Hello Mike, Thank you for your help in finding info. on getting my dead c-car running agian. Anthony From: "HOLLAND,MIKE (HP-USA,ex1)" <mike_holland@...>
Reply-To: C-Car@...
To: "'C-Car@...'" <C-Car@...>, "'anthonyluiz@...'" <anthonyluiz@...>
Subject: RE: [C-Car] Citicar motor
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:55:26 -0700
Hi Anthony (and other fellow C-Car owners),
I don't know it the following will help you or not but it's from "The
Citicar-Commutacar Service Manual" Pages 6-1 thru 6-7.
I've also attached the only illustration from this section of the book.
Mike
-------------------------------From the
Book------------------------------------------------
The GENERAL ELECTRIC MOTOR
As of March 1, 1976, all G.E. motor repairs will be handled through the
Authorized G.E. Repair Station in your local area.
You will be supplied with a listing of all G.E. Repair Stations. Take or
send the motor to the nearest one to your location.
Sebring-Vanguard will pay to remove and replace the motor. G.E. will take
care of the warranty.
You as a dealer must supply the G.E. Repair Station with the information on
the vehicle to obtain warranty service.
You must supply;
-Vehicle serial number
-Mileage of vehicle
-Delivery date of vehicle
If you don't know the delivery date, and the customer cannot supply the
date, call the Service Department and we can supply the delivery date.
If the vehicle is out of warranty, the G.E. Repair station will be glad to
quote a price on the repair for the customer.
It would be advisable to stock a motor for substitution in the customer's
vehicle to get it on the road as soon as possible. When you receive the
repaired motor back, put it in stock. A motor repaired by G.E. will be
considered a new motor.
MOTOR REMOVAL - DANA AXLE ONLY
1. It would be easier to remove the motor from under the vehicle, but
remember, it weigh 65 pounds. Raise the vehicle and support on suitable
stands.
2. Disconnect the heater pipes from the manifold.
3. Disconnect cables and mark for later installation. Disconnect heat lamp
wires, remove fan motor thermal switch from outside motor case, if equipped.
4. Remove the rear heater manifold casting from motor,
5. Remove the front 4 end plate bolts and retain.
6. Slide motor back and lower out of vehicle.
7. Remove front end plate from rear axle housing and install on motor.
8. Remove front heater manifold casting and retain.
9. Reinstall in reverse order.
ROUTINE EXAMINATION AND BRUSH REPLACEMENT
1. At 3,000 miles or six months, remove the covers over the brush access
openings and examine the interior.
a. Make sure the brush shunts are positioned so they can move freely down
the brush holder slot as the brush wears. Remove any obstruction which may
have occurred since the last inspection and might cause the brush to bind in
its holder.
b. Check each brush for free movement in its holder and examine it for any
wear and general condition. If a brush is broken, cracked, severely chipped,
or worn to a length of less than 5/8 inch measured on the short side of the
brush, replace it. Whenever any brushes are replaced, it is good practice to
replace all of them. Keep extra brushes on hand. It is recommended that only
brushes obtained from General Electric Company be used.
c. Examine the condition of the brush springs. Make sure the spring coils
are uniform and do not appear discolored by heat. This may have caused a
loss of spring quality. If these or other signs of spring damage are
evident, replace the spring. The use of a small spring scale can be employed
to see if the spring meets the required one pound or more force to lift it
at the point of contact.
d. Observe the condition of the commutator and the armature coils which may
be visible. Refer to section entitled, "Inspection of Armature" for details
to look for, during this inspection.
2. Brush Replacement
a. With fingers or a suitable hook, lift the brush spring end up so the
brush may slide out of its holder. Loosen the brush screw to remove the
brush shunt terminal and remove the brush.
b. Again, lift the end of the brush spring and place the new brush in the
holder in the same relative position as the old brush removed. Place end of
spring in position on top of the brush. Connect the brush shunt terminal to
its proper crossover with the brush screw. Note that the position of the
brush shunt is important when installing brushes. Assure positioning to
permit the brush shunt to travel down the brush holder slot as the brush
wears. If it hands up, commutator damage and motor failure will result.
