Re: Suggested video - Thos. Moser of Maine
I met him and toured his shop in Lewiston in the 80s. Always been impressed with his work and marketing skills.
Even with CNC it is still a fairly low tech operation.
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
To the original poster and zdfusco,
Apologies the title of this thread triggered a reaction for full size shop dust collector recommendations. I have owned Jet, Powermatic cyclones along with Felder RL's IMO any of those would work great it will be a tradeoff between noise, cost and footprint.? The cyclones are going to be 80+ dB the RL is 70dB you can talk right next to the machine.? The wireless remote start out of the box with Jet/PWM/Oneida is super convenient as well.
?
Jay Bowen
Cleveland
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Re: Suggested video - Thos. Moser of Maine
I love how they utilize CNC to take care of some of the grunt work yet maintain a reasonable level craftsmanship from the craftsperson
When I worked in the veneer dept. of WallGoldfinger in Northfield Vt we had a misting system, it used to scare the crap out of me every time it went off due to it’s randomness of being triggered based on the condition of the room.?
Here’s a link, some large conference tables were 150k+ and that was 20 yrs ago
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On Dec 8, 2022, at 2:14 AM, mark thomas <murkyd@...> wrote:
?I too like much of their furniture, and it's a nice video, but the language about "integrating" CNC and hand craftsmanship seems like just marketing.? They extol CNC "allowing for exact precision and increased quality" in making chair parts, and then later extol "hand sculpting" of the seats.? But why?? ?Do they intend the seats to vary from chair to chair, reflecting individual craftsmen handiwork, but they want the rest of the chair to have CNC precise consistency?? I doubt it.
The truth is likely economics.? The high cost of skilled human labor to produce parts that require precision fit up justifies replacing that labor with CNC now, but the simpler parts (seat shaping) are still more economical to produce by humans with handheld power tools.? ?When the accountants authorize it, they'll buy another CNC and crank out the seats with the same "exact precision and increased quality" that they crank out the rest of the parts.? Pretty soon there will only be "assemblers" and no "craftsmen".
That's not a criticism of the furniture.? ?It's well made and nicely designed.? It's just a critique of marketing claims that the furniture embodies a soul, rather than a ghost in the machine.
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Re: Suggested video - Thos. Moser of Maine
I too like much of their furniture, and it's a nice video, but the language about "integrating" CNC and hand craftsmanship seems like just marketing.? They extol CNC "allowing for exact precision and increased quality" in making chair parts, and then later extol "hand sculpting" of the seats.? But why?? ?Do they intend the seats to vary from chair to chair, reflecting individual craftsmen handiwork, but they want the rest of the chair to have CNC precise consistency?? I doubt it.
The truth is likely economics.? The high cost of skilled human labor to produce parts that require precision fit up justifies replacing that labor with CNC now, but the simpler parts (seat shaping) are still more economical to produce by humans with handheld power tools.? ?When the accountants authorize it, they'll buy another CNC and crank out the seats with the same "exact precision and increased quality" that they crank out the rest of the parts.? Pretty soon there will only be "assemblers" and no "craftsmen".
That's not a criticism of the furniture.? ?It's well made and nicely designed.? It's just a critique of marketing claims that the furniture embodies a soul, rather than a ghost in the machine.
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Suggested video - Thos. Moser of Maine
I thought some of you might be interested in the following video that profiles Thos. Moser Furniture. I have a special history with this, in that I first met Tom in 1976 just after he started his furniture business, and when I was in the process of building my timberframe home in southern New Hampshire (still standing, recent photo attached). His business has gone through a lot of twists and turns over the decades, but today, his shop produces a meaningful volume of spec and bespoke furniture, all based around the idea of individual craftsmen/women, in conjunction with some newer CNC technology.
