I have updated the firmware on my nanoVNA-H4 hardware build 4.3 using the NanoVNA-H.v1.2.40.bin file and STM32cube software, and notice that
the red battery LED no longer lights when charging or unit is turned on. Same effect after I upgraded my TinySA Ultra....no longer red LED function.
Is that normal?
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Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
Quite right, however backdoors are not the usual attack vector for viruses and malware. The attack is tricking users into executing something they shouldn't. On Mon, 24 Mar 2025 03:23:56 -0400 "William McLaughlin via groups.io" <indispensibill@...> wrote: As I understand it, back doors were (and presumably, still are) created by
programmers as a convenience. They use them because it's quicker for
getting into a system than going through the login procedure and all the
other entries necessary for gaining access to the code when they want to
fix bugs, make modifications, etc. As I said, they're just a convenience
but they have to be kept secret so hackers can't use them to gain access
(as they undoubtedly have at times). -- 73 -Jim NU0C
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Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
History is interesting, you can learn a lot from it. I heard that one of the first times the term ‘bug’ was used involved a moth that got into a relay, keeping it from operating.
This group is great at teaching us how to use and fix a VNA. Most of it is over my head but I am learning from it.
--
Sent from Canary ()
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Monday, Mar 24, 2025 at 3:23 AM, William McLaughlin via groups.io <indispensibill@... (mailto:indispensibill@...)> wrote:
As I understand it, back doors were (and presumably, still are) created by
programmers as a convenience. They use them because it's quicker for
getting into a system than going through the login procedure and all the
other entries necessary for gaining access to the code when they want to
fix bugs, make modifications, etc. As I said, they're just a convenience
but they have to be kept secret so hackers can't use them to gain access
(as they undoubtedly have at times).
Back in the late 1980s I heard about a prankster who, when designing a
large company's software, added some code that at random times would freeze
all of the company's terminals and display the following message: *Hello.
Can I have a cookie?* Their entire system remained locked with this
message on all of their screens until, after what must've been a lot of
trial and error, someone discovered you could unlock the computers by
entering "*Here. Have a cookie*." After that, the system would return to
normal until the next time.
As the story goes, the code was so deeply embedded in their software that
it was cheaper to just instruct all of their employees on the proper
response than to dig through millions of lines of code to fix it. Might be
apocryphal but it's amusing.
73,
Mac
AB3RV
On Mon, Mar 24, 2025 at 1:50?AM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
If you read it again, you will see that I said what a back door is, I
didn’t say it was a virus, it was how a virus was put in computers. Didn’t
mean to start an argument.
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 11:18 PM, Jim Shorney via groups.io <jimNU0C= [email protected] (mailto:jimNU0C@...)> wrote:
A backdoor is not a virus. Viruses and malware are created by
programmers with malicious intent in order to spread mayhem or for
financial gain. A lot of it is offshore these days. It may be fun to poke
at the AV vendors but this stuff is real.
On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 22:19:45 -0400
"Gary H Thompson via groups.io" <garythomjw@...> wrote:
You are right! Most virus’s were created by computer repair/programing
techs. It started a long time ago, while working on a banks system, the
tech put in what they call a ‘back door’. It’s a hidden password so he
could access the system without anyone knowing. Putting a problem in that
would activate in three months, he had steady work without anyone knowing.
When he got called, he was a hero because he could fix it. It wasn’t
long before he had all the work he wanted.
It’s a sad time we live in!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 10:02 PM, Michael Robinson via groups.io
<mlrobinson1953@... (mailto:mlrobinson1953=
[email protected])> wrote:
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed
virii
are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a
viral
attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made
solution for
the virii in question.
