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I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position.
My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate.
It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use.
Or has anyone found a solution?
Thanks
Phil
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Phil,
I believe Randy shared this flexible hose that has worked for me with no issues. it is available directly from supplier and also a bit cheaper from amazon.
POWERTEC 70220 PVC Dust Collection Hose (5 Inch x 10 Feet) | Flexible Clear Vue Heavy Duty PVC Hose https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XKMP1YX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_b87nFbH3VNS4K
make sure saw is at 90 when you determine hose length. IIRC, it was ~36” for me.
imran
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On Aug 15, 2020, at 4:14 AM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote:
?I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position.
My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate.
It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use.
Or has anyone found a solution?
Thanks
Phil
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Yes.. what Imran has suggested, works perfectly.. The trick, is to move the blade to a 45 degree position, take the hose and connect it to the dust port elbow on the blade housing and to the other end where it exits the saw cabinet but add a few inches to the length of the hose so it's not so stretched tight. when you bring the blade back to a 90 degree, the hose will "accordion" back to itself and not kink.
On Saturday, August 15, 2020, 03:58:27 AM PDT, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
Phil,
I believe Randy shared this flexible hose that has worked for me with no issues. it is available directly from supplier and also a bit cheaper from amazon.
POWERTEC 70220 PVC Dust Collection Hose (5 Inch x 10 Feet) | Flexible Clear Vue Heavy Duty PVC Hose https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XKMP1YX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_b87nFbH3VNS4K
make sure saw is at 90 when you determine hose length. IIRC, it was ~36” for me.
imran
On Aug 15, 2020, at 4:14 AM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote:
?I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position.
My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate.
It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use.
Or has anyone found a solution?
Thanks
Phil
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Randy, thanks for the correction. my brain plays tricks and for some reason thought that the housing tilts into the machine as opposed to away towards outside ??♂???♂???♂?
i told phil, incorrectly, to do what i did without thinking. seem to happen frequently. fortunately with 10’ length, there was enough to do it correctly. just as you describe.
imran?
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On Aug 15, 2020, at 7:38 AM, Randy Child via groups.io <strongman_one@...> wrote: ?
Yes.. what Imran has suggested, works perfectly.. The trick, is to move the blade to a 45 degree position, take the hose and connect it to the dust port elbow on the blade housing and to the other end where it exits the saw cabinet but add a few inches to the length of the hose so it's not so stretched tight. when you bring the blade back to a 90 degree, the hose will "accordion" back to itself and not kink.
On Saturday, August 15, 2020, 03:58:27 AM PDT, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
Phil,
I believe Randy shared this flexible hose that has worked for me with no issues. it is available directly from supplier and also a bit cheaper from amazon.
POWERTEC 70220 PVC Dust Collection Hose (5 Inch x 10 Feet) | Flexible Clear Vue Heavy Duty PVC Hose https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XKMP1YX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_b87nFbH3VNS4K
make sure saw is at 90 when you determine hose length. IIRC, it was ~36” for me.
imran
On Aug 15, 2020, at 4:14 AM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote:
?I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position.
My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate.
It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use.
Or has anyone found a solution?
Thanks
Phil
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You could also just buy the replacement hose from Felder. ?Then it will (likely) be the right length...
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I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position. My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate. It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use. Or has anyone found a solution? Thanks Phil
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Felder sells in meter increments, not for the size/application you need.
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You could also just buy the replacement hose from Felder. ?Then it will (likely) be the right length...
I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ? Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted.
It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position. My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate. It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use. Or has anyone found a solution? Thanks Phil
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Thats true for normal extractor hose. ?However, the hose for the interior of the saw is more flexible. ?I believe when I ordered a replacement because I couldn’t get the normal flex extractor hose on the fittings in the saw, it came cut to length.
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On Aug 15, 2020, at 1:11 PM, Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote:
Felder sells in meter increments, not for the size/application you need.
