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Instruction review

 

Good morning. Our ARES group was exercising APRS group messaging during our recent Blizzard Warning. Most of them are using phone apps (APRSDroid, APRSfi, APRSPro), and I am working on an instructional document for APRS including:

- Winlink pending mail notification
- SMS texting
- Group messaging

Are there features beyond these 3 to include? Are there corrections or clarifications to the attachment?

I am not being exhaustive (such as instructions for send/receiving WINLINK via APRS). Just trying to get operators to expand their APRS functionality & use, especially considering their limitations for being on phones.

I would be interested in reviews of the attachment for accuracy & clarity.

Thank you.

Joe, KC0NOX

APRS Special Features.docx
APRS Special Features.docx

 

Please include PinPoint ?

Hello
George Kirn had contact with this data.


On Mon, Jan 13, 2025 at 11:10?AM Joe Dietrick via groups.io <kc0nox=
[email protected]> wrote:

Good morning. Our ARES group was exercising APRS group messaging during
our recent Blizzard Warning. Most of them are using phone apps (APRSDroid,
APRSfi, APRSPro), and I am working on an instructional document for APRS
including:

- Winlink pending mail notification
- SMS texting
- Group messaging

Are there features beyond these 3 to include? Are there corrections or
clarifications to the attachment?

I am not being exhaustive (such as instructions for send/receiving WINLINK
via APRS). Just trying to get operators to expand their APRS functionality
& use, especially considering their limitations for being on phones.

I would be interested in reviews of the attachment for accuracy & clarity.

Thank you.

Joe, KC0NOX
 

On 1/13/2025 11:22 AM, Joe Dietrick via groups.io wrote:
Good morning. Our ARES group was exercising APRS group messaging during our recent Blizzard Warning. Most of them are using phone apps (APRSDroid, APRSfi, APRSPro), and I am working on an instructional document for APRS including:

- Winlink pending mail notification
- SMS texting
- Group messaging

Are there features beyond these 3 to include? Are there corrections or clarifications to the attachment?
I am not being exhaustive (such as instructions for send/receiving WINLINK via APRS). Just trying to get operators to expand their APRS functionality & use, especially considering their limitations for being on phones.
I would be interested in reviews of the attachment for accuracy & clarity.
Thank you.

Joe, KC0NOX
?1)??? Documents being distributed to unknown recipients should NOT be in the format of a single proprietary program; i.e. Microsoft Word .DOCX? format.? You can't simply assume everyone can open a DOCX document, especially on a phone or tablet.

They should be in a platform-agnostic format like a simple text file,? or a PDF document that can be opened on any platform.


2)??? Conspicuously absent here is any reference to *RADIO* !!

First and foremost, APRS is about data sent over RADIO.? The interfaces to the Internet are the tail wagging the dog. If you are using only phone apps and no radio, why get APRS involved at all???? If radio is NOT involved, there are much more efficient ways to communicate text and data than APRS protocols, such as text messages and email.


3)??? It's not clear how WinLink is involved with APRS at all. APRS and WinLink are both applications that that ride on top of packet radio for data transport, but they are separate from each other.? Winlink can use classic packet protocols, but it can also use Pactor, VARA or other data transmission modes as the transport medium.? I.e. the message is separate from the transmission medium.


4)??? if the majority of your users are only using phone apps, they are digging themselves deeper and deeper into the tar baby of? cellular/Internet dependency, which has a high chance of being NOT FUNCTIONAL after a major disaster.

Some of these phone apps (APRSdroid, PocketPACKET, etc) can use the phone's sound system as a soft TNC for 300- or 1200-baud packet. [I have actually linked an iPad to a Yaesu FT-857 for VHF/HF packet and APRS. It does work!] ? You need to focus on how to connect the phone "soft modems" to RADIOs, not the Internet.....


5)?? This sort of brings to mind an actual experience I had as a radio systems engineer decades ago with disaster planning in Los Angeles county.? We were gaming out disaster comms scenarios for the City and County of Los Angeles after the "Big One" (the anticipated 8.0+ earthquake).? This was before cellular networks became ubiquitous - the issue was the relative surviveability of the public land-line phone network vs the fire and police public safety radio networks.?? A representative of the County Board of Supervisors came up with this brilliant response plan:? "If the phones go out, we'll use the FAX"? !!!??? NOTE: These are the organizations dealing with the current fires there...


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephen H. Smith??? wa8lmf (at) aol.com
Skype:??????? WA8LMF
EchoLink:? Node #? 14400? [Think bottom of the 2-meter band]
Home Page:

New? 30 Meter?? APRS-over VARA? Frequency
As of 1 Jan 2025.?? Details Here:
<>

- APRS over VARA? --
<>

"Studio B" Ham Shack on Wheels
<>

-
 

well,
Best 2025 to all users of Uiview .

One of the Best if not the Best and simple to use but it cannot be updated!!

i tried other software and i always come back to it!

