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Nigel,
?
You need to click the “Show Unused Slots” box on the top left of the Slot Monitor.
?
HTH
?
Ross
?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of
Jan Carr
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2018 1:29 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, loconet slot monitor
?
Nigel:? My understanding is that Zephyr (DCS51 for me) releases a loco - ie stops all communications with it - when another loco is selected on its keypad. In fact I rely on that behaviour. Release before picking up a new loco is an option
on Engine Driver so I assume in JMRI.
Jan
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Thanks for the reply Ross,? but something has changed between versions.? ??
?
?
JMRI 4.9.4 (happens to be on an old laptop). Windows 10, ?PR3, Zephyr DCS50.?
Slot monitor shows 11 slots, with status being “in use” (actually on the Zephyr keypad/throttle), “common”? (loco left running with non-zero speed step),? “idle” (loco either left running on zero speed, or actually
dispatched using dispatch process on Zephyr).?
If I select “show unused slots”, I then see 120 slots, which are, of course, fictional.? They might be present on a DCS100 (Chief) command station.?
?
JMRI 4.13.4.? Windows 10 (different laptop), PR3, Zephyr DCS50.
Slot monitor shows 1 slot when it is “in use”.? If I use a second throttle, that will be displayed. ?But slots which have gone to “common” are not shown.
Use of “show unused slots” brings up the 120 slots, the first 11 (or thereabouts) are genuine, the remainder are fictional.?
?
And for completeness, the old LocoNet Checker program (unfortunately no longer available) shows the 11 slots similar to what I see in JMRI 4.9.4.??
?
?
Now, if this change was intentional, then where is it documented ????? If it was an accident of something else (which I suspect it may be to do with the big increase in slots in
the DCS240), then is it a bug, unintended side effect, accident, or what ??
?
?
?
?
Jan,? thanks for the reply, but I think I’m clear about the difference between locos left running (status = common) and locos which are idle, and also about dispatching mechanisms.??
I have a throttle (Fred) which only works if correct dispatching is used.???
?
?
?
- Nigel
?
?
?
?
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From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Ross Kudlick
Sent: 26 November 2018 18:45
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, LocoNet slot monitor
?
Nigel,
?
You need to click the “Show Unused Slots” box on the top left of the Slot Monitor.
?
HTH
?
Ross
?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]>
On Behalf Of Jan Carr
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2018 1:29 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, loconet slot monitor
?
Nigel:? My understanding is that Zephyr (DCS51 for me) releases a loco - ie stops all communications with it - when another loco is selected on its keypad. In fact I rely on that behaviour. Release before picking up a
new loco is an option on Engine Driver so I assume in JMRI.
Jan
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I too have noticed that there are a lot of slots that used to be shown are
not anymore (like since around 4.11). Of particular issue to me are locos
with speeds. To me those should show regardless of status. We have a couple
of clubs and layouts where proper shutdown and release of locos just doesn't
happen 30% of the time. So I find I'm always using the 'show all slots' and
then having to sort by features like speed to know which need cleaning up
(acquire, idle, turn off functions, release). I didn't need to do that for
many revisions. Something changed in the last year or so that default
display is often showing a lot less of the slots of interest.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.com
www.syracusemodelrr.org
|
I do not like the new slot monitor display which shows only locos in use.? I would prefer the previous method which displays all slot that have a loco number in them, regardless of the status.
Dale Gloer
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I will add my vote to Dale and Ken. I do not like the change at all. I use a DCS100, so all 120 slots are 'real', but very annoying that I have to select "show all slots" to see what is there. In the case of "Common" slots the Digitrax DCS100 will not write over those slots, so it is very important to know which slots were dispatched but left in "Common". Barry Draper ________________________________________ From: [email protected] < [email protected]> on behalf of Dale Gloer <dale.gloer@...> Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2018 7:32 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, LocoNet slot monitor I do not like the new slot monitor display which shows only locos in use. I would prefer the previous method which displays all slot that have a loco number in them, regardless of the status. Dale Gloer </https:></mailto: [email protected]></https:></https:></https:></mailto:dale.gloer@...?subject=private:%20re:%20re%3a%20%5bjmriusers%5d%20possible%20bug%2c%20loconet%20slot%20monitor></mailto: [email protected]?subject=re:%20re%3a%20%5bjmriusers%5d%20possible%20bug%2c%20loconet%20slot%20monitor></https:></dale.gloer@...></ [email protected]>
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If somebody wants to look into restoring the previous behavior, the commit that changed this was commit 7cc228bfaf451520ea16cb8e18b950050d1f9a4d
Date: Tue Dec 19 19:59:16 2017 -0500
Partly add filtering to Slot Monitor table
Need to use filtering instead of manipulating the model to implement checkboxes showing/hiding certain types of slots.
