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Re: Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces

 

开云体育

The fuel pump only draws maximum 2 amps and I am already using stranded wire and I have replaced the plastic remote control type connectors with straight through butt connectors and heat trick and my fuel pump is grounded. I will go flying tomorrow morning and see if it works better now. Hopefully the loose negative terminal connector was not giving a proper ground, making the needle sounds like crazy. Fingers crossed.
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Rol <rol@...>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2022 5:51:06 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces
?


Actually, soldered connections are prone to failure in environments where vibration is a factor.? That is why in ,ost cases in aircraft crimped connections and stranded wire is the standard.? It maintains a secure but flexible connection.

In addition in corrosive environments the metal insolder can lead to dissililar metal corrosion.



On Thu, Aug 11, 2022 at 2:43 AM Jonathan Webb <avia1or01@...> wrote:

I'm far from an expert but it does sound to my befuddled amateur brain like a wiring issue.

Only thing for it is replace old connectors and possibly also cables. Soldered joints are always better. I spent yesterday replacing a temporary chocolate screw connector with a soldered connection. Its difficult to do neatly in the confines of? the cockpit.

How often should fuel pumps be replaced. Mine are original from when my aircraft was built in 2003. Its done around 450 hours. It has a Pierburg mechanical pump which you cannot get any-more and I have been advised that an old Piesburg is better than a new replacement. The electrical pump is also original but working fine.


Regards


Jon

X air Falcon

 
On 11/08/2022 02:23, Justin Gregoris wrote:
Hello everyone once again,

I changed my facet cube auxiliary electric fuel pump with a bravex auxiliary electric fuel pump. The specifications between the both are merely identical - my current bravex pump has a current draw of 1-2amps with 2-4psi output.

After I installed it yesterday and went flying today, the ammeter inside my cockpit registers current draw of about 5-8amps give or take, but as soon as I switch the auxiliary pump on, the needle bounces back and forth like it's going crazy. No beakers pop/open but I'm confused as to why the ammeter needle is bouncing; it's bounces almost like one would simulate the same phenomenon by shaking the Ammeter, if it were to be disconnected, in your hands, sort of thing.

For starters, I changed the facet pump thinking it was defective when it stopped working, but afterwards re-plumbing new fuel lines with a check valve and after Installing a new pump, I then realized the wire connector was the culprit of the pump stopping - the puno was fine but rather the wire and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump had 2 sets of cheap plastic push-on connectors that were 15 years old and landing on rough grass field, probably exacerbated the connection to finally malfunctioning, amongst oxidization and humidity, and quality of connector, etc.

Anyway today I went flying with the new bravex fuel pump, soon realizing the brand new bravex fuel pump stop working.

After I landed I was surprised to find out if I got a defective new pump. I then chased the wires and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump one more, to then realized I noticed yet another cheap push on connect. I moved the last cheap connector that was part of this circuit around, at which point the new bravex fuel pump states to work again.

I will remove this last problematic connection and splice a straight through connection.

Could my ammeter needle be bouncing abruptly because of this (last) poor connection in the auxiliary pump circuit, or could that be a coincidence and the ammeter needle bouncing in the dial be tied towards something else?

If i don't turn on the newly installed pump, the needle doesn't bounce, but rather accurately measures total current in the entire electrical circuit of the plane.

When I turned on the auxiliary pump with the engine off, the needle also did not bounce around like crazy.

When I had the engine running more or less at idle, with the auxiliary pump on, the needle did not bounce around even then.

However, once I applied full throttle and got off the ground with the auxiliary pump on, the needle then started bouncing around back and forth like crazy.

I will be fixing the last connection issue tomorrow, but thought I'd reach out to you all for any advice.

Maybe once I fix the last connection problem within the auxiliary pump circuit, will the ammeter needle stop acting this way?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thank you!


Re: Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces

 



Actually, soldered connections are prone to failure in environments where vibration is a factor.? That is why in ,ost cases in aircraft crimped connections and stranded wire is the standard.? It maintains a secure but flexible connection.

In addition in corrosive environments the metal insolder can lead to dissililar metal corrosion.



On Thu, Aug 11, 2022 at 2:43 AM Jonathan Webb <avia1or01@...> wrote:

I'm far from an expert but it does sound to my befuddled amateur brain like a wiring issue.

Only thing for it is replace old connectors and possibly also cables. Soldered joints are always better. I spent yesterday replacing a temporary chocolate screw connector with a soldered connection. Its difficult to do neatly in the confines of? the cockpit.

How often should fuel pumps be replaced. Mine are original from when my aircraft was built in 2003. Its done around 450 hours. It has a Pierburg mechanical pump which you cannot get any-more and I have been advised that an old Piesburg is better than a new replacement. The electrical pump is also original but working fine.


Regards


Jon

X air Falcon

 
On 11/08/2022 02:23, Justin Gregoris wrote:
Hello everyone once again,

I changed my facet cube auxiliary electric fuel pump with a bravex auxiliary electric fuel pump. The specifications between the both are merely identical - my current bravex pump has a current draw of 1-2amps with 2-4psi output.

