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Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
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First, a year 2000 machine won’t do dado’s, so 1 and 2 are no. 3. yes, 4. no, 5. haven’t used them, but they should work. 6. maybe, it should be possible, but you’ll have to customize a zero clearance insert. 7. There are plenty of dado sets that can be had in 30mm bore, but none will fit this machine.
You can’t use the newer shaper spindle, it’s different. My 2001 machine parts list says the 400-136 is the part number. My spindle is currently in the machine, so I can’t double check the part number.
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 7:05 AM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote:
Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
Stephen,
I have 2002 KF700 and it takes as Brain said?400-136 router spindle which IIRC is for 1990-2007 machines. I could not find a P/N on my router spindle. With S/N of machine Felder can confirm for you.
As Brian said dado is not an option. FWIW, I just made some measurements for you. The 2 pins are ~6.5mm long
Once the flange is placed and screw tightened to the point where pins firmly engage with flange the gap is about 5mm.
I have no idea how thick a plate is safe to hold in the arbor. Finally I see P/N 135 in the KF book which is a flange for slotting tool but it is used with a slotting arbor option A. Not sure how useful it is but I had not looked at this until now. Maybe someone can elaborate.
Imran
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke <tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke <tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
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Show quoted text
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
Brian, Brilliant! ? Bill Bélanger?
On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 13:42 Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
I still like the idea of having something ready to use w/o any setup. If I had a cabinet saw prior to buying Felder, I would do it like Randy has in a heart beat considering you don’t get much for selling it.
It is also handy to have a saw available if you have a saw/shaper machine. On the other hand I won’t go out and buy a saw for this purpose or if I had separate saw and shaper.
To each his/her own.
Imran?
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 3:42 PM, Brian Lamb <blamb11@...> wrote: ? Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
you mean like this Imran??
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021, 02:03:52 PM PST, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
I still like the idea of having something ready to use w/o any setup. If I had a cabinet saw prior to buying Felder, I would do it like Randy has in a heart beat considering you don’t get much for selling it.
It is also handy to have a saw available if you have a saw/shaper machine. On the other hand I won’t go out and buy a saw for this purpose or if I had separate saw and shaper.
To each his/her own.
Imran?
On Mar 10, 2021, at 3:42 PM, Brian Lamb <blamb11@...> wrote: ? Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
|
Looks mighty fine Randy ?
Imran
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 6:48 PM, Randy Child via groups.io <strongman_one@...> wrote: ?
you mean like this Imran??
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021, 02:03:52 PM PST, imranindiana via groups.io <imranindiana@...> wrote:
I still like the idea of having something ready to use w/o any setup. If I had a cabinet saw prior to buying Felder, I would do it like Randy has in a heart beat considering you don’t get much for selling it.
It is also handy to have a saw available if you have a saw/shaper machine. On the other hand I won’t go out and buy a saw for this purpose or if I had separate saw and shaper.
To each his/her own.
Imran?
On Mar 10, 2021, at 3:42 PM, Brian Lamb <blamb11@...> wrote:
? Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
<Screenshot_20200809-040242_Instagram.jpg> <Screenshot_20200809-040228_Instagram.jpg>
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Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
? 
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? Hi Stephen,
Warning on “no dado” was a miss on my part. I used to warn about that regularly but for some reason don’t recall doing so lately.
I also have written both 401-136 and 400-136. I went with Brian’s P/N assuming a typo. Since I did not order it and bought it used I cannot confirm. I do not see PN on the spindle either but mine looks like the one on left on felder eshop
They do come up for sale used but not often enough. I recall 2 in about last 12 months. One here (i bought) and one on ebay.
Imran?
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 11:48 PM, Stephen Zielke <tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
? <felder high speed.tiff>
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Get the right sized router bits and your dado’s are one pass. They make bits for full size and undersize of pretty much any thickness.
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On Mar 10, 2021, at 9:48 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote:
Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
?<felder high speed.tiff>
|
Another thought... With our saws being as accurate as they are, multiple passes with a regular saw blade should suffice without the need for something dedicated?
Bill Bélanger?
On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 08:29 Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: Get the right sized router bits and your dado’s are one pass. They make bits for full size and undersize of pretty much any thickness.