--
73
-Jim
NU0C
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Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
As I understand it, back doors were (and presumably, still are) created by programmers as a convenience. They use them because it's quicker for getting into a system than going through the login procedure and all the other entries necessary for gaining access to the code when they want to fix bugs, make modifications, etc. As I said, they're just a convenience but they have to be kept secret so hackers can't use them to gain access (as they undoubtedly have at times). Back in the late 1980s I heard about a prankster who, when designing a large company's software, added some code that at random times would freeze all of the company's terminals and display the following message: *Hello. Can I have a cookie?* Their entire system remained locked with this message on all of their screens until, after what must've been a lot of trial and error, someone discovered you could unlock the computers by entering "*Here. Have a cookie*." After that, the system would return to normal until the next time. As the story goes, the code was so deeply embedded in their software that it was cheaper to just instruct all of their employees on the proper response than to dig through millions of lines of code to fix it. Might be apocryphal but it's amusing. 73, Mac AB3RV On Mon, Mar 24, 2025 at 1:50?AM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw= [email protected]> wrote: If you read it again, you will see that I said what a back door is, I
didn’t say it was a virus, it was how a virus was put in computers. Didn’t
mean to start an argument.
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 11:18 PM, Jim Shorney via groups.io <jimNU0C= [email protected] (mailto:jimNU0C@...)> wrote:
A backdoor is not a virus. Viruses and malware are created by
programmers with malicious intent in order to spread mayhem or for
financial gain. A lot of it is offshore these days. It may be fun to poke
at the AV vendors but this stuff is real.
On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 22:19:45 -0400
"Gary H Thompson via groups.io" <garythomjw@...> wrote:
You are right! Most virus’s were created by computer repair/programing
techs. It started a long time ago, while working on a banks system, the
tech put in what they call a ‘back door’. It’s a hidden password so he
could access the system without anyone knowing. Putting a problem in that
would activate in three months, he had steady work without anyone knowing.
When he got called, he was a hero because he could fix it. It wasn’t
long before he had all the work he wanted.
It’s a sad time we live in!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 10:02 PM, Michael Robinson via groups.io
<mlrobinson1953@... (mailto:mlrobinson1953=
[email protected])> wrote:
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed
virii
are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a
viral
attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made
solution for
the virii in question.
--
73
-Jim
NU0C
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
If you read it again, you will see that I said what a back door is, I didn’t say it was a virus, it was how a virus was put in computers. Didn’t mean to start an argument.
--
Sent from Canary ()
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 11:18 PM, Jim Shorney via groups.io <jimNU0C@... (mailto:jimNU0C@...)> wrote:
A backdoor is not a virus. Viruses and malware are created by programmers with malicious intent in order to spread mayhem or for financial gain. A lot of it is offshore these days. It may be fun to poke at the AV vendors but this stuff is real.
On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 22:19:45 -0400
"Gary H Thompson via groups.io" <garythomjw@...> wrote:
You are right! Most virus’s were created by computer repair/programing techs. It started a long time ago, while working on a banks system, the tech put in what they call a ‘back door’. It’s a hidden password so he could access the system without anyone knowing. Putting a problem in that would activate in three months, he had steady work without anyone knowing.
When he got called, he was a hero because he could fix it. It wasn’t long before he had all the work he wanted.
It’s a sad time we live in!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 10:02 PM, Michael Robinson via groups.io <mlrobinson1953@... (mailto:mlrobinson1953@...)> wrote:
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed virii
are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a viral
attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made solution for
the virii in question. --
73
-Jim
NU0C
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
A backdoor is not a virus. Viruses and malware are created by programmers with malicious intent in order to spread mayhem or for financial gain. A lot of it is offshore these days. It may be fun to poke at the AV vendors but this stuff is real. On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 22:19:45 -0400 "Gary H Thompson via groups.io" <garythomjw@...> wrote: You are right! Most virus’s were created by computer repair/programing techs. It started a long time ago, while working on a banks system, the tech put in what they call a ‘back door’. It’s a hidden password so he could access the system without anyone knowing. Putting a problem in that would activate in three months, he had steady work without anyone knowing.
When he got called, he was a hero because he could fix it. It wasn’t long before he had all the work he wanted.
