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Hello.
I just wanted to ask if there is any interest from the community or the developers to make the menu easy for radio amateurs, for people that are not engineers? Currently the menu is a big mess with a lot of options and sub-options and so on. So if you want to make a simple measure, you have to go in many menus to change many settings. I know this gives a lot of control, but I will be very nice to have a few buttons on the main screen, like a main menu, that take you to the most used measurements, with all of the settings already set, with bigger font and a few buttons to change some settings only to that current measurement. I also do not know if this is something that the hardware supports.

On 29/12/2024 06:44, aeternus.arcis via groups.io wrote:

Hello.
I just wanted to ask if there is any interest from the community or the developers to make the menu easy for radio amateurs, for people that are not engineers? Currently the menu is a big mess with a lot of options and sub-options and so on. So if you want to make a simple measure, you have to go in many menus to change many settings. I know this gives a lot of control, but I will be very nice to have a few buttons on the main screen, like a main menu, that take you to the most used measurements, with all of the settings already set, with bigger font and a few buttons to change some settings only to that current measurement. I also do not know if this is something that the hardware supports.

I take your point, but I feel that for many purposes start and stop frequencies
are all you need to change, perhaps followed by a calibration. I guess the TDR
measurements (find a cable length or a fault) are a little more complex.

What sorts of top-level options would you like to see? What settings to change?

As many of the devices use a similar menu structure it would be a lot of work to
change, and it might make support more difficult!

There are some excellent resources - including books and videos - out there
which may answer your questions:




/g/nanovna-users/files/Absolute%20Beginner%20Guide%20to%20The%20NanoVNA/Absolute_Beginner_Guide_NanoVNA_v1_6.pdf



Cheers,
David
--
SatSignal Software - Quality software for you
Web:
Email: davidtaylor@...
BlueSky: @gm8arv.bsky.social, Twitter: @gm8arv

I don't see it being practical. All those options exist because people do so many different things with the instrument. I for example use the same settings 95% of the time, only the start/stop frequencies change. So I calibrate for the half dozen ranges and measurements (S11 or S21) I use and SAVE them with all their settings (points, traces, etc) in place. All I have to do is RECALL one and I'm good to go!

I am looking from a point of view of someone that does not yet understand many technical things. I may not have time or interest to learn them. So for a person that just wants to simply measure let's say SWR, I think this will be easier. I am not saying to remove the other technical options. They need to exist. Just to add simpler ones. It saves time for people that do not use this every day and and do not remember all of the settings, and I think it also saves time for people that use the device every day, but take many different measurements.

My example is something like this - you press "SWR test" - a new screen opens with preselected only 1 trace, format SWR, channel 0. Then there are two buttons to choose start and stop frequency. And a button to instead choose predefined "amateur radio bands". All of this saves time.
Maybe some of this is limited, because of the screen size on some models. I like how that SV4401A model moves some common options outside of the hidden menu, but it is still not what I am imagining. It is also too expensive, but that is a different topic.

If you buy an instrument, you take time to learn how to use it. SWR is a weak measurement on its own. The Smith Chart is your real best friend. There are many YouTube videos on the instrument and the chart. Meanwhile, if you learn a few things and SAVE your settings, you will have 95% of what you want! Turn on VNA, RECALL the setting you want and go measure

Why not buy an " Antenna Analyzer"? That will? do what you want.

73,
Geoff --> AB6BT

Quick question. What nanovna is this
referring to?

Fred
N4CLA

On Sun, Dec 29, 2024 at 6:21?PM Geoff Peters - AB6BT via groups.io <AB6BT=
[email protected]> wrote:

Why not buy an " Antenna Analyzer"? That will do what you want.

73,
Geoff --> AB6BT

On 12/28/2024 10:44 PM, aeternus.arcis via groups.io wrote:

Hello.
I just wanted to ask if there is any interest from the community or the

developers to make the menu easy for radio amateurs, for people that are
not engineers? Currently the menu is a big mess with a lot of options and
sub-options and so on. So if you want to make a simple measure, you have to
go in many menus to change many settings. I know this gives a lot of
control, but I will be very nice to have a few buttons on the main screen,
like a main menu, that take you to the most used measurements, with all of
the settings already set, with bigger font and a few buttons to change some
settings only to that current measurement. I also do not know if this is
something that the hardware supports.

