#245597

Hello,

I'm working on a residence with 3 yamaha receivers, RX V85, RX A2080 and RX 3080. They are all using Yamaha 3010 IP v1.2 to connect and they all work fine with the xpanel app.

The problem is that all of them area trying to force a reconnection even if the module is already connected, leading to dozens of processes running showing up in toolbox.

As you can see below, the module has an IP connection via socket but tries again to reconnect.?

Maybe because the residence has 3 of them?

Anyone has this issue? Any tips on fixing this?

Thanks,

Daniel Arola

Heres my toolbox output:

00:00:02.719 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.719 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.719 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.719 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.719 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.734 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.734 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.734 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.734 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.734 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.750 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.750 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.766 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.766 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.766 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.891 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.891 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.891 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.891 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.891 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.906 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.906 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.906 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.906 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.922 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.922 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.937 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.937 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet

#245599

I know this doesn't answer your question. But since no one appears to have an answer for your question, thought I share a little insight base on my personal past experience.? In general, I avoid doing IP control for any consumer product, at least for anything mission critical, because of reliability issues.? Virtually ever job I have done using IP control on TVs and receivers, I have had to eventually go back on convert it to some other method because IP control was intermittent or a firmware update broke it.? A commercial product is a different story -- IP control is generally robust.?

I just did a Yamaha RX-A3080 and what I did was control it will IR.? There is a 3.5mm jack on the back of the RX-A3080 so you don't have to put a flasher on the front of the unit.? IR will always work because the manufacturer is very careful not to break that interface during firmware updates.? If I need feedback, such as volume level in my case, I do an RS232 connection to the receiver.? The RX-A3080 has RS232 port on the back of it.? I only use RS232 for feedback as if that breaks, and I have seen that happen after a firmware update, at least the receiver will turn on, switch inputs, and the volume control will still work.? The only thing that happens is the volume level may not display on any two-way interfaces.? But at least the system is still usable.

If you want to use IP control, you will probably have to write your own module. At least that is what I have had to do in the past. If the issue is with the firmware in the receiver, even that won't work.

#245601

开云体育

I agree with Steve, IR is pretty stable in general (especially via cable) and often totally sufficient, with RS232 next to the list.

However, for Yamaha, i?m using the YNCA protocol and found that to be very reliable and stable even over firmware updates.

It?s just a dead simple ASCII protocol.

To the OP: which control protocol are you using?

?

Cheers,

Thorsten

?

Von: [email protected] <[email protected]> Im Auftrag von Steve Kuehn
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. April 2022 04:02
An: [email protected]
Betreff: Re: [crestron] Yamaha 3080 multiple connections

?

I know this doesn't answer your question. But since no one appears to have an answer for your question, thought I share a little insight base on my personal past experience.? In general, I avoid doing IP control for any consumer product, at least for anything mission critical, because of reliability issues.? Virtually ever job I have done using IP control on TVs and receivers, I have had to eventually go back on convert it to some other method because IP control was intermittent or a firmware update broke it.? A commercial product is a different story -- IP control is generally robust.?

I just did a Yamaha RX-A3080 and what I did was control it will IR.? There is a 3.5mm jack on the back of the RX-A3080 so you don't have to put a flasher on the front of the unit.? IR will always work because the manufacturer is very careful not to break that interface during firmware updates.? If I need feedback, such as volume level in my case, I do an RS232 connection to the receiver.? The RX-A3080 has RS232 port on the back of it.? I only use RS232 for feedback as if that breaks, and I have seen that happen after a firmware update, at least the receiver will turn on, switch inputs, and the volume control will still work.? The only thing that happens is the volume level may not display on any two-way interfaces.? But at least the system is still usable.

If you want to use IP control, you will probably have to write your own module. At least that is what I have had to do in the past. If the issue is with the firmware in the receiver, even that won't work.

#245603

Thanks everyone,

Seems like you are right about this, probably something wrong in the keep alive /reconnect logic that cant be easily fixed.

