开云体育

Having just read a packet bulletin from G0FUM saying "Just one digipeat
blocked all the user ports on the BBS and slowed the BBS down to a great
degree" (and he's supposed to be a supporter of the program! ;-) Is
there anyone on the list within RF range of GB7VRB who can explain to
me, in technical terms, what it is about that area that results in a
single digipeat causing such problems? I have tried asking two users,
but all I get back is non-specific quotes from the sysop.

As far as I can make out, there are only two or three people attempting
to use UI-View in the GB7VRB area, and yet the sysop has been jumping up
and down about it ever since they first used the program. Has one of
them got something wrong that somehow results in their system sending
out a continuous stream of frames, or what?

--
Roger Barker, G4IDE roger@...
Boston, UK

In article <004d01be8b5e$5d62df20$156afea9@eve>, Roger Colwell
<zec@...> writes

From: "Roger Colwell" <zec@...>

From: Roger Barker <roger@...>

I would also like to be able to modify the font attributes in the Station
List, please Roger incidentally, I'm in agreement with Dave G0DJA over

the

usefulness of this list, but would prefer to reduce its physical size.

That's a non-trivial one, for several reasons. Also, if I make the font
smaller and the list smaller, then I'd really have to make the buttons
smaller, or it would still take up as much room across the screen. What
if I make it so you can shrink the window? Losing information from the
right and bottom the more you shrink it?

As it is now, the Station List window contents/menu/buttons use MS Sans
Serif in one point size, therefore how difficult would it be to dynamically
change the button size along with the one font?

No, the list itself uses a fixed pitch font, because it's easier to
space pad the columns than to start trying to put tabs in, particularly
when I'm trying to keep the width down.

As for shrinking the window on the bottom & right, not as the layout stands
as there is no menu...why is there no menu in this window when all the
others have them?

The buttons tend to be used a lot, and I regard them as being
functionally more suitable in that particular window than a menu bar,
because it's very much a dialogue window.

And/or, could the bottom bar be dynamically stacked into
two rows if the width was reduced (assuming dynamic button sizing isn't
feasible)? Then provide vertical window height adjustment (only) as the
vertical scroll bar is provided.

Mmm, possibly... At this stage of development, the complexity of either
dynamically resizing it all, or moving the buttons into two rows, really
rules out both options. It's the sort of thing I would do only when I
was confident that the final structure of the program was well defined.

Alternatively remove the buttons Details, Delete, Message, Ping, Query and
provide these functions from Station selection with a right-click? Why
left-click/select button when right-click/select menu option is no less
economical?

Because the list provides easy access to all the stations, without
searching for them on the map. (Isn't this where we came in? :-)

Anyway, I've just had a go at doing it in the way I suggested. The
window can now be sized. If you size it vertically, the list height
changes, and the buttons reposition so they don't disappear. If you size
it horizontally, you lose the right-hand side of the list and the right-
hand buttons. However, sized down to the right-hand edge of the Query
button, it is still quite useful, and the hidden buttons are still
usable via the speed keys. Also selecting Close from the System menu (or
in Win95 clicking the 'X'), which was previously disable, will hide the
window.

--
Roger Barker, G4IDE roger@...
Boston, UK

Hi Roger,
I'm pleased to be able to report that the bug fix appears to be
working fine, on my set-up at least, bitmaps now open perfectly, with all
stations in the right position on the map.

Now come the questions, I'm having some problems with gif files that I
have created myself (the ones included with the software open ok). The
problem is this, stations on the map move on the screen to reflect the
positions they would be in on the different scale map, but the map itself
isn't actually replaced. Do any gifs that I create have to be the same size
as the ones you included? If so can anyone tell me how to create an
appropriately sized image without stretching along the vertical axis to fit
in an art package. I'm using Autoroute 95 to create the maps and microsoft
photo editor, paint or windows imaging to manipulate the images.



Roger Barker wrote:

Downloaded, and installed. Thanks Roger,

It's completely cured the problems I was having with the KAM+ in Host mode.

:-)

I'm now hoping to run a few tests on HF on the other port. Anyone
interested in trying UI-View on some HF band or another please?