Although I don’t “absolutely love" all of Tom’s furniture designs, I do truly admire and share his dedication to the concept of “elegant simplicity” - a blend of Shaker, Scandinavian, and Japanese treatments with a contemporary flair. I feel privileged to own a few of his chairs, all built and signed by individual craftsmen in the late 1970’s and early 1980’s, prior to the introduction of the CNC equipment shown in the video. Tom was largely influential in my purchase of a Multirouter in 2001, although my lofty chair production ambitions have long since abated. Although I didn’t realize it until Tom sent me the video link, he has a Felder F7 sliding table saw that is still in dutiful service today which you can glimpse in the video. The link follows. Enjoy.
David Best
DBestWorkshop@...
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Re: Felder bf6-31 table top alignment?
Sounds like you have a handle on it if you move the table you have to adjust the saw assembly to compansate . Check saw at 90and 45 tha to slider? Designing and building for 50 years
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On Dec 7, 2022, at 5:09 PM, mac campshure <mac512002@...> wrote:
? 35/1000 is perfect Designing and building for 50 years On Dec 7, 2022, at 5:03 PM, Adam Killion <akillion84@...> wrote:
??I got an indicator on the cutterhead tonight when I got homeand it was .035 across the entire head so I would rather not touch that. Also it doesn't look like this was ever moved since factory set if you look at the bolts. I could move it a little closer but think just moving the saw table is the way to go. Does anyone know if moving it is just loosening the 4 nuts for table height adjustment and the set screws in between the saw and jointer and then backing off the jack nuts for the trunnion adjustment on shaper and saw? I was able to pivot the saw to get the dovetails parallel but couldn't move it front or back and didn't want to give it hell without advice first.    Thanks again everyone
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Re: FS: Barth Accessories, Rack and Pinion
Hi Joel:
?
Those look like lovely clamps. I hope you get the 60% asking price.
?
I am generally delighted when I buy used machinery, and generally appalled when I sell used machinery, because in Australia the going rate is 30-40% of new.
?
?
[Edited Message Follows]
I have a Barth Multipress (smallest version) and 500V bench. ?When I purchased the multiples, I selected 4 of the BM-70-33 Rack and Pinion clamping gear units and 4 of the BM-70-33 stops. ?For my 500V I also
purchased ?clamping units with stops. ?The clamps are identical other than the fact that the ones for the Multipress are setup to fit into smaller holes
I find that I do not use the clamps with the Multipress. ?I think I used them once. ?I like to dedicate the press to hydraulic clamping. ?If my Multipress were a larger unit, or my workflow and project selection were different, ?I would likely use it for more
tasks with the rack and pinion clamps.
I recently found out that the clamps for the Multipless can be used with the Barth bench that has the larger holes using an adapter (see black arrow) that is available. I do not think that was an option when I purchased my clamps.
So, if you have an interest in clamps for a Barth Bench or Multipress, these should work for either/both. ?Barth now makes smaller lighter weight clamps for their benches, and I plan to buy them. ?However, I still think the larger ones are nice to have for
certain applications, ?so I am not selling them all. I just do not need so many.
New, these are $800 for each clamp plus stop (not counting tax). ?I have 4 to sell. ?They are not new but like new. ?I am asking 60% of the new price, so $480 each set = ?$1,920 plus shipping.
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
Hi Albert:
?
Aha, the penny dropped for me when I saw airtight solutions. I was not particularly well informed about “Nederman” extractors, but I know from experience that Airtight units are excellent, both in terms of
value and performance. No wonder you’re happy.
?
Warm regards,
Lucky
?
Good day Lucky,?
I didnt have any technical issue with my hydrovane, but when I first got it, I called in compressor technician to give it a service, the cost of it at the time, $1000. I only bought the compressor for $800!! and the technician said to me that I need to run
it all the time and also this is only a small service, I need to do a service every year, by the time I got my invoice I have decided to cut it loose.?
I bought my Nederman 2nd hand, it did not come with any shaker, I know this can be retrofitted either by Nederman or after market it, mine did came with 3 stainless steel bins though, I will be replacing these bins with Comafer briquette press sometime in the
next 2 years.?
busy shop cant give you a good view of the unit.?
