Try Version 0.4.0. of NanoVNA Saver. Version 5 releases have had numerous bug issues due to code refactoring.
Roger
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With a bit of quick finger motion I was able to capture the following from running Nanosaver before it disappeared from trying to connect and failing:
NanoVNA-APP
See for further details.
2022-11-05 12:18:26,303 - NanoVNASaver.Hardware.NanoVNA_V2 - ERROR - Timeout reading version registers. Got: b''
2022-11-05 12:18:26,304 - NanoVNASaver.Controls.SerialControl - ERROR - Unable to connect to VNA: Timeout reading version registers
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "NanoVNASaver\Controls\SerialControl.py", line 74, in serialButtonClick
File "NanoVNASaver\Controls\SerialControl.py", line 105, in connect_device
File "NanoVNASaver\Hardware\VNA.py", line 151, in readFrequencies
File "NanoVNASaver\Hardware\VNA.py", line 193, in readValues
File "NanoVNASaver\Hardware\VNA.py", line 96, in exec_command
File "NanoVNASaver\Hardware\Serial.py", line 33, in drain_serial
File "serial\serialwin32.py", line 269, in read
serial.serialutil.PortNotOpenError: Attempting to use a port that is not open
Also I had attached my tinySA to the same port and successfully ran it using TinySA App between running invocations of nanovna-saver.
Again that seems to support the idea the issue is in the V2.2 device version git-20200308-3943ba
VE6ATS
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
On Thu, Nov 3, 2022 at 05:43 PM, Brent DeWitt wrote:
I having fits trying to measure lossy "soft" ferrites against the
manufacturers curves. Over the range 1 to 300 MHz, I'm not even getting
close, looking at either S11 into a short or S21. I've tried a few home-brew
fixtures, and they all yield a Z which is much lower than the published data,
so I'm thinking it is my fixturing and calibration that are doing me in.
You need a good test jig setup if you want to measure up to 300 MHz. Could you post some pictures of your test jig and the cal loads you use for calibration? When you measure the impedance are you referring to the complex impedance R +/-jX or the impedance magnitude |Z|?
For those that have been successful:
- Do you perform you OSL cal at the input port to the fixture, or the far
side?
You always do the OSL cal at the point where you connect the Device-Under-Test (DUT). This establishes the Reference Plane for measurements. You should verify it is working OK by measuring some known resistors that are non-inductive - Is your preferred method S11 into a short, S11 into 50 ohms, or S21? The S11 method is the preferred method. S21 measurements using a NanoVNA are subject to error for several reasons. - NanoVNA source and load impedances that are not 50 ohms - Stray capacitance in the test jig significantly affects results - NanoVNA does not perform 12 point calibration error correction You can read more about S11 vs S21 measurements in these links. Roger
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I have tried 3 machines, a laptop running W10, a desktop running W10 and a desktop running Ubuntu. All have the same symptoms. I have also tried a couple of cables.
After changing the cable using the same W10 computer that had failed the program did run for a while and I thought the issue was a cable, but in the middle of a 1000 point sweep in just failed (program crashed) and indicated the port was not available. After that have not gotten it to run again though I resorted to this group and have not spent more time on it since that event.
Almost seems like some sort of buffer issure??? Since the problem follows the VNA implies the issue is there, but cycling the vna power does not resolve issue.
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I have a similar issue with my SAA2 on windows 7. It's a driver issue I think. Runs ok on windows 10. Not sure how to fix it.
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
I always calibrate to the interface of the "vna/jig/cable combination" with the DUT because that interface is whatever circuitry the DUT is connected to will be seen as.
E.g. if you are testing an antenna mounted on a tower and are interested in the impedance of the feed point of the antenna then calibrate the vna and included feeder to the point the feeder connects to the antenna on the tower.
Similarly it is also important to carefully consider your reference point for calibration when sweeping/ tuning filters; in this case a set of cavities used in multiplexing.
On Sat, 5 Nov 2022 at 9:59, Brent DeWitt<bdewitt@...> wrote: Single turn. Tolerance is a good note, but my readings are consistently less than half the specified value.? Unfortunately, Fair-Rite is the only company who has written anything about how they measure their product, and they made the comment that other companies may do it differently.
I still think my "errors" may come from the way I calibrate.? For an S11 calibration into a fixture, should the fixture be included in the OSL cal, or performed at the input to the fixture.? For an S21 cal, should the fixture be included at all, or only the connecting cables.
Hopefully, I'll stumble on to an answer that agrees with the vendor one of these days!
Thanks again for your input, Jim!