Cheers de Dave (G0DJA)

What frequency are you looking on?

Try 432.675MHz or 144.9375MHz. I've even seen stations beaconing their
possition from around the Sheffield area. Try looking out for GB7SYP, that
has its Lat/Long in the beacon.

I've used 50.650MHz as well today.

Hope these ideas help.

de Dave (G0DJA)
West Yorkshire Area, but can hear the Mansfield 70cm repeater, the South
Yorkshire Repeater, and might be able to reach North Notts. on a 'good'
day. :-)

All I want now, is some activity in the South Yorkshire/North Nottingham

area. I seem to be the only one using Ui-view. Apart from seeing beacons
from my BBS, local nodes and an occasional station, there is nothing. Where
are you all? I'm getting fed up looking at an almost empty map!

Not wishing to add to the problems, but a situation is brewing where a
remote sysop in this area is getting more 'anti-UIVIEW' by the day.

The situation is that a station in the area, using BPQ and a multi-port
system feeding several radios, was digipeating UIVIEW from one frequency in
the 70cm band, to another 25kHz down.

Yes, I know, but he thought he was offering a service to people 'stuck' on
the one frequency and 'advertising' the use of UIVIEW to people who might be
interested......

After discussing the situation, he admitted that, as yet, there were no
UIVIEW users on the BBS frequency and that, untill there were, he would stop
doing it, especially when I asked him how many people monitored the channels
'looking' for new packet modes in use. He was reconfiguring his station when
I logged onto the BBS!

At this point I read a very inflamatory message from said remote sysop,
accusing UIVIEW of being to blame, this was the person who I thought I'd
convinced to at least load the program so that he knew what it did! The
gist of which was that UIVIEW digipeated packets from one frequency to
another, caused Ghosts and was messing up the MH lists. He then went on to
just about denounce UIVIEW as illegal and state that he believed that it
would cause loss of messages and bring the whole packet network crashing down!
(You don't believe me? List messages to UIVIEW and read it yourself....)

So, I've given up trying to reason with said sysop and asked if a different
sysop could check my outgoing mail in future, as it was when he read a
message of mine addressed to UIVIEW that he first contacted me with his
concerns about UI frames on the system.

Ah well, who would be a peace maker eh?

Regards - Dave (G0DJA)

With reference to indicating off-map stations.

It occured to me the other night that half the facility is there already.
The Distance and Bearing facility could be made to show a Distance and
Bearing line, captioned with Callsign of the off-map station, from the Host
UI-Vew station, automatically??

Is it possble Roger?

Thanks and 73, Mick O'Donnell

Phone/Fax:: +44 (0)1908 316052
Mobile : +44 (0)836 228084
E-Mail: mickodonnell@...
ICQ 27902590

----------

From: John <mull@...>
Subject: UIVIEW V0.75b
Date: 22 April 1999 01:46

Thanks Roger for such a good program,like a few people
I had the problem with the map calibrations..which now seem to be working
100% with the recent update.
At the moment in this area in the N/West it seems to be catching on
very quickly and there are quite a number using it.The problems seems

what

do you set the Unproto Ad to.??.at the moment I just
have mine set to RELAY but I have noticed a few set at RELAY,WIDE
it would be good to know what would be for the best so all staions
hopefully can use the same settings...just a thought fro a very grateful
user.73 all the best De John G0THP...
mull@... Keep up the good work Roger

1. Indication in stations list of which radio port the station was heard on.
2. Inclusion of some basic alarms (eg High Wind level) when there is a WX Node in the Station list.

Otherwise, thanks again Roger for a superb piece of software.

73, Emlyn (MW0ATT)

After a week away from my pc, and some serious withdrawl........

Roger Barker wrote:

Doesn't the above very much represent a self-fulfilling prophecy? ;-)

Not really, I'm just showing what can be done with a well placed digi.

No matter how good APRS is, few are going to permanently move their systems

onto >a dedicated APRS frequency, even when one is agreed.