I have always had impeller pushing material style extractor, my previous extractor is a 4kw bag house unit, its a copy of the Nederman, it survived 8 years in my workshop, these type of fan are material handling, they are designed to take the beating (to a
degree), but if you drop a 10mm spanner in it, it will surely cause damage, I have had odd 8mm thick domino get sucked into the extraction but the impeller are fine after I removed the ducting to inspect damage, they are well built.?
current workshop and ducting layout
The only regret I have with Nederman is that I should have bought it years ago but its an costly item... mine costed $8k NZD, could have bought it cheaper but I have been bothering the guy from Nederman long enough(first email to them was back in 2014!), so
decided to get this unit, its slightly used condition and a lot of free ducting, the Nederman is very very efficient, the shavings/dust you see on the floor are from spill over when I opened up the extractor to clean it. I am like you, in the suburban area
(am in Auckland), I cant have my extractor sitting in my garden.
I have just tested the noise level of the Nederman standing 1m from the machine using an app called Decibel X, ambient noise is 35dB, max noise is 80dB, it feels louder than 80dB maybe because its sitting in a corner
attached is a T750 datasheet, material is top entry but the fan is the same as S750, 7000m3/hr @ 2800 Pa?
On Wed, Dec 7, 2022 at 10:56 AM, David Luckensmeyer wrote:
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Thanks for your comments. I didn’t catch whether you had success or problems with the hydrovane? My hydrovane, like the screw, needed to be run continuously.
?
I understand you have a Nederman S750 and are very happy with it. I just looked it up online and the machines on offer look very interesting. A couple of questions:
?
- Do you have the shaker cleaning option? Whether you do or not, I wonder how the Nederman goes with wide belt dust?
- I see that the shaker cleaning option can only be operated (manual, mechanical or automatic) while the machine is stopped. I like to run my machines for hours at a time, and the RL250 cleaning cycle
might kick in every 15 to 20 mins depending on what I’m doing during that time. Is it normal to have to power everything down in order to “clean/shake” a dust extractor? Is this an advantage of the RL units, or in fact one of its downfalls?
- The Nederman runs the extracted material through the impeller, while the RL’s impeller is after the filters. I don’t know which is preferable in terms of extraction capability although I love not
having to worry about chunks of timber or foreign material damaging my impeller.
- I see there are bag, barrel and bin options for the Nederman. Which do you have and which do you recommend?
?
Bottom line: I’d love to hear more about the day to day living with a Nederman.
?
Regarding air compressors… Another point I failed to mention for the benefit of others considering hydrovane or screw compressors: I live in sub-tropical Brisbane in Australia. It is not quite as humid as Hawaii,
but relative humidity is generally high. That must play a role in how much water gets into the oil of these compressors and needs to be “burned off” with continuous or near-continuous run times. I wonder whether a hydrovane or screw compressor would last a
lot longer with intermittent use if located in an area of low relative humidity?
?
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Re: Felder bf6-31 table top alignment?
35/1000 is perfect Designing and building for 50 years
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Dec 7, 2022, at 5:03 PM, Adam Killion <akillion84@...> wrote:
??I got an indicator on the cutterhead tonight when I got homeand it was .035 across the entire head so I would rather not touch that. Also it doesn't look like this was ever moved since factory set if you look at the bolts. I could move it a little closer but think just moving the saw table is the way to go. Does anyone know if moving it is just loosening the 4 nuts for table height adjustment and the set screws in between the saw and jointer and then backing off the jack nuts for the trunnion adjustment on shaper and saw? I was able to pivot the saw to get the dovetails parallel but couldn't move it front or back and didn't want to give it hell without advice first.    Thanks again everyone
|
Re: Felder bf6-31 table top alignment?
