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What size wire rope do you use for the centerboard pennant?

[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9610 Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
Warren Stein All Messages By This Member #9611 I think the limiting factor may be the size of the hole at the edge of the center board. At least on my centerboard, there is a hole crossways, i.e. oriented as the hole for the pin; but there is also another hole, smaller, which runs from the aft edge of the center board perpendicularly and intersects with the crossways one. The pennant enters the smaller hole and can push out either side of the crossways hole, so one can put a swage fitting on it. This means that a bigger pennant requires a bigger hole. And there is only so much Centerboard thickness to work with. So I think thats the real limit. toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Jan 25, 2020, at 5:46 PM, jeremy@... wrote: ? Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
Caleb Davison All Messages By This Member #9612 Jeremy, I think Warren has pointed out why it might not be so easy to just upgrade the size of wire rope (thanks Warren). My information.html (file in the files section) says that the centerboard pennant is made up of 10' of 1/8" wire rope + 12' of 1/4" rope.? I don't think that the 1/8" wire rope even has to have a fancy weave like the 7x19 specified for the standing rigging - plain old 1/8" wire rope with however many strands it is made up with should do fine.? It may be worth spending a little extra on a SS version, if such does exist, as the wire attached to the centerboard will see frequent amounts of time in the water and will be likely to corrode/rust expecially up against dissimilar metal fittings.? So whatever material your wire rope is it should be compatible (the same) as the fittings/swages you may use. There is a good reason that Tartan did not use dyneema originally for this application; dyneema would not be invented for another 40 or so years after production of these boats ended.? High tech high strength lines are a relatively recent newcomer in the rigging world with many applications that make sense on a boat, and many that don't make sense since dyneema wont hold most conventional knots.? What I love about Dyneema is it's low weight, super high strength (1/4" dyneema breaking point is around 6000#s) but it can easily be cut by a razor blade or knife, and thus is more succeptible to chafing than any wire rope.? I have also seen my centerboard trunk covered in barnacles after a season in our brachish/salty waters and we all know how sharp barncles can be.? For this reason alone I think that dyneema is unsuitable for this application (but you are more than welcome to try it out), I also think this system should have had a sheave for the wire rope just inside the centerboard trunk to keep it from sawing away at the inside of the trunk. Best. Caleb D. T27 #328 toggle quoted message Show quoted text -----Original Message----- From: Warren Stein via Groups.Io <wrsteinesq@...> To: T27Owners <[email protected]> Sent: Sat, Jan 25, 2020 8:14 pm Subject: Re: [T27Owners] What size wire rope do you use for the centerboard pennant? I think the limiting factor may be the size of the hole at the edge of the center board. At least on my centerboard, there is a hole crossways, i.e. oriented as the hole for the pin; but there is also another hole, smaller, which runs from the aft edge of the center board perpendicularly and intersects with the crossways one.? The pennant enters the smaller hole and can push out either side of the crossways hole, so one can put a swage fitting on it. This means that a bigger pennant requires a bigger hole.? And there is only so much Centerboard thickness to work with.? So I think thats the real limit. > On Jan 25, 2020, at 5:46 PM, jeremy@... wrote: > > ? > Hello, > > What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? > > At what point is the diameter too big? > > I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. > > If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. > > - jeremy > >