Well, that's your opinion and I, a many others don't agree. Opposition to
the use of UIV on BBS freqs will grow, after all they're BBS access freqs
and shouldn't be used for keyboard to keyboard chats (DCC's words from my
previous experiences). UIV has generated a lot of interest with many talking
about seperate networks. Such a network has already been proposed for APRS
and it's because of this that it's essential that UIV complies with the
exisiting protocols.

Whilst UIV is streets ahead on the interface, there will be people who
prefer WinAPRS, APRSDos and MacAPRS so it makes sense to ensure that UIV is
compatible with these programs. Otherwise we will eventually have two
systems running on the same freq.

Why not just use UI-View? Well for the reasons stated above and the fact
that the various APRS packages, although not as user friendly, do a hell of
a lot more.....at the moment. Also, don't forget that it's possible to digi
into Europe....although if there are incompatibilities, you won't be able
to talk to them. What about the guy who travels over from the US or EU with
his laptop and THD7, tries to access the locals on the APRS freq, but can't
because they're using UI-View.

What I see happening at the moment is that an image of UI-View is being
projected by comments to the UIVIEW packet topic, that wide area
digipeating is a prerequisite of using the program, which isn't true.

No it's not, but it's a natural progression to ensure wider coverage. Whilst
it may have been your intention to use UIV as a local natter utility, people
have already picked up on its similarity to APRS, and are using it as such,
and in the same way has been developed over the pond.

My main concern with UIV is not the whinging on the BBS access freqs but
that of incompatibility with APRS. Previously there have been problems with
accessing the protocol, but these restrictions are being lifted.

Please remember, I think UI-View is the dogs plums, and Roger..."You da
man". But there are a few things that need hi-lighting.....in my humble
opinion.


73....Ciemon G0TRT g0trt@...
APRS UK
!5207.40N/00058.35E-PHG7268/ QRA:JO02lc QTH Wattisham Suffolk
Operating on 144.825 with a 'serious' WIDE

If anyone objects to URL's onthe server please say so!

Here's a nice one for those using GPS engines in their trackers, without a
display.




73...Ciemon Dunville g0trt@...
APRS UK
!5207.40N/00058.35E-PHG7268/ QRA:JO02lc QTH Wattisham Suffolk
Operating on 144.825 with a 'serious' WIDE

Hi all,

After re-reading this thread I'm not going to continue it. This, by the way,
isn't me harumfing, I just think that UIV is such a bloody good piece of
software that me ranting on about APRS isn't a good idea.

73...Ciemon qrx

In article <000801be8e1d$cb106e40$bd18883e@ciemon>, Ciemon Dunville
<g0trt@...> writes
[snip]

Well, that's your opinion and I, a many others don't agree. Opposition to
the use of UIV on BBS freqs will grow, after all they're BBS access freqs
and shouldn't be used for keyboard to keyboard chats (DCC's words from my
previous experiences).

[Sorry that the following is a bit long!]

In that case all 2m packet frequencies except possibly one, and all 70cm
packet frequencies should not be used for live packet! No wonder packet
in the UK has become equated with BBS usage! I really don't think the
recommendations of the DCC count for much in this respect. They are only
interested in the mailbox and cluster aspects of packet, and they don't
seem to want to accept some of the harsh realities of what is happening.
They still talk about the growth of the mailbox network, even though
usage probably peeked about two years ago and is now slowly declining.
(Despite that, the network now uses twice as many 2m frequencies as it
two years ago!)

In this part of the world, the biggest problem on the BBS "access"
frequencies is BBSs forwarding on them. The amount of traffic generated
by that in one day is probably equivalent to the total traffic that
UI-View use will generate in a year!

I simply cannot get my head round the concept that it's ok for BBSs to
clog up the user frequencies in this way, and it's ok for those
frequencies to be used for downloading large quantities of "junk"
bulletins that have absolutely nothing to do with amateur radio (more
like CB really), but it's not ok for me to indulge in a little real
amateur radio on those frequencies!

UIV has generated a lot of interest with many talking
about seperate networks. Such a network has already been proposed for APRS
and it's because of this that it's essential that UIV complies with the
exisiting protocols.

