|
Hi there, I
am new to this and want to set myself up with what Im likely to need to get stuck into this hobby. ?I’m on a budget.?
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
many thanks,
Heather
--
Heather Carpet Daemon
|
Hi, Heather, and welcome! May i assume you are female? If so, even better, as we have very few (only one that post regularly, Tamra).
You questions are a bit broad. Would help if you described what kind of work you wish to do with the Unimat.
Also, which Unimat do you have?
For instance, as far as collets are concerned, there are the very small watchmaker collets that require a different spindle.
But the "regular" collets come in different size series. You can get holders for these aftermarket or OEM. The aftermarket ones are cheap, but vary in usability. Some who have bought aftermarket holders had to work on them to get them to run true on the Unimat.
OEM ones will fit the machine readily and be accurate, but are generally only available on eBay, so that often means pricey.
Since I assume from your email you are in the UK, someone else will have to advise about cut-offs.
Martin P.
-----Original Message-----
Hi there, I
am new to this and want to set myself up with what Im likely to need to get stuck into this hobby. ?I’m on a budget.?
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
many thanks,
Heather
--
Heather Carpet Daemon
|
On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote:
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather, My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs. As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? https://www.nogginend.com/? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below: For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining. For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining. For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters. The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different! All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make? You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out. Keith
|
Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part.
I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL.
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09, Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io <ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote:
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather, My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs. As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? https://www.nogginend.com/? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below: For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining. For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining. For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters. The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different! All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make? You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out. Keith
|
I would back up the recommendations to set yourself up with an ER16 collet system. I have one on my Unimat SL and I use it a lot. ? I have the ER16 collets from Arc Euro Trade and have found these good and not too pricey. Others have bought cheaper ‘no name’ collets from eBay and have found more variable results. The Arc ones can be bought as a set. There are more than ten in a set because the smaller sizes go up in half millimetre increments. ? Arc also do a collet holder but this needs to be mounted on a separate backplate. This is what I have but I can’t recommend this product for someone who is learning because the backplate requires machining before it can be used. ? I’ve found that offcuts of extruded aluminium strip/angle seem to mill OK but otherwise I’d back up the advice to steer clear of ‘repurposed’ unknown metals or buying low grade bar/strip etc from the DIY sheds. ? Regards, Andy ?
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Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Alfred Fickensher
Sent: 19 March 2020 02:34
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unimat] Milling and collets? Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part. I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL. <<>> ?
On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09, Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io <ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote: Which Collets should I buy?? which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather,
My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs.
As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? ? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below:
For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining.
For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining.
For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters.
The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different!
All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make?
You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out.
Keith
|
Hi guys,?
I can recommend the purchase of an RCM Machines collet holder. I bought one, second hand, for less than the going price with P&P on eB@y. They don't turn up often.?
I bought Chinese collets for a song and so far they have been good. I have not really pushed them yet. They grip both drills and milling cutters well.?
I returned to machining after a break of about 35 years and found my SL does most that I ask of it.?
Cheers? James, Fife, UK? Sent from my Sony Xperia on the hoof
This email contains recycled electrons
I would back up the recommendations to set yourself up with an ER16 collet system. I have one on my Unimat SL and I use it a lot. ? I have the ER16 collets from Arc Euro Trade and have found these good and not too pricey. Others have bought cheaper ‘no name’ collets from eBay and have found more variable results. The Arc ones can be bought as a set. There are more than ten in a set because the smaller sizes go up in half millimetre increments. ? Arc also do a collet holder but this needs to be mounted on a separate backplate. This is what I have but I can’t recommend this product for someone who is learning because the backplate requires machining before it can be used. ? I’ve found that offcuts of extruded aluminium strip/angle seem to mill OK but otherwise I’d back up the advice to steer clear of ‘repurposed’ unknown metals or buying low grade bar/strip etc from the DIY sheds. ? Regards, Andy ? ? Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part. I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL. <<>> ?
On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09, Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io <ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote: Which Collets should I buy?? which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather,
My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs.
As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? ? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below:
For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining.
For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining.
For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters.
The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different!
All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make?
You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out.
Keith
--
James Batchelor?
