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Groover / Dado advice
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Hi folks,
??? When I purchased my KF700S, I bought a groover with it.? I *thought* I was getting the one that could be run on the saw arbor.? As it turns out, the one I ordered is only suitable for the shaper.? Sigh.
??? So now I have a project all set to go (purchased the materials, finalized the design, etc), and I don't actually have the tooling I thought I did.? (And no, the design is not such that I can just run it through the shaper.)
??? The pinned Forrest Dado King is one option.? (I have one for my large radial saw and it works well, though I'm not fond of the bat wings.)
??? The Felder Groover that I thought I was buying is another ()
??? I recall the recent thread about the CMT Dado, and someone trying to get it pinned.
??? Any other options I should consider?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
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You can get the Grover bored for the pins if it’s for a 30mm arbor. Several here have had Forrest blades bored.
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On Jun 17, 2024, at 5:07?PM, Michael Garrison Stuber <mtgstuber@...> wrote:
?Hi folks,
When I purchased my KF700S, I bought a groover with it. I *thought* I was getting the one that could be run on the saw arbor. As it turns out, the one I ordered is only suitable for the shaper. Sigh.
So now I have a project all set to go (purchased the materials, finalized the design, etc), and I don't actually have the tooling I thought I did. (And no, the design is not such that I can just run it through the shaper.)
The pinned Forrest Dado King is one option. (I have one for my large radial saw and it works well, though I'm not fond of the bat wings.)
The Felder Groover that I thought I was buying is another ()
I recall the recent thread about the CMT Dado, and someone trying to get it pinned.
Any other options I should consider?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
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You also have Ridge carbide that makes a dado set for Felder.
The bottom line on the CMT dado was that it is problematic/expensive to bore the pin holes on the spacers/chippers
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Hi Michael,
You did not mention the depth of cut you are after. I recently slapped myself for selling my 200 mm CMT dado after getting my Felder dado set, why because I found out it does not cut very deep. I guess it was designed for use on the saw where more depth on tooling is not usable but they could have designed it with use on shaper in mind. So if you would like to get an adjustable groover that will also work on shaper (30 mm spindle) and would like deeper grooves on shaper then get a dado instead of Felder dado. The dado sets can be had with flat bottom, so no bat ears. Keep in mind that while saw will accommodate larger dia tooling, shaper is limited to table opening (if you want to lower it below table), so 8” is what I have seen available even though the opening is larger.
After going thru this exercise, I just bought the following from ridge carbide in 1 1/4” bore but it is available in 30 mm as well. I am not sure if 30 mm comes with the 2 pin holes or that is extra. This is 8” but 10” dados are available which will go deeper than the Felder 228 mm dado but again 10” is too big for standard shaper hood.
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Ridge carbide offers many flat bottom choices including grooving blades of specific widths. These are attractive as they don’t require setup but I am not sure how accurate the cut they provide as the cut width is not adjustable. They do come in 12” so will provide a deeper groove on the saw.
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On Jun 17, 2024, at 1:07?AM, Michael Garrison Stuber via groups.io <mtgstuber@...> wrote:
?Hi folks,
??? When I purchased my KF700S, I bought a groover with it.? I *thought* I was getting the one that could be run on the saw arbor.? As it turns out, the one I ordered is only suitable for the shaper.? Sigh.
??? So now I have a project all set to go (purchased the materials, finalized the design, etc), and I don't actually have the tooling I thought I did.? (And no, the design is not such that I can just run it through the shaper.)
??? The pinned Forrest Dado King is one option.? (I have one for my large radial saw and it works well, though I'm not fond of the bat wings.)
??? The Felder Groover that I thought I was buying is another (https://www.felder-group.com/en-us/shop/dado-blades-sc1101680/hw-wm-adjustable-groove-cutter-for-circular-saws-sp124126)
??? I recall the recent thread about the CMT Dado, and someone trying to get it pinned.
??? Any other options I should consider?
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
Hi Michael, is there any reason you can’t have your existing groover modified for use on the saw.
If you bought a 30mm bore groover just have it bored for the saw pin holes.
I have an FS Tools dado bored for the saw, I also use it in the shaper.
Regards, Rod
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Good idea.? I'll look into what I can get done locally.
Imran mentioned the Ridge dado set.? I did a quick search through
the message archives and found a good post from David Best on
running groovers on the saw arbor:
/g/felderownersgroup/message/130313
Thanks to all for the thoughts.
On 6/17/2024 5:47 AM, rodsheridan via
groups.io wrote:
Hi Michael, is there any reason you can’t have your existing
groover modified for use on the saw.
If you bought a 30mm bore groover just have it bored for the saw
pin holes.