Alan Schaeffer All Messages By This Member #9613 开云体育 The limiting factor for centerboard cable is the diameter of the drum onto which the wire rope is spooled at the top. This is also why you should absolutely only use the recommended 7 x 19 stainless steel cable—for its flexibility.? Larger cable, or cable made with fewer strands, will stress from bending around its take-up spool and quickly fail. Look up wire rope shives for more data on allowable bending radii.? Dyneema is more chafe resistant than you would think and won’t part from rubbing even sharp edges for long periods ALONG its length, but is easy cut with a concentrated force with a very sharp edge ACROSS its length. This stuff continues to amaze me. I’m rebuilding my centerboard now. There’s more to think about, but I’ll be strongly considering dyneema.? Good luck with your centerboard.? Alan Schaeffer? 1968 T27? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Jan 25, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Caleb Davison via Groups.Io <calebjess@...> wrote: Jeremy, I think Warren has pointed out why it might not be so easy to just upgrade the size of wire rope (thanks Warren). My information.html (file in the files section) says that the centerboard pennant is made up of 10' of 1/8" wire rope + 12' of 1/4" rope.? I don't think that the 1/8" wire rope even has to have a fancy weave like the 7x19 specified for the standing rigging - plain old 1/8" wire rope with however many strands it is made up with should do fine.? It may be worth spending a little extra on a SS version, if such does exist, as the wire attached to the centerboard will see frequent amounts of time in the water and will be likely to corrode/rust expecially up against dissimilar metal fittings.? So whatever material your wire rope is it should be compatible (the same) as the fittings/swages you may use. There is a good reason that Tartan did not use dyneema originally for this application; dyneema would not be invented for another 40 or so years after production of these boats ended.? High tech high strength lines are a relatively recent newcomer in the rigging world with many applications that make sense on a boat, and many that don't make sense since dyneema wont hold most conventional knots.? What I love about Dyneema is it's low weight, super high strength (1/4" dyneema breaking point is around 6000#s) but it can easily be cut by a razor blade or knife, and thus is more succeptible to chafing than any wire rope.? I have also seen my centerboard trunk covered in barnacles after a season in our brachish/salty waters and we all know how sharp barncles can be.? For this reason alone I think that dyneema is unsuitable for this application (but you are more than welcome to try it out), I also think this system should have had a sheave for the wire rope just inside the centerboard trunk to keep it from sawing away at the inside of the trunk. Best. Caleb D. T27 #328 -----Original Message----- From: Warren Stein via Groups.Io <wrsteinesq@...> To: T27Owners <[email protected]> Sent: Sat, Jan 25, 2020 8:14 pm Subject: Re: [T27Owners] What size wire rope do you use for the centerboard pennant? I think the limiting factor may be the size of the hole at the edge of the center board. At least on my centerboard, there is a hole crossways, i.e. oriented as the hole for the pin; but there is also another hole, smaller, which runs from the aft edge of the center board perpendicularly and intersects with the crossways one.? The pennant enters the smaller hole and can push out either side of the crossways hole, so one can put a swage fitting on it. This means that a bigger pennant requires a bigger hole.? And there is only so much Centerboard thickness to work with.? So I think thats the real limit. > On Jan 25, 2020, at 5:46 PM, jeremy@... wrote: > > ? > Hello, > > What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? > > At what point is the diameter too big? > > I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. > > If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. > > - jeremy > >
fred4936 All Messages By This Member #9614 Hello, Mine is 1/8" wire on the centerboard. I wind up replacing mine every 4 years, since by then it develops "meat hooks". I had to replace the winch, and went with the smallest diameter I could keeping in mind the minimum bend radius specified for 1/8" SS wire, to maximize mechanical advantage. So if you wish to go larger, measure the drum diameter to see if it will work with the larger wire size. Fred Eagle #662 On Saturday, January 25, 2020, 05:46:40 PM EST, <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9615 Ahoy! It sounds like I should be fine using the 1/8" cable that Tartan sent me. A previous owner had installed 3/16" on my boat, but it is not clear that is really advantageous. It sounds like, in the end, the cable needs to be replaced every 5 years or so due to meat hooking no matter what gauge is used. Now.. the next question is -- how should I attach the cable to the centerboard. As shown in this album, the centerboard was previously installed by running the cable through the top of the centerboard and then swagged some sort of fitting on the end to keep the cable from slipping back out. Tartan kindly included a nico-press fitting with the cable. But they did not include the $200 swagging tool... Is there a reasonable way to terminate the wire that does not involve a very expensive tool? ?- jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
