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I need some help understanding what the Held property of a signal mast does. The JMRI signalling page says nothing other than it exists and web searches turns up a few developers discussions that seem to say it either does nothing or it sets the signal to stop.

In my own testing it sets the panel icon to stop but the physical signal on the layout isn't at stop.

How exactly is the held property supposed to work?

Thanks much.
--
Tim D. Childs
tim.d.childs@...
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Held state puts the signal aspect to stop. Typically, a held condition exists in a CTC system when a train has a proceed aspect on the signal. Once the train passes the signal, the signal drops to stop and held until cleared by the dispatcher for another train.
--
Ken
NYNH&H, Old Colony Division, Cape Cod Branch (1949-1959)
[DB150][PR3][QuadLN_S][JMRI 5.3.5]

By contrast, if the signal where an ABS (automatic block signal), the stop aspect would change as soon as the train exits the next block.
--
Ken
NYNH&H, Old Colony Division, Cape Cod Branch (1949-1959)
[DB150][PR3][QuadLN_S][JMRI 5.3.5]

Except that it doesn't do that. The ICON on the PANEL goes to stop but the actual signal on the railroad is still clear or whatever.

--
Tim D. Childs
tim.d.childs@...
--
Stand firm for what you believe in until and unless logic and experience prove you wrong. Remember, when the Emperor looks naked, the Emperor is naked; the truth and a lie are not sort of the same thing; and there's no aspect, no facet, no moment of life that can't be improved with Pizza. - Daria

The signal logic should be looking at Held and setting the signal to stop.

What is controlling your signal?

Bob

It's the slave of a signal mast repeater so I'm gonna guess that since
there isn't any signal mast logic this is why it's not working correctly.


On 5/6/23 9:03 PM, Bob Jacobsen wrote:

The signal logic should be looking at Held and setting the signal to
stop.
What is controlling your signal?
Bob

On May 6, 2023, at 8:09 PM, tdc <tim.d.childs@...> wrote:
?Except that it doesn't do that. The ICON on the PANEL goes to
stop but the actual signal on the railroad is still clear or
whatever.

On 5/6/23 8:04 PM, Ken Heywood wrote: Held state puts the signal
aspect to stop. Typically, a held condition exists in a CTC
system when a train has a proceed aspect on the signal. Once the
train passes the signal, the signal drops to stop and held until
cleared by the dispatcher for another train. -- Ken NYNH&H, Old
Colony Division, Cape Cod Branch (1949-1959) [DB150][PR3][QuadLN_S][JMRI 5.3.5]

-- Tim D. Childs tim.d.childs@... -- Stand firm for what you
believe in until and unless logic and experience prove you wrong.
Remember, when the Emperor looks naked, the Emperor is naked; the
truth and a lie are not sort of the same thing; and there's no
aspect, no facet, no moment of life that can't be improved with
Pizza. - Daria

------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Tim D. Childs
tim.d.childs@...
President, Lansing Model Railroad Club Inc.
Superintendent of Signalling and Communications,
Hogsback and Southern Railroad
Project Engineer, MSU IT, retired

Tim,

Which sort of mast and does it understand held? Some of this also gets into how
the logic for the mast is handled. Please comment on type of mast and logic used
to control it.

-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.com
www.syracusemodelrr.org

Yes that's right but JMRI is backward.

The information sent by a CTC system from the Office to the Field is Signal Called/Requested as opposed to "Signal Held"
The canonical (startup) state is no signals better than Stop at the control point.

Tim,

Does the signal mast table entry indicate stop?

According to a previous version of your xml file, you are using C/MRI for signals. Do the related signal heads and turnouts indicate stop? Does the C/MRI monitor show a turnout command being sent to the layout?

Dave Sand

The signal works correctly otherwise and the table entry does not indicate stop when held - that last and Bob's comment about signal mast logic triggered an epiphany, the signal being held was a repeater of another signal so it had no logic associated with it which is probably why the hold was not working.

I deleted the repeater and manually copied the signal mast logic from the former master. Now the signal works as expected and the table is showing stop when held. It'll be some days before I can try it on the layout but I am quite hopeful.

Thank you to everyone for their thoughts and ideas.

Tim

On 5/6/23 11:24 PM, Dave Sand wrote:

Tim,
Does the signal mast table entry indicate stop?
According to a previous version of your xml file, you are using C/MRI
for signals. Do the related signal heads and turnouts indicate stop?
Does the C/MRI monitor show a turnout command being sent to the
layout?
Dave Sand
----- Original message ----- From: tdc <tim.d.childs@...> To:
[email protected] Subject: [jmriusers] Signal mast held help Date:
Saturday, May 06, 2023 6:36 PM
I need some help understanding what the Held property of a signal
mast does. The JMRI signalling page says nothing other than it
exists and web searches turns up a few developers discussions that
seem to say it either does nothing or it sets the signal to stop.
In my own testing it sets the panel icon to stop but the physical
signal on the layout isn't at stop.
How exactly is the held property supposed to work?
Thanks much.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Tim D. Childs
tim.d.childs@...
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