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Re: “Really Intelligent “ charging system

 

开云体育

I wrote an Arduino software controller a few years back that measured battery voltage and fridge/freezer temp. When voltage was over 13.5 (adjustable to your float condition), it would turn on the fridge and/or freezer until they reached their “max cold” temp (38F for fridge, 10F for freezer, again configurable). Below 13.5V, it would default to the “regular cold” temps, 44F and 28F. It would be trivial to adapt it to a water heater as well.?

I no longer have that laptop with the code on it... and I’m not a coder, so I’m sure it was ugly... but someone qualified could code it up quickly.?

Tim


On Jul 17, 2018, at 1:30 AM, Marc <marc.giraudon@...> wrote:

hi all,

looking for some advice and thoughts please -

I have a number of ways of charging the battery bank, solar panel, the engine alternator and shore power.?

Sailing along yesterday in the uk and it dawned on me that it would be really usefull if the charging system that i have would sense when the batteries are full and rather than reduce the charging ampage and “dumping” the excess, this could be used to, for example, heat the hot water or ....

clearly, i can do this manually, and maybe that is the answer - automation is not worth doing - but does anyone know how this could be done?

thank you for youe thoughts.

Marc
”Linocat” 380s2
cruising uk west coast currently.
Re: Windlass Problem: The Quick "Doesn't Fit" - What About the Lofren Tigress Windlass Instead?

 

Sorry to report that the solenoid is completely BURNED OUT.? ?The Leroy Somers was a great Windlass for 14 years, but, alas it is pretty much a goner.

Scott Wallace
Nefarious
Hull #20
Lagoon L-440
Haleiwa (Honolulu) Hawaii


-----Original Message-----
From: svonwatch via Groups.Io <svonwatch@...>
To: lagooncatowners <[email protected]>
Sent: Tue, Jul 17, 2018 2:47 am
Subject: Re: [lagooncatowners] Windlass Problem: The Quick "Doesn't Fit" - What About the Lofren Tigress Windlass Instead?

By any chance do you still have the solenoid to your failed windlass?? Is it in good working condition?? Mine has failed and the yard I'm in has been unable to source another one.? I've got a 1999 Lagoon 410 with a Leroy Somers model #S801.

Bob Goldstein
s/v On Watch
hull #38
Lagoon410
Westbrook, CT

Re: Windlass Problem: The Quick "Doesn't Fit" - What About the Lofren Tigress Windlass Instead?

 

By any chance do you still have the solenoid to your failed windlass?? Is it in good working condition?? Mine has failed and the yard I'm in has been unable to source another one.? I've got a 1999 Lagoon 410 with a Leroy Somers model #S801.

Bob Goldstein
s/v On Watch
hull #38
Lagoon410
Westbrook, CT
“Really Intelligent “ charging system

 

hi all,

looking for some advice and thoughts please -

I have a number of ways of charging the battery bank, solar panel, the engine alternator and shore power.?

Sailing along yesterday in the uk and it dawned on me that it would be really usefull if the charging system that i have would sense when the batteries are full and rather than reduce the charging ampage and “dumping” the excess, this could be used to, for example, heat the hot water or ....

clearly, i can do this manually, and maybe that is the answer - automation is not worth doing - but does anyone know how this could be done?

thank you for youe thoughts.

Marc
”Linocat” 380s2
cruising uk west coast currently.
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Plus, using a transformer is encouraged to isolate your boat from the shore power. This method is used to eliminate any DC voltage going through the water back to ground at the pedestal. Eating anodes in its path.??

On July 16, 2018 at 1:21 PM Rob Hepler <rob@...> wrote:

I think I was recently quoted a price for a box that would do this.. I was actually trying to convert 220/60hz single phase to 220/60/3-phase .. the “box” was essentially a VFD (I think) with variable output for voltage, frequency, and phase.

I was looking to drive a large table saw, so was pricing units rated for 7kW at 220v - the price FOB from china to USA was <$500. ?I would guess half that for the size you need. ?I found the supplier thru .

I did not implement the solution, though, so cannot guarantee that this would work for you, but might be worth looking into. ?Theoretically, will also act as a surge suppressor (although it might do so by falling on its sword)

-Rob


On Jul 16, 2018, at 10:06 AM, Kevin Darden < drkevindarden@...> wrote:

Ok, a couple of thoughts. It seems easier to use a transformer for your needs than to reconvert the entire boat. And more cost effective. One avenue is to have an AC to AC converter and run with the different frequency. I would think over time this method may cause interesting problems that will cost more down the line to correct. The other option is to convert everything to DC then use inverters to convert to the power you need(you already have the inverter for the house). You could find a 240 50hz battery charger for your house bank then find the inverter you need to power house and another inverter to power the washer. This way would require more parts (3) but "portable in nature". Now you can adapt to your surroundings as the need arises. If one of those parts fails, replace as needed. Move to another country, now you only need to change one part, the battery charger. Your ONAN already runs the house. Each country you visit will most likely have a battery charger to fit your needs. This method requires much fewer parts than converting to the 50 hz for the entire house.?