After I installed it yesterday and went flying today, the ammeter inside my cockpit registers current draw of about 5-8amps give or take, but as soon as I switch the auxiliary pump on, the needle bounces back and forth like it's going crazy. No beakers pop/open but I'm confused as to why the ammeter needle is bouncing; it's bounces almost like one would simulate the same phenomenon by shaking the Ammeter, if it were to be disconnected, in your hands, sort of thing.

For starters, I changed the facet pump thinking it was defective when it stopped working, but afterwards re-plumbing new fuel lines with a check valve and after Installing a new pump, I then realized the wire connector was the culprit of the pump stopping - the puno was fine but rather the wire and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump had 2 sets of cheap plastic push-on connectors that were 15 years old and landing on rough grass field, probably exacerbated the connection to finally malfunctioning, amongst oxidization and humidity, and quality of connector, etc.

Anyway today I went flying with the new bravex fuel pump, soon realizing the brand new bravex fuel pump stop working.

After I landed I was surprised to find out if I got a defective new pump. I then chased the wires and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump one more, to then realized I noticed yet another cheap push on connect. I moved the last cheap connector that was part of this circuit around, at which point the new bravex fuel pump states to work again.

I will remove this last problematic connection and splice a straight through connection.

Could my ammeter needle be bouncing abruptly because of this (last) poor connection in the auxiliary pump circuit, or could that be a coincidence and the ammeter needle bouncing in the dial be tied towards something else?

If i don't turn on the newly installed pump, the needle doesn't bounce, but rather accurately measures total current in the entire electrical circuit of the plane.

When I turned on the auxiliary pump with the engine off, the needle also did not bounce around like crazy.

When I had the engine running more or less at idle, with the auxiliary pump on, the needle did not bounce around even then.

However, once I applied full throttle and got off the ground with the auxiliary pump on, the needle then started bouncing around back and forth like crazy.

I will be fixing the last connection issue tomorrow, but thought I'd reach out to you all for any advice.

Maybe once I fix the last connection problem within the auxiliary pump circuit, will the ammeter needle stop acting this way?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thank you!


Re: Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces

 

开云体育

Hello Justin, I was hoping someone else would jump in with more experience for me but it sounds to me like it is a grounding issue. When everything is running the ground is jumping all over the place. It is going to be happening when the fuel pump is going because it will draw a lot more power than just about anything else you have installed. Have you also grounded the fuel pump case itself? ??? this is very important, you just can't rely on the red and black wire going into the pump, the pump itself must be adequately grounded

Justin Gregoris wrote on 11/08/2022 11:23 am:
Hello everyone once again,

I changed my facet cube auxiliary electric fuel pump with a bravex auxiliary electric fuel pump. The specifications between the both are merely identical - my current bravex pump has a current draw of 1-2amps with 2-4psi output.

After I installed it yesterday and went flying today, the ammeter inside my cockpit registers current draw of about 5-8amps give or take, but as soon as I switch the auxiliary pump on, the needle bounces back and forth like it's going crazy. No beakers pop/open but I'm confused as to why the ammeter needle is bouncing; it's bounces almost like one would simulate the same phenomenon by shaking the Ammeter, if it were to be disconnected, in your hands, sort of thing.

For starters, I changed the facet pump thinking it was defective when it stopped working, but afterwards re-plumbing new fuel lines with a check valve and after Installing a new pump, I then realized the wire connector was the culprit of the pump stopping - the puno was fine but rather the wire and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump had 2 sets of cheap plastic push-on connectors that were 15 years old and landing on rough grass field, probably exacerbated the connection to finally malfunctioning, amongst oxidization and humidity, and quality of connector, etc.

Anyway today I went flying with the new bravex fuel pump, soon realizing the brand new bravex fuel pump stop working.

After I landed I was surprised to find out if I got a defective new pump. I then chased the wires and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump one more, to then realized I noticed yet another cheap push on connect. I moved the last cheap connector that was part of this circuit around, at which point the new bravex fuel pump states to work again.

I will remove this last problematic connection and splice a straight through connection.

Could my ammeter needle be bouncing abruptly because of this (last) poor connection in the auxiliary pump circuit, or could that be a coincidence and the ammeter needle bouncing in the dial be tied towards something else?

If i don't turn on the newly installed pump, the needle doesn't bounce, but rather accurately measures total current in the entire electrical circuit of the plane.

When I turned on the auxiliary pump with the engine off, the needle also did not bounce around like crazy.

When I had the engine running more or less at idle, with the auxiliary pump on, the needle did not bounce around even then.

However, once I applied full throttle and got off the ground with the auxiliary pump on, the needle then started bouncing around back and forth like crazy.

I will be fixing the last connection issue tomorrow, but thought I'd reach out to you all for any advice.

Maybe once I fix the last connection problem within the auxiliary pump circuit, will the ammeter needle stop acting this way?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thank you!