On Mar 10, 2021, at 9:48 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote:
Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
?<felder high speed.tiff>
|
Yes, but that can be more complicated than it’s worth. I have .750 diameter router bits for dados in Melamine (which measures like .740), and then I have a .720 bit for plywood that is undersize.
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On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:45 AM, Bill Belanger < Bill@...> wrote:
Another thought... With our saws being as accurate as they are, multiple passes with a regular saw blade should suffice without the need for something dedicated?
Bill Bélanger? On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 08:29 Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: Get the right sized router bits and your dado’s are one pass. They make bits for full size and undersize of pretty much any thickness.
On Mar 10, 2021, at 9:48 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote:
Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
?<felder high speed.tiff>
|
All:
A regular table saw placed just so does interfere with a power feeder for the shaper/router function of a KF.
Best, Terry
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Looks mighty fine Randy ?
Imran ?
you mean like this Imran??
On Wednesday, March 10, 2021, 02:03:52 PM PST, imranindiana via < imranindiana@...> wrote:
I still like the idea of having something ready to use w/o any setup. If I had a cabinet saw prior to buying Felder, I would do it like Randy has in a heart beat considering you don’t get much for selling it.
It is also handy to have a saw available if you have a saw/shaper machine. On the other hand I won’t go out and buy a saw for this purpose or if I had separate saw and shaper.
To each his/her own.
Imran? On Mar 10, 2021, at 3:42 PM, Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: ? Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years.
Stephen,
BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
Imran On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote: ?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle
<Screenshot_20200809-040242_Instagram.jpg> <Screenshot_20200809-040228_Instagram.jpg>
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I have a nos router spindle that is probably a 424-111 for sale. 
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Randy,?
????????? Thanks for the photos. I've never enjoyed having to change to a rip blade from a crosscut blade to rip lumber, so I've kept my old table saw after I got a K700s. But now that I see what you've done, I'm thinking it's a great idea. Now if I can only get a router table in there somewhere....
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Not to beat a dead horse but I saw this when I was looking for a saw with longer slider. Until seeing this I thought a lot more space is needed for the PF. Sorry pic is not in good focus. ? Imran ?
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From: [email protected] On Behalf Of Terence via groups.io Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:29 AM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [FOG] Felder Dado and Shaper cutter questions ? All: A regular table saw placed just so does interfere with a power feeder for the shaper/router function of a KF. ? ? Looks mighty fine Randy ? ? you mean like this Imran?? On Wednesday, March 10, 2021, 02:03:52 PM PST, imranindiana via <imranindiana@...> wrote: I still like the idea of having something ready to use w/o any setup. If I had a cabinet saw prior to buying Felder, I would do it like Randy has in a heart beat considering you don’t get much for selling it. It is also handy to have a saw available if you have a saw/shaper machine. On the other hand I won’t go out and buy a saw for this purpose or if I had separate saw and shaper.
On Mar 10, 2021, at 3:42 PM, Brian Lamb <blamb11@...> wrote:
Cripes… just use end mills or router bits in the high speed spindle. I’ve done it that way for years. ? BTW, a domestic saw placed at the outfeed of KF or a saw only machine works really well as a dado saw and really does not take much extra space.
On Mar 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Stephen Zielke <tseelkah@...> wrote:
?Hi all - I am negotiating the purchase of an older KF700 (year 2000). I realize that my typical joinery/grooving/rabbeting techniques with a US style dado blade set on a 5/8 arbor are going to need to change. I've got a few questions:
1. will any Felder saw accept their proprietary adjustable dado heads, or does the tool need to be ordered specifically capable (for example, with Minimax a saw must be specifically ordered with slider & arbor positioned for dado cuts)
2. is there a different dado table top "zero clearance" type insert, and does anyone know the part # for a 2000 year saw (current owner doesn't have part or diagram) - I can also fab one from aluminum or plywood
3. will the 180 or 228mm adjustable dado saw specific heads also fit on the 30mm shaper spindle? That would at least partially justify the insane pricing from Felder.
4. will any and all shaper specific heads fit on the saw spindle...or are they missing the saw blade specific brake pin holes? Thinking Magic Moulder concept, if you're familiar.
