? Click "Apply" and "OK" to exit the properties box.
? ? Click on the your new icon to start the second copy of fldigi and configure it as needed.

In my case, my shortcut target reads as follows:
"C:\Program Files\Fldigi-4.2.06\fldigi.exe" --config-dir C:\Users\<username>\fldigi_VHF.files

Now, when you upgrade to a newer version of FLDigi, copy the configuration pointer into the new shortcut target.?
All of your configurations will have been retained.
--
73,
Neil W?NRP
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Doug and all...

IIRC, I ran into this early on and saved a backup of my config files.? However, once I set up a dual configuration of FLDigi, one for VHF FM and one for HF, the problem goes away.

The process is detailed in message # 1797 dated 12/19/09 by Gary Wescom and forwarded by w1hkj.? While it is intended for having multiple configurations of FLDigi, it can work well to preserve configuration settings for a single configuration.

In simplest form, when you have FLDigi configured properly, COPY the folder "fldigi.files" to a new folder with a unique name.? In my case, for a dual configuration, I have a folder called "fldigi_VHF.files" and one called "fldigi_HF.files".? For a single configuration, only make one unique folder.
I don't change the original folder, but it will likely get overwritten in an upgrade.?

Next, modify the properties of your desktop shortcut for fldigi as follows:
? Right click on your new icon.
? ? Select the properties option. ?There will be line labeled "Target." ?
It should contain something like this: "C:\Program Files\Fldigi-3.13BD\fldigi.exe" ?
The actual filename may change as versions change but it should look similar to this.
? ? Add the following text to the Target line (except use the name of the directory you created in step 1 above):
(space)--config-dir C:\fldigi_VHF ?(Note that it is dash dash config dash dir)
? ? Click "Apply" and "OK" to exit the properties box.
? ? Click on the your new icon to start the second copy of fldigi and configure it as needed.

In my case, my shortcut target reads as follows:
"C:\Program Files\Fldigi-4.2.06\fldigi.exe" --config-dir C:\Users\<username>\fldigi_VHF.files

Now, when you upgrade to a newer version of FLDigi, copy the configuration pointer into the new shortcut target.?
All of your configurations will have been retained.
--
73,
Neil W?NRP
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Sri...? Yes, running on thumbdrive in Win11
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Robert... ?'fldigi_UI_colors.colors' does update @ close, but not every 'Save Config' while running. Today, I changed a few colors. ?Using SAVE in Config window and SAVE CONFIG, 'fldigi_UI_colors.colors' was unchanged. It updates @ Closing. Today, it's working correctly; I can't explain why I lost all color changes previously. It must be Op Error. I don't see another explanation.?
?
In 'Configure/Colors-Fonts/Rx-Tx', Text Highlighting, the 'XMT' control isn't working 4 me. All others OK. The color select screen works, but color doesn't change from Red.
?
I don't see well; I change nearly everything to make fldigi easier to operate for long periods. ?I really appreciate the NBEMS apps and your work and commitment.? FLDIGI sets the standard in Amateur digital operations.
?
Am I correct in thinking that archiving/restoring a copy of 'fldigi_UI_colors.colors' along with the other 2 config files will restore all my config settings?? TU Doug
fldigi 4.2.06.17 posted for testing

 

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Change to THOR-25 modem, increasing interleave depth to 1 second.? NOT compatible with previous test releases.? This change should improve the decoder under NVIS conditions, such as Mid-Latitue disturbed:

