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SSID strategy
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I have set up two ax.25 systems to play with and learn packet radio. There is no packet radio activity here at all - apart from some APRS - so my setup is for self-education purposes only.
System 1: TS-2000 / Kubuntu AMD64 + Direwolf System 2: Baofeng UV5R / Raspberry Pi4 + Direwolf Both systems are set up the same with a basic ax.25 stack and the latest version of LinPac, compiled locally. I want to turn system 2 into a full blown node/BBS eventually, but for now it only has LinPac installed. For system 1 I use SSID-10 in the axports config file. For system 2 I use SSID-1 in the axports config file. When setting up Direwolf I read somewhere that the call used in the config file shouldn't have the same SSID as the one used elsewhere, e.g. in axports, so in my Direwolf.conf the call sign BX2ABT without an SSID. But LinPac has it's own configuration files and in init.mac you can basically use any call sign and SSID you which. But I find this confusing, because I know system 2 is BX2ABT-1, but I don't know the users on that system, and if I don't setup a user called BX2ABT-1 in my LinPac init.mac file I can never reach that system by using :c BX2ABT-1. Then thinking ahead: what if I want to add a mailbox, BBS, etc. Do these also come with their own configurations and choice of SSID? So my question is: what is a good strategy to choose SSIDs without running into trouble and without confusing anyone? Cheers, Hans BX2ABT |
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At one time I saw a listing of suggested uses of SSID numbers by application?but then I observed that in the maoin no one was following the suggestions. SSIDs are in principle abstract IDs and the system, if it is being polite, announces its capabilities in its broadcasts. There is a weak tendency for WINLINK stations to use the -10 SSID. Also remember that SSIDs need only be consistent in what I will term a usage space.? You can use say a -7 for APRS on 144.39 MHz perhaps?and reuse the -& on a BBS system in 440 MHz so long as their position?reports?do not get aggregated. Good luck with your testing! On Sun, Nov 7, 2021 at 2:02 AM Hans Fong <hans@...> wrote: I have set up two ax.25 systems to play with and learn packet radio. There is no packet radio activity here at all - apart from some APRS - so my setup is for self-education purposes only. --
AB1PH Don Rolph |
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More correctly there is a weak tendency to use -10 for Winlink RMS Packet stations. On Sun, Nov 7, 2021 at 7:03 AM Don Rolph via <don.rolph=[email protected]> wrote:
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AB1PH Don Rolph |
开云体育Yep. I use -7 for my iGate/digipeater.I have the following: No SSID (just callsign): Is usually my node when I’m on BBS’s and/or chat. ?It also has a beacon saying that I have a Wires-X node and AllStar node, giving their details. Beacon also has my web address, where my email can be found. -1 is my BBS. -2 is my main radio, beacon announces it’s one of my main RPi4’s used for SDR, ADS-B, and frequency my main radio is on. -3 and -4, reserved for HT’s, whether they have built-in APRS or I use my MoblinkD TNC3 or Easy Digi. ?Beacon gives the frequency I’m monitoring -5, is for my smartphone/iPhone ?apps. -6, I use this one when using my Kenwood TH-D74 on satellites/ISS. -7, is my iGate/digipeater. ?