You could also just buy the replacement hose from Felder. ?Then it will (likely) be the right length...
I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ??Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted. It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position. My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate. It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use. Or has anyone found a solution? Thanks Phil
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I ordered from them a couple times over the years, both the 100mm and the 120mm hose and all were bulk (and yes it was the extra flexible version). Unfortunately the Felder hose goes kaput in about 3-4 years.
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Thats true for normal extractor hose. ?However, the hose for the interior of the saw is more flexible. ?I believe when I ordered a replacement because I couldn’t get the normal flex extractor hose on the fittings in the saw, it came cut to length. On Aug 15, 2020, at 1:11 PM, Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote:
Felder sells in meter increments, not for the size/application you need.
You could also just buy the replacement hose from Felder. ?Then it will (likely) be the right length...
I decided to once and for all sort out this problem in my 2006 machine. ??Not the flexible hosing prematurely rotting but the seemingly inevitable disconnect of one end of the tubing whenever the blade was tilted. It seems that whatever length of hose I tried, it was either too short and pulled off at a 45deg tilt or too long and over-crumpled and creased at the zero, 90deg, position. My knees can only stand so much kneeling under the saw to further explore this and the back of my head still tends to forget that the sawtable extension regards it as a primary target with an uncomfortably high hit rate. It seems to me that in that absence of a “Goldilocks” length of hose or a particular hose structure designed to concertina rather than bend, I might have to settle for effective collection only in the zero position and keep replacing the disconnect after each tilted use. Or has anyone found a solution? Thanks Phil
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Thanks for the responses to my problem.? Before posting I had already tried different lengths of the flexible hose including the shortest length to run from the saw unit at 45deg which I found to be around 34”.?
The problem came when returning the saw to 0deg (or 90deg blade) when one could observe much kinking of the hose within a very confined space.?
It was clear that whilst some air would still move through the hose, there was no way that this is conducive to either a high flow or long hose life.?
In the absence of a better suggestion and when Axminster has this back in stock, this is what I propose trying:
?
In the meantime I will use a short run of hose for the 0deg (or 90deg blade) setting which is used for much of the time and disconnect the hose for angle cuts beyond 15deg at which point the hose and saw unit separate.?
It’s a bit of a dog’s breakfast design, presumably not the work of someone who uses the saw.?
Phil?
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I actually ran a section of rigid pipe inside the cabinet before I converted to flex, not sure it really helped all that much, but it’s easier to suction out any chunks left over in the pipe from the outside of the machine. Mine is an older KF700 so it might not apply to your situation.
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Thanks for the responses to my problem.??Before posting I had already tried different lengths of the flexible hose including the shortest length to run from the saw unit at 45deg which I found to be around 34”.? The problem came when returning the saw to 0deg (or 90deg blade) when one could observe much kinking of the hose within a very confined space.? It was clear that whilst some air would still move through the hose, there was no way that this is conducive to either a high flow or long hose life.? In the absence of a better suggestion and when Axminster has this back in stock, this is what I propose trying:? In the meantime I will use a short run of hose for the 0deg (or 90deg blade) setting which is used for much of the time and disconnect the hose for angle cuts beyond 15deg at which point the hose and saw unit separate.? It’s a bit of a dog’s breakfast design, presumably not the work of someone who uses the saw.? Phil?
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here is a pic of the hose i recommended on K975 at 90 and at 45
imran
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On Aug 16, 2020, at 11:34 AM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote: ?
Thanks for the responses to my problem.? Before posting I had already tried different lengths of the flexible hose including the shortest length to run from the saw unit at 45deg which I found to be around 34”.?
The problem came when returning the saw to 0deg (or 90deg blade) when one could observe much kinking of the hose within a very confined space.?
It was clear that whilst some air would still move through the hose, there was no way that this is conducive to either a high flow or long hose life.?
In the absence of a better suggestion and when Axminster has this back in stock, this is what I propose trying:
?