?I got an indicator on the cutterhead tonight when I got homeand it was .035 across the entire head so I would rather not touch that. Also it doesn't look like this was ever moved since factory set if you look at the bolts. I could move it a little closer but think just moving the saw table is the way to go. Does anyone know if moving it is just loosening the 4 nuts for table height adjustment and the set screws in between the saw and jointer and then backing off the jack nuts for the trunnion adjustment on shaper and saw? I was able to pivot the saw to get the dovetails parallel but couldn't move it front or back and didn't want to give it hell without advice first.    Thanks again everyone
|
Thanks David. Good to know they are still around.
All, sorry, I did not elaborate as I knew David would know since he uses the outfit. I was also very happy with their aqua blue (not mauve) rollers ?
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On Dec 7, 2022, at 3:28 PM, David P. Best <david@...> wrote: ? Axiom was purchased by a sister company named Griffith Polymers. ?They have picked up where Axiom left off offering rubber/poly recovering services for feeder tires, planer feed rollers, and all manner of other applications in agriculture, automotive, oil/gas, etc. they are in the same city that Axion was in - Tualitin Oregon.?
sales@... 503-612-0999 David Best - via mobile phone? On Dec 7, 2022, at 12:09 PM, Imran Malik <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? David,
Is Axiom out =
of business? Their website does not come up anymore and their web address i=
s available for sale. <=
/html>
=20
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
Also found a fan curve of the RL series, RL250, 300 and 350 if anyone is interested.? in 2016 a RL350 costed $32k NZD, or 20k Euro.?  
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
Good day Lucky,? I didnt have any technical issue with my hydrovane, but when I first got it, I called in compressor technician to give it a service, the cost of it at the time, $1000. I only bought the compressor for $800!! and the technician said to me that I need to run it all the time and also this is only a small service, I need to do a service every year, by the time I got my invoice I have decided to cut it loose.? I bought my Nederman 2nd hand, it did not come with any shaker, I know this can be retrofitted either by Nederman or after market it, mine did came with 3 stainless steel bins though, I will be replacing these bins with Comafer briquette press sometime in the next 2 years.? busy shop cant give you a good view of the unit.?  I have always had impeller pushing material style extractor, my previous extractor is a 4kw bag house unit, its a copy of the Nederman, it survived 8 years in my workshop, these type of fan are material handling, they are designed to take the beating (to a degree), but if you drop a 10mm spanner in it, it will surely cause damage, I have had odd 8mm thick domino get sucked into the extraction but the impeller are fine after I removed the ducting to inspect damage, they are well built.? current workshop and ducting layout  The only regret I have with Nederman is that I should have bought it years ago but its an costly item... mine costed $8k NZD, could have bought it cheaper but I have been bothering the guy from Nederman long enough(first email to them was back in 2014!), so decided to get this unit, its slightly used condition and a lot of free ducting, the Nederman is very very efficient, the shavings/dust you see on the floor are from spill over when I opened up the extractor to clean it. I am like you, in the suburban area (am in Auckland), I cant have my extractor sitting in my garden. I have just tested the noise level of the Nederman standing 1m from the machine using an app called Decibel X, ambient noise is 35dB, max noise is 80dB, it feels louder than 80dB maybe because its sitting in a corner attached is a T750 datasheet, material is top entry but the fan is the same as S750, 7000m3/hr @ 2800 Pa?
On Wed, Dec 7, 2022 at 10:56 AM, David Luckensmeyer wrote:
Thanks for your comments. I didn’t catch whether you had success or problems with the hydrovane? My hydrovane, like the screw, needed to be run continuously.
?
I understand you have a Nederman S750 and are very happy with it. I just looked it up online and the machines on offer look very interesting. A couple of questions:
?
- Do you have the shaker cleaning option? Whether you do or not, I wonder how the Nederman goes with wide belt dust?
- I see that the shaker cleaning option can only be operated (manual, mechanical or automatic) while the machine is stopped. I like to run my machines for hours at a time, and the RL250 cleaning cycle might kick in every 15 to 20 mins depending on what I’m doing during that time. Is it normal to have to power everything down in order to “clean/shake” a dust extractor? Is this an advantage of the RL units, or in fact one of its downfalls?
