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Object Beacon time question
¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHello Arnold, In Section 9.1.1 of the Direwolf User Guide, it gives the beacon syntax.? I believe you should be able to use an odd "EVERY" interval time to have the beacons sent out outside of the "top of the hour" time timing. ? Beyond this, I don't think there is a way for Direwolf to send beacons on a relative startup time and instead, it sends on standard time boundaries today. --David KI6ZHD On 02/26/2025 02:46 PM, Arnold Harding
- KQ6DI via groups.io wrote:
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I didn't explain well enough.? In an Object Beacon it can have an internal time stamp.? For example the following 'raw' is sent from APRSICCE/32.? Notice in the "object" is a time stamp that matches local PST time (except for a 6 second difference).
2025-02-27 10:01:44 PST: >APWW11,TCPIP*,qAC,T2SJC:;Junction?*180138h3723.54N\12129.12WR/A=002190
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Trying to send an Object from Direwolf 1.8D always sends a timestamp that doesn't relate to any real time.? (Yes, the RPi sending this is connected to the internet and does have correct time.)
2025-02-27 16:28:34 PST: >APDW18,qAR,:;time6????*010000z/;U5#/hNO/A=002040
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?APRS can send an object without any time stamp as seen in this example from APRSISCE/32 (actually an Item, not Object).
2025-02-27 09:56:45 PST: >APWW11,TCPIP*,qAC,T2SJC:)Junction!\;Vwv/hm7R?sT/A=002190
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So it would seem that Direwolf should be able to send correct time, or nothing.? I just don't know what the Direwolf syntax is.
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APRS101 chapter 11 specification talks about the actual format of Objects, and it appears time is in an Object, but not included in an Item Report.? But then again, I'm not any sort of expert on APRS formats.
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In any case, thank you for your time.
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Arnold, KQ6DI
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¿ªÔÆÌåÓýHey Arnold, Ok.. I understand now and looking in my AX.25 RF logs, I see various examples of this: #Here is Direwolf v1.5, 1.6 and v1.7 sending fixed 111111z times: -- vhfdrop: fm K6YIL-1 to APDW15 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 57 01:59:26.413033 ;147.315EH*111111z/;*--/H_2r? !147.315MHz T088 +060 W6SON vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 10:00:04.963848 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !11:00:00 vhfdrop: fm WA6ODP-4 to APDW17 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 05:00:01.028574 ;time???? *111111z/;LhV/c--/? !05:00:00 -- Interestingly enough, if I focus on the W6SRR station, I *do* see an incrementing timestamps but in a different field: -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 10:00:04.963848 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !11:00:00 -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 11:00:01.718827 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !12:00:00 --- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 12:00:02.159378 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !13:00:01 -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 13:00:07.242274 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !14:00:00 -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 14:00:02.039557 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !15:00:00 -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 15:00:02.101090 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !16:00:00 -- vhfdrop: fm W6SRR-3 to APDW16 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 16:00:02.919940 ;time???? *111111z/;R!!/fKY/? !17:00:00 -- #Here is Direwolf v1.8D sending 010000 times as you originally reported (I even see your packets as you are local to me!): -- vhfdrop: fm KQ6DI-3 to APDW18 via W6CX-3* ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 16:55:48.852307 ;time???? *010000zH;WmZ/e8d#? !16:55:47 vhfdrop: fm WB6ETY-3 to APDW18 via W6CX-3* ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 16:58:54.393368 ;time???? *010000zS;KH*/c's#? !16:58:52 -- Digging deeper, I do see other beacons on APRS doing this ?broken" / fixed time thing.? Maybe it's just the APRS standard?? -- vhfdrop: fm K6YIL-1 to QST ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 57 21:02:02.882875 ;147.315EH*111111z/;*--/H_2r? !147.315MHz T088 +060 W6SON vhfdrop: fm AA6RH-1 to QST ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 70 10:10:02.325230 ;145.040SR*111111z/;#66/LP#r? !K6ACS D-Star 145.040MHz -060 Santa Rosa vhfdrop: fm AE6FK-2 to APTT4 via WB6TMS-5* BKELEY* WIDE2* ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 36 22:24:50.181771 /010000z3823.00N\12244.13Wy/A=000066 vhfdrop: fm K6SH-2 to APMI06 via BKELEY* WIDE2-1 ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 61 16:00:21.523099 @010000z3749.33NS12211.61W# Oakland, CA 12.5V vhfdrop: fm KJ6LNH-1 to APRS via K6FGA-1* N6ZX-3* WIDE2* ctl UI^ pid=F0(Text) len 63 16:00:16.481462 @010000z3800.62N/12158.15W_024/002g003t097r000p000P000b10100h19 vhfdrop: fm NC6J-1 to APBPQ1 via K6FGA-1* N6ZX-3* WIDE2* ctl UI^ pid=F0(Text) len 91 16:00:57.544107 }KD7NHM-1>APOSB4,TCPIP,NC6J-1*:@010000z3835.27N/12124.31W[/A=001640SharkRF openSPOT4 Mobile vhfdrop: fm WB6ETY-3 to APDW18 via W6CX-3* ctl UI pid=F0(Text) len 39 16:58:54.393368 ;time???? *010000zS;KH*/c's#? !16:58:52 -- I think we need to hear from John WB2OSZ (direwolf) or maybe Andrew, KA2DDO (YAAC), Lynn (D) - KJ4ERJ (APRSISCE), or other APRS app developers here on this list to chime in. --David KI6ZHD On 02/28/2025 12:24 PM, Arnold Harding
- KQ6DI via groups.io wrote:
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David,
Thanks again.