On July 14, 2018 at 7:19 PM "milan via Groups.Io" < milanvotrubec@...> wrote:

Hi Simon,
By now I'm quite overwhelmed by all the great responses. ?Thankyou. I'm on the Gold Coast. I'm a little concerned about changing the boat over to 240v even though i know the onan can be changed.... I'm just wary of the can of worms that may be opened. If you can put my mind at ease after doing it yourself that may help. It would obviously be desirable to have it all on 240v.
The AC units are definitely 115v 60Hz Cruiseairs with Dometic motors. Not sure if maybe just the motors may need changing?? Perhaps someone may be able to advise here? And the water heater element sticker clearly states 110v. I'm guessing that changing a hot water element would note be a big issue.?
Definitely concur with your solar thoughts as well as a Rainman high output water maker.?


?


--
-Rob H
Pacific NW, USA
No sailing vessel at the moment


?
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

Rob Hepler
 

开云体育

I think I was recently quoted a price for a box that would do this.. I was actually trying to convert 220/60hz single phase to 220/60/3-phase .. the “box” was essentially a VFD (I think) with variable output for voltage, frequency, and phase.

I was looking to drive a large table saw, so was pricing units rated for 7kW at 220v - the price FOB from china to USA was <$500. ?I would guess half that for the size you need. ?I found the supplier thru .

I did not implement the solution, though, so cannot guarantee that this would work for you, but might be worth looking into. ?Theoretically, will also act as a surge suppressor (although it might do so by falling on its sword)

-Rob


On Jul 16, 2018, at 10:06 AM, Kevin Darden <drkevindarden@...> wrote:

Ok, a couple of thoughts. It seems easier to use a transformer for your needs than to reconvert the entire boat. And more cost effective. One avenue is to have an AC to AC converter and run with the different frequency. I would think over time this method may cause interesting problems that will cost more down the line to correct. The other option is to convert everything to DC then use inverters to convert to the power you need(you already have the inverter for the house). You could find a 240 50hz battery charger for your house bank then find the inverter you need to power house and another inverter to power the washer. This way would require more parts (3) but "portable in nature". Now you can adapt to your surroundings as the need arises. If one of those parts fails, replace as needed. Move to another country, now you only need to change one part, the battery charger. Your ONAN already runs the house. Each country you visit will most likely have a battery charger to fit your needs. This method requires much fewer parts than converting to the 50 hz for the entire house.?

On July 14, 2018 at 7:19 PM "milan via Groups.Io" <milanvotrubec@...> wrote:

Hi Simon,
By now I'm quite overwhelmed by all the great responses. ?Thankyou. I'm on the Gold Coast. I'm a little concerned about changing the boat over to 240v even though i know the onan can be changed.... I'm just wary of the can of worms that may be opened. If you can put my mind at ease after doing it yourself that may help. It would obviously be desirable to have it all on 240v.
The AC units are definitely 115v 60Hz Cruiseairs with Dometic motors. Not sure if maybe just the motors may need changing?? Perhaps someone may be able to advise here? And the water heater element sticker clearly states 110v. I'm guessing that changing a hot water element would note be a big issue.?
Definitely concur with your solar thoughts as well as a Rainman high output water maker.?


--
-Rob H
Pacific NW, USA
No sailing vessel at the moment
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Ok, a couple of thoughts. It seems easier to use a transformer for your needs than to reconvert the entire boat. And more cost effective. One avenue is to have an AC to AC converter and run with the different frequency. I would think over time this method may cause interesting problems that will cost more down the line to correct. The other option is to convert everything to DC then use inverters to convert to the power you need(you already have the inverter for the house). You could find a 240 50hz battery charger for your house bank then find the inverter you need to power house and another inverter to power the washer. This way would require more parts (3) but "portable in nature". Now you can adapt to your surroundings as the need arises. If one of those parts fails, replace as needed. Move to another country, now you only need to change one part, the battery charger. Your ONAN already runs the house. Each country you visit will most likely have a battery charger to fit your needs. This method requires much fewer parts than converting to the 50 hz for the entire house.?