Dunfermline, Fife, UK.?
07805 207238
|
Hi all, I’ve also dealt, once, with RC Machines. The ER16 collet chuck came with .004” runout. No response from customer service. Only a $90-$100 tool, so I’m not out much. But I won’t do business with them ever again.
Great advice about materials and cutting tools. Heather, that’ll save you a lot of time along the learning curve.
On Wednesday, March 18, 2020, 7:33 PM, Alfred Fickensher <alfickjr@...> wrote: Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part.
I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL.
<<>> On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09, Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io <ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote:
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather, My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs. As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? https://www.nogginend.com/? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below: For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining. For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining. For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters. The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different! All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make? You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out. Keith
|
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 02:33 AM, Alfred Fickensher wrote:
Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part.
?
I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL.
?
Also available with 14 mm thread for the Unimat 3, 4 and Basic/PC. (Beyond that I know nothing about them.)
|
Hi everyone,?
thank you for your advice. I’ve followed it - and had a great chat with Chris at RGD Tools about milling cutters. I’ll post photos of my purchases - end mills for ?Chris, a collet chuck and a set of collets, and some materials. Thanks again! H
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Show quoted text
On 19 Mar 2020, at 02:09, ksangus via [] <ksangus=btopenworld.com@[]> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote:
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather, My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs. As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? https://www.nogginend.com/? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below: For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining. For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining. For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters. The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different! All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make? You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out. Keith
--
Heather Carpet Daemon?
|
Hi Heather, what are you going to make?? I pretend to make scale miniatures - generally working in 1/12th scale.... I generally work in brass on my unimat...
Welcome to the group!
I chased down the WW Spindle, and actually found one in my state at an antique store. (I just had to have one!) Since it was kinda expensive, I wanted to see it in person before the purchase, it was about 100+ miles from home, but getting collets for the WW Spindle is another story... so purchasing an option manufactured today is a less frustrating option.? I was told not to do this, but had to have the WW Spindle.
I don't think I would be happy with .004 runout, I would always be questioning if it is the equipment or me?? ?The downside of learning what precision machining is, is that after you get to a certain skill level, you want it to be precise!
Tamra
|
Hi
Gang:
The
runout is something that can be fixed. Most lathe chucks come
with a mounting plate that you machine on your lathe.
I
would inspect first your lathe's spindle to make sure it runs
true and has no burrs. Then check the bore and mounting face
of the collet holder. Install the holder on the spindle with
the nut out and no collet. This should be a smooth and easy
assembly. If anything binds check again for burrs. Then use
your indicator to check the tapered bore for runout.
If
there is too much runout, mark the holder in quarters. Make a
note of where the indicator reads high and carefully use a
sharpening stone to reduce that side of the mounting space. Be aware
that a 0.001" removed from the face will change the runout
0.002" so be gentle. I like to coat the face I'm "stoning"
with magic marker so I can watch as I remove the material.
Repeat the process until you are happy with the results. Also
know that you can't get a runout better than the spindle. This
is how I corrected the ER-32 collet holder I made for my
Unimat.
Actually
a 0.004" runout isn't too bad for a first install. Just
0.002" off the face should fix it.
Good
luck, Carl.
On 3/19/2020 1:03 AM, james Pineda via
Groups.Io wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi all,
I’ve also dealt, once, with RC Machines. The ER16 collet
chuck came with .004” runout. No response from customer service.
Only a $90-$100 tool, so I’m not out much. But I won’t do
business with them ever again.
Great advice about materials and cutting tools. Heather,
that’ll save you a lot of time along the learning curve.
On Wednesday, March
18, 2020, 7:33 PM, Alfred Fickensher
<alfickjr@...> wrote:
Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then
bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch
Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does
everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked
up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise
for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail
part.
I had and still have ill feelings about their
customer relations attitude and payment policies but
then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase
one at that. There might well be some cultural
differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless
of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend
their collet holder for the Unimat SL.