:040000 040000 e4378d76dab518e516a5ef33130d95bdfc1db7d0 d8cfda18046228b646c8ead203ceabd08b7bf201 M java You can see the full set of changes here: The PR that included it is here: It’s called "Fix errors reading slots in Slot Monitor” It doesn’t look to me like the Zephyr behavior change was intended, but rather an unintended part of fixing some intermittent failures under load. It first appeared in JMRI 4.11.1 on December 24th, 2017. Bob -- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
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I think this should be reverted before the release of 4.15. If I could convince myself to participate in the development of this product I would do it but I've been retired for just 1 year and need to get away from Java for a while (java engineer for many years).?
On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 12:08 AM Bob Jacobsen < rgj1927@...> wrote: If somebody wants to look into restoring the previous behavior, the commit that changed this was
> commit 7cc228bfaf451520ea16cb8e18b950050d1f9a4d
> Date:? ?Tue Dec 19 19:59:16 2017 -0500
>
>? ? ?Partly add filtering to Slot Monitor table
>? ? ?
>? ? ?Need to use filtering instead of manipulating the model to implement checkboxes showing/hiding certain types of slots.
>
> :040000 040000 e4378d76dab518e516a5ef33130d95bdfc1db7d0 d8cfda18046228b646c8ead203ceabd08b7bf201 M? ? java
You can see the full set of changes here:?
The PR that included it is here:?
It’s called "Fix errors reading slots in Slot Monitor”
It doesn’t look to me like the Zephyr behavior change was intended, but rather an unintended part of fixing some intermittent failures under load.
It first appeared in JMRI 4.11.1 on December 24th, 2017.
Bob
--
Bob Jacobsen
rgj1927@...
-- John Griffin? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? _______________________________ If today was your last day, you would...
|
That particular PR includes a lot of good stuff besides this change to the filter logic. The filter part seems to boil down to a line that says (effectively) “if no checkboxes are selected, display slots that have status “LOCO_IN_USE”. The older code was so messy (and I can say that, as I wrote it) that it’s not clear to me what it was doing before. Which of these states should it (by default) show now? * LOCO_IN_USE which is defined as STAT1_SL_BUSY | STAT1_SL_ACTIVE (this is happening now) * LOCO_IDLE = STAT1_SL_BUSY * LOCO_COMMON = STAT1_SL_ACTIVE * LOCO_FREE = 0 Bob On Nov 28, 2018, at 7:55 AM, John Griffin <johng.sst@...> wrote:
I think this should be reverted before the release of 4.15 If I could convince myself to participate in the development of this product I would do it but I've been retired for just 1 year and need to get away from Java for a while (java engineer for many years).
On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 12:08 AM Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...> wrote:
If somebody wants to look into restoring the previous behavior, the commit that changed this was
commit 7cc228bfaf451520ea16cb8e18b950050d1f9a4d
Date: Tue Dec 19 19:59:16 2017 -0500
Partly add filtering to Slot Monitor table
Need to use filtering instead of manipulating the model to implement checkboxes showing/hiding certain types of slots.
:040000 040000 e4378d76dab518e516a5ef33130d95bdfc1db7d0 d8cfda18046228b646c8ead203ceabd08b7bf201 M java You can see the full set of changes here:
The PR that included it is here:
It’s called "Fix errors reading slots in Slot Monitor”
It doesn’t look to me like the Zephyr behavior change was intended, but rather an unintended part of fixing some intermittent failures under load.
It first appeared in JMRI 4.11.1 on December 24th, 2017.
Bob
--
Bob Jacobsen
rgj1927@...
--
John Griffin
_______________________________
If today was your last day, you would...
-- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
|
Just a cursory look but it appears removing the right side of the && at line 182 would fix it.?
On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 9:11 AM Bob Jacobsen < rgj1927@...> wrote: That particular PR includes a lot of good stuff besides this change to the filter logic.
The filter part seems to boil down to a line that says (effectively) “if no checkboxes are selected, display slots that have status “LOCO_IN_USE”.? The older code was so messy (and I can say that, as I wrote it) that it’s not clear to me what it was doing before.
Which of these states should it (by default) show now?
* LOCO_IN_USE which is defined as STAT1_SL_BUSY | STAT1_SL_ACTIVE? (this is happening now)
* LOCO_IDLE = STAT1_SL_BUSY
* LOCO_COMMON = STAT1_SL_ACTIVE
* LOCO_FREE = 0
Bob
> On Nov 28, 2018, at 7:55 AM, John Griffin <johng.sst@...> wrote:
>
> I think this should be reverted before the release of 4.15 If I could convince myself to participate in the development of this product I would do it but I've been retired for just 1 year and need to get away from Java for a while (java engineer for many years).