On July 14, 2018 at 7:19 PM "milan via Groups.Io" <milanvotrubec@...> wrote:

Hi Simon,
By now I'm quite overwhelmed by all the great responses. ?Thankyou. I'm on the Gold Coast. I'm a little concerned about changing the boat over to 240v even though i know the onan can be changed.... I'm just wary of the can of worms that may be opened. If you can put my mind at ease after doing it yourself that may help. It would obviously be desirable to have it all on 240v.
The AC units are definitely 115v 60Hz Cruiseairs with Dometic motors. Not sure if maybe just the motors may need changing?? Perhaps someone may be able to advise here? And the water heater element sticker clearly states 110v. I'm guessing that changing a hot water element would note be a big issue.?
Definitely concur with your solar thoughts as well as a Rainman high output water maker.?
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Thanks David but I don't believe they're available in Australia unless you know otherwise??
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

hi Milan. Check out this machine?
--
—-
David
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Paul,
Copy that. Appreciate your advice. So maybe some more thought into converting the boat to 240v? I understand the 110v wiring can handle the 240v but it's the other unknowns that worry me. ?I know about the Dometic motors on the Cruiseair ACs and the water heater element requiring 110v 60Hz but it's the other bits and pieces. ?Guessing it's time for a sparky? I'm on Gold Coast. Know anyone reliable?
TIA
Milan
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Hi Don,
Yes but easier said than done unfortunately. Searched in Australia and none available..... unless someone can help.?
Cheers
M
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Thanks Jerry, yes the frequency is the issue. Tried a step up transformer and because of the sophisticated washer dryer it simply said 'No'.
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Hi Simon,
By now I'm quite overwhelmed by all the great responses. ?Thankyou. I'm on the Gold Coast. I'm a little concerned about changing the boat over to 240v even though i know the onan can be changed.... I'm just wary of the can of worms that may be opened. If you can put my mind at ease after doing it yourself that may help. It would obviously be desirable to have it all on 240v.
The AC units are definitely 115v 60Hz Cruiseairs with Dometic motors. Not sure if maybe just the motors may need changing?? Perhaps someone may be able to advise here? And the water heater element sticker clearly states 110v. I'm guessing that changing a hot water element would note be a big issue.?
Definitely concur with your solar thoughts as well as a Rainman high output water maker.?
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Dave, thankyou for your most detailed reply. ?I certainly wish i had your electrical knowledge. The ACs are definitely 115v 60 Hz.?
I'm going to digest your info and probably get back to you with some queries if you dont mind. ?Thanks again.?
Milan
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

PaulinOz
 
Edited

or is there a means of coming straight from the genset delivering 110v 60Hz and converting that to 240v 50Hz.?

Yes, the simplest and best way to accomplish a conversion from 110 V AC 60 Hz to 240 V AC 50 Hz is with something called a 50Hz to 60Hz Frequency Converter. They are neither cheap nor light weight a 3kW will set you back in the vicinity of $3,500 AUD plus installation and weigh in at 75 kg.

The washer at 1850 watts if run off a separate 12 volt / 240 AC inverter will be drawing something in the vicinity of 150 amps out of your battery bank, neither your solar or 80 amp battery charger are going to be up to that challenge.

I suggest a long hard think about what exactly you need / want in the way of electrical power now and into the future, before spending money that may be regretted at a latter date.

-- Paul Rogers . Lagoon 450F #233 2013 East Coast of Oz
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

Don Roy
 

You probably don't want to here this but I'd sell the washer and get a new 110v version. May be a lot easier on your budget and simpler solution

Don Roy
Fezywig L380 #288 in Grenada.
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

Dave cant help but love the name of your 421. Thanks for the smile,
Bil

On Sat, Jul 14, 2018 at 12:03 AM, Dave Bond <d.bond@...> wrote:

The generator being American should be able to produce 110/220V at 60Hz. You can get 50Hz by slowing the motor down but the power output also goes down. My generator is 9.5Kw at 50 Hz and 11Kw at 60Hz. The issue you face is the impact of the Hz on motors. A 60Hz motor run at 50Hz runs about 17% slower whereas a 50Hz motor being run at 60Hz will run 20% faster. As a rule a 60Hz motor can run generally Ok at 50Hz but the other way round can cause premature failure as the motors run at a higher speed hence the bearings are being asked to run at a higher speed.

?

One thing you need to be aware of is how is the 220V being generated. In Australia and Europe 230/240V AC goes from 0-240-0V in one sine wave cycle( 0V is earth potential). In the US they use two 110V supplies( known as hots), one goes from 0V to? +110V back to 0 and another goes from 0V to -110V back to 0V. The power supply has four wires, Earth, Neutral, +110V and -110V. Appliances don’t care about the sign only the potential, so to get 220V you simply connect to the two hot wires with no Neutral. Make sure your electrician understands the difference between US and Europe

?