In the meantime I will use a short run of hose for the 0deg (or 90deg blade) setting which is used for much of the time and disconnect the hose for angle cuts beyond 15deg at which point the hose and saw unit separate.?
It’s a bit of a dog’s breakfast design, presumably not the work of someone who uses the saw.?
Phil?
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That's the hose I want Imran.? It looks to have retractable and not just flexible properties.? Sadly the cost of importing from the US to the UK makes this impractical for me.? I'll await the Axminster version but in the meantime I'll give Felder a ring and see if they can supply similar.
Phil
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Sorry, did not know you were in UK.
imran?
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On Aug 16, 2020, at 1:25 PM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote: ?That's the hose I want Imran.? It looks to have retractable and not just flexible properties.? Sadly the cost of importing from the US to the UK makes this impractical for me.? I'll await the Axminster version but in the meantime I'll give Felder a ring and see if they can supply similar.
Phil
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Phil, Have you had a look at Amazon uk? Have used them in the past. Obviously different suppliers there and different grades and prices.
I was able to get a heavy duty thick walled hose for machine to metal ducting coupling. Heavy duty enough for use on those street cleaning machines.
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Phil,
If your hose is the right length when the saw is at 45-degrees, and kinks when it’s at 90-degrees, then you’re using the wrong hose.
Felder sells two types of flex-hose. ?One is light duty which they install in the machines and the plastic disintegrates in a few years, the other is a much higher quality H/SE hose that isn’t quite as flexible, but is smooth on the inside and is flexible enough work inside the K975 or Profil 45 shaper:
Both are sold by the meter in length. ? You can probably buy that original hose for the K975 cut to length as a spare part, but it will disintegrate in a couple of years. ? When I had my K975, I used the H/SEE Felder hose and it was still in great condition when I sold the machine 10 years later. ? I have had the 160mm H/SE hose on my RL160 to Nordfab piping for 15 years now and it’s still in great condition.
David Best
https://www.instagram.com/davidpbest/
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Thanks for the responses to my problem.? Before posting I had already tried different lengths of the flexible hose including the shortest length to run from the saw unit at 45deg which I found to be around 34”.?
The problem came when returning the saw to 0deg (or 90deg blade) when one could observe much kinking of the hose within a very confined space.?
It was clear that whilst some air would still move through the hose, there was no way that this is conducive to either a high flow or long hose life.?
In the absence of a better suggestion and when Axminster has this back in stock, this is what I propose trying:
?
In the meantime I will use a short run of hose for the 0deg (or 90deg blade) setting which is used for much of the time and disconnect the hose for angle cuts beyond 15deg at which point the hose and saw unit separate.?
It’s a bit of a dog’s breakfast design, presumably not the work of someone who uses the saw.?
Phil?
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Hi David:
This is a “germane” response as probably more than some of us has had issues with the lower dust extraction hose “popping off” just as Phil describes. Me included.
Thank you for your explanation on your K975. I’m curious whether you have successfully used the stiffer H/SE on your Kappa 400? I have struggled, similarly to Phil, to keep the dust extraction hose attached, and in serviceable condition. After my hose disintegrated, I tried using the H/SE on my Kappa 400 without much success. There is so little space in the machine base that the stiffer hose kept popping off, no matter what I did.
After a few months of fighting, I ordered some of the inferior but much more flexible hosing and have used that. Of course it will disintegrate in a couple of years time. Very curious if you have successfully installed the stiffer variety hose on your Kappa 400?
Lucky
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Phil,
If your hose is the right length when the saw is at 45-degrees, and kinks when it’s at 90-degrees, then you’re using the wrong hose.
Felder sells two types of flex-hose. ?One is light duty which they install in the machines and the plastic disintegrates in a few years, the other is a much higher quality H/SE hose that isn’t quite as flexible, but is smooth on the inside and is flexible enough work inside the K975 or Profil 45 shaper:
<screenshot_3884.jpeg>
Both are sold by the meter in length. ? You can probably buy that original hose for the K975 cut to length as a spare part, but it will disintegrate in a couple of years. ? When I had my K975, I used the H/SEE Felder hose and it was still in great condition when I sold the machine 10 years later. ? I have had the 160mm H/SE hose on my RL160 to Nordfab piping for 15 years now and it’s still in great condition.