a41967t27 All Messages By This Member #9616 开云体育 Hello! I did this a couple years ago. Tartan sent me a cable with a loop swaged onto one end. Is that what you have? The cable goes through the small hole on the aft edge of the board and loops back on itself. Then the bulk of the swaged fitting nestles in the bigger lateral hole. Hard to explain but simple.? Good luck, Marty Marty Levenson? Poseidon? Bowen Island BC ? sent by carrier pigeon ? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Jan 26, 2020, at 10:41 AM, jeremy@... wrote: ? Ahoy! It sounds like I should be fine using the 1/8" cable that Tartan sent me. A previous owner had installed 3/16" on my boat, but it is not clear that is really advantageous. It sounds like, in the end, the cable needs to be replaced every 5 years or so due to meat hooking no matter what gauge is used. Now.. the next question is -- how should I attach the cable to the centerboard. As shown in this album, the centerboard was previously installed by running the cable through the top of the centerboard and then swagged some sort of fitting on the end to keep the cable from slipping back out. Tartan kindly included a nico-press fitting with the cable. But they did not include the $200 swagging tool... Is there a reasonable way to terminate the wire that does not involve a very expensive tool? ?- jeremy On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9617 They sent me the cable and the stainless steel nicro-press crimp -- but they did not install the crimp onto the cable. If they had sent the cable pre-crimped that would have helped a lot! Unfortunately, to put the crimp on correctly requires a $200 tool... - jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sun, Jan 26, 2020 at 12:51 PM a41967t27 <martylev@...> wrote: Hello! I did this a couple years ago. Tartan sent me a cable with a loop swaged onto one end. Is that what you have? The cable goes through the small hole on the aft edge of the board and loops back on itself. Then the bulk of the swaged fitting nestles in the bigger lateral hole. Hard to explain but simple.? Good luck, Marty Marty Levenson? Poseidon? Bowen Island BC ? sent by carrier pigeon ? On Jan 26, 2020, at 10:41 AM, jeremy@... wrote: ? Ahoy! It sounds like I should be fine using the 1/8" cable that Tartan sent me. A previous owner had installed 3/16" on my boat, but it is not clear that is really advantageous. It sounds like, in the end, the cable needs to be replaced every 5 years or so due to meat hooking no matter what gauge is used. Now.. the next question is -- how should I attach the cable to the centerboard. As shown in this album, the centerboard was previously installed by running the cable through the top of the centerboard and then swagged some sort of fitting on the end to keep the cable from slipping back out. Tartan kindly included a nico-press fitting with the cable. But they did not include the $200 swagging tool... Is there a reasonable way to terminate the wire that does not involve a very expensive tool? ?- jeremy On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
a41967t27 All Messages By This Member #9618 开云体育 I guess I was lucky? Or did they mistakenly not swage your cable? You might give them a call, or take it to a rigger who might charge $20 or so.... Marty ?? sent by carrier pigeon ? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Jan 26, 2020, at 10:56 AM, jeremy@... wrote: ? They sent me the cable and the stainless steel nicro-press crimp -- but they did not install the crimp onto the cable. If they had sent the cable pre-crimped that would have helped a lot! Unfortunately, to put the crimp on correctly requires a $200 tool... - jeremy On Sun, Jan 26, 2020 at 12:51 PM a41967t27 <martylev@...> wrote: Hello! I did this a couple years ago. Tartan sent me a cable with a loop swaged onto one end. Is that what you have? The cable goes through the small hole on the aft edge of the board and loops back on itself. Then the bulk of the swaged fitting nestles in the bigger lateral hole. Hard to explain but simple.? Good luck, Marty Marty Levenson? Poseidon? Bowen Island BC ? sent by carrier pigeon ? On Jan 26, 2020, at 10:41 AM, jeremy@... wrote: ? Ahoy! It sounds like I should be fine using the 1/8" cable that Tartan sent me. A previous owner had installed 3/16" on my boat, but it is not clear that is really advantageous. It sounds like, in the end, the cable needs to be replaced every 5 years or so due to meat hooking no matter what gauge is used. Now.. the next question is -- how should I attach the cable to the centerboard. As shown in this album, the centerboard was previously installed by running the cable through the top of the centerboard and then swagged some sort of fitting on the end to keep the cable from slipping back out. Tartan kindly included a nico-press fitting with the cable. But they did not include the $200 swagging tool... Is there a reasonable way to terminate the wire that does not involve a very expensive tool? ?- jeremy On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