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces

 

开云体育

I'm far from an expert but it does sound to my befuddled amateur brain like a wiring issue.

Only thing for it is replace old connectors and possibly also cables. Soldered joints are always better. I spent yesterday replacing a temporary chocolate screw connector with a soldered connection. Its difficult to do neatly in the confines of? the cockpit.

How often should fuel pumps be replaced. Mine are original from when my aircraft was built in 2003. Its done around 450 hours. It has a Pierburg mechanical pump which you cannot get any-more and I have been advised that an old Piesburg is better than a new replacement. The electrical pump is also original but working fine.


Regards


Jon

X air Falcon

 
On 11/08/2022 02:23, Justin Gregoris wrote:

Hello everyone once again,

I changed my facet cube auxiliary electric fuel pump with a bravex auxiliary electric fuel pump. The specifications between the both are merely identical - my current bravex pump has a current draw of 1-2amps with 2-4psi output.

After I installed it yesterday and went flying today, the ammeter inside my cockpit registers current draw of about 5-8amps give or take, but as soon as I switch the auxiliary pump on, the needle bounces back and forth like it's going crazy. No beakers pop/open but I'm confused as to why the ammeter needle is bouncing; it's bounces almost like one would simulate the same phenomenon by shaking the Ammeter, if it were to be disconnected, in your hands, sort of thing.

For starters, I changed the facet pump thinking it was defective when it stopped working, but afterwards re-plumbing new fuel lines with a check valve and after Installing a new pump, I then realized the wire connector was the culprit of the pump stopping - the puno was fine but rather the wire and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump had 2 sets of cheap plastic push-on connectors that were 15 years old and landing on rough grass field, probably exacerbated the connection to finally malfunctioning, amongst oxidization and humidity, and quality of connector, etc.

Anyway today I went flying with the new bravex fuel pump, soon realizing the brand new bravex fuel pump stop working.

After I landed I was surprised to find out if I got a defective new pump. I then chased the wires and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump one more, to then realized I noticed yet another cheap push on connect. I moved the last cheap connector that was part of this circuit around, at which point the new bravex fuel pump states to work again.

I will remove this last problematic connection and splice a straight through connection.

Could my ammeter needle be bouncing abruptly because of this (last) poor connection in the auxiliary pump circuit, or could that be a coincidence and the ammeter needle bouncing in the dial be tied towards something else?

If i don't turn on the newly installed pump, the needle doesn't bounce, but rather accurately measures total current in the entire electrical circuit of the plane.

When I turned on the auxiliary pump with the engine off, the needle also did not bounce around like crazy.

When I had the engine running more or less at idle, with the auxiliary pump on, the needle did not bounce around even then.

However, once I applied full throttle and got off the ground with the auxiliary pump on, the needle then started bouncing around back and forth like crazy.

I will be fixing the last connection issue tomorrow, but thought I'd reach out to you all for any advice.

Maybe once I fix the last connection problem within the auxiliary pump circuit, will the ammeter needle stop acting this way?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thank you!


Analog Ammeter needle all of a sudden bounces

 

Hello everyone once again,

I changed my facet cube auxiliary electric fuel pump with a bravex auxiliary electric fuel pump. The specifications between the both are merely identical - my current bravex pump has a current draw of 1-2amps with 2-4psi output.

After I installed it yesterday and went flying today, the ammeter inside my cockpit registers current draw of about 5-8amps give or take, but as soon as I switch the auxiliary pump on, the needle bounces back and forth like it's going crazy. No beakers pop/open but I'm confused as to why the ammeter needle is bouncing; it's bounces almost like one would simulate the same phenomenon by shaking the Ammeter, if it were to be disconnected, in your hands, sort of thing.

For starters, I changed the facet pump thinking it was defective when it stopped working, but afterwards re-plumbing new fuel lines with a check valve and after Installing a new pump, I then realized the wire connector was the culprit of the pump stopping - the puno was fine but rather the wire and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump had 2 sets of cheap plastic push-on connectors that were 15 years old and landing on rough grass field, probably exacerbated the connection to finally malfunctioning, amongst oxidization and humidity, and quality of connector, etc.

Anyway today I went flying with the new bravex fuel pump, soon realizing the brand new bravex fuel pump stop working.

After I landed I was surprised to find out if I got a defective new pump. I then chased the wires and circuit of the auxiliary fuel pump one more, to then realized I noticed yet another cheap push on connect. I moved the last cheap connector that was part of this circuit around, at which point the new bravex fuel pump states to work again.

I will remove this last problematic connection and splice a straight through connection.

Could my ammeter needle be bouncing abruptly because of this (last) poor connection in the auxiliary pump circuit, or could that be a coincidence and the ammeter needle bouncing in the dial be tied towards something else?

If i don't turn on the newly installed pump, the needle doesn't bounce, but rather accurately measures total current in the entire electrical circuit of the plane.

When I turned on the auxiliary pump with the engine off, the needle also did not bounce around like crazy.