Em sex., 1 de abr. de 2022 às 03:31, Thorsten K?hler <thorsten.koehler@...> escreveu:

Show quoted text

I agree with Steve, IR is pretty stable in general (especially via cable) and often totally sufficient, with RS232 next to the list.
However, for Yamaha, i?m using the YNCA protocol and found that to be very reliable and stable even over firmware updates.
It?s just a dead simple ASCII protocol.
To the OP: which control protocol are you using?
?
Cheers,
Thorsten
?
Von: [email protected] <[email protected]> Im Auftrag von Steve Kuehn
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. April 2022 04:02
An: [email protected]
Betreff: Re: [crestron] Yamaha 3080 multiple connections
?
I know this doesn't answer your question. But since no one appears to have an answer for your question, thought I share a little insight base on my personal past experience.? In general, I avoid doing IP control for any consumer product, at least for anything mission critical, because of reliability issues.? Virtually ever job I have done using IP control on TVs and receivers, I have had to eventually go back on convert it to some other method because IP control was intermittent or a firmware update broke it.? A commercial product is a different story -- IP control is generally robust.?

I just did a Yamaha RX-A3080 and what I did was control it will IR.? There is a 3.5mm jack on the back of the RX-A3080 so you don't have to put a flasher on the front of the unit.? IR will always work because the manufacturer is very careful not to break that interface during firmware updates.? If I need feedback, such as volume level in my case, I do an RS232 connection to the receiver.? The RX-A3080 has RS232 port on the back of it.? I only use RS232 for feedback as if that breaks, and I have seen that happen after a firmware update, at least the receiver will turn on, switch inputs, and the volume control will still work.? The only thing that happens is the volume level may not display on any two-way interfaces.? But at least the system is still usable.

If you want to use IP control, you will probably have to write your own module. At least that is what I have had to do in the past. If the issue is with the firmware in the receiver, even that won't work.

#245606

I am using Yamaha IP 3000 1.2. Also I opened the module in simpl to check for parameters about keep alive / connections and they are actually there.

But I wasn't able to figure out a way to stabilize the ip connection. Seems like even when connected flag is high, the driver sends 4-5 reconnects per second which returns as broken connections remotely (because it is already connected).

After I m done alexa integrating the house will try to change parameters on module to solve this (but I'm not keeping my hopes high)

Em sex., 1 de abr. de 2022 03:31, Thorsten K?hler <thorsten.koehler@...> escreveu:

Show quoted text

I agree with Steve, IR is pretty stable in general (especially via cable) and often totally sufficient, with RS232 next to the list.
However, for Yamaha, i?m using the YNCA protocol and found that to be very reliable and stable even over firmware updates.
It?s just a dead simple ASCII protocol.
To the OP: which control protocol are you using?
?
Cheers,
Thorsten
?
Von: [email protected] <[email protected]> Im Auftrag von Steve Kuehn
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. April 2022 04:02
An: [email protected]
Betreff: Re: [crestron] Yamaha 3080 multiple connections
?
I know this doesn't answer your question. But since no one appears to have an answer for your question, thought I share a little insight base on my personal past experience.? In general, I avoid doing IP control for any consumer product, at least for anything mission critical, because of reliability issues.? Virtually ever job I have done using IP control on TVs and receivers, I have had to eventually go back on convert it to some other method because IP control was intermittent or a firmware update broke it.? A commercial product is a different story -- IP control is generally robust.?

I just did a Yamaha RX-A3080 and what I did was control it will IR.? There is a 3.5mm jack on the back of the RX-A3080 so you don't have to put a flasher on the front of the unit.? IR will always work because the manufacturer is very careful not to break that interface during firmware updates.? If I need feedback, such as volume level in my case, I do an RS232 connection to the receiver.? The RX-A3080 has RS232 port on the back of it.? I only use RS232 for feedback as if that breaks, and I have seen that happen after a firmware update, at least the receiver will turn on, switch inputs, and the volume control will still work.? The only thing that happens is the volume level may not display on any two-way interfaces.? But at least the system is still usable.

If you want to use IP control, you will probably have to write your own module. At least that is what I have had to do in the past. If the issue is with the firmware in the receiver, even that won't work.