??? THOR-25
?? ?
????? * add new THOR modem with following characteristics
??????? . symlen = 320
??????? . samplerate = 8000
??????? . flushlength = 20
??????? . bandwidth = 460
??????? . interleave depth = 25, 1 second
??????? . IEEE coefficients for viterbi encode/decode algorithms
????????? THOR_K15? 15
????????? K15_POLY1 044735
????????? K15_POLY2 063057
??????? . objective to provide highest baud within 500 Hertz bandwidth for
????????? European amateurs
????????? .CPS test text:
???????????? "0123456789
????????????? abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
????????????? ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ"
???????????? number chars:????? 66
???????????? overhead:???? 6.480000 sec
???????????? xmt time:???? 10.280000 sec
???????????? xmt samples:? 134080
???????????? chars/sec:??? 6.42
????? * assigned secondary RsID code 691 to THOR-25
????? * increased flush length for all THOR baud rates
????? * added configurable start and end of signal shaping to these modem types:
??????? . dominoEX
??????? . psk
??????? . mfsk
??????? . rtty
??????? . thor
??????? . selectable on configuration tab Modem/General
????? * restored selectable paths to all THOR modem types

Bench tests with the above test parameters produced 100% decode.

73, David
W1HKJ
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Doug,

Is the file "fldigi_UI_colors.colors" located on the thumb drive? if so, when saved/updated does the file date update to the save on date?

Robert
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Doug,

Yes, the script engine was not designed to save the superficial look of FLDIGI, just the internal operations part of it.

Robert
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Re:-
??? File->Config Scripts->Generate

Not noticed that facility before...


Thinks...? FlRig needs that facility!? Especially when you have the layers of "extra command" buttons programmed up, too!

(Sadly, beyond my coding competence level.)

Dave G0WBX.

--
Created on and sent from a Unix like PC running and using open source software:
RF SPECTRA of THOR with Signal Shaping

 

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Here are the?? RF Spectra ? of?? THOR22? (sent on 40m SSB)? when sent with? 0 (milliseconds) signal shaping and? 500 (millisec) signal shaping.

The shaping value is now in the FLDIGI MENU under? MODEM:? GENERAL??? and can be set manually from 0 to 500 value.


Shaping the signal amplitude tones in the FSK modes like THOR, MFSK, AFSK RTTY? should tend to "soften" them - resulting in a smaller bandwidth (like shaping a CW carrier)

On CW the shaping in milliseconds is typically 4-8 ms? (turning the carrier on/off) which results in a narrow bandwidth CW signal.

No shaping of a CW signal results in key clicks and a wide splatter type signal.


I'm not sure what the units are in FLDIGI for tone "shaping" but it also looks like milliseconds.

RF spectra captured with an SDR (RSP play) and RSP Spectrum Software


de k3eui


No Signal Shaping


500 ms Signal Shaping
Re: Signal Shaping option in THOR modes

 

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Here are the two audio images with the spectra side-by-side to compare

de k3eui
Signal Shaping option in THOR modes

 

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Now the THOR modes (and all of the FSK modes)? have "signal shaping" (set in CONFIG MENU: MODEM: GENERAL)


I think this slowly builds up the amplitude of each tone, and slowly diminishes each tone, much like CW "shaping" of the amplitude of a? CW carrier.

My guess is that this might soften the tone changes (maybe how it sounds less abrupt) and result in a somewhat smaller bandwidth? (just like in CW).

This has obvious implications on HF SSB, rather than on FM bands.



Here are some AUDIO SPECTRA? captured using the FLDIGI audio spectrum option.

Next I will try to capture the RF Spectra using a SDR and Spectrum Analyzer software.


I sent a THOR22 signal? (80m SSB)? with signal shaping of? 0? and again, signal shaping? 500? (milliseconds).

I don't really see much change, nor do I hear any change.

So it must be very subtle.

de k3eui


===================
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

TU Robert... I've not done this b4.? It works as you say, but doesn't restore changes to the color scheme.? In the script, there's no mention of color or the file, 'fldigi_UI_colors.colors'.? Even after changing many color settings, Saving in the color window and 'Save Config', altered colors are lost @ restart and the Script doesn't restore them either.? Script seem to have every setting except color changes.?
?
Whatever talks to 'fldigi_UI_colors.colors doesn't seem to be working @ my station.? And, maybe I'm way off course.? ?Replacing the two config files with current copies usually worked perfectly.?
Re: Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

Doug,

After you have reset FLDIGI to the configuration you want. Run the following from the menu:

File->Config Scripts->Generate

Save the file to the location of preference. This file can be used to restore the set up when fldigi.prefs' and 'fldigi_def.xml get corrupted.