Simple and it works!

73 everyone

gervais,ve2ckn
________________________________
De : [email protected] <[email protected]> de la part de WA8LMF via groups.io <wa8lmf@...>
Envoyé : 13 janvier 2025 13:00
? : [email protected] <[email protected]>
Objet : Re: [UI-View] Instruction review

On 1/13/2025 11:22 AM, Joe Dietrick via groups.io wrote:
Good morning. Our ARES group was exercising APRS group messaging during our recent Blizzard Warning. Most of them are using phone apps (APRSDroid, APRSfi, APRSPro), and I am working on an instructional document for APRS including:

- Winlink pending mail notification
- SMS texting
- Group messaging

Are there features beyond these 3 to include? Are there corrections or clarifications to the attachment?

I am not being exhaustive (such as instructions for send/receiving WINLINK via APRS). Just trying to get operators to expand their APRS functionality & use, especially considering their limitations for being on phones.

I would be interested in reviews of the attachment for accuracy & clarity.

Thank you.

Joe, KC0NOX
1) Documents being distributed to unknown recipients should NOT be in the
format of a single proprietary program; i.e. Microsoft Word .DOCX format. You
can't simply assume everyone can open a DOCX document, especially on a phone or
tablet.

They should be in a platform-agnostic format like a simple text file, or a PDF
document that can be opened on any platform.


2) Conspicuously absent here is any reference to *RADIO* !!

First and foremost, APRS is about data sent over RADIO. The interfaces to the
Internet are the tail wagging the dog. If you are using only phone apps and no
radio, why get APRS involved at all? If radio is NOT involved, there are
much more efficient ways to communicate text and data than APRS protocols, such
as text messages and email.


3) It's not clear how WinLink is involved with APRS at all. APRS and WinLink
are both applications that that ride on top of packet radio for data transport,
but they are separate from each other. Winlink can use classic packet
protocols, but it can also use Pactor, VARA or other data transmission modes as
the transport medium. I.e. the message is separate from the transmission medium.


4) if the majority of your users are only using phone apps, they are digging
themselves deeper and deeper into the tar baby of cellular/Internet
dependency, which has a high chance of being NOT FUNCTIONAL after a major
disaster.

Some of these phone apps (APRSdroid, PocketPACKET, etc) can use the phone's
sound system as a soft TNC for 300- or 1200-baud packet. [I have actually
linked an iPad to a Yaesu FT-857 for VHF/HF packet and APRS. It does work!]
You need to focus on how to connect the phone "soft modems" to RADIOs, not the
Internet.....


5) This sort of brings to mind an actual experience I had as a radio systems
engineer decades ago with disaster planning in Los Angeles county. We were
gaming out disaster comms scenarios for the City and County of Los Angeles
after the "Big One" (the anticipated 8.0+ earthquake). This was before
cellular networks became ubiquitous - the issue was the relative surviveability
of the public land-line phone network vs the fire and police public safety
radio networks. A representative of the County Board of Supervisors came up
with this brilliant response plan: "If the phones go out, we'll use the FAX"
!!! NOTE: These are the organizations dealing with the current fires there...


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stephen H. Smith wa8lmf (at) aol.com
Skype: WA8LMF
EchoLink: Node # 14400 [Think bottom of the 2-meter band]
Home Page:

New 30 Meter APRS-over VARA Frequency
As of 1 Jan 2025. Details Here:
<>

- APRS over VARA --
<>

"Studio B" Ham Shack on Wheels
<>

-
 

Stephen, I appreciate your experience & response. I certainly agree with my document format; I realized it a little after I posted it - PDF has been added.

Ref #2: A number of us use APRS over radio, and I posted here because people, like you, are experts and can help me formulate information most accurately. However, the fact exists that not everyone in my rural community has/can afford equipment to do APRS via RF and maintain voice comms. Also, not everyone is convinced of the value of APRS regardless of the mode (especially at the home station), and I am trying to show them the additional utility. If they can use it & practice with it on their phone app, I hope this will promote APRS' significance to operators and make them more likely to upgrade. It certainly is about radio, so I have to disagree with your statement.

We have many radio/internet interfaces that are in regular use, so this is not unique. Also, we are a rural area where digipeater coverage is limited. I have no desire to exclude information or participation just because one is not in the range of a digipeater.

For our net during the Blizzard, I made a concerted effort to exercise our APRS capabilities, which was the genesis for the instructions. First, we had the tactical information of who was participating in a visual format using an APRS mapping view.

Second, stations were asked to update their symbol with their numerical snowfall total, use the comment to timestamp (and their total if they couldn't change their symbol), and I placed Objects for locations where the operator did not have APRS capability. This was quite a distinctive APRS visual that I have not seen used in my 20+ years in amateur radio.

Third, we established a group message ID, and sent messages to share with the group. Some RF/ some IS; that's simply my reality. But we had good participation and there were learning curves overcome. That's a positive.

