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Starting a new topic here to avoid hijacking other threads and allow a more focused discussion.
I've had bits and pieces of automation in my shop for several years. The pieces were mostly iVac. A couple blast gates, and an IVac Pro Switch to control my RL160. They worked fine most of the time. It seemed sort of piecemeal, but it worked. One aspect that kept me from adding more blast gates was that I was spending money to buy the automated gate to replace an already pricey Nordfab gate. The iVac gates were so-so IMO.
Over the past several days I did a full install of a GRIT automation system. It was pretty easy to do and the individual pieces are real quality. One thing I hadn't expected was the exceptional service from GRIT. I have literally never had friendly, helpful service like this. Joel and Jaclyn made it even more a pleasure to install everything.
One thing I wasn't expecting to do was integrate my two dust collectors. I have the RL160 that serves the AD941, the tablesaw, bandsaw, and floor sweep. Earlier this year I added a Harvey Gyro 700. I'm using my CNC a lot now and it was really overkill using the RL160 for hours to keep the CNC jobs clean. I just switched hoses to each collector when I was doing a different type of job. When I was discussing the system with Joel at Grit he suggested adding branches to each collector. I hesitated for a while because of the added costs involved (Nordfab and GRIT), but decided to make the whole system work as a unit.
Long story short, the system is working really well. For the GYRO and RL160 Joel had to add a functionality to my collector switches which he did in a day and pushed them over to my system for automatic updates. Now, when I turn on the CNC, it triggers the CNC blast gate, the Gyro 700 blast gate, turns on the Gyro 700 and closes the RL160 blast gate (another functionality Joel added in a day and pushed over). It's a great system.
A few aspects I hadn't counted on but love:
1) GRIT support. Mentioned above, but they are amazing.
2) The software makes it so easy to understand how the whole system is set up, and is easy to customize instantly, No more dip switches. I can also turn on/off pieces in my shop from in my house.?
3) All the pieces are heavy duty. The 3 phase switch for the AD941 looks like it belongs in a factory. The gates are Nordfab gates, with solenoid operated switches. The 220V triggers for tablesaw, bandsaw, etc. are really heavy duty with L6-30 plugs.
I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
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Scott,
Agreed!
I used the e-stop triggers for the 3ph machines.? Really simple actually.??
Joel was awesome to me also, as was Jaclyn.? They were available to help via face time at one point.? Joel pushed me firmware updates also and decided to send me updated e-stops with an internal change they preformed.
I had an issue when the table saw was going through star-delta start and when the third phase would kick in then the DC would spool down.? He showed me how to change settings to eliminate the issue with no downside to performance.
It isn't cheap, but I think it is less than the competition and really flexible to use.
PK
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Thanks, Scott! I probably should have done that as well but when I searched for Grit, I saw so little activity on the topic, I flipped a coin and decided to go back to an earlier thread to ask my question rather than start a new thread.
?Question: You mentioned Norfab gates with solenoid-operated switches. Were these gates you already had and integrated them into your new Grit system? Thanks.
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Quite a long time ago, I purchased the original Ecogate with vibration sensors. ?Then I upgraded to the Greenbox 12. ?The gates changed to be more beefy and enclosed with time, and then the wire used changed. ?At one point, you had to run a wire from the Greenbox to the gate and a separate wire from the Greenbox to the machine. With the current gates, you can run 1 wire to the gate and from the gate to the machine... better.
Last week, I had a problem with my jointer gate and to troubleshoot, you can't use an app. ?You have to own a PC with the software installed and connect with a USB - serial cable.. ?I am a Mac guy, and so this is what is needed.
EcoGate is local to me and they sent someone to troubleshoot. ?Problem with bad motor and that was replaced. ?There was another very old gate that was making terrible noice and it just needs to be replaced --- over $500 for a 5 inch gate.
For me, I have overall had good success with EcoGate, and at this point I am locked into their system as I see no compelling reason to start over with another brand. ?I started with EcoGate when to my knowledge, that was the 1 system to get. ?However, if I did not have the EcoGate, I wonder if I would have selected GRIT instead. ?Not sure of the pros-cons of each system.
