|
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
|
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe
as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....????
However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022
5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine
being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works
very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much
greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine
burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12
litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated
carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation
attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward
engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft
and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller
single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long
range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far
greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an
interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912
is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a
noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation.
The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be
more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I
like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the
reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air
Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022
5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine
being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?
Get
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt
12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved
the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are
flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at
4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop,
have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK
xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much
better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the
standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912
and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but
much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns
around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The
difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to
prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine
installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the
forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns.
Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and
originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55
Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so
now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5
hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems
an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is
flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit
although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the
Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me
reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want
to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own
the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27
pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial
engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Hi, thanks for info, thats very interesting. The prop was recently
replaced due to corrosion and was set up for me by Metal Seagulls in
Wales, including test flying. Not sure what its set at but think its
now set at what is specified in the manual? whereas before it was
slightly different.
C of G is interesting, I might try some experiments. Another 9112
Falcon owner reports they get 12L per hour.
At the moment mine is running cool and I need to adjust the radiator
shielding. Im hoping this will also improve fuel use.
regards,
Jonathan
G-BZWC
On 29/07/2022 12:47, Seamus O'Donnell
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
?
your performance with the 912 is not that
good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years
ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and
was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on
prop
weight and CG is important and
the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs
no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG
and especially the falcon which was never as good as the
standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022
9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR]
replacement engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it
works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but
much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel
but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it
burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I
fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation
attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the
forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development
aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a
smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long
range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is
far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems
an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with
the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which
makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has
improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with
half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me
reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but
would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is
before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own
the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because
of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on
29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl
air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks
like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4 cylinder) are currently flying in the uk?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 29 Jul 2022, at 11:48, Seamus O'Donnell <etronics@...> wrote:
?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are
flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at
4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop,
have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK
xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much
better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the
standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912
and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but
much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns
around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The
difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to
prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine
installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the
forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns.
Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and
originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55
Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so
now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5
hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems
an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is
flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit
although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the
Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me
reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want
to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own
the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27
pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial
engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
The lift to up to 600kg may solve the weight issue?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 29 Jul 2022, at 13:25, Brian Ellis <bellis2uk@...> wrote:
? Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4 cylinder) are currently flying in the uk? On 29 Jul 2022, at 11:48, Seamus O'Donnell <etronics@...> wrote:
?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are
flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at
4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop,
have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK
xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much
better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the
standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912
and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but
much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns
around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The
difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to
prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine
installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the
forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns.
Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and
originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55
Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so
now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5
hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems
an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is
flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit
although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the
Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me
reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want
to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own
the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27
pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial
engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
I think that Aeromomentum engine looks like a fine option. It’s a little heavier than the Rotax 912 I believe but could still work. The thing about the X-Air standard (much preferred over the X-Air F in my view) is that it’s designed to fly relatively slowly so adding bags of power might make it more economical but not necessarily any quicker. For this reason a reliable and less expensive 4 stroke option to the Rotax 582 only is surely worth considering. As Michael Coates once stated, the absolutely best fit for the standard X-Air is the 75Hp Rotax 618. Although not produced any more - you can still find newly rebuilt 618 motors on Barnstormers and several that I know of have gone for well over 1000 hours fault free if set up properly. It’s a peach of an engine. ????????? ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Hank Optland
Sent: Friday, 29 July 2022 11:12
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine? I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote: Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm: Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham K&M HD Motorcycles U2 5-9 Kingston Ave? Richmond? South Australia 5033?? Ph +61 8? 8234 1090? kmmotor@... kmmotorcycles.com.au
-- With regards,??? Michael Coates ? AU +61 7 5522 0583 USA +1 213 984 1237 ? ? PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012 Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012 PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017 ? mailto:mcoates@... ? skype name:?? xcomavionics ? Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually do what it is meant to do.? Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake gets through. ? Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed. No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message. ? "Amateurs practice till they get it right; Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
?
|
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Jul 29, 2022, at 4:11 AM, Hank Optland <scorchedenvelope@...> wrote:
?
I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?
Get
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt
12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved
the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
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Ulpower.com
Look a like Rotax motors?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
What about a Viking 90?
On Jul 29, 2022, at 4:11 AM, Hank Optland <scorchedenvelope@...> wrote:
?
I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?
Get
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt
12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved
the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
it is going to help but not of the airframe design is limited to a
lower number. For example if the aircraft was originally rated at
450 kg maximum takeoff weight then having a 600 kg limit is not
going to help that particular aircraft because it is not going to be
able to be flown at anything more than the design certification.