<<>>
alf,
On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09,
Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io
<ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM,
<hcamalcolm@...> wrote:
Which Collets should I buy??
which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium
and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather,
My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap
but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting
holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck
of the draw whether you can find a decent one on
sale, but it leads back to the question of which
Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with
it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even
what the bits are called, look at the instructions
in the Files section, They will also give you an
idea of what sort of work you can do with these
machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than
6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small -
I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to
try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5
mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range
of jobs.
As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin
End Metals (? ? ). They
have the advantage that they know what grades they
are selling, including the ones listed below:
For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade.
It cuts easy and will do for most things until you
need to be really fussy about strength or finish.
There is a huge range of steels and some of them
are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically
formulated for easy machining.
For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass
and is generally reckoned to be the easiest
material to machine. Like steels, there are many
grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free
machining.
For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good
grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have
guessed by now there are innumerable grades of
aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and
clog up the cutters.
The best machining plastic is acetal (also known
as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look
and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but
cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to
glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex)
and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp
cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating.
Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when
it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly
grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes
to machining - acrylic is just different!
All this applies to milling and turning. What are
you hoping to make?
You will have lots of questions to start with -
just ask - like we all had to when we started out.
Keith
|
Hello
Tamra:
I saw
loads of WW collets at Cabin Fever this February. It is a
great machine show if you can get there. I've gone four times
and have always found something interesting to see. It is in
Lebanon PA.
Carl.
PS:
for the best runout you grind the collet taper on the machine
after mounting it. csb.
On 3/19/2020 9:46 AM, Tamra wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi Heather, what are you going to make?? I pretend to make scale
miniatures - generally working in 1/12th scale.... I generally
work in brass on my unimat...
Welcome to the group!
I chased down the WW Spindle, and actually found one in my state
at an antique store. (I just had to have one!) Since it was kinda
expensive, I wanted to see it in person before the purchase, it
was about 100+ miles from home, but getting collets for the WW
Spindle is another story... so purchasing an option manufactured
today is a less frustrating option.? I was told not to do this,
but had to have the WW Spindle.
I don't think I would be happy with .004 runout, I would always be
questioning if it is the equipment or me?? ?The downside of
learning what precision machining is, is that after you get to a
certain skill level, you want it to be precise!
Tamra
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Altho it sounds as if Heather is currently a newby, when I replied about my collet holder from Luxembourg I really didn't know her future tolerance needs. Depending on her intentions the RCM holder like mine may or may not be adequate. I notice that someone mentioned he wasn't satisfied with the runout of his.
I haven't checked the runout on mine nor does it bother me. The things I make for my railroad modeling aren't critical. So long as my old eyes can't readily see a wobble and the part fits, it works.
I am attaching a couple photos of my most recent parts, aluminum internally threaded bushings for mounting passenger car trucks to the car underframes. It's fairly obvious that there are no serious tolerance issues there. I am not sure if photos will stay with the posting here on IO but we shall see.
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On Mar 19, 2020, at 02:40, Andy Carlson <andycarlson@...> wrote:
? I would back up the recommendations to set yourself up with an ER16 collet system. I have one on my Unimat SL and I use it a lot. ? I have the ER16 collets from Arc Euro Trade and have found these good and not too pricey. Others have bought cheaper ‘no name’ collets from eBay and have found more variable results. The Arc ones can be bought as a set. There are more than ten in a set because the smaller sizes go up in half millimetre increments. ? Arc also do a collet holder but this needs to be mounted on a separate backplate. This is what I have but I can’t recommend this product for someone who is learning because the backplate requires machining before it can be used. ? I’ve found that offcuts of extruded aluminium strip/angle seem to mill OK but otherwise I’d back up the advice to steer clear of ‘repurposed’ unknown metals or buying low grade bar/strip etc from the DIY sheds. ? Regards, Andy ? ? Heather, etal, a year ago I bought this one. I then bought a set of 1-10 metric and a set of 1/32 - 3/8 inch Chinese collets for it. As a novice I have found it does everything I've wanted it to do so far. I've even chucked up a collet in it and used it as a very handy hand vise for some file shaping of a brass rod for a model rr detail part. I had and still have ill feelings about their customer relations attitude and payment policies but then I'm just a one-time customer and a small-purchase one at that. There might well be some cultural differences as well that I didn't recognize. Regardless of how I feel about them as a business, I can recommend their collet holder for the Unimat SL. <<>> ?