Are you sure that all the AC is 110V? I say that because normally high load items like AC, washer, dryer etc in the US are normally supplied 220V as I explained above to reduce the amps being used (Volts=Amps*Resistance). It is normal for the appliance outlet/plugs to be 110V and the Inverter supplying 110V 60Hz. I’m surprised the water heater is 110V for the same reasons. A kettle or water heater not affected by frequency so a 230V water heater unlikely to be changed to US and power being supplied at 220V via shore power cable (assuming it is 4 wire normally 50A), generator when running. The battery charger again is not normally sensitive to frequency because it is rectifying the AC to DC so tends to be higher voltage

?

My vessel was rewired (after a lightening strike in US) to be 60Hz but a hybrid of 220V and 110V.? Both Generator and Shore power are 220V 60Hz. The battery Charger is 220/240V, didn’t change the water heater (220V) and AC is 220V (some 50/60Hz some 60Hz). The inverter is 110V 60Hz so when on shore power here in Phuket I run the inverter off the battery charger. The AC runs fine but not as powerful.

?

I have a 12V water maker which we can use when engines or generator running.

?

Hope that helps

?

Dave

Shaken Not Stern

L421

Phuket

?

?
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

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It’s probably easiest to get a 110 washer but another option is to install a 110 to 220 transformer.? That would be far more efficient than using an inverter.? You could use it for other 220 requirements as they arrive and drive it directly from the genset.? Remember also the 110 is 60 cycle and the 220 is 50.? The transformer will not do anything to alter the frequency.? Most loads are not sensitive to the frequency difference but some will work poorly or not at all.? Good luck

?

Jerry Peters

s/v Mucho Gusto

?
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

simon kelly
 

Hi Milan,
i have Lagoon 420, 2009 and I live in Australia, Passing Townsville as we speak. I can voice a few suggestions with what I have learnt to date.
if you are keeping the boat in Aus change over to 240. Put in 800watts plus of quality solar, rainmaker desal in 240v and 12v with 100litre plus per hour, your inverter is good and house capacity too, Victron inverters are good. If you can pass on where you are I might be able to pass on a reliable contractor which is hard to find at times.
cheers
simon
Re: 110v 240v Electrial advice sought

 

开云体育

The generator being American should be able to produce 110/220V at 60Hz. You can get 50Hz by slowing the motor down but the power output also goes down. My generator is 9.5Kw at 50 Hz and 11Kw at 60Hz. The issue you face is the impact of the Hz on motors. A 60Hz motor run at 50Hz runs about 17% slower whereas a 50Hz motor being run at 60Hz will run 20% faster. As a rule a 60Hz motor can run generally Ok at 50Hz but the other way round can cause premature failure as the motors run at a higher speed hence the bearings are being asked to run at a higher speed.

?

One thing you need to be aware of is how is the 220V being generated. In Australia and Europe 230/240V AC goes from 0-240-0V in one sine wave cycle( 0V is earth potential). In the US they use two 110V supplies( known as hots), one goes from 0V to? +110V back to 0 and another goes from 0V to -110V back to 0V. The power supply has four wires, Earth, Neutral, +110V and -110V. Appliances don’t care about the sign only the potential, so to get 220V you simply connect to the two hot wires with no Neutral. Make sure your electrician understands the difference between US and Europe

?

Are you sure that all the AC is 110V? I say that because normally high load items like AC, washer, dryer etc in the US are normally supplied 220V as I explained above to reduce the amps being used (Volts=Amps*Resistance). It is normal for the appliance outlet/plugs to be 110V and the Inverter supplying 110V 60Hz. I’m surprised the water heater is 110V for the same reasons. A kettle or water heater not affected by frequency so a 230V water heater unlikely to be changed to US and power being supplied at 220V via shore power cable (assuming it is 4 wire normally 50A), generator when running. The battery charger again is not normally sensitive to frequency because it is rectifying the AC to DC so tends to be higher voltage

?

My vessel was rewired (after a lightening strike in US) to be 60Hz but a hybrid of 220V and 110V. ?Both Generator and Shore power are 220V 60Hz. The battery Charger is 220/240V, didn’t change the water heater (220V) and AC is 220V (some 50/60Hz some 60Hz). The inverter is 110V 60Hz so when on shore power here in Phuket I run the inverter off the battery charger. The AC runs fine but not as powerful.

?

I have a 12V water maker which we can use when engines or generator running.

?

Hope that helps

?

Dave

Shaken Not Stern

L421

Phuket

?

?
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