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Help Ripping - just got my first sliding table saw. Felder k700s


 

Hi Everyone?
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I just joined the forum and there is so much helpful info, thanks everyone!
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I just got my k700s 2 weeks ago and would like some advice on ripping. My saw was setup by a Felder tech and he gave the rip fence a toe out. I don’t like when I use it as a bump stop and I find ripping harder than on my old cabinet saw.?

Any advice or tips on the rip fence and ripping would be greatly appreciated.?

I read the post about adding tape to the rip fence when using it as a stop. I think David Best wrote it. I have not tried it yet, but I will
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thanks for taking the time to read my post?


 

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Name please. ?Best advice…use the slider for almost everything…the riip fence should be a seldom used item. ?Terry

On Oct 25, 2024, at 11:46 PM, Jonathan Maloney <jonathanmaloney123@...> wrote:

Hi Everyone?
?
I just joined the forum and there is so much helpful info, thanks everyone!
?
I just got my k700s 2 weeks ago and would like some advice on ripping. My saw was setup by a Felder tech and he gave the rip fence a toe out. I don’t like when I use it as a bump stop and I find ripping harder than on my old cabinet saw.?

Any advice or tips on the rip fence and ripping would be greatly appreciated.?

I read the post about adding tape to the rip fence when using it as a stop. I think David Best wrote it. I have not tried it yet, but I will
?
thanks for taking the time to read my post?


 

I went through the same evolution. The tape trick on the rip fence really works.
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I do miss the ability to quickly and accurately rip with a rip fence, but have learned to rip with the slider. It just takes a little more time to set up a cut. ?Using the rip fence to align stock for ripping works pretty well if your stock is wide enough to clamp to the table. Otherwise use parallel fences like the one Lamb Tool Works sells. A Fritz and Fanz jig helps rip pieces that are fairly short (say 2 feet or less), but I have not gotten comfortable using mine for longer pieces.
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if you have not done so, add DRO to your outrigger fence and to your rip fence. Those upgrades will make many operations easier.
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Overall the change from a cabinet saw to a slider has been positive. So positive, in fact, that I am upgrading from a K700S to a Kappa 450X. That saw is on a boat transiting the Panama Canal right now.
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

Welcome to the club Jonathan,?
Best advice is to do your ripping to the left of the blade on the slider. I do mine in conjunction with the flip stop on the fence and Brian's parallel fence towards the rear of the slider. I also use a Fritz and Franz for ripping some smaller parts and tapers. The only thing I ever use the rip fence for is a bump stop.?

I also still have a cabinet saw, and will rip there occasionally.

Jason Holtz
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406
612.432.2765

--
Jason
J. Holtz Furniture
3307 Snelling Ave. South
Minneapolis, MN 55406


 

What do you mean by name please?


 

He means that you should always sign your posts with your name at the end.
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Like other stated, it is recommended to use the slider and/or a Frizt-n-Franz jig to rip anything on the left side of the blade.? That being said, I find that I still need to rip on the right side occasionally if the need arises.? An example would be a 6-8 foot long board that is 1-1/2" wide that I need to rip down to 1" wide.? Trying to do this on the slider has elements of inaccuracy because the long board can bend/fliex sideways to create a width that changes over the 6-8 feet.?
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-Aaron Inami


 

The German BGHM guide, is the most informative I've seen, regarding the use of sliders.
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All the best
Tom


 

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This is how I recommend you set up your rip fence for use as both a conventional rip fence and as a bump stop:


DM me if you have questions. ?

David Best - via mobile phone?

On Oct 26, 2024, at 5:04?AM, Jonathan Maloney via groups.io <jonathanmaloney123@...> wrote:

?
Hi Everyone?
?
I just joined the forum and there is so much helpful info, thanks everyone!
?
I just got my k700s 2 weeks ago and would like some advice on ripping. My saw was setup by a Felder tech and he gave the rip fence a toe out. I don’t like when I use it as a bump stop and I find ripping harder than on my old cabinet saw.?

Any advice or tips on the rip fence and ripping would be greatly appreciated.?

I read the post about adding tape to the rip fence when using it as a stop. I think David Best wrote it. I have not tried it yet, but I will
?
thanks for taking the time to read my post?


 

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Sign your posts with a name so we know who you are.?

David Best - via mobile phone?