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
Greetings, Just as an FYI: There is a great deal of downloadable generic reference material from?Rhode & Schwarz relating to all things VNA.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Friday, November 4, 2022 at 08:03:30 PM EDT, Brent DeWitt <bdewitt@...> wrote:
I have a Copper Mountain VNA in my lab at work, so I will probably try to get some generic advice from them next week, without mentioning that it's really for use with a nanoVNA at home.
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The following events on the usb port my nanovna is attached to is causing the program to not connect:
Faulting application name: nanovna-saver.exe, version: 0.0.0.0, time stamp: 0x632416e2
Faulting module name: Qt5Core.dll, version: 5.15.2.0, time stamp: 0x5fa4dd3b
Exception code: 0xc0000409
The program error is that the "attempting to use a port that is not open"
Nanovna-saver runs, but when attempting to connect to the com port the usb to the device, the previous event takes place and the program terminates.
Any help in resolving this would be appreciated.
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The following events on the usb-port my nanovna is attached to is causing the program to not connect:
Faulting application name: nanovna-saver.exe, version: 0.0.0.0, time stamp: 0x632416e2
Faulting module name: Qt5Core.dll, version: 5.15.2.0, time stamp: 0x5fa4dd3b
Exception code: 0xc0000409
The program error is that the "attempting to use a port that is not open"
Any help in resolving this would be appreciated.
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
I have a Copper Mountain VNA in my lab at work, so I will probably try to get some generic advice from them next week, without mentioning that it's really for use with a nanoVNA at home.
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
Single turn. Tolerance is a good note, but my readings are consistently less than half the specified value. Unfortunately, Fair-Rite is the only company who has written anything about how they measure their product, and they made the comment that other companies may do it differently.
I still think my "errors" may come from the way I calibrate. For an S11 calibration into a fixture, should the fixture be included in the OSL cal, or performed at the input to the fixture. For an S21 cal, should the fixture be included at all, or only the connecting cables.
Hopefully, I'll stumble on to an answer that agrees with the vendor one of these days!
Thanks again for your input, Jim!
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Re: How To Do A SWR Sweep on 2 Meter HT Antenna ?
I agree with Jim Lux. Holding the VNA in your hand is both simple and probably the most representative of the performance with an HT. In the olden days, the German VDE 0871 testing standard used a salt water column with a plate on top for testing hand-held devices. Jim's suggestion lets you simulate you!
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
On 11/4/22 8:04 AM, Brent DeWitt wrote: The parts I'm currently playing with are all Laird ( formerly Steward) 28 alloy, with the Z peaking in the 100-200 MHz region. The data I'm referencing is from their data sheets.
I'll read through Jim's paper. Thanks!
What test fixture are you using? 1 or a few turns through the core? Note that these things have about 20% tolerance with respect to the datasheet values, too.
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
The parts I'm currently playing with are all Laird ( formerly Steward) 28 alloy, with the Z peaking in the 100-200 MHz region. The data I'm referencing is from their data sheets.
I'll read through Jim's paper. Thanks!
Brent AB1LF
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Re: Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
What ferrites and where's the reference for them.
Jim K9YC has done some fairly extensive choke testing.
Mike W9MDB
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Thursday, November 3, 2022 at 07:43:56 PM CDT, Brent DeWitt <bdewitt@...> wrote:
I having fits trying to measure lossy "soft" ferrites against the manufacturers curves.? Over the range 1 to 300 MHz, I'm not even getting close, looking at either S11 into a short or S21.? I've tried a few home-brew fixtures, and they all yield a Z which is much lower than the published data, so I'm thinking it is my fixturing and calibration that are doing me in.
For those that have been successful:
- Do you perform you OSL cal at the input port to the fixture, or the far side?
- Is your preferred method S11 into a short, S11 into 50 ohms, or S21?
Just to set the level of conversation; I'm quite comfortable driving around a Smith Chart and have been involved in RF for a very long time, so feel free to pick me apart!
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Fixture de-embedding for component measurement
I having fits trying to measure lossy "soft" ferrites against the manufacturers curves. Over the range 1 to 300 MHz, I'm not even getting close, looking at either S11 into a short or S21. I've tried a few home-brew fixtures, and they all yield a Z which is much lower than the published data, so I'm thinking it is my fixturing and calibration that are doing me in.
For those that have been successful:
- Do you perform you OSL cal at the input port to the fixture, or the far side?
- Is your preferred method S11 into a short, S11 into 50 ohms, or S21?
Just to set the level of conversation; I'm quite comfortable driving around a Smith Chart and have been involved in RF for a very long time, so feel free to pick me apart!