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I had two iVac gates, one 4 inch and one six inch. All my other gates were stock Nordfab (Several fours and sixes). I put the Grit Gate Controls (which are solenoids, I believe) on the stock Nordfab gates. I also replaced the iVac gates with Grit Gate Control modified Nordfabs. Each gate can be converted to the Grit Gate Control in a few minutes. Wiring them is pretty easy as you daisy chain them via thermostat wire to a common 9V Grit Power Bank. I ended up with 3 'circuits' to minimize power drop.
I did have one Nordfab gate that was sticky. It didn't open and close like the others. This one also happened to be new. GRIT instructs you to lightly file the edges and I gave them a coat of dry bike lubricant and it worked perfectly.
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Scott, how does it start the RL? ?The start button is supposed to be depressed until the unit comes to speed ¡ª is their control designed to do the same?
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On Jul 3, 2023, at 12:25 PM, Scott Grossman via groups.io <scottgrossman@...> wrote:
I had two iVac gates, one 4 inch and one six inch. All my other gates were stock Nordfab (Several fours and sixes). I put the Grit Gate Controls (which are solenoids, I believe) on the stock Nordfab gates. I also replaced the iVac gates with Grit Gate Control modified Nordfabs. Each gate can be converted to the Grit Gate Control in a few minutes. Wiring them is pretty easy as you daisy chain them via thermostat wire to a common 9V Grit Power Bank. I ended up with 3 'circuits' to minimize power drop.
I did have one Nordfab gate that was sticky. It didn't open and close like the others. This one also happened to be new. GRIT instructs you to lightly file the edges and I gave them a coat of dry bike lubricant and it worked perfectly.
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It's a contact closure in 'Auto' mode.? The whole GRIT Magswitch is inside the Felder. The power to the switch comes from mains on the RL160. Two other control wires run from the switch to two terminals in the RL160:  You can also see the toroid that goes around one of the power wires going to the blower motor. When the switch gets a signal from the GRIT Hub, it closes that circuit. The 'latching' functionality in the switch keeps the circuit closed until the RL160 is told to shut down. The toroid monitors the current in the circuit. In other machines (like the AD941), the current sensing tells GRIT the machine is running. I have no idea how other versions of the RL160 would be wired, so your machine could be different. John Kee helped me through this years ago, and there seem to be other threads how to make this work. When John guided me through the installation of iVac Pro switch, it was a little more complicated. The iVac Pro switch fed power to a 120 V fan relay (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0071NAYUU/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 ). This closed the circuit and turned on the RL160. Both worked well, but the iVac Pro got wonky every now and then. I have no experience with the durability of the Magswitch.
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Scott...pro tip on the stuck gate...thanks!
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I also installed a full GRIT Automation system on my Nordfab gates for my Felder A941 jointer, D951 Planer, FB710 Bandsaw as well as adding it to my SawStop ICS, Festool Kapex, and router table.? Most importantly, I put a Grit gate on my Grizzly Wide-Belt Sander.? Very recently I added a Hammer HS950 Edge Sander to my workshop, and added a GRIT gate to that too.? It was helpful that I already had a Nordfab set of piping to all my machines, so it was just minutes per gate to modify them. The GRIT system has really made amazing changes to my workflow.? No having to reach under machines to open gates.? My workshop sits on a raised access floor, so all the Nordfab ducting goes under the floor.? Awesome for keeping piping out of your way, but the gates are on the floor, sometimes under machine tables so it was always a huge pain to crawl under machines to open and close gates.? And what a joy it was when I would forget to open up the gate to the wide-belt sander and create a dust cloud.? I later added the air quality controls to my two Jet air cleaners, and it's great to have the workshop air clean virtually all of the time automatically.? I was pretty skeptical about this initially, but Joel has come through with flying colors. I had seriously thought about Ecogate's Greenbox system at the time, but am very glad I tool the GRIT route.? Really nice not having to trash all of?my Nordfab gates and replace them with expensive new Ecogate ones. My experience with Grit has been really remarkable.? They really do have the best customer service of any company I have dealt with.? Joel and Jacklyn are really remarkable people.? I can't recommend this company highly enough.? They have really been quite awesome to me.??  