Install the brush like the sketch below and observe if the shunt will follow
down the slot with wear. Make minor adjustments to ensure the path of
movement will be free before final tightening of the brush screw. Also make
sure that only the insulated portion of the shunt touches the motor
endshield or is touched by the brush cover when it is reinstalled.
c. Replace the covers over the brush access openings.
3 .Cleaning At regular maintenance periods for the vehicle. Remove the cover
over the brush access openings and clean all foreign material, such as dirt
and carbon dust, from the motor's interior. use dry compressed air of
moderate pressure. Clean by suction, if possible, to avoid blowing dirt,
carbon dust, or metal particles into the bearings and insulation.
4. When parts have worn considerably, the motor interior is very dirty, or
other indications suggest a higher echelon of maintenance, the motor must be
disassembled.
NOTE: This condition could be caused by an undetected fault of manufacture
appearing early in normal field service or it could be caused by overloading
the motor and causing high temperature failure of connections. The resulting
high resistance in a joint could cause this symptom appearance. Evidence of
general overheating and accompanying flat spots would tend to indicate
overworking of the motor.
2. If one or more armature conductors is abnormally black or appear burned
compared with the other armature conductors, it is an indication of a
shorted armature. It should first be blown off to clean it, then checked
with a growler. If the short circuit is not confirmed by this indication,
check resistance and apply a high potential test not exceeding 600 volts AC
for I minute. If the armature does not pass these tests, it should not be
used.
NOTE: SHORT CIRCUITED COILS CAN BE CAUSED BY MANY THINGS, AS WELL AS AN
UNDETECTED MANUFACTURING FAULT WHICH MOST LIKELY WOULD SHOW UP EARLY IN
NORMAL SERVICE.
3. If a generally heat discolored appearance is uniformly over the
commutator or windings is observed, it is usually a sign of overloading of
the vehicle or motor. This should be corrected or the symptoms will be
repetitive and motors will be burned out frequently. While an armature of
this appearance might pass checks for resistance, shorts, and high
potential, it has lost some survival ability and will not have a normal
service life.
4. Bubbled insulation and individual brush burn marks on the commutator is
rather a classic example of a motor armature which has been loaded up to
stall with power applied. It promptly overheated and its elements boiled to
quick failure. Other comments are similar to 3 above.
Generally, armatures with other than normal service wear are not recommended
to be repaired and reused although some re-soldering of commutators in the
field has been successfully done. Replacement is heavy duty motors which
sometimes run at high speed under light load conditions.
5. Commutator Inspection and Care
a. Inspect the commutator during each brush inspection.
b. Commutator bars should not be pitted, burned or grooved in the brush
track. If found in this condition, the surface should be refinished in a
lathe, limiting the depth of cut to .055 inch or less on a side and repeat
until smooth.
Before a final cut, the mica insulation between commutator bars should be
undercut .032 inch. No mica slivers should be left along the sides of the
bars above the undercut.
Next, dynamic balance the armature to within .0015 inch amplitude at 3000
RPM. After this, the final finish cut should be made with a diamond tool to
obtain a surface finish of 8 to 16 micro inch. The armature should not be
put back in service with a diameter of less than 2.625 inches.
c. After refinishing a commutator, check it for eccentricity. It should not
exceed .001 inch total indicator reading for the entire diameter and with a
.0002 inch maximum bar-to-bar difference.
INSPECTION OF FIELD WINDINGS
If, upon inspection, the insulation on the field coils appears blackened or
charred, the serviceability of the coils is questionable. Burned or scorched
coil insulation is a symptom of coil overheating due to overloads, grounded,
or short circuited winding.
To check the windings electrically for grounds or open circuits a continuity
tester, ground tester, and ohm meter are required.
To check for a grounded field connect the tester between terminal studs SI
to ground and S2 to ground.
To check for an open or shorted winding: Connect the ohm meter between S2
and Sl. The resistance should read.0138 plus or minus .0014 ohm.