Steve Bufe All Messages By This Member #9619 开云体育 Can anyone tell me what the inner diameter of the tube is? Steve Bufe Wolfington body company Cell 610.308.5657 On Jan 25, 2020, at 10:20 PM, Alan Schaeffer <alan.g.schaeffer@...> wrote: toggle quoted message Show quoted text The limiting factor for centerboard cable is the diameter of the drum onto which the wire rope is spooled at the top. This is also why you should absolutely only use the recommended 7 x 19 stainless steel cable—for its flexibility.? Larger cable, or cable made with fewer strands, will stress from bending around its take-up spool and quickly fail. Look up wire rope shives for more data on allowable bending radii.? Dyneema is more chafe resistant than you would think and won’t part from rubbing even sharp edges for long periods ALONG its length, but is easy cut with a concentrated force with a very sharp edge ACROSS its length. This stuff continues to amaze me. I’m rebuilding my centerboard now. There’s more to think about, but I’ll be strongly considering dyneema.? Good luck with your centerboard.? Alan Schaeffer? 1968 T27? On Jan 25, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Caleb Davison via Groups.Io <calebjess@...> wrote: Jeremy, I think Warren has pointed out why it might not be so easy to just upgrade the size of wire rope (thanks Warren). My information.html (file in the files section) says that the centerboard pennant is made up of 10' of 1/8" wire rope + 12' of 1/4" rope.? I don't think that the 1/8" wire rope even has to have a fancy weave like the 7x19 specified for the standing rigging - plain old 1/8" wire rope with however many strands it is made up with should do fine.? It may be worth spending a little extra on a SS version, if such does exist, as the wire attached to the centerboard will see frequent amounts of time in the water and will be likely to corrode/rust expecially up against dissimilar metal fittings.? So whatever material your wire rope is it should be compatible (the same) as the fittings/swages you may use. There is a good reason that Tartan did not use dyneema originally for this application; dyneema would not be invented for another 40 or so years after production of these boats ended.? High tech high strength lines are a relatively recent newcomer in the rigging world with many applications that make sense on a boat, and many that don't make sense since dyneema wont hold most conventional knots.? What I love about Dyneema is it's low weight, super high strength (1/4" dyneema breaking point is around 6000#s) but it can easily be cut by a razor blade or knife, and thus is more succeptible to chafing than any wire rope.? I have also seen my centerboard trunk covered in barnacles after a season in our brachish/salty waters and we all know how sharp barncles can be.? For this reason alone I think that dyneema is unsuitable for this application (but you are more than welcome to try it out), I also think this system should have had a sheave for the wire rope just inside the centerboard trunk to keep it from sawing away at the inside of the trunk. Best. Caleb D. T27 #328 -----Original Message----- From: Warren Stein via Groups.Io <wrsteinesq@...> To: T27Owners <[email protected]> Sent: Sat, Jan 25, 2020 8:14 pm Subject: Re: [T27Owners] What size wire rope do you use for the centerboard pennant? I think the limiting factor may be the size of the hole at the edge of the center board. At least on my centerboard, there is a hole crossways, i.e. oriented as the hole for the pin; but there is also another hole, smaller, which runs from the aft edge of the center board perpendicularly and intersects with the crossways one.? The pennant enters the smaller hole and can push out either side of the crossways hole, so one can put a swage fitting on it. This means that a bigger pennant requires a bigger hole.? And there is only so much Centerboard thickness to work with.? So I think thats the real limit. > On Jan 25, 2020, at 5:46 PM, jeremy@... wrote: > > ? > Hello, > > What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? > > At what point is the diameter too big? > > I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. > > If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. > > - jeremy > >