(144.390 and 50.620 6m APRS) -8, when I go out on Lake Erie, I use this SSID with whatever radio I’m using out there. ?Often just a cheap BTech UV-5X3 and EasyDigi, in case it gets lost or damaged out on the water. -9 is my Yaesu 8900R in my car (with TNC3 or RPi+DireWolf). ?Planning to get a FTM400 and will continue using this SSID in car. -10 is my WinGate server. ? -11 is my chat server. -12, I’ve used with my drones a couple times. Still I’m search of a lighter VHF/2m radio though, like a small module. -13 is my WX station. -15, is just an open extra one that could get used for any additional (usually data) radio I have. ?If I put it I use, beacon says what it is and what is being used for. I figure this is pretty close to the suggested SSID’s. ?It’s not perfect and there is some crossover between the WinGate/BBS/iGate/Digipeater, but I wanted to follow local conventions here. Anyway, that’s what I’ve been using and it’s worked fine. ?Oh yeah, I also have a few mmdvm’s that transmit an APRS (by just TCP), but they use a letter for their SSID.? Of course, you can “technically” use whatever SSID you want (and some seem to do just that), but I figured it would be more considerate and better protocol to follow the recommended suggestions as closely as possible. Have fun and 73. -Jerry? 12 Max Pro On Nov 7, 2021, at 7:06 AM, Don Rolph <don.rolph@...> wrote:
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开云体育-10 is my WinLINK server, that is, lol.I don’t know why I write WinGATE, S haven’t used that program in decades. ?I must have been thinking WinLink Gateway. ?:-) -Jerry? 11 Max Pro On Nov 7, 2021, at 8:55 AM, J K <kuhnje@...> wrote:
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开云体育Hello Hans, I have set up two ax.25 systems to play with and learn packet radio. There is no packet radio activity here at all - apart from some APRS - so my setup is for self-education purposes only. Since you're all by yourself, it doesn't really matter but a few thoughts: ?? - APRS does have a standard for SSIDs but it doesn't apply to classic packet :: ?? - For classic packet, different regions even within the same country might have different schemes.? In my area for our KB2KB frequencies, this is what we use (Section 28.c.11 ):? ????? -- ??????????? SSID :: Description ??????????? -----::-------------------------------------------- ????????????? -0 :: (aka.. no SSID) direct human to human / keyboard to keyboard chat ????????????? -1 :: PBBS mailboxes ????????????? -2 :: not specifically used ????????????? -3 :: not specifically used ????????????? -4 :: not specifically used ????????????? -5 :: netrom nodes and digipeaters ????????????? -6 :: not specifically used ????????????? -7 :: netrom nodes and digipeters (alternate) ????????????? -8 :: not specifically used ????????????? -9 :: not specifically used ???????????? -10 :: for Winlink nodes ????? -- ?? - Generally speaking, nothing is really wrong but I wouldn't recommend to use -10.? That's pretty universally used for WInlink. But LinPac has it's own configuration files and in init.mac you can basically use any call sign and SSID you which. But I find this confusing, because I know system 2 is BX2ABT-1, but I don't know the users on that system, and if I don't setup a user called BX2ABT-1 in my LinPac init.mac file I can never reach that system by using :c BX2ABT-1. The base callsign+ssid shown via "ifconfig" which comes from the kernel ax25 stack is just a base layer.? It's recommended to keep it unique from say a used SSID used by say Linpac or ax25d but it technically doesn't have to be.? I have seen some strange collisions when they were the same but I forget what the behavior is here.? The behavior also might be different between using say the VE7FET AX.25 tools vs. the official AX.25 tools (the old versions say in the distro repo or the newer ones via git). Then thinking ahead: what if I want to add a mailbox, BBS, etc. Do these also come with their own configurations and choice of SSID? Correct though it depends on which BBS.? If you use FBB, it's listening AX.25 port going to get configured via /etc/ax25/ax25d.conf but if you're running something like JNOS or BPQ32, they have their own AX25 stack and can care less about Linux's internal stack (unless you connect the two stacks together). --David KI6ZHD |
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Hello David et al.