On Mar 18, 2020, at 21:09, Keith S. Angus via Groups.Io <ksangus@...> wrote:
?On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 05:57 PM, <hcamalcolm@...> wrote: Which Collets should I buy?? which milling cutters should I buy??
what’s a good source of offcuts if aluminium and brass that I can practice on??
Welcome Heather,
My recommendation is to use ER16 collets. Cheap but accurate ones can be had from China. Getting holders for them is more difficult. It's the luck of the draw whether you can find a decent one on sale, but it leads back to the question of which Unimat do you have, and what accessories came with it? If you're not sure what you've got, or even what the bits are called, look at the instructions in the Files section, They will also give you an idea of what sort of work you can do with these machines. For milling cutters don't go bigger than 6 mm (1/4"). Cutters can go down to really small - I've seen 0.2 mm diameter but I've never dared to try one. I suggest an assortment around 3, 4, 5 mm, and with 2, 3, or 4 flutes will suit a range of jobs.
As for metals I suggest, as one example, Noggin End Metals (? ? ). They have the advantage that they know what grades they are selling, including the ones listed below:
For steel use EN1A, which is a free cutting grade. It cuts easy and will do for most things until you need to be really fussy about strength or finish. There is a huge range of steels and some of them are a nightmare to machine. EN1A is specifically formulated for easy machining.
For brass you want CZ121, which is a hard brass and is generally reckoned to be the easiest material to machine. Like steels, there are many grades of brass, but CZ121 is the most free machining.
For aluminium 6082 (also known as HE30) is a good grade. It machines cleanly. As you may have guessed by now there are innumerable grades of aluminium alloys, but many of them are soft and clog up the cutters.
The best machining plastic is acetal (also known as Delrin). It machines cleanly and has the look and feel of Nylon (which is a pain to machine but cheaper). It is low friction and difficult to glue. You may want to machine acrylic (Perspex) and it's not too bad, but you need very sharp cutters and gentle cuts to avoid it overheating. Acrylic is unlike almost all other plastics when it comes to machining. Plastics are broadly grouped as Hard, Soft & Acrylic when it comes to machining - acrylic is just different!
All this applies to milling and turning. What are you hoping to make?
You will have lots of questions to start with - just ask - like we all had to when we started out.
Keith
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Thank you again everyone.
?I’ll get back to you when my stuff arrives, and I’m feeling up to getting the lathe together.
And hi to James from Dunfermline from an ex-pat Fifer from Leven.?
--
Heather Carpet Daemon
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Hi Alfred,
That is nice work you do on your model trains.
Can you suggest a good book or two on model train scratch building? It looks like an interesting hobby.
Dick
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Oh wow! Well yes I can recommend a fantastic book for learning about railroad modeling, 304 fantastic books actually and all on one DVD. It is the entire 26 year run of MAINLINE MODELER MAGAZINE scanned in searchable PDF format.
Every issue of MM contained modeling information that always was based on actual prototype railroad drawings and photos. Literally multi-hundreds of articles about working with styrene, and scores about working with brass.
MM essentially explained the prototype and how it can be modeled.
For years I bought the magazine and kept every one till this DVD came along. I willingly paid $250 for this DVD and then sold off my paper magazines. I note that now they have reduced the price way below what I paid a few years ago.
<<>>
alf,
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On Mar 22, 2020, at 15:43, OldToolmaker via Groups.Io <old_toolmaker@...> wrote:
?Hi Alfred,
That is nice work you do on your model trains.
Can you suggest a good book or two on model train scratch building? It looks like an interesting hobby.
Dick
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What is the quality of these scans? ?I have seen some scanned material (from other sources) that was not that great. (Some were quite fuzzy).
Not being critical here- just asking.
Dick
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The website offers a sample issue. It looks pretty good to me.
https://chessieshop.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=127_130&products_id=3291
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I viewed the sample and agree it looks good. ?A few years ago I purchased a two disk set of ?Model Engineers Workshop scans from EBay and some were very clear and some were a little fuzzy. That is why I asked the question.
Dick
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James Batchelor
Tamra
Carl
OldToolmaker