When I had the engine running more or less at idle, with the auxiliary pump on, the needle did not bounce around even then.

However, once I applied full throttle and got off the ground with the auxiliary pump on, the needle then started bouncing around back and forth like crazy.

I will be fixing the last connection issue tomorrow, but thought I'd reach out to you all for any advice.

Maybe once I fix the last connection problem within the auxiliary pump circuit, will the ammeter needle stop acting this way?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thank you!


Re: A MUST watch video of a Hanuman rebuild owned by Brent Dunphy

 

开云体育

What a beautiful looking plane!

Quite the head-turner.

Great job Brent!


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Monday, August 8, 2022 5:52:56 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: [XAIR] A MUST watch video of a Hanuman rebuild owned by Brent Dunphy
?





Who can think of a mallet joke to finish their video ?



After a long night at the bar, a man invites his friend to see his new apartment

The friend notices a large gong against the wall and asks, "What's with the gong?"

– "It's not a gong, it's a talking clock", he replies. He then picks up a mallet and hits the gong.


From the other side of the wall they both hear: "Shut the hell up! It's three in the morning for God's sake!"



-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


A MUST watch video of a Hanuman rebuild owned by Brent Dunphy

 

开云体育






Who can think of a mallet joke to finish their video ?



After a long night at the bar, a man invites his friend to see his new apartment

The friend notices a large gong against the wall and asks, "What's with the gong?"

– "It's not a gong, it's a talking clock", he replies. He then picks up a mallet and hits the gong.


From the other side of the wall they both hear: "Shut the hell up! It's three in the morning for God's sake!"



-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Hanuman bungee

 

So a total of 4 9044s is what you used?


?Kevin
Jul 28???
I replaced mine with two 9044 bungees per side. One each was a bit soft, two worked just fine.


Re: replacement engine

 

?
there have been a few different 912 mounts, randkar did have one but we had to design our own to pass the UK load tests especially torque requirements, I can let you have?the details I have?if you send me an email to xairireland@...
Seamus

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2022 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine

Hi Seamus,

Do you have any drawings or sketches with some measurements for the 912? My Xair (std) has been on a Jabiru since new. Managing the cht temps was a full time job, I tried many different duct mods and did manage to get below the 350°f but that was also using fuel cooling which carbons the engine and reduces performance. I am at the stage of fitting a new engine and the new Jabiru ones don't use the same mount, exhaust or prop flange also untested in out of cowl fitment so could have same?problem as current. Like most of the group there really isn't a good reliable engine like the 912 so that's where I am headed, just need any info on mounting.

My Xair has a cog of 12 from memory (away from home so can't look at my book to check) always flew very well tho fairly heavy on fuel because of the rich mixture. Mount was supplied by Jabiru but they don't make one for the new engines. I have been working with a LAME who thinks we can use existing mount frame and weld on the 912 firewall mount, apparently Randkar never made the mount although my assembly manual specifies one in the drawings. So that's where we are at the moment so any info would help.

Thanks

On Fri, 29 Jul 2022, 6:48 pm Seamus O'Donnell, <etronics@...> wrote:
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...






-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

Hi Seamus,

Do you have any drawings or sketches with some measurements for the 912? My Xair (std) has been on a Jabiru since new. Managing the cht temps was a full time job, I tried many different duct mods and did manage to get below the 350°f but that was also using fuel cooling which carbons the engine and reduces performance. I am at the stage of fitting a new engine and the new Jabiru ones don't use the same mount, exhaust or prop flange also untested in out of cowl fitment so could have same?problem as current. Like most of the group there really isn't a good reliable engine like the 912 so that's where I am headed, just need any info on mounting.

My Xair has a cog of 12 from memory (away from home so can't look at my book to check) always flew very well tho fairly heavy on fuel because of the rich mixture. Mount was supplied by Jabiru but they don't make one for the new engines. I have been working with a LAME who thinks we can use existing mount frame and weld on the 912 firewall mount, apparently Randkar never made the mount although my assembly manual specifies one in the drawings. So that's where we are at the moment so any info would help.

Thanks

On Fri, 29 Jul 2022, 6:48 pm Seamus O'Donnell, <etronics@...> wrote:
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...






-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee

 

开云体育

Hello Hank, basically the tooling has been worn out. It was a same with the 503. The cost of retooling was many millions of dollars and much more than the company could recover in years and years of sales so it just comes to a stage where it is unviable to continue.

Added to this probably 99 out of 100 engines that they sell at the moment are going to be the larger 4 stroke engines to suit the bigger aircraft we are now flying so I guess the market is just not there anymore.

It's not so much about the plans for the engine but it is the choice of materials that go into the production of the metal components. Knowing exactly what goes into what part and where it can be sourced from is probably the biggest difficulty for the company wanting to take over production of the two-stroke engines. I wish it was really easy but it isn't

Hank Optland wrote on 30/07/2022 11:42 am:
It would be really nice if Rotax sold (or gave away) their plans to a manufacturer who was prepared to re-start production of 582 or 618 motors.