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KnockUout,
Ducting run under the floor? ?Have you ever had to make changes or modifications to your Nordfab pipe? ?Would it be easy to access it, if needed? ?
Do you have a picture of how you adapted the Grit to your Kapex?
Thx,
Wade
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On Jul 7, 2023, at 8:02 AM, knockuout@... wrote:
?I also installed a full GRIT Automation system on my Nordfab gates for my Felder A941 jointer, D951 Planer, FB710 Bandsaw as well as adding it to my SawStop ICS, Festool Kapex, and router table.? Most importantly, I put a Grit gate on my Grizzly Wide-Belt Sander.? Very recently I added a Hammer HS950 Edge Sander to my workshop, and added a GRIT gate to that too.? It was helpful that I already had a Nordfab set of piping to all my machines, so it was just minutes per gate to modify them. The GRIT system has really made amazing changes to my workflow.? No having to reach under machines to open gates.? My workshop sits on a raised access floor, so all the Nordfab ducting goes under the floor.? Awesome for keeping piping out of your way, but the gates are on the floor, sometimes under machine tables so it was always a huge pain to crawl under machines to open and close gates.? And what a joy it was when I would forget to open up the gate to the wide-belt sander and create a dust cloud.? I later added the air quality controls to my two Jet air cleaners, and it's great to have the workshop air clean virtually all of the time automatically.? I was pretty skeptical about this initially, but Joel has come through with flying colors. I had seriously thought about Ecogate's Greenbox system at the time, but am very glad I tool the GRIT route.? Really nice not having to trash all of?my Nordfab gates and replace them with expensive new Ecogate ones. My experience with Grit has been really remarkable.? They really do have the best customer service of any company I have dealt with.? Joel and Jacklyn are really remarkable people.? I can't recommend this company highly enough.? They have really been quite awesome to me.??  
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The raised access floors, which are common in computer server rooms, are 2' x 2' metal/concrete/metal sandwiches with a hole on each corner to use a specific machine screw to screw into the supports that hold them up.? There is a suction cup device that you use to lift up the squares, if needed, giving you full access underneath them.? Mine is 18" off the cement floor, so plenty of room.? You need to think a little about routing the rigid ducting, but it really is a great solution to hide the ducting.? I've not seen anyone else use this approach, but I highly recommend it.? You can usually buy used raised access floors for a very reasonable amount, and have the pros install it, which they did in a day.? They also cut holes for the ducting through the squares (kids don't try that at home.? That generated more dust than anything I have ever seen.)
Really quite easy to adapt the Kapex to the Grit, although I should have been more specific.? I have the Grit turning on my two Jet air filters by having the Festool vac its attached to plugged into a 120V Grit trigger.? I have plans to make a small enclosure around the back of the Kapex and hooking that up to Nordfab ducting to have both my cyclone and Festool vac collecting chips from the Kapex, because as we sadly all know dust collection for miters saws is poor.? Even the Kapex, which is supposedly better than most.? Once I do that, I'll install a Grit gate to a Nordfab gate and I bet the dust collection will get markedly better.??
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It irritates the hell out of me that miter saw companies (especially Festool) haven't nailed the whole dust collection thing yet (or choose not to). We are no longer living in the 1930s where inhaling sawdust while smoking Camel unfiltereds added years onto your life.
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Paul,
a small question regarding the wiring of your 3P machines. You mention that you added a transformer. I was wondering why do you need a transformer and not just take 2 hot lines for 240V?
Did you also connect it to the e-stop of the machine?
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Another question. How can one get a permission from Felder to open the electric panel without voiding the warranty??
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You just call them and discuss it with them and they add the authorization to your account. ?
Thx,
Wade
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On May 6, 2024, at 8:57?AM, netanel.belgazal@... wrote:
?Another question. How can one get a permission from Felder to open the electric panel without voiding the warranty??
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Netanel,
I guess I was not clear in the video.? The transformers are in the machines already.? I am just using existing taps to power the e-stop controllers.? It does not connect to the e-stops.
PK
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So do you the power the grit e-stop from DC current??
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No,
Off the 120 or 240 tap.
PK
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It is probably a super stupid question, but how do you disconnect a cable from the terminal block?
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PK
Larry