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Please forgive my ignorance, this hasn't been a concern of mine nor would it be currently. However as I age, I'm becoming more aware of deteriorating health that I might start to face!!! Currently I'm a class 3 med holder but if my health does make it more difficult to keep this, I'd like to still fly my tailwind, under the light sport medical approval. With this said, I have not had my tailwind faa inspected, only started registration. If possible, how should I register my tailwind to allow me to legally fly my plane under light sport? Does this even matter? Is this even possible? Does anyone fly their tailwind using the light sport med? Thanks
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Greg,
Two different points to mention here.? First, there is nothing different about the certification process for a Homebuilt aircraft regardless of whether the aircraft meets the LSA definition or not.? It is still simply an amateur-built aircraft.? You do not do anything during registration or certification that would differentiate whether the aircraft is sport pilot-eligible or not.? So no issue there.
Now, regarding the ability to operate as a sport pilot, I am to sure whether a Tailwind could ever be made to meet the LSA definition as it is currently written, due to maximum level flight cruise speed.? Heck, even my C-90 powered W8 won¡¯t qualify on that point alone.? Stall speed might be an issue as well, but maximum level flight cruise would definitely be an issue. ?
So, having said that, the other option to investigate would be BasicMed.? Slightly different than Sport Pilot, but still a good option as the speed of the Tailwind would be no issue. ?
The other possibility on the horizon is the expansion of LSA under the new proposes MOSAIC rules.? Not sure when we will see those go into effect, but certainly would work out in the scenario you describe.
Joe
Please forgive my ignorance, this hasn't been a concern of mine nor would it be currently. However as I age, I'm becoming more aware of deteriorating health that I might start to face!!! Currently I'm a class 3 med holder but if my health does make it more difficult to keep this, I'd like to still fly my tailwind, under the light sport medical approval. With this said, I have not had my tailwind faa inspected, only started registration. If possible, how should I register my tailwind to allow me to legally fly my plane under light sport? Does this even matter? Is this even possible? Does anyone fly their tailwind using the light sport med? Thanks
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The Tailwind doesn't qualify for light sport.? MOSAIC may effectively expand that.
If you currently have a medical you can switch to Basic Med.?? You can use your family doctor, you only need a physical every 4 years,? you have to take a self-evaluation exam every 2 years.? I've been using Basic Med for almost 8 years now.
On Thursday, January 9, 2025 at 06:27:28 PM CST, Greg Blake via groups.io <gregablake@...> wrote:
Please forgive my ignorance, this hasn't been a concern of mine nor would it be currently. However as I age, I'm becoming more aware of deteriorating health that I might start to face!!! Currently I'm a class 3 med holder but if my health does make it more difficult to keep this, I'd like to still fly my tailwind, under the light sport medical approval. With this said, I have not had my tailwind faa inspected, only started registration. If possible, how should I register my tailwind to allow me to legally fly my plane under light sport? Does this even matter? Is this even possible? Does anyone fly their tailwind using the light sport med? Thanks
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Just food for thought, if you feel you will not meet the 3rd class med. exam requirements when it comes due, then by all means pursue the basic med application because if you fail the 3rd class med you can't apply for basic med. I am 78 yrs old and just got my basic med because my 3rd class med expires in feb. of this year. I feel that with my age I don't want to press my luck and fail the next 3rd class application although I feel fine.
Alex
On Thursday, January 9, 2025 at 06:35:56 PM CST, Joe Norris via groups.io <joepilot13@...> wrote:
Greg,
Two different points to mention here.? First, there is nothing different about the certification process for a Homebuilt aircraft regardless of whether the aircraft meets the LSA definition or not.? It is still simply an amateur-built aircraft.? You do not do anything during registration or certification that would differentiate whether the aircraft is sport pilot-eligible or not.? So no issue there.
Now, regarding the ability to operate as a sport pilot, I am to sure whether a Tailwind could ever be made to meet the LSA definition as it is currently written, due to maximum level flight cruise speed.? Heck, even my C-90 powered W8 won¡¯t qualify on that point alone.? Stall speed might be an issue as well, but maximum level flight cruise would definitely be an issue. ?
So, having said that, the other option to investigate would be BasicMed.? Slightly different than Sport Pilot, but still a good option as the speed of the Tailwind would be no issue. ?