Thanks for all the replies and info. I know this topic is only marginally dealing with Direwolf, but I thought most people hanging out here are would be most knowledgeable about packet radio, so I hope you don't mind. I have more packet radio setup related questions, but I'll post them on groups.io/linuxham (unless you don't mind off topic questions here on this board). I was aware of the APRS SSID recommendations, but I'll stick with this list for now. And I will not use -10 again, promise :-) ??????????? SSID :: Description ??????????? -----::-------------------------------------------- ????????????? -0 :: (aka.. no SSID) direct human to human / keyboard to keyboard chat ????????????? -1 :: PBBS mailboxes ????????????? -2 :: not specifically used ????????????? -3 :: not specifically used ????????????? -4 :: not specifically used ????????????? -5 :: netrom nodes and digipeaters ????????????? -6 :: not specifically used ????????????? -7 :: netrom nodes and digipeters (alternate) ????????????? -8 :: not specifically used ????????????? -9 :: not specifically used ???????????? -10 :: for Winlink nodes ? The base callsign+ssid shown via "ifconfig" which comes from the kernel ax25 stack is just a base layer.? It's recommended to keep it unique from say a used SSID used by say Linpac or ax25d but it technically doesn't have to be.? I have seen some strange collisions when they were the same but I forget what the behavior is here.? The behavior also might be different between using say the VE7FET AX.25 tools vs. the official AX.25 tools (the old versions say in the distro repo or the newer ones via git). Do I need to see SSIDs as an ID related to a system or a service? From what you wrote above the latter. But how does that work then? If on a system the ax.25 stack has SSID-1 and Linpac SSID-2 then how does a connecting station get routed to Linpac? All packets have to go through the ax.25 stack, so SSID-1, so towards the outside world there is no SSID-2. You could make SSID-2 visible to the outside world if you create a new port in axports, or am I not correct with that assumption. Still it works: just configured LinPac on my RPi (BX2ABT-1) with BX2ABT-2, -3 and -4 in init.mac, and had no problem connecting from my other machine (BX2ABT-10), creating 4 different sessions with BX2ABT-1, -2, -3 and -4 respectively. Then thinking ahead: what if I want to add a mailbox, BBS, etc. Do these also come with their own configurations and choice of SSID? >>Correct though it depends on which BBS.? If you use FBB, it's listening AX.25 port going to get configured via /etc/ax25/ax25d.conf but if you're running something like JNOS or BPQ32, they have their own AX25 stack and can care less about Linux's internal stack (unless you connect the two stacks together). You mean FBB uses ax0 and JNOS ax1, etc... Why would you do that? You can create different ports in axports and use those, not? Excuses for my lack of insight, I hope you do not too vexed about it. I'm not familiar at all with (computer) networking and right now I see a lot of pieces of a puzzle without an idea on how to connect them together. It's complicated stuff to me. BTW, I still don't know what my next step should be: I guess it's setting up node with ax25-node or uronode and then FBB. Or should I go straight to JNOS or BPQ32? What I wrote before, my aim is to understand this whole packet radio stuff and prefer KISS. Any ideas? Cheers! Hans BX2ABT |
开云体育Hello Hans, Do I need to see SSIDs as an ID related to a system or a service? From what you wrote above the latter. But how does that work then? If on a system the ax.25 stack has SSID-1 and Linpac SSID-2 then how does a connecting station get routed to Linpac? All packets have to go through the ax.25 stack, so SSID-1, so towards the outside world there is no SSID-2. You could make SSID-2 visible to the outside world if you create a new port in axports, or am I not correct with that assumption. Yes.. you need to consider each CALLSIGN+SSID identifier as unique and once a program "claims" it, any packets being received for a specific CALLSIGN+SSID will be routed to that listening program to be processed.? By default, Linux's AX.25 setup usually doesn't run any daemons to connect to so a remote user could try to connect to any of your SSIDs and nothing will happen.? It's only once you install and configure a program to listen on a specific SSID will your system answer for that CALLSIGN+SSID combination.? Linpac is very flexible here as it can be configured to listen on one SSID or ALL of them (0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, etc).? Linpac offers the ability to even share the same SSID and have two different F-keys using the same SSID as long as they are connected to different remote stations.? Beyond Linpac, the way you get other programs to register their use of a specific SSID is via the /etc/ax25/ax25d.conf file.? This is how you might enable programs like UroNode, FPAC, FBB, etc. I have a lot of this detailed in my HamPacket documentation:? ?? Still it works: just configured LinPac on my RPi (BX2ABT-1) with BX2ABT-2, -3 