On Oct 26, 2024, at 11:01?AM, Jonathan Maloney via groups.io <jonathanmaloney123@...> wrote:

?
What do you mean by name please?


 

I would like to pose a question to the group regarding the comments above…. I am in a small space with a K700S, and every inch of usability that I remove from the right side of the blade I pick up on the left side.

Given this scenario, how would you all apportion the space? Right side as small as possible to maximize cross-cut/outrigger capacity? Is there a happy medium?

-David Gandy


 

I have the narrow rip capacity machine, 32" or so. I've had my machine up against walls a time or two and always left 49" or so from the blade to any unmovable obstruction on the right so I could split a 4x8 sheet.

Brian Lamb
blamb11@...
lambtoolworks.com


On Saturday, October 26, 2024 at 07:23:46 PM MST, David Gandy <david@...> wrote:


I would like to pose a question to the group regarding the comments above…. I am in a small space with a K700S, and every inch of usability that I remove from the right side of the blade I pick up on the left side.?

Given this scenario, how would you all apportion the space?? Right side as small as possible to maximize cross-cut/outrigger capacity?? Is there a happy medium?

-David Gandy






 
Edited

The German BGHM guide, is the most informative I've seen, regarding the use of sliders.
?
?
All the best
Tom
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I was curious, but don't read German, so I clipped out the section on sliding table saws and let Google take a crack at translating it.? It did well enough that I thought others might want to read it, so I've uploaded the translation to the Files section, at General Information/BGHM sliding table saw training translated.pdf?


 

Thank you for doing that! I tried to do it last night, but the original file was too large.
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

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I had no problem downloading that file, although I’d seen it before. ?

David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best



On Oct 27, 2024, at 6:19?PM, John Hinman via groups.io <jhinman1911@...> wrote:

Thank you for doing that! I tried to do it last night, but the original file was too large.
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

I had no problem downloading the file, but Google Translate balked at the size of the original file. The download was 16.9 MB, and Translate said it would not process a file larger than 10 MB.
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I have software that will split up pdf files into manageable portions, but I had not yet done that. I appreciate Mr. Wolf getting it done.
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

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David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best



On Oct 27, 2024, at 7:50?PM, John Hinman via groups.io <jhinman1911@...> wrote:

I had no problem downloading the file, but Google Translate balked at the size of the original file. The download was 16.9 MB, and Translate said it would not process a file larger than 10 MB.
?
I have software that will split up pdf files into manageable portions, but I had not yet done that. I appreciate Mr. Wolf getting it done.
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

Good idea, Mr. Best, but I think I will stay with translation apps.
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Rudimentary Spanish is almost necessary here. If I could acquire another language it would perhaps be French. I’d like to be able to read Dumas, or Rostand, in the original.
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(Sorry - getting off topic)
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

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Ahem, I rip on the right side of the blade all the time on my Kappa 400.

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Yes, we consistently get a better finish (cleaner cut, more consistent, straight) when using the sliding table and a mixture of clamps and jigs. However, that mixture of clamps and jigs takes time to get exactly right. Not a lot of time, but enough time for resentment to build.

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So here are rules of thumb I use:

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  • If I need to rip 1-5 items that are not any longer than say 1200mm, I don’t even think about it. I go straight to the right side of the blade for a conventional rip.

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  • If the outcome is critical, and I’m relying on as perfect-as-possible-result, I usually take the time to work on the left side of the blade, using the slider.

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  • I say ‘usually’ because short stock, say 600mm or shorter, can be ripped on the right side of the blade with perfection. I have done so literally thousands of times so my sample size is adequate.

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Keys to ripping ‘perfectly’ on the right side of the blade.

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  • Rip fence toe out must be dialled in. I defer to da Best (a.k.a. David Best) for details if you need help on this.

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  • The material to be ripped must have one straight edge, and must be flat. Cup, bow and twist will have a very negative impact on ripping (on either side of the blade), especially when the material is hand-fed through the blade.

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  • The riving knife and blade selection is important. These must be correctly calibrated and chosen.

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  • Feed-rate is important. There is definitely ‘too slow’ but most videos online show a feed-rate that is too fast to way-to-fast. Experimenting with your saw and blade combination is key. Make four sample rip cuts at different feed rates and inspect the results. As the feed-rate is reduced, the surface quality of the rip will increase, but only to a point. Going any slower just dulls the blade.