The other possibility on the horizon is the expansion of LSA under the new proposes MOSAIC rules.? Not sure when we will see those go into effect, but certainly would work out in the scenario you describe.
Joe
Please forgive my ignorance, this hasn't been a concern of mine nor would it be currently. However as I age, I'm becoming more aware of deteriorating health that I might start to face!!! Currently I'm a class 3 med holder but if my health does make it more difficult to keep this, I'd like to still fly my tailwind, under the light sport medical approval. With this said, I have not had my tailwind faa inspected, only started registration. If possible, how should I register my tailwind to allow me to legally fly my plane under light sport? Does this even matter? Is this even possible? Does anyone fly their tailwind using the light sport med? Thanks
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Hope you don't mind input from a non-Tailwind (but Tailwind fan) guy. The issue(s) of Light Sport and Sport Pilot pop up often on forums. Easiest thing to remember for me is that they're two separate things. Special Light sport is airframe, and it currently is only available to a manufacturer who complies with ASTM certification. Experimental Light Sport is only available through kits that comply precisely with the SLS airframe sold by that mfgr but built by others.? As others have said, there's not really any way to make a Tailwind into any form of Light Sport airframe, due to both performance and manufacturing issues.
?
Sport Pilot, on the other hand, defines what performance is allowed to be flown without a medical of any sort. The performance allowed is the performance of current Light Sport aircraft, but not limited to just those certified under Light Sport certification. It also includes planes like standard Cubs, some Ercoupes, Taylorcraft, etc that are standard category a/c, and any homebuilt that meets the performance requirements.
?
Both of the above are likely to change significantly (for the better) with the MOSAIC rule that is on the horizon. It's possible that a Tailwind will be able to be flown by a Sport Pilot once the new rules are implemented. But the easiest path now, as others have said, is the Basic Med option. As long as you've had a Class 3 or better in the last 10 years, you can switch to Basic Med with any State Certified physician doing the exams every 4 years and you taking the on-line course/test every two years.?
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Pretty good synopsis, with one minor correction. You don't have to have held an FAA medical within the previous ten years.? You have to have held an FAA medical within the 10 years prior to the enactment of the basicmed rules.? The following is a quote directly from the FAA's website:
Comply with the general BasicMed requirements (possess a U.S. driver's license, have held a medical after July 14, 2006).
So as long as you have held a valid FAA medical since that date, you are eligible for basicmed.? Frankly, if I didn't need a 2nd class medical for my flying at EAA, I would go besicmed in a heartbeat.? It covers all the flying I do personally, but I still like to haul biplane and helicopter rides at Pioneer Airport, so I will stick with the 2nd class until I can't anymore.
Basicmed is a really nice deal, and should not be ignored.? Yes, you do have to go see a doctor every 4 years, and you have to do the online thing every two, but that's easy compared to fretting about passing an FAA medical.
Hope you don't mind input from a non-Tailwind (but Tailwind fan) guy. The issue(s) of Light Sport and Sport Pilot pop up often on forums. Easiest thing to remember for me is that they're two separate things. Special Light sport is airframe, and it currently is only available to a manufacturer who complies with ASTM certification. Experimental Light Sport is only available through kits that comply precisely with the SLS airframe sold by that mfgr but built by others.? As others have said, there's not really any way to make a Tailwind into any form of Light Sport airframe, due to both performance and manufacturing issues.
?
Sport Pilot, on the other hand, defines what performance is allowed to be flown without a medical of any sort. The performance allowed is the performance of current Light Sport aircraft, but not limited to just those certified under Light Sport certification. It also includes planes like standard Cubs, some Ercoupes, Taylorcraft, etc that are standard category a/c, and any homebuilt that meets the performance requirements.
?
Both of the above are likely to change significantly (for the better) with the MOSAIC rule that is on the horizon. It's possible that a Tailwind will be able to be flown by a Sport Pilot once the new rules are implemented. But the easiest path now, as others have said, is the Basic Med option. As long as you've had a Class 3 or better in the last 10 years, you can switch to Basic Med with any State Certified physician doing the exams every 4 years and you taking the on-line course/test every two years.?
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I consider myself to be in decent health for 56 but this is the last year I¡¯m going to play ¡°FAA Medical Roulette¡±. ?When this medical expires I¡¯m switching to BasicMed. ?