This method can also be used to configure FLDIGI to a particular set-up on a given event requirement. Just generate a baseline script file so the set up can be restored to "normal" FLDIGI operation.

Robert
Update FLDIGI, Config settings lost

 

I just updated fldigi 4.2.06 to 4.2.06.16 and all Config settings reverted to default including Macro addresses.? I run NBEMS apps on a Thumbdrive.? Usually, updates use existing 'fldigi.prefs' and 'fldigi_def.xml' files for Configuration.? I archive these files for troubleshooting and/or repair.? Has something changed or am I missing something obvious?? It seems when I start fldigi after moving archived files, I see my usual 4 rows of macros for an instant b4 the default 2 rows. Like fldigi first sees the original files, then goes to default.?
?
Initially, I thought it may be caused by something different in the Alpha app, but when I reinstall 4.2.06 the issue remains.? I have 3 sets of archived config files. None produce anything more than default configuration.? ? ? ?Thanks for any insight you can provide...
Re: Traffic Received 12/22/2024

 

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Ha, that was very good.

Thanks for sharing.

Merry Christmas

Bruce WA1YZN
On 12/22/2024 17:08, Ron NY3J via groups.io wrote:

I received this Flmsg from Greg, KC3SMW, on the Pennsylvania NBEMS net this morning.
It's a fitting tribute to a great program, FLDIGI, and a great programmer Dave, W1HKJ.

The Flmsg is attached. Happy Holidays everyone and Dave, thanks for all the work you do
and supplying the Ham Radio community with this great program.
?
73, Ron NY3J
Traffic Received 12/22/2024

 

I received this Flmsg from Greg, KC3SMW, on the Pennsylvania NBEMS net this morning.
It's a fitting tribute to a great program, FLDIGI, and a great programmer Dave, W1HKJ.

The Flmsg is attached. Happy Holidays everyone and Dave, thanks for all the work you do
and supplying the Ham Radio community with this great program.
?
73, Ron NY3J

KC3SMW-holidayQSO.b2s
KC3SMW-holidayQSO.b2s

review of THOR speeds on HF SSB

 

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Here are the RF spectra of the?? THOR?? speeds from?? 11 ? to ? 56? sent today on 3585 kHz usb-data mode

Rec'd on a SDR (RSP play) and SDR Spectrum Analyzer.


The new THOR 25? (alpha) mode seems to be working well (still in alpha stage)

Now wish it appears soon on FLMSG optional modes.


I see all of the THOR speeds now have a longer "tail" at the end of each transmission (a few seconds) and the tones are "shaped" as described in the READ ME files

written on the W1HKJ.com/alpha

I think this keeps the BW to a minimum? (like shaping a CW signal).


On the PA NBEMS on Sunday mornings (0730 hr on 3583 kHz vfo) we typically use THOR 22 for checkins (about 500 Hz and 80 wpm)

and then use?? MFSK 32?? and? THOR 32? for traffic with FLMSG or FLAMP.

These are a bit faster and wider but seem to work well for 1-3 kB files.


Prop was excellent today on 80m from all over the Mid-Atlantic area.

QRP? stations were easily copied by me as net control, well above my noise level.

Here are the spectra of each THOR speed? - ? I show the peak BW and the BW at? 30dB? below the peak.


Not sure the current definition of "bandwidth" but I think it is the width of the signal at -26 dB below peak.

We do find that?? THOR 11?? really cuts through the noise with longer duration tones, and is especially good as a checkin mode during RTTY contests.

Thor 11 feels slow, but is still around 30 wpm.


de k3eui? Barry

Philly

Dec 22 2024
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