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2022 10:38:51 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, the problem is when we are talking about all of these engines they are simply too heavy for the standard X-Air aircraft. You are limited in weight to the equivalent of the Rotax 618/582 series.

Any more weight than this requires setting the engine on the leading edge of the wing, adding weight into the rear of the aircraft and all other things which change the characteristics of a fantastic flying aeroplane (X-Air standard)

The ending of production of all of the Rotax two-stroke engines is a real issue for light aircraft manufacturers like X-Air unfortunately Because we lose a semi affordable but ultimately very reliable and suitable propulsion system.




Justin Gregoris wrote on 30/07/2022 12:41 am:
check out this new engine, like a rotax - ulpower.com. very interesting. UL260i.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of tdudet2000 via groups.io <tdudet2000@...>
Sent: July 29, 2022 1:46 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Group,?

on the?issue of a suitable alternative to the Rotax 582?for the X-air, has anyone considered the MZ202 by Compact Radial Engines (now Fiate)? It is advertised as a 63 go?bolt on replacement for the R582…..

?





Thank you for your comments

Tom Dudet



Le vendredi, juillet 29, 2022, 6:30 AM, Michael Coates <mcoates@...> a écrit?:

Hello Hank, that is the million-dollar question.....??? There are really no viable alternates....?? A lot of people mention the Hirth but in reality they just don't have the reliability and service record of the Rotax 582. The Jabiru 2.2 doesn't perform all that well on the original X-Air airframe which was always designed for the 582.

I guess we will just have to look for electric !



Hank Optland wrote on 29/07/2022 2:10 pm:
★ What will replace the two-stroke Rotax motors (no longer made) in the X-Airs?

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 1:58:00 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
They could have always done things differently in my opinion. The problem was the market also changed and tube and fabric aircraft were no longer The only option available to recreational flyers when composite aircraft started getting around. Added to this is now There are no longer Rotax two-stroke engines available and that makes it much harder to sell the standard models.....



Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:11 am:
I wonder if the marketing ads and campaigns were better with the X Air - they may have sold a lot more aircraft.

I've taken about 4 very experienced pilots wirh total flighr hours ranging from 1800-28,000hrs and all have said the same thing: the X Air comes across as a brittle 'paper airplane' but after flying it, is surprised with overall stability and engineering while keeping it in value packed design.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 8:08:11 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, yes I have also been sent photographs of the progress from the first day and he is doing a fantastic job. I have been holding off in posting the pictures in dribs and drabs and rather waiting until he has completely finished and then do a mass upload but you are more than welcome to send through anything that he has already sent you. It is really good to see the resources of X-Air owners and how they can approach things from a different perspective and make really significant improvements

Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:02 am:
Totally off topic, but If I'm allowed - I'll send everyone a bunch of pictures of this gentlemen's (Brent) Hanuman.

He purchased a 2009 X Air.

Completely stripped the plane - literally dismantled 98% of it. New covering, new Jabiru motor. New everything. New, modified landing gear, big tundra-like STOL tires. 3 bladed prop, list goes on. Then he also got a custom door builder to increase cabin width to 49 inches by installing bubble doors without any cross members. Looks high-end.

This airplane is by far the nicest looking X Air I have ever seen. Probably all input around 55,000$ CDN but I'm blown away how nice it is. Located in New Brunswick Canada.



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Kevin <k-ryan@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 7:20:57 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
I replaced mine with two 9044 bungees per side. One each was a bit soft, two worked just fine.


-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee

 

开云体育

It would be really nice if Rotax sold (or gave away) their plans to a manufacturer who was prepared to re-start production of 582 or 618 motors.

Get


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2022 10:38:51 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, the problem is when we are talking about all of these engines they are simply too heavy for the standard X-Air aircraft. You are limited in weight to the equivalent of the Rotax 618/582 series.

Any more weight than this requires setting the engine on the leading edge of the wing, adding weight into the rear of the aircraft and all other things which change the characteristics of a fantastic flying aeroplane (X-Air standard)

The ending of production of all of the Rotax two-stroke engines is a real issue for light aircraft manufacturers like X-Air unfortunately Because we lose a semi affordable but ultimately very reliable and suitable propulsion system.




Justin Gregoris wrote on 30/07/2022 12:41 am:
check out this new engine, like a rotax - ulpower.com. very interesting. UL260i.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of tdudet2000 via groups.io <tdudet2000@...>
Sent: July 29, 2022 1:46 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Group,?

on the?issue of a suitable alternative to the Rotax 582?for the X-air, has anyone considered the MZ202 by Compact Radial Engines (now Fiate)? It is advertised as a 63 go?bolt on replacement for the R582…..

?





Thank you for your comments

Tom Dudet



Le vendredi, juillet 29, 2022, 6:30 AM, Michael Coates <mcoates@...> a écrit?:

Hello Hank, that is the million-dollar question.....??? There are really no viable alternates....?? A lot of people mention the Hirth but in reality they just don't have the reliability and service record of the Rotax 582. The Jabiru 2.2 doesn't perform all that well on the original X-Air airframe which was always designed for the 582.