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After looking into the MOSAIC proposal, it seems as though it will begin to implement as law sometime this year, 2025. The new laws under MOSAIC will expand criteria so that more pilots can use driver liscense as medical. The big changes that will help the tailwind hroup include increasing the clean stall to 54, and max speed to 250. I believe weight is increased as well. This will be great news for many of us!
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I suggest you go ahead and do it.? You can have both at the same time,? an airman's physical certificate and a basic med.? It is what I have done.
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Experimental Light Sport is only available through kits that comply precisely with the SLS airframe sold by that mfgr but built by others.?
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I think any EAB that was certified at LSA limits and remained so is legal for a Sport Pilot to fly. The trick might be establishing it met the clean stall and top speed limits. If you built a WagAero Cub or Vagabond and registered it at the 1320 LSA limit, I doubt anyone would question the speeds are out of limits.
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You are correct.? Any aircraft that meets the definition of a light-sport aircraft is eligible to be operated by sport pilots, regardless of what category the aircraft is certificated in. ? When it comes to Homebuilts, it is up to the builder or person performing the flight tests to carefully document the speeds.? However, if you make unreasonable claims the FAA will likely look to published performance figures to determine whether the aircraft is eligible or not.
Joe
On Sun, Jan 19, 2025 at 11:44?AM Karl Kleimenhagen via <kwk= [email protected]> wrote:
Experimental Light Sport is only available through kits that comply precisely with the SLS airframe sold by that mfgr but built by others.?
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I think any EAB that was certified at LSA limits and remained so is legal for a Sport Pilot to fly. The trick might be establishing it met the clean stall and top speed limits. If you built a WagAero Cub or Vagabond and registered it at the 1320 LSA limit, I doubt anyone would question the speeds are out of limits.
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I recall talking about this 20 or so years ago and? I still feel the same way. While a Cub might not be questioned.......
A LSA compliant Tailwind is an Oxymoron.
With due respect,
Jack
On Sunday, January 19, 2025 at 12:48:50 PM EST, Joe Norris via groups.io <joepilot13@...> wrote:
You are correct.? Any aircraft that meets the definition of a light-sport aircraft is eligible to be operated by sport pilots, regardless of what category the aircraft is certificated in. ? When it comes to Homebuilts, it is up to the builder or person performing the flight tests to carefully document the speeds.? However, if you make unreasonable claims the FAA will likely look to published performance figures to determine whether the aircraft is eligible or not.
Joe
On Sun, Jan 19, 2025 at 11:44?AM Karl Kleimenhagen via <kwk= [email protected]> wrote:
Experimental Light Sport is only available through kits that comply precisely with the SLS airframe sold by that mfgr but built by others.?
?
I think any EAB that was certified at LSA limits and remained so is legal for a Sport Pilot to fly. The trick might be establishing it met the clean stall and top speed limits. If you built a WagAero Cub or Vagabond and registered it at the 1320 LSA limit, I doubt anyone would question the speeds are out of limits.
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Joe you are correct, after discussing this with my local FAA inspector, he informed me that a pilot practicing under the light sport category, it would be determined by the individual pilot on whether or not he is maintaining his authority to fly based on characteristics of the given aircraft he is flying. MOSAIC's proposal for light sport regulation modification is due to kick of sometime this year, per last report, therefore many of our tailwinds will apply under the light sport pilots' capabilities. As they lie now, the stall speed and top cruise speed is the constraints in many instances. However, these will be increased this year with the modified regulations. I am excited to the number of tailwind pilots who might have been grounded r/t medical requirements as this will allow many to fly their dream aircraft that many blood sweat and tears were put into.?
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A LSA compliant Tailwind is an Oxymoron.
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The typical modern Tailwind, with a big 320 cu in engine and an empty weight well above 800 lb, is certainly not going to qualify under LSA.
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However, the W-10 and the Sonex have similar wing dimensions (span and area), and there are hundreds of Sonex flying as LSA with the FAA not minding. So, if you build a W-10 extra light with about an 80 hp engine and a gross of 1100 lb or so, you should get away with it. Old NACA data suggests switching to the venerable USA 35-B airfoil would help a bit with the clean stall, and you'd want to up the chord 5% to better match the Sonex's area.
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With MOSAIC, the speeds go up, and the task is much easier.
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Greg Blake
Joe Norris
Alex Frizzell