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9620 On mine, the ID of the pennant tube is approximately 0.834" or 21.18mm. That is actually the OD of a tube I filed down so that it just barely fit inside the existing tube. ?- jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sun, Jan 26, 2020 at 5:39 PM Steve Bufe <sbufe@...> wrote: Can anyone tell me what the inner diameter of the tube is? Steve Bufe Wolfington body company Cell 610.308.5657 On Jan 25, 2020, at 10:20 PM, Alan Schaeffer <alan.g.schaeffer@...> wrote: The limiting factor for centerboard cable is the diameter of the drum onto which the wire rope is spooled at the top. This is also why you should absolutely only use the recommended 7 x 19 stainless steel cable—for its flexibility.? Larger cable, or cable made with fewer strands, will stress from bending around its take-up spool and quickly fail. Look up wire rope shives for more data on allowable bending radii.? Dyneema is more chafe resistant than you would think and won’t part from rubbing even sharp edges for long periods ALONG its length, but is easy cut with a concentrated force with a very sharp edge ACROSS its length. This stuff continues to amaze me. I’m rebuilding my centerboard now. There’s more to think about, but I’ll be strongly considering dyneema.? Good luck with your centerboard.? Alan Schaeffer? 1968 T27? On Jan 25, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Caleb Davison via Groups.Io <calebjess@...> wrote: Jeremy, I think Warren has pointed out why it might not be so easy to just upgrade the size of wire rope (thanks Warren). My information.html (file in the files section) says that the centerboard pennant is made up of 10' of 1/8" wire rope + 12' of 1/4" rope.? I don't think that the 1/8" wire rope even has to have a fancy weave like the 7x19 specified for the standing rigging - plain old 1/8" wire rope with however many strands it is made up with should do fine.? It may be worth spending a little extra on a SS version, if such does exist, as the wire attached to the centerboard will see frequent amounts of time in the water and will be likely to corrode/rust expecially up against dissimilar metal fittings.? So whatever material your wire rope is it should be compatible (the same) as the fittings/swages you may use. There is a good reason that Tartan did not use dyneema originally for this application; dyneema would not be invented for another 40 or so years after production of these boats ended.? High tech high strength lines are a relatively recent newcomer in the rigging world with many applications that make sense on a boat, and many that don't make sense since dyneema wont hold most conventional knots.? What I love about Dyneema is it's low weight, super high strength (1/4" dyneema breaking point is around 6000#s) but it can easily be cut by a razor blade or knife, and thus is more succeptible to chafing than any wire rope.? I have also seen my centerboard trunk covered in barnacles after a season in our brachish/salty waters and we all know how sharp barncles can be.? For this reason alone I think that dyneema is unsuitable for this application (but you are more than welcome to try it out), I also think this system should have had a sheave for the wire rope just inside the centerboard trunk to keep it from sawing away at the inside of the trunk. Best. Caleb D. T27 #328 -----Original Message----- From: Warren Stein via Groups.Io <wrsteinesq@...> To: T27Owners <[email protected]> Sent: Sat, Jan 25, 2020 8:14 pm Subject: Re: [T27Owners] What size wire rope do you use for the centerboard pennant? I think the limiting factor may be the size of the hole at the edge of the center board. At least on my centerboard, there is a hole crossways, i.e. oriented as the hole for the pin; but there is also another hole, smaller, which runs from the aft edge of the center board perpendicularly and intersects with the crossways one.? The pennant enters the smaller hole and can push out either side of the crossways hole, so one can put a swage fitting on it. This means that a bigger pennant requires a bigger hole.? And there is only so much Centerboard thickness to work with.? So I think thats the real limit. > On Jan 25, 2020, at 5:46 PM, jeremy@... wrote: > > ? > Hello, > > What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? > > At what point is the diameter too big? > > I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. > > If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. > > - jeremy > >
Steve Bufe All Messages By This Member #9621 Thanks, I'm thinking of coming up with some sort of guide to insert in the tube? something like this? Steve #663
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9622 On Mon, Jan 27, 2020 at 3:42 AM Steve Bufe <sbufe@...> wrote: Thanks, I'm thinking of coming up with some sort of guide to insert in the tube I'm working on something similar. I have a 1" diameter UHMW-PE rod arriving in the mail today. - jeremy