It’s a sad time we live in!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 10:02 PM, Michael Robinson via groups.io <mlrobinson1953@... (mailto:mlrobinson1953@...)> wrote:
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed virii
are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a viral
attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made solution for
the virii in question. -- 73 -Jim NU0C
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
You are right! Most virus’s were created by computer repair/programing techs. It started a long time ago, while working on a banks system, the tech put in what they call a ‘back door’. It’s a hidden password so he could access the system without anyone knowing. Putting a problem in that would activate in three months, he had steady work without anyone knowing.
When he got called, he was a hero because he could fix it. It wasn’t long before he had all the work he wanted.
It’s a sad time we live in!
--
Sent from Canary ()
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 10:02 PM, Michael Robinson via groups.io <mlrobinson1953@... (mailto:mlrobinson1953@...)> wrote:
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed virii
are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a viral
attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made solution for
the virii in question. This includes Microsoft products, as well. Time to
use a little common sense here, folks. I am slowly making the transition
to Linux OS's. Currently using Linux Mint Cinnamon, Debian 12.9.0 with the
Mate Desktop and Kali Linux. No viruses detected by Clam AV.
Michael L Robinson, KC0TA
“In the beginning of a change the Patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and
hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it
costs nothing to be a Patriot.” ― Mark Twain
When Tyranny becomes Law, Revolution becomes Duty!
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:48?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
That’s great! I do a lot of computer work too. Back in the day, my wife
would play the ‘ghost buster’ song and call me the virus buster.
Glad you got it fixed!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:14 PM, William French - AA1BF via groups.io <bill.french.epsom@... (mailto:bill.french.epsom=
[email protected])> wrote:
My grandson cleared the "McAfee" pop-ups on my computer today.
He is a computer services professional.
He did what was stated above, clearing cookies and related stuff from the
Chrome browser and the problem went away. He said that he has to do this a
couple
of times a week for some of his clients.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:20?PM Chuck Cole via groups.io <cncole=
[email protected]> wrote:
Gary, you're probably right, but MacAfee is the only ID I could find in
many intrusions and I could not find anything to block. I examined and
searched extensively.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:03?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to
their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the
virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟
work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the
popup
and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your
bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
--
Chuck Cole K4TZO
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here and suggest that all supposed virii are manufactured by the antivirii companies to induce the fear of a viral attack on your computer in order to sell you their ready-made solution for the virii in question. This includes Microsoft products, as well. Time to use a little common sense here, folks. I am slowly making the transition to Linux OS's. Currently using Linux Mint Cinnamon, Debian 12.9.0 with the Mate Desktop and Kali Linux. No viruses detected by Clam AV. Michael L Robinson, KC0TA “In the beginning of a change the Patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot.” ― Mark Twain When Tyranny becomes Law, Revolution becomes Duty! On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:48?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw= [email protected]> wrote: That’s great! I do a lot of computer work too. Back in the day, my wife
would play the ‘ghost buster’ song and call me the virus buster.
Glad you got it fixed!
--
Sent from Canary ()
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:14 PM, William French - AA1BF via groups.io <bill.french.epsom@... (mailto:bill.french.epsom=
[email protected])> wrote:
My grandson cleared the "McAfee" pop-ups on my computer today.
He is a computer services professional.
He did what was stated above, clearing cookies and related stuff from the
Chrome browser and the problem went away. He said that he has to do this a
couple
of times a week for some of his clients.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:20?PM Chuck Cole via groups.io <cncole=
[email protected]> wrote:
Gary, you're probably right, but MacAfee is the only ID I could find in
many intrusions and I could not find anything to block. I examined and
searched extensively.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:03?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to
their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the
virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟
work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the
popup
and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your
bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
--
Chuck Cole K4TZO
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
That’s great! I do a lot of computer work too. Back in the day, my wife would play the ‘ghost buster’ song and call me the virus buster.
Glad you got it fixed!
--
Sent from Canary ()
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Sunday, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:14 PM, William French - AA1BF via groups.io <bill.french.epsom@... (mailto:bill.french.epsom@...)> wrote:
My grandson cleared the "McAfee" pop-ups on my computer today.
He is a computer services professional.