Brian Ellis via groups.io wrote on
29/07/2022 10:28 pm:
The lift to up to 600kg may solve the weight issue?
?
Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4
cylinder) are currently flying in the uk?
?
your performance with the 912 is
not that good, you are flying at?a very high
rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts
never burned more than 12 litres and was also using
the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and
the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG,
all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much
better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which
was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message
-----
Sent: Friday, July
29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR]
replacement engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912
and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than
a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically
it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres
an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour
. The difference might be because I fitted heated carb
bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine
installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for
the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development
aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and
originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly
alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now
aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance
!! - more than 5 hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor
which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing
I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs (
cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit
although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation.
The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs
so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is
the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want
to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before
flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13,
Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....???
They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant
use it because of the weight etc....???? However it
looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on
29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial
Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made
in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD
Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston
Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia
5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234
1090?
kmmotor@...
kmmotorcycles.com.au
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Hi Seamus,
Do you have any drawings or sketches with some measurements for the 912? My Xair (std) has been on a Jabiru since new. Managing the cht temps was a full time job, I tried many different duct mods and did manage to get below the 350°f but that was also using fuel cooling which carbons the engine and reduces performance. I am at the stage of fitting a new engine and the new Jabiru ones don't use the same mount, exhaust or prop flange also untested in out of cowl fitment so could have same?problem as current. Like most of the group there really isn't a good reliable engine like the 912 so that's where I am headed, just need any info on mounting.
My Xair has a cog of 12 from memory (away from home so can't look at my book to check) always flew very well tho fairly heavy on fuel because of the rich mixture. Mount was supplied by Jabiru but they don't make one for the new engines. I have been working with a LAME who thinks we can use existing mount frame and weld on the 912 firewall mount, apparently Randkar never made the mount although my assembly manual specifies one in the drawings. So that's where we are at the moment so any info would help.
Thanks
On Fri, 29 Jul 2022, 6:48 pm Seamus O'Donnell, < etronics@...> wrote:
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are
flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at
4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop,
have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK
xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much
better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the
standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912
and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but
much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns
around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The
difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to
prevent carb ice.
If attachments work there is a photo of the engine
installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the
forward engine struts are shortened.
There are some weight concerns.
Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and
originally had a smaller single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55
Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so
now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5
hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems
an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is
flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit
although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the
Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me
reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want
to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates
wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own
the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27
pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial
engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
?
there have been a few different 912 mounts, randkar did
have one but we had to design our own to pass the UK load tests especially
torque requirements, I can let you have?the details I have?if you send
me an email to xairireland@...
Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2022 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
Hi Seamus,
Do you have any drawings or sketches with some measurements for
the 912? My Xair (std) has been on a Jabiru since new. Managing the cht temps
was a full time job, I tried many different duct mods and did manage to get
below the 350°f but that was also using fuel cooling which carbons the engine
and reduces performance. I am at the stage of fitting a new engine and the new
Jabiru ones don't use the same mount, exhaust or prop flange also untested in
out of cowl fitment so could have same?problem as current. Like most of
the group there really isn't a good reliable engine like the 912 so that's
where I am headed, just need any info on mounting.
My Xair has a cog of 12 from memory (away from home so can't
look at my book to check) always flew very well tho fairly heavy on fuel
because of the rich mixture. Mount was supplied by Jabiru but they don't make
one for the new engines. I have been working with a LAME who thinks we can use
existing mount frame and weld on the 912 firewall mount, apparently Randkar
never made the mount although my assembly manual specifies one in the
drawings. So that's where we are at the moment so any info would help.
Thanks
On Fri, 29 Jul 2022, 6:48 pm Seamus O'Donnell,
< etronics@...> wrote:
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you
are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago
cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using
the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of
the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted
fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as
good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45
AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement
engine
I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax
912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2
stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel
but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12
litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb
bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.
If attachments work
there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine
mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are
shortened.
There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development
aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller
single tank.
It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I
fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft
endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5
hours.
In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which
seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with
the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for
a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The
D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more
comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like
the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability
is before flying with one.
Regards,
Jonathan
On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air
Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test
bed but cant use it because of the weight
etc....???? However it looks promising !
Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep
an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in
Australia. Looks like a winner!
Clive Cunningham
K&M HD Motorcycles
U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?
Richmond?
South Australia 5033??
Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?
kmmotor@...
--
With regards, Michael Coates
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
mailto:mcoates@...
skype name: xcomavionics
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process.
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do. Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."
|
Clive Cunningham