Bottom right hand corner of menu indicates it is for Hugen’s (Zeenko) -H and -H4 with older version 1.1 firmware by DiSlord

I think some people are missing the point, or just do not want any changes to the way they are doing things. Which I said is not what I want to do. When I buy something, I learn everything about it. That does not mean that it is doing the things in the best way. I know how it works. I watched the videos. I am really grateful for that, to those people, because without them it would be even worse to learn this. All I asked was a possibility of simplified menu without removing the advanced options. For everyone that thinks it is more complicated than it needs to be, which I know is not just me. But this is a lot like in Linux - when someone suggests GUI for a terminal program, all of the people that use only terminal jump that he should learn the terminal or just use Windows.

SWR was just an example. It is not the only thing I need and after all, this is not only about me.

I understand about support being more difficult. I think something can be done about that, but it needs time. It is not easy for sure.

So, thanks for the suggestions. Like I said, I watched videos and read guides. I learned and I am still learning. But that does not make it simpler. So if someone is ever interested in simplifying this menu, contact me. I do not want to be a programmer, but can help with the design.

On Mon, Dec 30, 2024 at 12:45 AM, <aeternus.arcis@...> wrote:

All I asked was a possibility of simplified menu without removing the advanced
options. For everyone that thinks it is more complicated than it needs to be,
which I know is not just me.

A developer named Reald did make a big font version with SWR display about 4 or 5 years ago and you could try that out and see if it works for you. The links are in archive posts. A simplified menu been discussed several times in this group over the years and no one stepped up to do it. Not enough interest I guess as most of us like all the VNA features. The code is open source so feel free to modify it to do what you want.

Roger

You'll probably get along much better with a RigExpert analyzer.
I use this one:

and I think it's what you're looking for.
However, NanoVNA offers much more possibilities of use, it just needs to be
learned.

73!
Costin, YO8RCD <>


?n lun., 30 dec. 2024 la 20:43, Roger Need via groups.io <sailtamarack=
[email protected]> a scris:

OP: Your thoughts are legit, but you will face lots of opposition from existing users and from the developers, as these VNAs are designed to have every possible feature and are built to perform just enough above the lowest possible performance standards to keep costs to a minimum and folks buying.

THEY ARE NOT BUILT AT ALL FOR EASE OF USE.

As a comparison, compare and contrast a ham radio built by hams, but incorporating DSP/SDR elements...to an SDR built by non-ham programmers. :)
One is easy to use while the other is like using C++ as a radio interface...in a translated language...with inverted colors...
My phone has a dual interface, which would be welcome on hobbyist VNAs. In full-feature mode it's the latest and greatest version of Android. In "easy" mode it lacks many features but is super easy to use for common tasks.
Hint, hint, developers?
Regards,
Kirk, NT0ZRochester, MN

My book, "Stealth Amateur Radio," is now available from www.stealthamateur.com and on the Amazon Kindle (soon)

Sure, I'm an engineer. I've been using professional VNAs for some
40-years. I salute the creators of the NANOVNAs! It works just like the
professional units and quite intuitive to me. Keep it up. I have no
problem with the "complexity" of the NANOVNAs.

You would be much happier with the Rig Expert offerings as they are
designed as a technician tool at the top of the tower.

Leave the NANOVNAs alone.

Dave - W?LEV

On Mon, Dec 30, 2024 at 7:29?PM Kirk Kleinschmidt, NT0Z via groups.io
<sohosources@...> wrote:

OP: Your thoughts are legit, but you will face lots of opposition from
existing users and from the developers, as these VNAs are designed to have
every possible feature and are built to perform just enough above the
lowest possible performance standards to keep costs to a minimum and folks
buying.

THEY ARE NOT BUILT AT ALL FOR EASE OF USE.

As a comparison, compare and contrast a ham radio built by hams, but
incorporating DSP/SDR elements...to an SDR built by non-ham programmers. :)
One is easy to use while the other is like using C++ as a radio
interface...in a translated language...with inverted colors...
My phone has a dual interface, which would be welcome on hobbyist VNAs. In
full-feature mode it's the latest and greatest version of Android. In
"easy" mode it lacks many features but is super easy to use for common
tasks.
Hint, hint, developers?
Regards,
Kirk, NT0ZRochester, MN

My book, "Stealth Amateur Radio," is now available from
www.stealthamateur.com and on the Amazon Kindle (soon)

On Sunday, December 29, 2024 at 09:40:37 AM CST, aeternus.arcis via
groups.io <aeternus.arcis@...> wrote:

Hello.
I just wanted to ask if there is any interest from the community or the
developers to make the menu easy for radio amateurs, for people that are
not engineers? Currently the menu is a big mess with a lot of options and
sub-options and so on. So if you want to make a simple measure, you have to
go in many menus to change many settings. I know this gives a lot of
control, but I will be very nice to have a few buttons on the main screen,
like a main menu, that take you to the most used measurements, with all of
the settings already set, with bigger font and a few buttons to change some
settings only to that current measurement. I also do not know if this is
something that the hardware supports.