Finally, the information I am working on includes APRS to SMS. I can't imagine a situation where that would be uniquely useful except when the is no cell service and the operator is using APRS RF.

I think all of these combined definitely show a radio utility for my project.

REF #3. We are encouraging practice & utilization of Winlink as it has mult attributes useful for EmComm, but it is a connection-based link. Those who run APRS can get notification each day that one has pending Winlink emails (this morning, I found I have 4 msgs to retrieve). That makes APRS more useful, and promotes continued use of Winlink. It's a win/win.

As well, I understand there is some capacity to send & receive Winlink emails over APRS. Any process which make it more than "position" reporting is what, I believe, will get my operators more interested in APRS, and enhance our communication connectivity.

REF #4. If they don't have it on their phone and find utility of APRS, they won't get it, period. It's a curve, not a square wave. Also, many of them are on APRSDroid, and as you noted, with a cable & UV-5R - they've got a good inexpensive APRS station (I have 2). But, back to #2 - I have to show them the utility of APRS before the spend the $/effort. Our Blizzard net, I believe, was successful in that respect.

From my pew, you're preaching to the choir, . I've run APRS for about 15 years, established our digipeater here (CHILLI), use UI-View32 @ home/mobile continuously including storm-spotting or participating in public service events, add Overlays and Objects, and use messaging. But I can't force other amateur operators to do what I think they should; I am working on carrots.

Again, I appreciate your experience & knowledge in APRS.

So, my ask for everyone: is the information in the (new) attachment correct & understandable? Are there any other specific features which broadly appeal to operators?

Joe,KC0NOX

APRS Special Features.pdf
APRS Special Features.pdf

 

Interesting. I’m


Sent from AT&T Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Monday, January 13, 2025, 16:25, Joe Dietrick via groups.io <kc0nox@...> wrote:

Stephen, I appreciate your experience & response.? I certainly agree with my document format; I realized it a little after I posted it - PDF has been added.

Ref #2: A number of us use APRS over radio, and I posted here because people, like you, are experts and can help me formulate information most accurately.? However, the fact exists that not everyone in my rural community has/can afford equipment to do APRS via RF and maintain voice comms.? Also, not everyone is convinced of the value of APRS regardless of the mode (especially at the home station), and I am trying to show them the additional utility.? If they can use it & practice with it on their phone app, I hope this will promote APRS' significance to operators and make them more likely to upgrade.? It certainly is about radio, so I have to disagree with your statement.?

We have many radio/internet interfaces that are in regular use, so this is not unique. Also, we are a rural area where digipeater coverage is limited. I have no desire to exclude information or participation just because one is not in the range of a digipeater.

For our net during the Blizzard, I made a concerted effort to exercise our APRS capabilities, which was the genesis for the instructions. First, we had the tactical information of who was participating in a visual format using an APRS mapping view.?

Second, stations were asked to update their symbol with their numerical snowfall total, use the comment to timestamp (and their total if they couldn't change their symbol), and I placed Objects for locations where the operator did not have APRS capability.? This was quite a distinctive APRS visual that I have not seen used in my 20+ years in amateur radio.

Third, we established a group message ID, and sent messages to share with the group.? Some RF/ some IS; that's simply my reality. But we had good participation and there were learning curves overcome. That's a positive.

Finally, the information I am working on includes APRS to SMS. I can't imagine a situation where that would be uniquely useful except when the is no cell service and the operator is using APRS RF.

I think all of these combined definitely show a radio utility for my project.

REF #3. We are encouraging practice & utilization of Winlink as it has mult attributes useful for EmComm, but it is a connection-based link.? Those who run APRS can get notification each day that one has pending Winlink emails (this morning, I found I have 4 msgs to retrieve). That makes APRS more useful, and promotes continued use of Winlink. It's a win/win.

As well, I understand there is some capacity to send & receive Winlink emails over APRS.? Any process which make it more than "position" reporting is what, I believe, will get my operators more interested in APRS, and enhance our communication connectivity.

REF #4. If they don't have it on their phone and find utility of APRS, they won't get it, period.? It's a curve, not a square wave. Also, many of them are on APRSDroid, and as you noted, with a cable & UV-5R - they've got a good inexpensive APRS station (I have 2). But, back to #2 - I have to show them the utility of APRS before the spend the $/effort.? Our Blizzard net, I believe, was successful in that respect.

From my pew, you're preaching to the choir, . I've run APRS for about 15 years, established our digipeater here (CHILLI), use UI-View32 @ home/mobile continuously including storm-spotting or participating in public service events, add Overlays and Objects, and use messaging.? But I can't force other amateur operators to do what I think they should; I am working on carrots.

Again, I appreciate your experience & knowledge in APRS.

So, my ask for everyone: is the information in the (new) attachment correct & understandable? Are there any other specific features which broadly appeal to operators?

Joe,KC0NOX

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