What I am/was attempting to do is help with post-processing of aprs trackers during an event.? I sometimes have a portable digipeater involved, and that portable does not have internet, thus the times into the log produced by Direwolf don't match real time which makes post-processing difficult when a couple logs are involved.? What I did temporarily was to have W6SRR-3 send a "time stamp" that would get received by the portable and stuck into it's log, thus giving real time to be able to correct with. So the comment in the Object is the time being transmitted.
I was hoping I could use the Time portion of the object report to save a few milliseconds of RF time and simplify things.
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Since I originally sent this question to the group I've found a couple better ways.
A Real Time Clock attached to the Pi is a simplest solution, and hope it stays correct.
One method is to not send an Object, but an Item report.? Almost the same, but eliminates the unnecessary 111111z times, but Direwolf doesn't seem to have a method to configure an Item.? I tried it here using CBEACON, but it's ugly rolling my own packet.? (fun trying it though...)
A better method is to simply embed the time string into the comments of a regular position packet.
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A time stamp not something I would normally do, but it solved a problem quickly.
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Everything can be worked around, but my investigating possible methods I did find real time from an Object packet isn't there, and having Item type available might be nice as well.
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I found acceptable solutions along the way so all is good.? A few lingering questions, but minor.
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Arnold, KQ6DI
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So Direwolf always sets the tOBJECT timestamp to 111111z and has no way of providing the time? Kind of defeats the purpose of having those 7-bytes in the format if they are always the same. ?? Sending an OBJECT out with 111111z just means it is permanent (like a repeater). Objects were meant to track ANY assets that did not have APRS capability.? The OBJECT would just have to be sent manually from another APRS capable station, and kept up to date. ?? Sending and updating an OBJECT like an Ambulance that doesn't APRS without a timestamp has no value. Since APRS is unconnected, some stations will miss some updates.?? Sending an OBJECT without a timestamp means others don't know how old that valuable information is. Robert Giuliano
On Saturday, March 1, 2025 at 04:04:49 PM EST, Arnold Harding - KQ6DI via groups.io <kq6di@...> wrote:
David,
Thanks again.
What I am/was attempting to do is help with post-processing of aprs trackers during an event.? I sometimes have a portable digipeater involved, and that portable does not have internet, thus the times into the log produced by Direwolf don't match real time which makes post-processing difficult when a couple logs are involved.? What I did temporarily was to have W6SRR-3 send a "time stamp" that would get received by the portable and stuck into it's log, thus giving real time to be able to correct with. So the comment in the Object is the time being transmitted.
I was hoping I could use the Time portion of the object report to save a few milliseconds of RF time and simplify things.
?
Since I originally sent this question to the group I've found a couple better ways.
A Real Time Clock attached to the Pi is a simplest solution, and hope it stays correct.
One method is to not send an Object, but an Item report.? Almost the same, but eliminates the unnecessary 111111z times, but Direwolf doesn't seem to have a method to configure an Item.? I tried it here using CBEACON, but it's ugly rolling my own packet.? (fun trying it though...)
A better method is to simply embed the time string into the comments of a regular position packet.
?
A time stamp not something I would normally do, but it solved a problem quickly.
?
Everything can be worked around, but my investigating possible methods I did find real time from an Object packet isn't there, and having Item type available might be nice as well.
?
I found acceptable solutions along the way so all is good.? A few lingering questions, but minor.
?
Arnold, KQ6DI
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