The biggest mistake that can be made in attempting to encourage use of
this type of packet software in the UK is going to be to import a system
from the USA, that has grown up to suit conditions in the USA (which are
very different in some ways to conditions in the UK) and say that this
is the standard and everything else should follow it.

APRS was never designed, it has developed by the authors adding bits to
the system as they think fit, and those bits reflect what is needed in
the USA. They are never going to add (or remove) bits to suit the UK. To
do as you suggest means that we would never have software developed to
suit the needs of users in this country. You only need to look at the
history of packet BBS software to see that the UK and Europe very soon
went their own way, and developed far better products than the BBS
software used in the USA.

Also, anyone who reads the APRSSIG will know that, even now, comments
are being made in the USA that a new protocol should be developed. So
some people over there are already not happy, for various reasons, with
what they are using.

Another important point is that anyone developing software of this type
is likely to be motivated by wanting to implement their own ideas.
There's no way I would have bothered to write UI-View if all I had been
doing was cloning someone else's "protocol", particularly when I regard
parts of it as crap!

Whilst UIV is streets ahead on the interface, there will be people who
prefer WinAPRS, APRSDos and MacAPRS so it makes sense to ensure that UIV is
compatible with these programs. Otherwise we will eventually have two
systems running on the same freq.

Basic compatibility exists at beacon level. Some other aspects are not
compatible. However, as Ciemon is well aware, for me or anyone else to
even claim a program is compatible with APRS means, that, in theory,
they are infringing a claimed copyright on the APRS "protocol". The most
unacceptable aspect of APRS is that the original author, Bob Bruninga,
WB4APR, and the authors of the versions cloned onto other platforms,
notably the Sproul brothers with WinAPRS and MacAPRS, have for years
attempted to stop other software authors writing compatible software.

The very existence of their software depends on the free availability of
the highly complex AX25 protocol. They also make use of other freely
available protocols - KISS, TNC2 command language, tcp/ip, etc. Yet they
attempt to restrict the use of the APRS "protocol", which amounts to
little more than abbreviated plain text.

Their attitude is different to anything else that I have encountered in
the field of amateur radio software, and, to me, goes completely against
the normal ethics of amateur radio.

If the *wishes* of WB4APR are respected (his claimed copyright almost
certainly has no legal validity) then neither I nor anyone else can
write APRS compatible software without getting his approval, and he
won't give it except for weird "niche" applications.

My main concern with UIV is not the whinging on the BBS access freqs but
that of incompatibility with APRS. Previously there have been problems with
accessing the protocol, but these restrictions are being lifted.

Maybe, that remains to be seen. However, the problem still remains that
the "protocol" will always reflect the conditions and requirements of
the USA. Bruninga and the Sprouls are never going to change their
systems to reflect anything that I or any UK author thinks is a good
idea for users in the UK!

My suggestion is very simple - "Suck it and see!" Don't let's start off
by making lots of rules about what should and shouldn't be done. I
expect a lot of other people are like me and sick to death of petty
packet bureaucrats saying what can't be done on the BBS network. Let
people have a "play" with UI-View and APRS, in the true spirit of
amateur radio, and see if the interest holds, which is the important
thing. I think incompatibilities are relatively unimportant at this
early stage.

--
Roger Barker, G4IDE roger@...
Boston, UK

I've just uploaded the V0.77b update to my web site. Please note that
this is only an update, not a complete installation system. The update
can be applied to V0.6b or later and includes all the changes made since
that version, you don't need to apply the previous updates before
applying this one. The url is:-



Please don't publicise the link outside this mailing list. Also, it's
probably a good idea not to pass the update on to too many people until
a day or two has elapsed, to allow any serious problems to be reported
by subscribers to this list.

There aren't a lot of changes, but they are all things that have been
requested by users.

If anyone wants a full version, rather than an update, then let me know
and I'll put one together once I'm confident that there are no major
problems with it.

Here is the relevant section of HISTORY.TXT:-

[There was a V0.76b, but it was only released to one person.]