>
> On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 12:08 AM Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...> wrote:
> If somebody wants to look into restoring the previous behavior, the commit that changed this was
>
> > commit 7cc228bfaf451520ea16cb8e18b950050d1f9a4d
> > Date:? ?Tue Dec 19 19:59:16 2017 -0500
> >
> >? ? ?Partly add filtering to Slot Monitor table
> >? ? ?
> >? ? ?Need to use filtering instead of manipulating the model to implement checkboxes showing/hiding certain types of slots.
> >
> > :040000 040000 e4378d76dab518e516a5ef33130d95bdfc1db7d0 d8cfda18046228b646c8ead203ceabd08b7bf201 M? ? java
>
> You can see the full set of changes here:?
>
> The PR that included it is here:?
> It’s called "Fix errors reading slots in Slot Monitor”
>
> It doesn’t look to me like the Zephyr behavior change was intended, but rather an unintended part of fixing some intermittent failures under load.
>
> It first appeared in JMRI 4.11.1 on December 24th, 2017.
>
> Bob
> --
> Bob Jacobsen
> rgj1927@...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> John Griffin? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
> _______________________________
> If today was your last day, you would...
>
--
Bob Jacobsen
rgj1927@...
-- John Griffin? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? _______________________________ If today was your last day, you would...
|
I suspect from reading the github pages that the original intention was to offer more checkboxes to choose which things to display. So, my ideal solution would be to have checkboxes for all of the states available at the top of the listing, and the user selects the ones they want, and that selection would be persistent between JMRI sessions.
If that's too much work (and I appreciate I'm asking someone else to do work), then of the states listed by Bob, I'd pick all of them except "LOCO_FREE =0"
- Nigel
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-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto: [email protected]] On Behalf Of Bob Jacobsen Sent: 28 November 2018 16:11 To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, LocoNet slot monitor That particular PR includes a lot of good stuff besides this change to the filter logic. The filter part seems to boil down to a line that says (effectively) “if no checkboxes are selected, display slots that have status “LOCO_IN_USE”. The older code was so messy (and I can say that, as I wrote it) that it’s not clear to me what it was doing before. Which of these states should it (by default) show now? * LOCO_IN_USE which is defined as STAT1_SL_BUSY | STAT1_SL_ACTIVE (this is happening now) * LOCO_IDLE = STAT1_SL_BUSY * LOCO_COMMON = STAT1_SL_ACTIVE * LOCO_FREE = 0 Bob On Nov 28, 2018, at 7:55 AM, John Griffin <johng.sst@...> wrote:
I think this should be reverted before the release of 4.15 If I could convince myself to participate in the development of this product I would do it but I've been retired for just 1 year and need to get away from Java for a while (java engineer for many years).
On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 12:08 AM Bob Jacobsen <rgj1927@...> wrote:
If somebody wants to look into restoring the previous behavior, the commit that changed this was
commit 7cc228bfaf451520ea16cb8e18b950050d1f9a4d
Date: Tue Dec 19 19:59:16 2017 -0500
Partly add filtering to Slot Monitor table
Need to use filtering instead of manipulating the model to implement checkboxes showing/hiding certain types of slots.
:040000 040000 e4378d76dab518e516a5ef33130d95bdfc1db7d0 d8cfda18046228b646c8ead203ceabd08b7bf201 M java You can see the full set of changes here:
The PR that included it is here:
It’s called "Fix errors reading slots in Slot Monitor”
It doesn’t look to me like the Zephyr behavior change was intended, but rather an unintended part of fixing some intermittent failures under load.
It first appeared in JMRI 4.11.1 on December 24th, 2017.
Bob
--
Bob Jacobsen
rgj1927@...
--
John Griffin
_______________________________
If today was your last day, you would...
-- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
|
I agree, lots of other things in that commit. I would say the change from
looking for LOCO_IN_USE to != LOCO_FREE would come closest to the older
results. My other thought was if anything had a throttle speed != 0, that
should always return true also.
I see the filter being nice an clean compared to old way.
I don't have a working repository right now or those two things are what I'd
consider doing.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.com
www.syracusemodelrr.org
|
Bob J does a good job of focusing the problem on a key question (like he usually does!): What do we want the JMRI "LocoNet Slot Monitor" tool to do?
Whatever we come up with, I think we need a simple-to-use mechanism with a carefully-chosen default setting.