I have an FS Tools dado bored for the saw, I also use it in the
shaper.
Regards, Rod
--
Michael Garrison Stuber
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Sorry to revive an older thread but about to pull the trigger on dado blades for my K700S.? Looking at the Ridge Carbide 6" Chipper Super Dado @ $350 vs the Felder Adjustable Groover Cutter Set 6.3-20mm @$1,209.? Have ruled out the CMT Orange set due to my understanding that boring the pin holes may be structurally problematic.? Looking to make 1/4" to 3/4"ish Dados and don't think they will get enough use to warrant replaceable knives.
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What am I missing in the terms of the price delta other than the Felder premium ;)?
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Kamal Patel
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I have the Forrest 8” that I used in my K700S. It worked well the few times I used it.?
I don’t know how it will work on my K450X, as the pin setup is not present when using the Dado.?
--
John Hinman
Boise ID
Kappa 450X and A941
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Kamal,
I have the Forrest stack for my K700S. ?Great results for me.
Wade
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 6:50?AM, KRPatel via groups.io <kamalsonal@...> wrote:
? Sorry to revive an older thread but about to pull the trigger on dado blades for my K700S.? Looking at the Ridge Carbide 6" Chipper Super Dado @ $350 vs the Felder Adjustable Groover Cutter Set 6.3-20mm @$1,209.? Have ruled out the CMT Orange set due to my understanding that boring the pin holes may be structurally problematic.? Looking to make 1/4" to 3/4"ish Dados and don't think they will get enough use to warrant replaceable knives.
?
What am I missing in the terms of the price delta other than the Felder premium ;)?
?
Kamal Patel
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I have the ridge carbide stack and it works well for the most part. However if you are trying to get any precise measurements dialed in then it can prove to be very annoying with the shims. The numbers they give should add up but somehow they don’t and you’re left figuring out various combinations to get your measurement right. At least that was my experience so far. I will be replacing it with a euro type dado cutter sooner than later.?
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 10:12?AM, Wade Dees via groups.io <wjdsignature@...> wrote:
? Kamal,
I have the Forrest stack for my K700S. ?Great results for me.
Wade
On Dec 23, 2024, at 6:50?AM, KRPatel via groups.io <kamalsonal@...> wrote:
? Sorry to revive an older thread but about to pull the trigger on dado blades for my K700S.? Looking at the Ridge Carbide 6" Chipper Super Dado @ $350 vs the Felder Adjustable Groover Cutter Set 6.3-20mm @$1,209.? Have ruled out the CMT Orange set due to my understanding that boring the pin holes may be structurally problematic.? Looking to make 1/4" to 3/4"ish Dados and don't think they will get enough use to warrant replaceable knives.
?
What am I missing in the terms of the price delta other than the Felder premium ;)?
?
Kamal Patel
?
?
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Hi Kamal,
You may already know this but to be sure 6" dado will give you about 1" depth of cut (depending upon your saw aggregate). May be this is fine for your use case.
I did have the older 8" CMT that I bought from Scott & Sargent which was fine. I could see the individual kerf lines but no perceptible ridges. I sold that after acquiring the Felder dado set. Oh! I don't need the pin holes on K975 so will need to check if same is available with Felder pin pattern.
Hope this helps.
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 9:50?AM, KRPatel via groups.io <kamalsonal@...> wrote: ? Sorry to revive an older thread but about to pull the trigger on dado blades for my K700S.? Looking at the Ridge Carbide 6" Chipper Super Dado @ $350 vs the Felder Adjustable Groover Cutter Set 6.3-20mm @$1,209.? Have ruled out the CMT Orange set due to my understanding that boring the pin holes may be structurally problematic.? Looking to make 1/4" to 3/4"ish Dados and don't think they will get enough use to warrant replaceable knives.
?
What am I missing in the terms of the price delta other than the Felder premium ;)?
?
Kamal Patel
?
?
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Kamal -
I tried to use the Felder grooving cutter for some dadoes for 1/4 ply on the C3.
Ply being ply, it was about 1/32 thinner.? The Felder cutters did not go that thin.
Ended up getting a 6" Forrest Dado King, which worked fine.
Imran's point about depth of cut is relevant here.
Depending on your intended use, you might verify the exact Felder dimensions before pulling the trigger.
?? happy holidays...
?
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I also bought a cutter that had pin holes but wouldn’t mount on the pin pattern on the saw arbor. It is part number 4.1.173 and I have other sizes and they don’t fit. What is this cutter meant for? I’m trying in a kf700sp.
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photo attached showing pin hole offset from the ones on the arbor washer.
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im assuming it’s for a different saw or a shaper but don’t understand the pins.