BEARING INSPECTION AND CARE
1. The bearings are prelubircated with Chevron SRI-2 high temperature
grease, or equivalent (do not use silicone grease in a DC motor), sufficient
for the life of the bearings.
2. Check bearings by turning them with your fingers. Feel for binding or
gritty effects and for excessive looseness or wobble. If any defect is
apparent or if there is any doubt to serviceability of the bearings, replace
them with new ones.
3. Pull the old bearings with a suitable bearing puller. Press new bearings
into place with an arbor that exerts pressure on the inner ring. Do not use
a hammer for bearing replacement. It will damage the bearing.
REASSEMBLY
1. Set commutator endshield in place on bench with brush rigging facing
upward.
Push each brush back up into brush holder until its end would permit the
commutator to pass under without hitting. Adjust end of spirng so that it is
against side of brush and holds brush in "cocked" position.
2. Set armature, with the ball bearings already assembled, into place in the
endshield.
3. Push on end of each brush to release onto the commutator. Obsereve that
brushes seat on commutator properly and that end of springs ride on brush
tops in line with brush holder grooves. Make sure that the brush shunt will
travel down the holder slot as the brush wears.
4. Mount the stator over the armature and position it exactly with chisel
mark on endshield. Thread thermostat leads through the proper hole in the
commutator endshield. Gently seat on rabbet.
5. a. The pulley endshield contains a seal whose inside lip rides on a
highly finished surface of the shaft. If the shaft surface is still polished
and undamaged but the seal requires replacement then:
(1). Drive the seal from the pulley endshield with a suitable punch and
hammer.
(2). Apply "Hanna Oil Sealer" to the mating surface before placement of the
oil seal (Use # 709957 oil Seal Compound - Hanna Paint Company, Columbus,
Ohio, or equivalent). Do not allow to dry before assembly.
(3). Press seal into position with a suitable press so that its outside
diameter is flush with the face of the endsheild surface recess (see motor
outline). Locate seal into the pulley endshield with seal lip spring facing
away from the bearing.
b. Position spring, spacer, and shim washers into the pulley endshield using
enough Chevron SRI-2 grease in the cavity to hold these parts in place.
After suitably covering the spline of the armature shaft to prevent damage
to the seal lip (also use bearing grease to coat seal lip and shaft cover
surface), gently fit the end shield assembly over the shaft and pulley end
bearing. Line up chisel marks and seat the endshield into the stator rabbet.
6. Be sure endshields are snugly fit in stator rabbets, then replace clamp
screws on both ends. Check to determine that armature is free to turn. If it
will not turn, the parts have been assembled to cause binding.
7. Replace brush access covers
8. Make a high potential test (up to maximum of 600 volts AC for I minute)
to assure motor has been properly reassembled.
9. If a running performance test is to be made before reinstalling motor in
vehicle, observe caution in that this series motor will overspeed if voltage
is applied under no load or inadequate load conditions. Do not apply voltage
to the motor unless a torque load equivalent to 3-1/2 HP at 320ORPM is first
connected to the shaft, and use only direct current battery power.
-----Original Message-----
From: anthonyluiz@... [mailto:anthonyluiz@...]
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2001 11:28 PM
To: C-Car@...
Subject: [C-Car] Citicar motor
Has anybody taken apart their citicar GE 3.5hp motor? I got my
Citicar with almost dead batteries and a jerking at low speed. After
battery replacment the motor started to smell and the jerking got much
more noticeable. After removing the motor and opening it up we found
that the motor brush holder was bad and the commutator was in bad need
of turning, and the commutator plates have different resistance
readings between adjoining plates. After looking it over,it looks like
there was at one time a ring of some sort that put pressure on the
wires where they attach to the commutator via some set screws or
something, I think this would explain the resistance difference. On
all of the outer wires there is a small dent that looks like there was
a bolt that pushed on it at one time. After looking around and calling
GE I still have not found any info.Does anyone know if there is a ring
of some kind missing. Does anyone have some knowledge or an assembly
drawing of this motor? Can anybody help me? Any info at all would be
helpful and very much appreciated.... want to drive my car again!
Anthony
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