skhook All Messages By This Member #9623 开云体育 What a great thread of emails on center board stuff this is. Our T27 #196 has been on the hard for many a year waiting for her time to sail again. Life got in the way and now just some time and $. My idea was to not re-invent the system. Besides making sure the tube for the pendent doesn’t need to be coaxed out and rebeded with that new fangled G10 and beefed up with epoxy and cloth onto the trunk, I was just going to G10 a pipe bushing/reducer into said pipe and add another bushing/reducer as a consumable wear/guide item. The pendent cable ran very true in her, with minimal touches on the tube. Three things I believe made it run true, 1) proper angle of the tube 2) proper attachment point on the center board to make the geometry of those angles correct 3) previous owner had Ray McCloud do all the work on her. The previous owner passed away and I purchased the boat from them and trailered her to Ray’s yard for his advice on any repairs that she needed.? The stranded 1/8” cable sounds correct and a barrel crimped in the attachment hole on the board. Bronze pipe nipples and caps glassed to the Cb-trunk enclose and hold the pivot cross pin in place. Now on to deck recore, replace chain plate knees, replace thru hulls, pull the A4...well most of you know the rest. toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Jan 27, 2020, at 9:02 AM, jeremy@... wrote: On Mon, Jan 27, 2020 at 3:42 AM Steve Bufe <sbufe@...> wrote: Thanks, I'm thinking of coming up with some sort of guide to insert in the tube I'm working on something similar. I have a 1" diameter UHMW-PE rod arriving in the mail today. - jeremy
Carl Damm All Messages By This Member #9624 Most west marine stores have a nicro press swage tool you can use for free -- Carl Damm DAMSELv 1976 #593 Stuart Fl
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9625 But wait! There is more! It seems that the nico-press fitting that Tartan sent me is too skinny for my needs -- it is small enough to slip through the hole at the top of the centerboard. There is an album here: If you look at the album, you can see that the previous setup used a 3/16" wire rope that had a large stop sleeve on it. You can also see that there was a lot of damage where the wire came out from the top of the centerboard. When I repaired the board I reinforced the area with stainless steel tube that was correctly sized for the old wire & sleeve. But it seems I should have used a smaller tube for the 1/8" wire? Given the situation I am in now -- how would you proceed? Bonus points if I don't need a $200 crimping tool. I considered something like this, but it is also too small, ! From what I can tell wire rope swage fittings basically come in one size for each wire diameter. I considered putting a bolt through the crossways hole for the loop to hang onto. However, the minimum bend radius for 1/8" 7x19 wire seems to be 1.5"? I could put a washer on the cable -- but then all the weight of the centerboard would be on that one poor little washer. I could fill the tube the cable runs through with thickened epoxy and then drill a hole that is only slightly larger than the wire diameter. So far that is what I am leaning towards. - jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
Robert Harvey All Messages By This Member #9626 I like the idea of filling the hole and redrilling, but I believe I would try to mix in some chopped fiberglass to the epoxy along with fumed silica. They sell it but for that little volume you could do it yourself with a pair of scissors. Then if you feel the need you could put a washer or two just for insurance.? --Rob toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Wed, Jan 29, 2020, 6:45 PM <jeremy@...> wrote: But wait! There is more! It seems that the nico-press fitting that Tartan sent me is too skinny for my needs -- it is small enough to slip through the hole at the top of the centerboard. There is an album here: If you look at the album, you can see that the previous setup used a 3/16" wire rope that had a large stop sleeve on it. You can also see that there was a lot of damage where the wire came out from the top of the centerboard. When I repaired the board I reinforced the area with stainless steel tube that was correctly sized for the old wire & sleeve. But it seems I should have used a smaller tube for the 1/8" wire? Given the situation I am in now -- how would you proceed? Bonus points if I don't need a $200 crimping tool. I considered something like this, but it is also too small, ! From what I can tell wire rope swage fittings basically come in one size for each wire diameter. I considered putting a bolt through the crossways hole for the loop to hang onto. However, the minimum bend radius for 1/8" 7x19 wire seems to be 1.5"? I could put a washer on the cable -- but then all the weight of the centerboard would be on that one poor little washer. I could fill the tube the cable runs through with thickened epoxy and then drill a hole that is only slightly larger than the wire diameter. So far that is what I am leaning towards. - jeremy On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