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support and sales have ignored my question and sold me this during the sale process with no warning.?
brian lam
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Hi Brian,
I wood call Felder, speak with a manager, ask for a return shipping label and ask for a refund or exchange.
I don’t know why they would have southway does not fit the machine.
BTW, I have done the above process with item that came damaged and also for a flipstop with a crooked body. Not something you could even try to fix.
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 11:31?AM, B Lam via groups.io <Brianlam8@...> wrote: ? I also bought a cutter that had pin holes but wouldn’t mount on the pin pattern on the saw arbor. It is part number 4.1.173 and I have other sizes and they don’t fit. What is this cutter meant for? I’m trying in a kf700sp.
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photo attached showing pin hole offset from the ones on the arbor washer.
?
im assuming it’s for a different saw or a shaper but don’t understand the pins.
?
support and sales have ignored my question and sold me this during the sale process with no warning.?
brian lam
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Brian,
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My understanding is that you were sent tooling designer for the shaper (spindle), while you were looking for something that could be used on both saw and shaper.
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An example of what you may be looking for is seen on the attached image. You will notice there are two sets of pin holes.
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Imran provided good advice regarding getting back to Felder.
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I hope this helps,
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Jacques
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Kamal,
I have the 8” size Forrest’s dado set.
Thx,
Wade
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 7:34?AM, Rich M. via groups.io <rmarkiewicz@...> wrote:
? Kamal -
I tried to use the Felder grooving cutter for some dadoes for 1/4 ply on the C3.
Ply being ply, it was about 1/32 thinner.? The Felder cutters did not go that thin.
Ended up getting a 6" Forrest Dado King, which worked fine.
Imran's point about depth of cut is relevant here.
Depending on your intended use, you might verify the exact Felder dimensions before pulling the trigger.
?? happy holidays...
?
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I have a 10-inch (254mm) Forrest Dado King drilled to fit a KF700 saw arbor (or 30mm shaper spindle) that I’m willing to sell. ?It was used only once to cut tenons in 10 Douglas Fir fence rails, and has sat in its storage cassette ever since. ?So it is still sharp. ?If someone is interested, DM me and we can discuss pricing. ?Photos below of my unit, but?except?it’s out of stock everywhere, and Forrest says to expect 2-3 months for delivery if you order from them. ?I bought this 10-inch kit because I needed a 90mm depth of cut on the fence rail tenons using the shaper, but had it bored for the pin holes just in case I wanted to use it on my KF700 (which I no longer own).
 .
Tenoning operation:
David Best DBestWorkshop@...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidpbest/collections/
https://www.youtube.com/@David_Best
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On Dec 23, 2024, at 6:49?AM, KRPatel via groups.io <kamalsonal@...> wrote:
Sorry to revive an older thread but about to pull the trigger on dado blades for my K700S.? Looking at the Ridge Carbide 6" Chipper Super Dado @ $350 vs the Felder Adjustable Groover Cutter Set 6.3-20mm @$1,209.? Have ruled out the CMT Orange set due to my understanding that boring the pin holes may be structurally problematic.? Looking to make 1/4" to 3/4"ish Dados and don't think they will get enough use to warrant replaceable knives.
?
What am I missing in the terms of the price delta other than the Felder premium ;)?
?
Kamal Patel
?
?
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Thanks fellas for the responses and will be going with the Forrest 8" set...that is, if I can find any in stock ;(.
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Imran and Rich, good point on the 6" set as I do want flexibility to cut greater depth of cuts.
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Kamal Patel
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Hi Kamal,
8” will work on saw and shaper. If you have a need for deeper than 3” depth of groove on shaper then you need 10” or 12” dado and both require tenoning hood. I plan to make my own tenoning hood out of plywood, which most likes not meet any safety standards
I recently bought Ridge Carbide 8” box joint dado which does 3/16 to 7/16 dados and depth of cut is just under 3”.
The 220mm Felder rebate heads I have, are also about 3”. I cannot get a narrow groove though as they are 31mm tall.
Just thought I mention it. I wish someone made a 9” dado so we could take full advantage of 700 series shaper hood.
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On Dec 26, 2024, at 10:41?AM, KRPatel via groups.io <kamalsonal@...> wrote: ? Thanks fellas for the responses and will be going with the Forrest 8" set...that is, if I can find any in stock ;(.
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Imran and Rich, good point on the 6" set as I do want flexibility to cut greater depth of cuts.
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Kamal Patel
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Kamal,
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I have been using two 250mm (10 inch) ripping blades (FS Tools) stacked on the spindle to cut longer tenons. I am using the Hammer tenoning hood on my B3. Works well for my hobbyist use.
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Regards,
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Jacques
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Joe Jensen
imran
rodsheridan
Dan Gavrilyuk
David P. Best