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  • Consistency is important. Many operators do not concentrate on the feed-rate for the entirely of the cut. The introduction to the blade, passing through the cut, and exiting the material from the back of the blade, are all of equal importance. I see operators ‘finish a cut’ and then quickly exit the back of the blade. This results in a slight roughness to the edge. Exactly the same feed-rate – like a power feeder – is required throughout.

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  • Focus on hand positioning so that there are absolutely no transitional issues from using a hand
  • or push stick. In fact, if you feel you need a push stick due to the width of the material being ripped, you must (in my opinion) move to the left side of the blade, because the transition from fingers to a push stick nearly always results in a less-than-perfect ripping result. I can rip 1200mm length stock with no transition whatsoever, and use my thumb for the entire cut. You can work out your own maximum length for perfection.

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  • I don’t buy the argument about how much harder it is to rip (on the right side) using a slider. It is not a jot harder; it is just different. Unless you have unusually short arms, it is entirely possible to keep your head to the left side of the blade, while using your right arm and hand to push material on the right side of the blade. I’m willing to post a video on request but this stuff is pretty self-explanatory.

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  • For all of this, I’m assuming you have a ‘good’ blade guard fitted to your slider. No ‘good’ blade guard and all of my words are essentially worthless. In my opinion, you should never present any part of your body, hand, arm, head, whatever, in front of the blade without a ‘good’ guard.

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  • And finally, and probably most controversially, I’m happy to rip material much narrower than recommended because of the stout nature of the Felder overhead guard. The Kappa 400 guard is stout enough that I can push sideways with very considerable strength, and the guard will not move enough to touch a running blade. Consequently, with the rip fence in the low position, if I can get a good grip on the material, I have no problem allowing my hand, thumb and fingers to ride against the right side of the blade guard as it passes by. If adjusted low (i.e. a few mm above the stock) the risk is exceptionally low, in my opinion. But that is just me. You find your own width and own your own decisions. I explicitly take no responsibility here in expressing my methods of work.

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I hope this is helpful.

J’espère que cela est utile!

(Mais, Dumas est trop difficile pour moi!)

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Warm regards,

Lucky

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David Luckensmeyer

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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of John Hinman via groups.io <jhinman1911@...>
Date: Monday, 28 October 2024 at 13:26
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [FOG] Help Ripping - just got my first sliding table saw. Felder k700s

Good idea, Mr. Best, but I think I will stay with translation apps.

?

Rudimentary Spanish is almost necessary here. If I could acquire another language it would perhaps be French. I’d like to be able to read Dumas, or Rostand, in the original.

?

(Sorry - getting off topic)

--

John Hinman
Boise ID
K700S and A941


 

Ok, i'll try to add something to this topic.?
It depends......
What are you trying to rip? How many? What thickness? There are so many questions that need answering before an answer can be given.
Here are some examples.
If i need to take a bunch of 6, 8 or 10' boards from roughly 6" in width, and make them all straight and say 5 or 5 1/2" in width, then i would start by making a straight line rip with the rip shoe on one end of the slider and holding the other. I would have the rip fence set to my desired width, and simply rip the board down.?
If i am doing a lot of ripping of solid timber and i'm not just ripping a small amount off the edge, then i will always be using the short fence. Not only does this lessen the chance of the timber binding on the back of the blade if there is tension in the board, but allows for better accuracy of the cut when that tension is released.
If you are talking about sheetgoods, then you will have more accuracy sticking to the slider side. Having said that, i do all my thinner "rips" (say under 8 or 10" wide) of sheetgoods on the right of the blade. Good technique will get you a perfectly good result.
With all that said, i will pretty much always be ripping solid wood as a first step in the machining process. From there i will be square dressing the material and or running it through the shaper for use in whatever it is i'm making.
Let us know what kind of rip cuts you need advise with and i'm sure you will find lots of good advice.
Regards,
Bryce
--
https://www.brycecomerwoodworks.com/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHdrRaAZd_pOa7wwbdNPUEw


 

Lucky-

That was excellent. Thank you for taking the time to write such a detailed explanation, I understand significantly more now. I notice that you discuss the length of the work, but not the width. I assume you work primarily with solid wood? Is there a width at which you would switch sides of the blade? I’m not referring to aspect-ratio here.

David