V0.77b 1999-Apr-24 1. A bug fixed in restoring the size of the main
window when the program was loaded.
2. The Station List can now be sized and the
station count is shown on the caption bar.
3. The Station List, the Message window and the
Terminal window can all be hidden by selecting
Close on the window System menu. Previously Close
was disabled.
4. KISS mode support added for both ports on
Kantronics dual port TNCs. (It's selected from the
KISS Setup dialogue.)
5. Double-clicking a callsign in the messages
received window will automatically put that
callsign in the "To" box, and position the cursor
in the "Text" box.

--
Roger Barker, G4IDE roger@...
Boston, UK

How about the ability to repeat the ALL message at individually set times.
For example I want everyone to know that there is going to be a meeting and
demo of UI-View so I setup UIV to send the message to ALL at x hours
interval (minimum 1) over y days with a maximum of say three. Obviously x
and y could be decided thru debate.


73...Ciemon Dunville g0trt@...
APRS UK
!5207.40N/00058.35E-PHG7268/ QRA:JO02lc QTH Wattisham Suffolk

Hi Roger

At the moment if I want to broadcast a general message I put ALL as the
callsign.

Would it be possible to make ALL a special allsign. So it transmits the
message once and not 5 times ?

Andy - G7OCW

Hi Roger,

I know this has been suggested before, and I can't remember if you
gave an answer to it, but it would be handy to have a timestamp against
received messages. A couple of times I have been out of the shack for
protracted periods and returned to find messages for me, but I have no
idea when they were received. I know I can zoom the monitor and scroll
back to find them, but it would be easier with a timestamp.

Also is it possible to filter the message screen in someway ? This may
sound like a strange question but I can see a point were there will
be an awful lot of stations chatting to each other, and it becoming
dificult to find your QSO's text lines in amongst everyone elses.

Does that make sense???

Or is it possible to give each incoming station a different coloured
line ?

Anyway update 077b has been installed and is running AOK here,
many thanks Roger.


73 de John G0FSM

Excuse me for appearing to be a bit of a knowall, but here's my two
penneth....

Messages that aren't connected with you are in one colour, black would be
good as it doesn't attract much attention

Messages from you could be in red

Messages to you should remain blue as they smack you in the face.

Messages to ALL could be green

Timestamp is an idea, but does it matter? The good thing about this type of
software is that it doesn't really matter, just reply, you know instantly,
whether it gets there. The other guy will reply when he does!

Also what about user definable font, font colour and even back ground colour
to make the window completely user configurable. Ok this is asking a lot but
UI-View is cutting edge so why not ask.




73...Ciemon Dunville g0trt@...
APRS UK
!5207.40N/00058.35E-PHG7268/ QRA:JO02lc QTH Wattisham Suffolk

In article <000001be8e7e$ff5470a0$eb927ed4@house-server>, John Bent
<jbent@...> writes

From: "John Bent" <jbent@...>

Hi Roger,

I know this has been suggested before, and I can't remember if you
gave an answer to it, but it would be handy to have a timestamp against
received messages. A couple of times I have been out of the shack for
protracted periods and returned to find messages for me, but I have no
idea when they were received. I know I can zoom the monitor and scroll
back to find them, but it would be easier with a timestamp.

The big problem with the current message screen is fitting in the
information on a 640x480 display without the user having to use the
horizontal scroll bar. Putting in a time stamp would take up a lot of
screen width. If you ask people to use Ctrl+S and Ctrl+E if they're
leaving a message, then it sends time stamp message lines.

Also is it possible to filter the message screen in someway ? This may
sound like a strange question but I can see a point were there will
be an awful lot of stations chatting to each other, and it becoming
dificult to find your QSO's text lines in amongst everyone elses.

You can use Options, Only My Messages.

--
Roger Barker, G4IDE roger@...
Boston, UK

Is it possible to assign a wav file to the ping system?

Ideally I'd like to use one for ping successful and one for ping failure.


73...Ciemon Dunville g0trt@...
APRS UK
!5207.40N/00058.35E-PHG7268/ QRA:JO02lc QTH Wattisham Suffolk