Michael Connolly All Messages By This Member #9627 Jeremy, Do you have a West Marine near by where you live?? Most larger West stores have that tool set-up on a workbench that you can use for free.? I just made a bridle for my whisker pole and swaged 8 cable ends for just the cost of the swages. Michael toggle quoted message Show quoted text On January 26, 2020 at 1:40 PM jeremy@... wrote: Ahoy! It sounds like I should be fine using the 1/8" cable that Tartan sent me. A previous owner had installed 3/16" on my boat, but it is not clear that is really advantageous. It sounds like, in the end, the cable needs to be replaced every 5 years or so due to meat hooking no matter what gauge is used. Now.. the next question is -- how should I attach the cable to the centerboard. As shown in this album, the centerboard was previously installed by running the cable through the top of the centerboard and then swagged some sort of fitting on the end to keep the cable from slipping back out. Tartan kindly included a nico-press fitting with the cable. But they did not include the $200 swagging tool... Is there a reasonable way to terminate the wire that does not involve a very expensive tool? ?- jeremy On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw < jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy ?
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #9647 Ahoy! I am inching ever closer to having a working solution. I have one more question. How small should I make the loop at the end of the cable? For some reason that I do not understand, I am supposed to use an oval sleeve instead of a stop sleeve. With the oval sleeve I have to make a loop at the end? of the cable-- even though the loop doesn't go around anything. Looking at the minimum bending radius for a 1/8" 7x19 wire, that loop should have a pretty big radius -- 2-5/8". Clearly a loop that big won't fit inside the 0.5" pipe in the centerboard. Since the loop isn't load bearing, perhaps I should just make it as small as possible? Or should I make the loop big and it just sticks out the side and rubs on the centerboard trunk (potentially getting caught on stuff?). Or maybe I am missing something? - jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy
fred4936 All Messages By This Member #9648 When I do mine, I put a thimble on both ends of the wire, then use the appropriate oval? sleeves, making sure the wire sticks out at least one diameter of the wire.. From the eye w/thimble I found a shackle that just fits inside the trunk, The pin is wired in place so it can't back out. Hope this helps. Fred Liesegang Eagle #662 On Wednesday, February 5, 2020, 03:23:50 PM EST, <jeremy@...> wrote: Ahoy! I am inching ever closer to having a working solution. I have one more question. How small should I make the loop at the end of the cable? For some reason that I do not understand, I am supposed to use an oval sleeve instead of a stop sleeve. With the oval sleeve I have to make a loop at the end? of the cable-- even though the loop doesn't go around anything. Looking at the minimum bending radius for a 1/8" 7x19 wire, that loop should have a pretty big radius -- 2-5/8". Clearly a loop that big won't fit inside the 0.5" pipe in the centerboard. Since the loop isn't load bearing, perhaps I should just make it as small as possible? Or should I make the loop big and it just sticks out the side and rubs on the centerboard trunk (potentially getting caught on stuff?). Or maybe I am missing something? - jeremy toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 4:46 PM Jeremy Shaw <jeremy@...> wrote: Hello, What size wire do you use for the centerboard pennant. I originally ordered the replacement cable from Tartan, but it seems it is only 1/8". That has a working load of 340lbs and a breaking strength around 1760lbs -- so, it should be plenty. But is it worthwhile to go up to a larger size ? At what point is the diameter too big? I know some people are experimenting with dyneema, but I am going to wait to hear how that works out before making the switch. Among other things, last time I got hauled out I couldn't drop my centerboard because a bunch of mussels, barnacles, or other hard, pointy things started growing in the centerboard trunk and actually jammed the centerboard in place. If those things started scraping on my centerboard pennant, I think stainless steel would fair better than dyneema. - jeremy

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