He did what was stated above, clearing cookies and related stuff from the
Chrome browser and the problem went away. He said that he has to do this a
couple
of times a week for some of his clients.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:20?PM Chuck Cole via groups.io <cncole=
[email protected]> wrote:
Gary, you're probably right, but MacAfee is the only ID I could find in
many intrusions and I could not find anything to block. I examined and
searched extensively.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:03?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to
their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟
work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the popup
and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your
bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
--
Chuck Cole K4TZO
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
My grandson cleared the "McAfee" pop-ups on my computer today. He is a computer services professional. He did what was stated above, clearing cookies and related stuff from the Chrome browser and the problem went away. He said that he has to do this a couple of times a week for some of his clients. On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:20?PM Chuck Cole via groups.io <cncole= [email protected]> wrote: Gary, you're probably right, but MacAfee is the only ID I could find in
many intrusions and I could not find anything to block. I examined and
searched extensively.
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:03?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw=
[email protected]> wrote:
It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to
their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟
work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the popup
and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your
bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
--
Chuck Cole K4TZO
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
Gary, you're probably right, but MacAfee is the only ID I could find in many intrusions and I could not find anything to block. I examined and searched extensively. On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 6:03?PM Gary H Thompson via groups.io <garythomjw= [email protected]> wrote: It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to
their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟
work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the popup
and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your
bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
-- Chuck Cole ?K4TZO
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
It’s probably not McAfee, it’s a virus that try's to get you to go to their site, thinking you are going to McAfee. The message is the virus.
Clear your browser cookies and browser history and reboot. If that 诲辞别蝉苍’迟 work, use Google to find other things to try. If you clicked on the popup and went to their site, anything you entered is now compromised. Call your bank and credit card and let them know what happened.
|
Locked
Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
For me, MacAfee *is* the invasive virus. I must take careful steps to ignore and remove their notices! I will only use Win10. Win11 has suggested I buy new software when what I have ain't broke. Will use Linux exclusively if /when Win10 no longer runs. 73, Chuck K4TZO On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 11:06?AM Steve Withnell via groups.io <steve.withnell@...> wrote: I've tried downloading nanoSaver to Win11Pro and McAfee snatches the .exe
into quarantine. I'm using the github download:
I tried using a Win10 machine and nanoSaver runs, but MacAfee wants to
remove a virus.
Anyone got a clue on what is going on?
-- Chuck Cole ?K4TZO
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Re: Running NanoVNA Saver (or other software) on Linux
SUSO ………. sudo perhaps ? On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 at 20:05, k6whp via groups.io <k6whp= [email protected]> wrote: My apologies for being so dense but I cannot seem to unpack the advice
given here. I am running Linux Mint 21.0 something and have been able to
install other packages handily, but cannot get my head around what it takes
to install NanoVNA-saver per the instructions here.
Per your instructions..
<11:44|~> Suso apt-cache search nanovna
Suso: command not found
<11:44|~>sudo apt-cache search nanovna
[sudo] password for whp:
<11:45|~> {{{{nothing occurred after password negotiated}}}}
..howeverr, none of this worked out so, in looking for alternatives, I
found this, and was able to bring saver up.
panda@vika:~$ history
1 sudo apt update
2 sudo apt install python3-pip
3 pip3 install
4 echo 'export PATH=$PATH:/home/panda/.local/bin' >> ~/.bashrc
5 source ~/.bashrc
6 NanoVNASaver
Now my question is how does one connect to the NanoVNA like one would do
searching out the Com port on Windows?
--
William, k6whp
--------------------
"Cheer up, things could get worse. So I cheered up and things got worse."
|
Re: Running NanoVNA Saver (or other software) on Linux
Disregard all of above. Found this..
panda@vika:~$ history
1 sudo apt update
2 sudo apt install python3-pip
3 pip3 install
4 echo 'export PATH=$PATH:/home/panda/.local/bin' >> ~/.bashrc
5 source ~/.bashrc
6 NanoVNASaver
Change "panda" to your home -- such as .home/panda/ for me became /home/whp/
The rest works and, once installed, entering "NanaoVNASaver" does the trick. It comes up with "/dev/ttyACM1 (H4)" in port (in my case).