Thanks for the responses to my problem.??Before posting I had already tried different lengths of the flexible hose including the shortest length to run from the saw unit at 45deg which I found to be around 34”.? The problem came when returning the saw to 0deg (or 90deg blade) when one could observe much kinking of the hose within a very confined space.? It was clear that whilst some air would still move through the hose, there was no way that this is conducive to either a high flow or long hose life.? In the absence of a better suggestion and when Axminster has this back in stock, this is what I propose trying:? In the meantime I will use a short run of hose for the 0deg (or 90deg blade) setting which is used for much of the time and disconnect the hose for angle cuts beyond 15deg at which point the hose and saw unit separate.? It’s a bit of a dog’s breakfast design, presumably not the work of someone who uses the saw.? Phil?
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I can report having resolved my under table K975 hose problem by using 4” diameter flexible hose that compresses along its length by 50%.?
This contrasts markedly with the hose I have from Felder which is of the heavier type and which compresses very little along its length – perhaps an inch per foot.?
Without this feature there is much distortion of the hose when the saw is moved from 45deg to 0deg.?
I cannot explain why others, Lucky excluded, seem not to share this problem which involves the hose separating from the saw unit when angled.?
?
In Imran’s case his pics show considerable longitudinal compression but how David Best has managed I know not. Perhaps the Felder hose specs have changed over time?
I found that a 38” length of hose does the trick although with moderate “S-bending” at 0deg which will no doubt hasten the decay of the plastic.?
Phil?
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On 19 Aug 2020, at 2:08 am, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote:
?
I can report having resolved my under table K975 hose problem by using 4” diameter flexible hose that compresses along its length by 50%.?
This contrasts markedly with the hose I have from Felder which is of the heavier type and which compresses very little along its length – perhaps an inch per foot.?
Without this feature there is much distortion of the hose when the saw is moved from 45deg to 0deg.?
I cannot explain why others, Lucky excluded, seem not to share this problem which involves the hose separating from the saw unit when angled.?
?
In Imran’s case his pics show considerable longitudinal compression but how David Best has managed I know not. Perhaps the Felder hose specs have changed over time?
I found that a 38” length of hose does the trick although with moderate “S-bending” at 0deg which will no doubt hasten the decay of the plastic.?
Phil?
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glen, is that a typo or your machine accepts 4” hose for this location?
imran?
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On Aug 18, 2020, at 12:08 PM, glenhyrst <phil_moger@...> wrote: ?
I can report having resolved my under table K975 hose problem by using 4” diameter flexible hose that compresses along its length by 50%.?
This contrasts markedly with the hose I have from Felder which is of the heavier type and which compresses very little along its length – perhaps an inch per foot.?
Without this feature there is much distortion of the hose when the saw is moved from 45deg to 0deg.?
I cannot explain why others, Lucky excluded, seem not to share this problem which involves the hose separating from the saw unit when angled.?
?
In Imran’s case his pics show considerable longitudinal compression but how David Best has managed I know not. Perhaps the Felder hose specs have changed over time?
I found that a 38” length of hose does the trick although with moderate “S-bending” at 0deg which will no doubt hasten the decay of the plastic.?
Phil?
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Imran - the 120mm diameter is the correct fit but I happened to have a length of the more compressible 4" and used adaptors.
?
And to Lucky too, I fear I have not been as successful as I had hoped.? Certainly the compressible hose stays put in all positions of the saw unit BUT unfortunately the modest S bend in the hose at the 0deg position will surely trap whatever offcuts get past the sawblade and need frequent clearing.
?
I contacted Felder in the UK and they did not shed any light on the situation.
?
Phil
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imran
David P. Best
David Luckensmeyer