- The Nederman runs the extracted material through the impeller, while the RL’s impeller is after the filters. I don’t know which is preferable in terms of extraction capability although I love not having to worry about chunks of timber or foreign material damaging my impeller.
- I see there are bag, barrel and bin options for the Nederman. Which do you have and which do you recommend?
?
Bottom line: I’d love to hear more about the day to day living with a Nederman.
?
Regarding air compressors… Another point I failed to mention for the benefit of others considering hydrovane or screw compressors: I live in sub-tropical Brisbane in Australia. It is not quite as humid as Hawaii, but relative humidity is generally high. That must play a role in how much water gets into the oil of these compressors and needs to be “burned off” with continuous or near-continuous run times. I wonder whether a hydrovane or screw compressor would last a lot longer with intermittent use if located in an area of low relative humidity?
?
|
FS: Barth Accessories, Rack and Pinion
I have a Barth Multipress (smallest version) and 500V bench. ?When I purchased the multiples, I selected 4 of the BM-70-33 Rack and Pinion clamping gear units and 4 of the BM-70-33 stops. ?For my 500V I also purchased ?clamping units with stops. ?The clamps are identical other than the fact that the ones for the Multipress are setup to fit into smaller holes
I find that I do not use the clamps with the Multipress. ?I think I used them once. ?I like to dedicate the press to hydraulic clamping. ?If my Multipress were a larger unit, or my workflow and project selection were different, ?I would likely use it for more tasks with the rack and pinion clamps.
I recently found out that the clamps for the Multipless can be used with the Barth bench that has the larger holes using an adapter (see black arrow) that is available. I do not think that was an option when I purchased my clamps.
So, if you have an interest in clamps for a Barth Bench or Multipress, these should work for either/both. ?Barth now makes smaller lighter weight clamps for their benches, and I plan to buy them. ?However, I still think the larger ones are nice to have for certain applications, ?so I am not selling them all. I just do not need so many.
New, these are $800 for each clamp plus stop (not counting tax). ?I have 4 to sell. ?They are not new but like new. ?I am asking 60% of the new price, so $480 each set = ?$1,920 plus shipping.
|
A while back we were talking about recovering feeder rollers by Axiom.? If this is the company you're referring then yes their website seems to be gone
Dave Davies
You mean
?David,
Is Axiom out of business? Their website does not come up anymore and their web address is available for sale.
-- Dave & Marie Davies
318-219-7868
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On Dec 7, 2022, at 3:09 PM, imranindiana <imranindiana@...> wrote:
? David,
Is Axiom out of business? Their website does not come up anymore and their web address is available for sale.
|
David,
Is Axiom out of business? Their website does not come up anymore and their web address is available for sale.
|
Re: Felder bf6-31 table top alignment?
Happy to help , ?done this a few times Designing and building for 50 years
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On Dec 7, 2022, at 10:21 AM, Adam Killion <akillion84@...> wrote:
?Thanks Mac, that is the info I was hoping for. I figured the cutterhead was the reference but wasn't aware of that dimension to the table. I will check the outfeed table to cutterhead when I get home and see where that puts me. My main issue is I am not sure if I have enough movement to move the saw table forward a heavy 1/16". I got a feeling this will be a multi day project for me.
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
While this great discussion is running, anyone have a take on a dust collector to rule *some* of them??
I can make a separate topic if people feel this will derail the conversation too much, but I'm looking for the quietest dust collector that will handle my tablesaw and jointer/planer exclusively. I can't help but feel something like the ALKO units or the Nederman units might be overkill for my 500sq shop, given that I outsource my sanding.
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Re: One dust collector to rule them all?
Another option same style as Nederman half the cost, Belfab $6,250 comes with a starter. Efficiency is 99% @.5 micron intake is 9" and 85dB rating which is 2x the Nederman.? Small footprint and rollout dustbin instead of a drum. Nederman weighs 600# Belfab 325#.  Jay Bowen Cleveland
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David P. Best
David Luckensmeyer
imran
Albert Lee