I guess we will just have to look for electric !



Hank Optland wrote on 29/07/2022 2:10 pm:
★ What will replace the two-stroke Rotax motors (no longer made) in the X-Airs?

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 1:58:00 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
They could have always done things differently in my opinion. The problem was the market also changed and tube and fabric aircraft were no longer The only option available to recreational flyers when composite aircraft started getting around. Added to this is now There are no longer Rotax two-stroke engines available and that makes it much harder to sell the standard models.....



Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:11 am:
I wonder if the marketing ads and campaigns were better with the X Air - they may have sold a lot more aircraft.

I've taken about 4 very experienced pilots wirh total flighr hours ranging from 1800-28,000hrs and all have said the same thing: the X Air comes across as a brittle 'paper airplane' but after flying it, is surprised with overall stability and engineering while keeping it in value packed design.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 8:08:11 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, yes I have also been sent photographs of the progress from the first day and he is doing a fantastic job. I have been holding off in posting the pictures in dribs and drabs and rather waiting until he has completely finished and then do a mass upload but you are more than welcome to send through anything that he has already sent you. It is really good to see the resources of X-Air owners and how they can approach things from a different perspective and make really significant improvements

Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:02 am:
Totally off topic, but If I'm allowed - I'll send everyone a bunch of pictures of this gentlemen's (Brent) Hanuman.

He purchased a 2009 X Air.

Completely stripped the plane - literally dismantled 98% of it. New covering, new Jabiru motor. New everything. New, modified landing gear, big tundra-like STOL tires. 3 bladed prop, list goes on. Then he also got a custom door builder to increase cabin width to 49 inches by installing bubble doors without any cross members. Looks high-end.

This airplane is by far the nicest looking X Air I have ever seen. Probably all input around 55,000$ CDN but I'm blown away how nice it is. Located in New Brunswick Canada.



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Kevin <k-ryan@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 7:20:57 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
I replaced mine with two 9044 bungees per side. One each was a bit soft, two worked just fine.


-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee

 

开云体育

Hello Justin, the problem is when we are talking about all of these engines they are simply too heavy for the standard X-Air aircraft. You are limited in weight to the equivalent of the Rotax 618/582 series.

Any more weight than this requires setting the engine on the leading edge of the wing, adding weight into the rear of the aircraft and all other things which change the characteristics of a fantastic flying aeroplane (X-Air standard)

The ending of production of all of the Rotax two-stroke engines is a real issue for light aircraft manufacturers like X-Air unfortunately Because we lose a semi affordable but ultimately very reliable and suitable propulsion system.




Justin Gregoris wrote on 30/07/2022 12:41 am:
check out this new engine, like a rotax - ulpower.com. very interesting. UL260i.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of tdudet2000 via groups.io <tdudet2000@...>
Sent: July 29, 2022 1:46 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Group,?

on the?issue of a suitable alternative to the Rotax 582?for the X-air, has anyone considered the MZ202 by Compact Radial Engines (now Fiate)? It is advertised as a 63 go?bolt on replacement for the R582…..

?





Thank you for your comments

Tom Dudet



Le vendredi, juillet 29, 2022, 6:30 AM, Michael Coates <mcoates@...> a écrit?:

Hello Hank, that is the million-dollar question.....??? There are really no viable alternates....?? A lot of people mention the Hirth but in reality they just don't have the reliability and service record of the Rotax 582. The Jabiru 2.2 doesn't perform all that well on the original X-Air airframe which was always designed for the 582.

I guess we will just have to look for electric !



Hank Optland wrote on 29/07/2022 2:10 pm:
★ What will replace the two-stroke Rotax motors (no longer made) in the X-Airs?

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 1:58:00 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
They could have always done things differently in my opinion. The problem was the market also changed and tube and fabric aircraft were no longer The only option available to recreational flyers when composite aircraft started getting around. Added to this is now There are no longer Rotax two-stroke engines available and that makes it much harder to sell the standard models.....



Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:11 am:
I wonder if the marketing ads and campaigns were better with the X Air - they may have sold a lot more aircraft.

I've taken about 4 very experienced pilots wirh total flighr hours ranging from 1800-28,000hrs and all have said the same thing: the X Air comes across as a brittle 'paper airplane' but after flying it, is surprised with overall stability and engineering while keeping it in value packed design.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 8:08:11 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, yes I have also been sent photographs of the progress from the first day and he is doing a fantastic job. I have been holding off in posting the pictures in dribs and drabs and rather waiting until he has completely finished and then do a mass upload but you are more than welcome to send through anything that he has already sent you. It is really good to see the resources of X-Air owners and how they can approach things from a different perspective and make really significant improvements

Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:02 am:
Totally off topic, but If I'm allowed - I'll send everyone a bunch of pictures of this gentlemen's (Brent) Hanuman.