Much simpler.
--
William, k6whp
--------------------
"Cheer up, things could get worse. So I cheered up and things got worse."
|
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Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
Something in the newer versions of Saver is falsely triggering McAfee virus signatures. I tell the quarantine to restore the file, then put it on the list to ignore while scanning.
Some other virus scanners also have problems with it, but some do not.
Stan
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Re: McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
Even without MacAfee, my laptop running Windows 11 will always say that any Ham software I try to install is untrustworthy. I thought it may be because ham software authors are unable to get the software certified due to low potential usage compared to other general use software. Same problem occurs when I try to visit the older and quite popular ham websites as well. All are blocked by my antivirus, mostly because they are http rather than https. 73 Jon, VU2JO On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 8:36?PM Steve Withnell via groups.io <steve.withnell@...> wrote: I've tried downloading nanoSaver to Win11Pro and McAfee snatches the .exe
into quarantine. I'm using the github download:
I tried using a Win10 machine and nanoSaver runs, but MacAfee wants to
remove a virus.
Anyone got a clue on what is going on?
|
Locked
McAFee Virus Scanner Objects to nanoSaver download from GitHub
I've tried downloading nanoSaver to Win11Pro and McAfee snatches the .exe into quarantine. I'm using the github download:
I tried using a Win10 machine and nanoSaver runs, but MacAfee wants to remove a virus.
Anyone got a clue on what is going on?
|
Re: Running NanoVNA Saver (or other software) on Linux
I just installed it in Kubuntu 24.04 from the repository via Synaptic package monitor with no errors. It executes and comes with the expected screen but I would have to go to the room with the physical machine to test operation and it's past my bedtime... On Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:38:18 +0000 "M0CNL via groups.io" <m1cxz.m0cnl@...> wrote: Try doing a
$ Suso apt-cache search nanovna
See what that shows (if anything) as the naming may be slightly different or not included in your versions repo.
Away from a Debian based machine right now so cannot check the actual name of the package.
Just searched the package repo and it’s there in:
24.04LTS
24.10
And plucky
Called nanovna-saver in all of them -- 73 -Jim NU0C
|
Re: Running NanoVNA Saver (or other software) on Linux
Try doing a $ Suso apt-cache search nanovna See what that shows (if anything) as the naming may be slightly different or not included in your versions repo. Away from a Debian based machine right now so cannot check the actual name of the package. Just searched the package repo and it’s there in: 24.04LTS 24.10 And plucky Called nanovna-saver in all of them ________________________________ From: [email protected] < [email protected]> on behalf of k6whp via groups.io <k6whp@...> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2025 1:39:42 AM To: [email protected] < [email protected]> Subject: Re: [nanovna-users] Running NanoVNA Saver (or other software) on Linux Saw this: Install Howto Update the package index: ＄ sudo apt-get update Install nanovna-saver deb package: ＄ sudo apt-get install nanovna-saver Did this: <17:23|~>sudo apt-get update Got this: .... Get:67 jammy-security/universe Translation-en [207 kB] Get:68 jammy-security/universe amd64 DEP-11 Metadata [125 kB] Get:69 jammy-security/universe amd64 c-n-f Metadata [21.7 kB] Get:70 jammy-security/multiverse amd64 DEP-11 Metadata [208 B] Reading package lists... Done N: Skipping acquire of configured file 'main/binary-i386/Packages' as repository ' vscodium InRelease' doesn't support architecture 'i386' E: Failed to fetch 403 Forbidden [IP: 79.143.189.67 443] E: The repository ' focal InRelease' is no longer signed. N: Updating from such a repository can't be done securely, and is therefore disabled by default. N: See apt-secure(8) manpage for repository creation and user configuration details. Did this: <17:25|~>sudo apt-get install nanovna-saver Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree... Done Reading state information... Done E: Unable to locate package nanovna-saver <17:26|~> Sorry to be lame; what am I missing? -- William, k6whp -------------------- "Cheer up, things could get worse. So I cheered up and things got worse."
|
Jim Shorney
Chuck Cole
k6whp