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On 11/2/22 12:20, N2MS wrote: InfoAge did accept my Radio and Electronic Data Books, Equipment Manuals and Electronic perodicals. I donated it in the spring of this year.
The person I worked with is Ray Chase. Is business card shows www.InfoAge.org his email address is radio862@...
Most of my Data Books were for semiconductor and integrated circuit devices. Among the periodicals accepted were my collection Popular Communications magazines.
They are selective on hardware donations but were actively looking for RADAR equipment. My guess, the ISEC folks but radar would be very appropriate for InfoAge & Camp Evans. A lot of work was done there from WWII until the 80's (maybe the 90's). The makerspace used to be called IXR - Institute for Exploratory Research. We still have the sign. If you have any documentation I would check with them before trashing it. Oh, so it was InfoAge - cool. Don't worry they're probably still around here. :-) We're very careful about tossing things. You never know what's appropriate. -- Linux Home Automation Neil Cherry kd2zrq@... Main site My HA Blog Author of: Linux Smart Homes For Dummies KD2ZRQ
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Re: How to use my NanoVNA-H4 to test resonant frequency of a tower?
On Tue, Nov 1, 2022 at 04:36 PM, WB2UAQ wrote: What if a number of insulated turns are wrapped
around the tower Well, that would have not only magnetic coupling but considerable capacitive coupling also with the wire wrapped around the tower. The resonant frequency of the magnetic and capacitive coupling could be a problem. You could minimize the capacitive coupling by standing the wire off some distance - an inch or several inches? - from the tower. Wish I had a structure to test this on. Try it on a street light pole or something. A stop sign post or a flag pole. the Tacoma Narrows (wasn't that Galloping Gurdy which mechanically
resonated?). Sure was! Have you seen the video of that?
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... So as to stay on the topic of Network Analyzers one piece of equipment Info-Age accepted was my General Radio 916 RF Bridge.
Mike N2MS
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Show quoted text
On 11/02/2022 12:20 PM mstangelo@... wrote:
InfoAge did accept my Radio and Electronic Data Books, Equipment Manuals and Electronic perodicals. I donated it in the spring of this year.
The person I worked with is Ray Chase. Is business card shows www.InfoAge.org his email address is radio862@...
Most of my Data Books were for semiconductor and integrated circuit devices. Among the periodicals accepted were my collection Popular Communications magazines.
They are selective on hardware donations but were actively looking for RADAR equipment.
If you have any documentation I would check with them before trashing it.
Mike N2MS
On 11/02/2022 12:59 AM Neil Cherry <ncherry@...> wrote:
On 10/22/22 12:18, N2MS wrote:
... Fortunately InfoAge Museum in Wall NJ accepts technical documentation. ... Not InfoAge but more likely The Vintage Computer Federation (VCF - museum) or
NJARC (Antique Radio museum). I don't think we (Computer Deconstruction Lab -
CDL - Makerspace) got them. InfoAge manages the camp (Camp Evans) and the museums
are responsible for they're piece of the world. :-)
CDL has a NanoVNA-V2 for our digital ham equipment. NJARC has the boat anchors,
meant respectfully. ISEC has the 20m dish. Can you use the NanoVNA on a 20m
dish?
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InfoAge did accept my Radio and Electronic Data Books, Equipment Manuals and Electronic perodicals. I donated it in the spring of this year.
The person I worked with is Ray Chase. Is business card shows www.InfoAge.org his email address is radio862@...
Most of my Data Books were for semiconductor and integrated circuit devices. Among the periodicals accepted were my collection Popular Communications magazines.
They are selective on hardware donations but were actively looking for RADAR equipment.
If you have any documentation I would check with them before trashing it.
Mike N2MS
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 11/02/2022 12:59 AM Neil Cherry <ncherry@...> wrote:
On 10/22/22 12:18, N2MS wrote:
... Fortunately InfoAge Museum in Wall NJ accepts technical documentation. ... Not InfoAge but more likely The Vintage Computer Federation (VCF - museum) or
NJARC (Antique Radio museum). I don't think we (Computer Deconstruction Lab -
CDL - Makerspace) got them. InfoAge manages the camp (Camp Evans) and the museums
are responsible for they're piece of the world. :-)
CDL has a NanoVNA-V2 for our digital ham equipment. NJARC has the boat anchors,
meant respectfully. ISEC has the 20m dish. Can you use the NanoVNA on a 20m
dish?
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Roger Need
F4WCV
Brent DeWitt
Jim Allyn - N7JA