He purchased a 2009 X Air.

Completely stripped the plane - literally dismantled 98% of it. New covering, new Jabiru motor. New everything. New, modified landing gear, big tundra-like STOL tires. 3 bladed prop, list goes on. Then he also got a custom door builder to increase cabin width to 49 inches by installing bubble doors without any cross members. Looks high-end.

This airplane is by far the nicest looking X Air I have ever seen. Probably all input around 55,000$ CDN but I'm blown away how nice it is. Located in New Brunswick Canada.



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Kevin <k-ryan@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 7:20:57 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
I replaced mine with two 9044 bungees per side. One each was a bit soft, two worked just fine.


-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

it is going to help but not of the airframe design is limited to a lower number. For example if the aircraft was originally rated at 450 kg maximum takeoff weight then having a 600 kg limit is not going to help that particular aircraft because it is not going to be able to be flown at anything more than the design certification.

Brian Ellis via groups.io wrote on 29/07/2022 10:28 pm:
The lift to up to 600kg may solve the weight issue?


On 29 Jul 2022, at 13:25, Brian Ellis <bellis2uk@...> wrote:

? Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4 cylinder) are currently flying in the uk?


On 29 Jul 2022, at 11:48, Seamus O'Donnell <etronics@...> wrote:

?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

Ulpower.com

Look a like Rotax motors?


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of NOLTON BEALE via groups.io <nonobeale@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 10:14:53 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine
?
What about a Viking 90?

On Jul 29, 2022, at 4:11 AM, Hank Optland <scorchedenvelope@...> wrote:

?
I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?




Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Jonathan Webb <avia1or01@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 8:45:13 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine
?

I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee

 

开云体育

check out this new engine, like a rotax - ulpower.com. very interesting. UL260i.


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of tdudet2000 via groups.io <tdudet2000@...>
Sent: July 29, 2022 1:46 AM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re?: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Group,?

on the?issue of a suitable alternative to the Rotax 582?for the X-air, has anyone considered the MZ202 by Compact Radial Engines (now Fiate)? It is advertised as a 63 go?bolt on replacement for the R582…..

?





Thank you for your comments

Tom Dudet



Le vendredi, juillet 29, 2022, 6:30 AM, Michael Coates <mcoates@...> a écrit?:

Hello Hank, that is the million-dollar question.....??? There are really no viable alternates....?? A lot of people mention the Hirth but in reality they just don't have the reliability and service record of the Rotax 582. The Jabiru 2.2 doesn't perform all that well on the original X-Air airframe which was always designed for the 582.

I guess we will just have to look for electric !



Hank Optland wrote on 29/07/2022 2:10 pm:
★ What will replace the two-stroke Rotax motors (no longer made) in the X-Airs?

Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 1:58:00 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
They could have always done things differently in my opinion. The problem was the market also changed and tube and fabric aircraft were no longer The only option available to recreational flyers when composite aircraft started getting around. Added to this is now There are no longer Rotax two-stroke engines available and that makes it much harder to sell the standard models.....



Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:11 am:
I wonder if the marketing ads and campaigns were better with the X Air - they may have sold a lot more aircraft.

I've taken about 4 very experienced pilots wirh total flighr hours ranging from 1800-28,000hrs and all have said the same thing: the X Air comes across as a brittle 'paper airplane' but after flying it, is surprised with overall stability and engineering while keeping it in value packed design.

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Michael Coates <mcoates@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 8:08:11 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
Hello Justin, yes I have also been sent photographs of the progress from the first day and he is doing a fantastic job. I have been holding off in posting the pictures in dribs and drabs and rather waiting until he has completely finished and then do a mass upload but you are more than welcome to send through anything that he has already sent you. It is really good to see the resources of X-Air owners and how they can approach things from a different perspective and make really significant improvements

Justin Gregoris wrote on 29/07/2022 10:02 am:
Totally off topic, but If I'm allowed - I'll send everyone a bunch of pictures of this gentlemen's (Brent) Hanuman.

He purchased a 2009 X Air.

Completely stripped the plane - literally dismantled 98% of it. New covering, new Jabiru motor. New everything. New, modified landing gear, big tundra-like STOL tires. 3 bladed prop, list goes on. Then he also got a custom door builder to increase cabin width to 49 inches by installing bubble doors without any cross members. Looks high-end.

This airplane is by far the nicest looking X Air I have ever seen. Probably all input around 55,000$ CDN but I'm blown away how nice it is. Located in New Brunswick Canada.



From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Kevin <k-ryan@...>
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 7:20:57 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] Hanuman bungee
?
I replaced mine with two 9044 bungees per side. One each was a bit soft, two worked just fine.


-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

What about a Viking 90?

On Jul 29, 2022, at 4:11 AM, Hank Optland <scorchedenvelope@...> wrote:

?
I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?




Get

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Jonathan Webb <avia1or01@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 8:45:13 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine
?