and -4 in init.mac, and had no problem connecting from my other machine (BX2ABT-10), creating 4 different sessions with BX2ABT-1, -2, -3 and -4 respectively. Yup.. that's expected.? As long as the CALLSIGN+SSID combinations are different, Linpac will manage them separately. Then thinking ahead: what if I want to add a mailbox, BBS, etc. Do these also come with their own configurations and choice of SSID? Of course.? Think of the Linux AX.25 network stack just like Linux TCP/IP stack.? AX.25 stack is only the base layer and you need to install applications on top of it to be usable.? In TCP/IP land, if you want a web server then you need to install, configure, and start say Apache HTTPD.? In AX.25 land, if you want a BBS like say FBB, you need to install and configure one. You mean FBB uses ax0 and JNOS ax1, etc... Why would you do that? You can create different ports in axports and use those, not? Think of the base "ax" interfaces as the physical layer that's connecting your Linux host to a specific radio operating on a specific frequency.? If you want your computer to simultaneously operate on another frequency (aka.. additional radios), you'll need to setup an additional AX.25 interfaces such as ax1, ax2, ax3, etc.? Please note that the same packet program that uses the Linux kernel's AX.25 stack can offer their services on multiple interfaces at the same time.? It's also worth mentioning that you can REUSE the same SSID number as long as they are being used on different AX.25 kernel interfaces (aka different radios).? For example: ?? Radio frequency? |? linux kernel interface? |? Linux kernel interface name? |? Program? |? Configured callsign+SSID ?? -----------------+--------------------------+-------------------------------+-----------+-------------------------- ??? 14.105????????? |? ax0 ? ????????????????? |? hfdrop?????????????????????? |? Linpac?? |? BX2ABT-1 ?? 144.390????????? |? none - Direwolf stack?? |? None???????????????????????? |? Direwolf |? BX2ABT-9 ?? 145.050 ? ? ? ?? |? ax1 ?? ? ?????? ? ?? ?? |? vhfdrop????????????????????? |? Linpac?? |? BX2ABT, BX2ABT-1 ?? 145.050 ? ? ? ?? |? ax1 ? ? ??????? ? ?? ?? |? vhfdrop????????????????????? |? Uronode? |? BX2ABT-5 ?? 443.370????????? |? ax2???????????????????? |? uhfdrop????????????????????? |? FBB????? |? BX2ABT-1 That is just an example and you can make it either simpler or way more complex.? This is the power of Linux working for you.? Btw, notice I'm NOT talking about JNOS or BPQ32.? Why?? Because they have their own AX.25 stacks and don't depend on the Linux in-kernel AX.25 stack.? Yes, you *can* interconnect them if you wish but it's not required if you just want JNOS to run. Excuses for my lack of insight, I hope you do not too vexed about it. I'm not familiar at all with (computer) networking and right now I see a lot of pieces of a puzzle without an idea on how to connect them together. It's complicated stuff to me. No doubt, it's a lot to wrap your head around the first time but AX.25 networking is very similar to TCP/IP networking in many respects.? This is all an excellent way to learn about networking btw. BTW, I still don't know what my next step should be: I guess it's setting up node with ax25-node or uronode and then FBB. Or should I go straight to JNOS or BPQ32? What I wrote before, my aim is to understand this whole packet radio stuff and prefer KISS. Any ideas? Cheers! Solutions like BPQ32 and JNOS are excellent "vertical solutions" that can do almost everything within one program while also allowing for interconnections to say the LInux AX.25 stack or even other AX.25 solutions.? The flip side is they hide a lot of the networking concepts so you might not get to learn about them for the sake of simplicity? I suppose the answer comes down to what are you looking to do??? ?? - Do you just want something to work and be easy"?? BPQ32 or maybe JNOS might be the best option for you ?? - Maybe you're looking to learn how all the pieces fit together and inter-operate?? Maybe you want to setup a very rich environment involving RF AX.25, AMPR IPIP mesh and BGP routing, etc. with learning the Linux AX.25 stack.? Then the Linux AX.25 stack is the way to go. --David KI6ZHD |
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Thank you David. It's a little clearer now.
??I will take a look at that page - again. I was basically only following this page: , but it stops with setting up a node, FBB, etc. So the basis is there, but then integrating more capabilities is still a work-in-progress for you and ideally I would want to follow some examples or tutorials to get going. Saw a lot of info on this site, too: but haven't gotten around studying it all. ?? - Maybe you're looking to learn how all the pieces fit together and inter-operate?? Maybe you want to setup a very rich environment involving RF AX.25, AMPR IPIP mesh and BGP routing, etc. with learning the Linux AX.25 stack.? Then the Linux AX.25 stack is the way to go.Yes, this is what I want, so I'll skip JNOS and BPQ for now. Thanks again. 73 de Hans |
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