#245609

Daniel,
I've been testing/refactoring my interface module for the RX-AxA series, which is ONLY IP controllable (IR of course) and I have not had any connectivity issues that you describe.
I'm holding the CONNECT input high just after program start, and I've had good luck with reconnection after program updates/processor reboots, and even when I mess with the Power and network connections of the AVR.

For Previous Yamaha AVR models, I was using the RS232 module and connection with no issues.
Though it could be the older models that aren't as reliable with IP, OR you might have something going on with your network...

#245611

Hello ckangis,

Seems like Rs232 connections are way more stable then IP connections. Those 3 I'm working on are connected via ethernet only,?using 1 TCP/IP socket each on the ethernet slot of the AP3, with fixed IP addresses.

I'm holding the trigger high for connection (forcing 1 on the input) but still receiving tons of reconnection tries even after the socket state changes to connected.

My guess is still a poorly designed module, but changing to rs 232 now isn't an option, can't pass any more cables or make any changes on hardware.?

Em sex., 1 de abr. de 2022 às 14:06, ckangis <chris@...> escreveu:

Show quoted text

Daniel,
I've been testing/refactoring my interface module for the RX-AxA series, which is ONLY IP controllable (IR of course) and I have not had any connectivity issues that you describe.
I'm holding the CONNECT input high just after program start, and I've had good luck with reconnection after program updates/processor reboots, and even when I mess with the Power and network connections of the AVR.

For Previous Yamaha AVR models, I was using the RS232 module and connection with no issues.
Though it could be the older models that aren't as reliable with IP, OR you might have something going on with your network...

#245612

I think I may know what your issue is!!

The module you're using has external TCP/IP input/output connections - Are you using these, attaching them to a TCP Client in the Device Symbol section??
If so, that's your issue - Those connections don't actually connect to ANYTHING inside the module!!? (Yes!? you may scream now!!!)
Thus, your TCP client symbol is trying to connect but is not being properly processed...
OR, it may just be that your processor is trying to make two connections at the same time to the same IP/Port - one via the TCP client and one via the module's Direct Socket connection, and the AVR or processor doesn't like it

Try Deleting or commenting out your TCP Clients and just use the IP address and Port # (default=50000d) parameters on the module.
Latch the Connect input of the module High when your program starts.
Note: I generally don't use a '1' on the connects, as I have had some modules that didn't behave well with it - if you don't have a delayed start signal in your program, I would use a '1' to trigger a DELAY symbol, wait 10s, and use the output for the connect.

Let me know if this fixes the issue...
HTH, Chris K

#245615

Hello Chris,

First let me thank you for helping me. I'm still new this and documentation is really scarce.?

I followed your tip and... that was exactly what I was looking for!!!!

I had 3 sockets defined in IP-ID section named 0A, 0B, 0C, all on port 50000. They? were populated with inputs and outputs to match yamaha module, which was receiving them as I was expecting it was the right way to do it.

Now I understand that those inputs are not needed. We just need the IP-ID opening up a socket to port 50000.? I did as you said, ignored inputs and outputs on tcp/ip client command on yamaha module, except for the ip and port parameters and worked like a charm!?

You're awesome man, great insight.

Also, I did insert a delay/trigger for connection as you suggested. Thanks again.

Daniel

Em sex., 1 de abr. de 2022 às 18:14, ckangis <chris@...> escreveu:

Show quoted text

I think I may know what your issue is!!

The module you're using has external TCP/IP input/output connections - Are you using these, attaching them to a TCP Client in the Device Symbol section??
If so, that's your issue - Those connections don't actually connect to ANYTHING inside the module!!? (Yes!? you may scream now!!!)
Thus, your TCP client symbol is trying to connect but is not being properly processed...
OR, it may just be that your processor is trying to make two connections at the same time to the same IP/Port - one via the TCP client and one via the module's Direct Socket connection, and the AVR or processor doesn't like it

Try Deleting or commenting out your TCP Clients and just use the IP address and Port # (default=50000d) parameters on the module.
Latch the Connect input of the module High when your program starts.
Note: I generally don't use a '1' on the connects, as I have had some modules that didn't behave well with it - if you don't have a delayed start signal in your program, I would use a '1' to trigger a DELAY symbol, wait 10s, and use the output for the connect.