I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

I think that Aeromomentum engine looks like a fine option. It’s a little heavier than the Rotax 912 I believe but could still work. The thing about the X-Air standard (much preferred over the X-Air F in my view) is that it’s designed to fly relatively slowly so adding bags of power might make it more economical but not necessarily any quicker. For this reason a reliable and less expensive 4 stroke option to the Rotax 582 only is surely worth considering. As Michael Coates once stated, the absolutely best fit for the standard X-Air is the 75Hp Rotax 618. Although not produced any more - you can still find newly rebuilt 618 motors on Barnstormers and several that I know of have gone for well over 1000 hours fault free if set up properly. It’s a peach of an engine. ?????????

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Hank Optland
Sent: Friday, 29 July 2022 11:12
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine

?

I wonder if a 90 hp "Viking 90" motor (stated weight 72 kg) or an 85 hp "Aeromomentum AM10" (63 kg) could be considered?

?

?

?

?

Get


From: [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf of Jonathan Webb <avia1or01@...>
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 8:45:13 PM
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine

?


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan


On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:

Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !





Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:

Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!

?


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





-- 
With regards,??? Michael Coates
?
AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237
?
?
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017
?
mailto:mcoates@...
?
skype name:?? xcomavionics
?
Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.? Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.
?
Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.
?
"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."

?


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

The lift to up to 600kg may solve the weight issue?


On 29 Jul 2022, at 13:25, Brian Ellis <bellis2uk@...> wrote:

?Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4 cylinder) are currently flying in the uk?


On 29 Jul 2022, at 11:48, Seamus O'Donnell <etronics@...> wrote:

?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





-- 
With regards,    Michael Coates

AU +61 7 5522 0583
USA +1 213 984 1237


PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2012
Winner of the EAA August Raspet Award 2012
PIPISTREL AIRCRAFT DEALER OF THE YEAR 2017

mailto:mcoates@...

skype name:   xcomavionics

Please note: because of the volume of e-mail we are now receiving our replies are
done using voice recognition software in an effort to speed up the reply process. 
Sometimes the voice recognition program inserts silly words or doesn't actually
do what it is meant to do.  Occasionally these mistakes get through our quick
proofreading of each e-mail sent, so please accept my apologies if the odd mistake
gets through.

Legal Notice: The information contained in this email is confidential
and intended only to be read by the person(s) to whom it is addressed.
No one is authorized to copy, use, disclose, distribute or rely on this
information for any purpose whatsoever. If this communication has been
sent to you in error, please email the sender and delete the message.

"Amateurs practice till they get it right;
Professionals practice till they can’t get it wrong."


Re: replacement engine

 

开云体育

Might be interesting to find out just how many D Motors (4 cylinder) are currently flying in the uk?


On 29 Jul 2022, at 11:48, Seamus O'Donnell <etronics@...> wrote:

?
your performance with the 912 is not that good, you are flying at?a very high rpm,?the?one I built years ago cruised at 4200 55kts never burned more than 12 litres and was also using the DUC prop, have you tried changing pitch on prop
weight and CG is important and the?majority of the UK xairs have a very forward CG, all xairs no matter which engine fitted fly much better with an aft CG and especially the falcon which was never as good as the standard xair
?Seamus
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 29, 2022 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [XAIR] replacement engine


I have an X-Air F? ( Falcon in the UK ) with Rotax 912 and it works very well.? Performance is no greater than a 2 stroke but much greater reliability. Theoretically it should use less fuel but mine burns around 14 litres an hour. Previous owner said it burnt 12 litres an hour . The difference might be because I fitted heated carb bodies when I bought it to prevent carb ice.

If attachments work there is a photo of the engine installation attached.? The Engine mount is special for the 912 and the forward engine struts are shortened.

There are some weight concerns. Mine was the development aircraft and has lightweight wheels, floor and originally had a smaller single tank.

It now has double tanks ( 55 Litres )? and as I fly alone a long range tank with another 20 litres, so now aircraft endurance is far greater than pilot endurance !! - more than 5 hours.

In the UK there are a couple flying with the D-motor which seems an interesting combination.? The only thing I don't like with the 912 is flying with high revs ( cruise 4800-5000 rpm ) which makes for a noisy cockpit although a recent Bose A20 has improved the situation. The D-Motor , like the Jabiru flies with half the revs so would be more comfortable but for me reliability is the No consideration.? I like the D Motor but would want to wait a few years to see how the reliability is before flying with one.


Regards,

Jonathan



On 29/07/2022 10:13, Michael Coates wrote:
Too heavy for the X-Air Standard....??? They own the X-Air Airframe as their test bed but cant use it because of the weight etc....???? However it looks promising !






Clive Cunningham wrote on 29/07/2022 5:27 pm:
Keep an eye on Radial Motion. 3 cyl air cooled radial engine being made in Australia. Looks like a winner!


Clive Cunningham

K&M HD Motorcycles

U2 5-9 Kingston Ave?

Richmond?

South Australia 5033??

Ph +61 8? 8234 1090?

kmmotor@...

kmmotorcycles.com.au





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