For the existing GUI, I would argue that the "default" mode of operation (i.e. "show unused slots" checkbox unchecked) should show any slot which can be actively controlled by a throttle (JMRI, Wi, Digitrax, or otherwise). This interpretation means, I believe, that "IN_USE" state _and_ "COMMON" state slots should always be shown, and "checking" the "show unused slots" checkbox would enable display of "FREE" state and "IDLE" state slots.
I do not support the idea of replacing the simple "show unused slots" checkbox with four checkboxes, one for each slot "state". The typical LocoNet/JMRI user doesn't have a clue about "slot state" values. Implementing four checkboxes, one for each state would cause massive confusion in the user-base, and would require significant re-training and support.
However, I and other power-users have uses for the four-checkbox approach. We could implement an option where the user could fiddle something like a checkbox in a new menu item on the Slot Monitor tool to swap out the simple "show unused slots" checkbox for the four "checkbox per slot status value" checkboxes.
Regards,
Billybob
|
Hi
I agree that the four check boxes approach aint the greatest for general use.?
The generalised approach would be the Excel one of right clicking the column header and selecting the filter options, a lot of work to develop.
The default was to show anything not free. So Common, idle, In Use. It could be reprogrammed to that.
While the discussion goes on, try selecting show all slots and then sort descending on loco number column (click on the header column name). It will get you to the same place.
You can click on any of the headers to sort on that column.
My biggest problem on this screen is that the default direction column width is too small and that it doesn't remember my choices. With some direction we can fix this up. Colours, any one want colours?
Steve G.
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First off: I have no stake in this at all. But reading along, it seems to boil down to a UI question. And I think that sort of question has been successfully answered in other products I have used by having the original checkbox and a second one labeled 'Advanced settings' that releases the four checkboxes instead of the one. That steers inexperienced users quite reliably away from areas where they could do more harm than good while giving 'power users' all they need.
Wouter
Hi
I agree that the four check boxes approach aint the greatest for general use.?
The generalised approach would be the Excel one of right clicking the column header and selecting the filter options, a lot of work to develop.
The default was to show anything not free. So Common, idle, In Use. It could be reprogrammed to that.
While the discussion goes on, try selecting show all slots and then sort descending on loco number column (click on the header column name). It will get you to the same place.
You can click on any of the headers to sort on that column.
My biggest problem on this screen is that the default direction column width is too small and that it doesn't remember my choices. With some direction we can fix this up. Colours, any one want colours?
Steve G.
|
My preference would be that any slot that has a Loco address in? it should be displayed.? That seems to me like very simple filtering also.? Have that as the default and if you want check boxes to refine the filtering that is okay but not necessary in my opinion.
Dale Gloer
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Dale,
The problem with any value in the loco id is twofold. First you have zero,
which is a valid number while also being the default from a reset. Second is
the command station keeps the id in a slot after the proper release (that
will let the command station over-ride it as needed.
So on a healthy system you will see a growing list of all the locos that
have been used at some time.
-Ken Cameron, Member JMRI Dev Team
www.jmri.org
www.fingerlakeslivesteamers.org
www.cnymod.com
www.syracusemodelrr.org
|
Pull Request (PR) 6224 has a change to display slots that are not in FREE state. ?It should be in development builds shortly, and then the next test release around December 4th. ?
The discussion about what to do beyond that is great, and if it settles down to a consensus somebody will probably code it.
|
Thanks.?? ?I’ll test next week when the test release is available.
?
-?????????
Nigel
?
?
?
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Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Bob Jacobsen
Sent: 30 November 2018 19:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, LocoNet slot monitor
?
Pull Request (PR) 6224 has a change to display slots that are not in FREE state. ?It should be in development builds shortly, and then the next test release around December 4th. ?
The discussion about what to do beyond that is great, and if it settles down to a consensus somebody will probably code it.
|
Slot monitor in JMRI 4.13.6 is much better – seems to be mostly back to how I remember things of old.?? Works nicely on a Zephyr DCS50.?
?
Users of systems with more slots, such as a Chief, will have to comment on how it works for them.
?
?
-?????????
Nigel
?
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Bob Jacobsen
Sent: 30 November 2018 19:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [jmriusers] possible bug, LocoNet slot monitor
?
Pull Request (PR) 6224 has a change to display slots that are not in FREE state. ?It should be in development builds shortly, and then the next test release around December 4th. ?
The discussion about what to do beyond that is great, and if it settles down to a consensus somebody will probably code it.
|
What kind of things could you do with the filter(s)? I.e. what could it filter on?
2 - For those who have worked with Loconet Checker, it had a nice pull down menu for filtering viewable slots. Implementing that in JMRI Monitor Slots would be nice addition.
-- Bob Jacobsen rgj1927@...
|
Ken Cameron
Dale Gloer
Bob Jacobsen