--

*Dave - W?LEV*


--
Dave - W?LEV

Just a thought - there are several apps for Windows and Android that could
meet your needs for an easier to use interface. Most will run on an
inexpensive tablet or Win PC ($100 low cost laptopsnorbWin pcs are great)

On Sun, Dec 29, 2024, 10:40?AM aeternus.arcis via groups.io <aeternus.arcis=
[email protected]> wrote:

Hello.
I just wanted to ask if there is any interest from the community or the
developers to make the menu easy for radio amateurs, for people that are
not engineers? Currently the menu is a big mess with a lot of options and
sub-options and so on. So if you want to make a simple measure, you have to
go in many menus to change many settings. I know this gives a lot of
control, but I will be very nice to have a few buttons on the main screen,
like a main menu, that take you to the most used measurements, with all of
the settings already set, with bigger font and a few buttons to change some
settings only to that current measurement. I also do not know if this is
something that the hardware supports.

Some people need one simple functionality from NanoVNA, others need another simple one, and so on. And what to do with many simple functions for each?

NanoVNA interface is quite simple, and it is enough to configure it once for your tasks (types of routes, scales, etc.).

It comes down to the strategy in the UI design . . . task centric versus item centric. Task centric would be a top menu that gives a setup/submenu for key/"most used" tasks (as the OP is suggesting), and item centric is what we have now - all settings are there, with zero relationship to task, expecting the user to comprehend the device to a far deeper level. I see this a lot in software development, since the devs often are not end users, and by definition know the code so well that working at that level seems natural, which is almost never the case for end users. A combination of both is typically the best solution - something like a top level choice for "expert mode" that drops into what we have now, and the others making general settings/prompting/opening appropriate screens for the chosen task. (This assumes, of course, that the flash space is available for the little bit of extra UI code).

FWIW, in the IT world, I inspired a number of products to go this way, and they were always well accepted. Users just want to get a job done, not learn all the details of a very complex istrument, many which they will not be affected by or need to know for thier task.

Just another viewpoint . . .

- Tim

--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

Once one learns how to use and understand the measurements any VNA can
make, there will be no need for a "simplified" (dumbed down) menu
structure.

ADVICE: Go buy yourself a RigExpert unit which is a technician-oriented
instrument and is far simpler to use for the uninitiated.

I will always prefer the NANOVNAs (and their professional and expensive
offerings)!

Once again, a hearty THANK YOU to it's creators!!

Dave - W?LEV

On Wed, Jan 1, 2025 at 10:23?AM DiSlord via groups.io <dislordlive=
[email protected]> wrote:

Some people need one simple functionality from NanoVNA, others need
another simple one, and so on. And what to do with many simple functions
for each?

NanoVNA interface is quite simple, and it is enough to configure it once
for your tasks (types of routes, scales, etc.).

--

*Dave - W?LEV*


--
Dave - W?LEV

I don't think anyone asked for "dumbed down", just, perhaps, a few shortcuts to setup routine tasks, leaving the rest as is.

--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

This is where HP went astray in the early 80s with their manuals.

Hi, all.

I'm HIRO, JJ1FXF and I just joined this group today cause I'm also looking for some simple menu firmware of my NanoVNA-H.

Since the 2.8" screen is becoming too small for my age, so I will have a 4.3" screen hardware.

Then I would like to use 2.8" one for field use to check only the SWR of antennas on various HAM frequencies. I don't wanna configure NanoVNA on the field so I'd like to complete and save all configurations such as 1.8-1.9, 3.5-3.6, 3.7-3.8, ... in advance while I'm home.

Is there any mod or version of firmware that measures SWR only but has more configuration save area, like 10 or 15?

Thanks for your advice.

HNY es 73/88,

// HIRO, JJ1FXF