5. for less cost than an adjustable head, I am looking at the fixed 4mm and 5mm grooving table saw blades. Has anyone used the 5mm, and is it a good match (or sloppy) for Baltic Birch 5mm plywood? In cross grain, does the 6 flat tooth configuration make for terribly ugly tearout?
6. if I have a two blade, "box joint cutter" set, and I'm willing to pay to have it bored for the Felder saw arbor, does the blade clamp have room to stack two blade thicknesses on it? I could specify that the blade brake pins be carefully offset to make sure the interlocking left/right carbide cutters don't conflict. This would at least allow for nominal 1/4" dados. Let me know if there is something specific about the arbor length or nut that would make this unsafe or unfeasible. I don't have the saw in my possession yet, so I can't self determine this.
7. what manufacturers make an alternative dado head for felder, and are they any more affordable? i.e. $200-400 vs. $600+
This tool only has a 30mm shaper spindle. Regarding the right part # for a router 15,000RPM spindle, the catalogue and e-shop are confusing for part #'s for this older machine. I am guessing, that as a 3 speed machine, I need to look at the Series 6 part #401-136, which for some shaper parts in the catalog also has series 7 or 3 speeds called out in parantheses.
Can anyone with this age machine confirm that part #424-111 for series 700 from April/2007 is the WRONG part #? I'd hate to spend $900 and find out I bought the wrong one.
Also, if anyone has an adjustable dado cutter or high speed spindle they find is just collecting dust on the shelf, I'd be open to negotiating purchase. Reply to me direct, so we don't clutter up the forum.
thanks a ton, (well 600+ kilos, that's the weight of this machine)
Steve Z./Seattle ? <Screenshot_20200809-040242_Instagram.jpg> <Screenshot_20200809-040228_Instagram.jpg>
?
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Bill B. I do believe we have the same saw, if my memory is there, Have you used the program in the saw to do your dado's at first i thought? of it as not much but I found it to be quite good at single dado and repetitive dado's, I think it works with the dado cutters too if Felder but haven't checked that out yet. Glen
Alpine Moulding and Millwork Inc.
Mail: ?? P.O. Box 257 ?????????? Avery, CA. 95224 Shop: 441 Pennsylvania Gulch Road ????????? Murphys, CA. 95247
????????? 650-678-3137 LIC # 707507
On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 7:46 AM Bill Belanger < Bill@...> wrote: Another thought... With our saws being as accurate as they are, multiple passes with a regular saw blade should suffice without the need for something dedicated?
Bill Bélanger? On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 08:29 Brian Lamb < blamb11@...> wrote: Get the right sized router bits and your dado’s are one pass. They make bits for full size and undersize of pretty much any thickness.
On Mar 10, 2021, at 9:48 PM, Stephen Zielke < tseelkah@...> wrote:
Thanks all. I enjoyed the shop photos of dual saws.?
Hmm, that's kind of a bummer, I might not have bought the saw if I'd known it was not dado compatible. I falsely assumed that since the new machines could do it, that it was in the legacy machines.?
The new 2020 catalog seems to indicate the part number for the router spindle is #401-136. I assume either this is a typo, or the replacement for part #400-136. I will get the serial number for my machine and talk to the sales team before buying anything. I am planning on selling my other Rojek slider (with a 5/8" US style arbor, just fine for dados) to pay for the KF700, and wouldn't have room in my 1 car garage shop to really do back-back machines (back to back saw-shapers does sound tempting in a crazy wayl). But, I have a portable jobsite saw for work that can still run the dado - I'll see if it makes sense to set it up into an outfeed table. I'll probably end up using that, in tandem with rabbetting cutter in the shaper.?
The high speed spindle will be an "aspirational" purchase, maybe next year. It seems expensive, but when I consider how much tooling for it I already own, and the cost of full size 30mm tooling, it's actually worth investing in. Would certainly get me back to the dado like operations for groves in the middle of wide panels. Just more room for error with multiple passes, compared to shimming a dado and then production cutting.?
Steve
?<felder high speed.tiff>
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This looks a lot like 401-136 since the belt grove is elevated. What would you consider selling it for?
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imran
Bill Belanger
Jonathan Smith
Nick Pappas