Let me know if this fixes the issue...
HTH, Chris K

#245616

Hi HTH,

The module I'm using is this one:?

Chris just solved my problem, as you can see in my previous email. It was about me thinking that the module needed socket inputs and outputs to work. The module cares only about the IP and Port, as long as the program has an IP-ID device socket open on port 50000 it will work.

Thanks everyone, this one is solved.

Daniel

Em sex., 1 de abr. de 2022 às 18:36, MSTC <kol.mstc@...> escreveu:

Show quoted text

Hi Daniel;
?
Looking at the trace below it appears the module is only trying to reconnect after the connection is broken remotely.? I don’t see any try to force a reconnection, are you sure you are not confusing the connected feedback going high (1) with waiting for connection status (1d)?
?
It appears the module may actually be working correctly and there is an external reason the connection keeps getting broken, either something in the network or a problem with the AVR.? It does seem a bit unlikely to be 3 bad AVRs, but ?I have seen this sort of thing happen when there is an IP address conflict with something (not even AV related) on the network.? You might try scanning the network to see if there is a conflict, or changing the address of one of the AVRs as a test.
?
Where did you get the module? I don’t see it in CresDB or on application market or the files section here.
?
As a last resort, if you have anything co-located with the AVR that is controlled by IR you could use IR for the AVR pretty easily.
?
HTH
?
From: <[email protected]> on behalf of Daniel Arola <daniel.arola@...>
Reply-To: <[email protected]>
Date: Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 8:55 AM
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: [crestron] Yamaha 3080 multiple connections
?
Hello,
?
I'm working on a residence with 3 yamaha receivers, RX V85, RX A2080 and RX 3080. They are all using Yamaha 3010 IP v1.2 to connect and they all work fine with the xpanel app.
?
The problem is that all of them area trying to force a reconnection even if the module is already connected, leading to dozens of processes running showing up in toolbox.
?
As you can see below, the module has an IP connection via socket but tries again to reconnect.?
Maybe because the residence has 3 of them?
?
Anyone has this issue? Any tips on fixing this?
?
Thanks,
?
Daniel Arola
?
Heres my toolbox output:
00:00:02.719 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.719 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.719 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.719 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.719 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.734 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.734 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.734 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.734 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.734 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.750 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.750 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.766 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.766 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.766 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.781 ? ?1 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.891 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.891 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.891 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.891 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.891 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.906 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_SuiteMaster
00:00:02.906 ? ?4d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.906 ? ?Connection Broken Remotely ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.906 ? ?0 ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_Connect-F}}_Mainroom
00:00:02.922 ? ?1d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.922 ? ?Waiting For Connection ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.937 ? ?2d ? ?{{TCP/IP_Client_>>_status}}_Gourmet
00:00:02.937 ? ?Connected ? ?//{{Connection_Status_Text}}_Gourmet

#245617

A couple Follow-up points for others' edification.
- The Yamaha modules that the above link references are the ones that I've used successfully for both RS232 and IP control. As mentioned the IP module has TCP/IP client signal In/Outs but they are not internally connected.

And Daniel, you're very welcome!!? I've received untold amounts of help from this Forum and the previous Yahoo iteration, so I'm happy to give back in some little way - Many on this forum are WAY MORE skilled than I, HaHa!!!

- Just to clarify regarding your mention of the need to still have IP-IDs. The terminology may just be mixed up
....You do not need any TCP client symbols in the Device Symbol/Ethernet slot section. All you need is the IP address and the Port (50000d) on the module. The connections are all handled within the module.
...Using the TCP client with the module still doubles the connections for each AVR, which you don't want or need.
...This may just be a semantic issue with your description, but I just wanted to be clear about it - I.e. you will not have any IP-IDs associated with the AVRs.

NOTE: That is the one downside with Direct Socket modules in that you do not have indication in the IPTABLE report as to the connectivity.
This module does have an "Is_Connected" output signal that you can monitor to verify that the unit is connected and 'talking'...