开云体育

Phylogeography document update - R-Z381/R-Z301 minor clades

Iain All Messages By This Member #8545 Dear all, ? A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! ? Cheers, ? Iain.
Roy All Messages By This Member #8546 Hi Iain, With reference to the relatively late surge of DF98, it may be helpful to enquire whether the phylogeography shows a parallel expansion with other haplogroups, not necessarily under U106. Even mt haplogroups could offer clues, though the trail might be too sparse to follow. In an unpublished essay several years ago, I was able to confirm the VIking origin of the Auldhame skeleton by drawing on both mt and Y data, among other evidence. See attached file. It may eventually also be feasible to correlate Y-DNA haplogroups with tribal or other demographic admixture profiles or even segments of autosomal DNA conserved in space and time. Cheers, Roy? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Mon, 24 Feb 2025 at 17:28, Iain via <gubbins=[email protected]> wrote: Dear all, ? A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! ? Cheers, ? Iain. The Ghost of Auldhame v2b.pdf The Ghost of Auldhame v2b.pdf
Brian Swann All Messages By This Member #8547 开云体育 Dear Iain ? I have to say that the U106 branches I’m most interested in fall under the Z156 and L48 clades. ? Does the lack of your response on these particular clades mean that there are so many samples and sub-clades to deal with that you are unlikely to find the time to tackle these in the near future [?].? Or it is just not worth the candle by the dates they arose, as these SNPs are becoming ubiquitous across a lot of Europe by then making any further dissection of migration routes unrealistic until you get to about 1000 CE and the dawn of written documentation. ? Brian ? toggle quoted message Show quoted text From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Iain via groups.io Sent: 24 February 2025 22:28 To: [email protected] Subject: [R1b-U106] Phylogeography document update - R-Z381/R-Z301 minor clades ? Dear all A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! Cheers Iain_._,_ 开云体育 Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#8545) \| Reply to Group \| Reply to Sender \| Mute This Topic \| New Topic Please SNIP before replying. Change subject line when starting new thread Home page: /g/R1b-U106 Your Subscription \| Contact Group Owner \| Unsubscribe [brian_swann@...] _._,_._,_
Gary Corbett All Messages By This Member #8548 Glad to finally see something posted that gets closer to me.? Thank you.? I'm pretty similar to Gann in BY19022, not exact.? Wondering why mine wasn't mentioned?? I'm the person L259 was discovered in, at the same time L257 was discovered in Peter op den Velde Boots.? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Mon, Feb 24, 2025 at 4:28 PM, Iain via groups.io <gubbins@...> wrote: Dear all, ? A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! ? Cheers, ? Iain.
Iain All Messages By This Member #8549 Hi all, ? Roy: Yes, it would be helpful to look at parallel expansions of haplogroups. I am trying to do this within R-U106. However, it's difficult to do this in general because of the difficulty in establishing what a parallel haplogroup actually looks like. From my analysis so far, it seems that most of the R-U106 haplogroups stuck together between 3000 BC and about 2300 BC, but I can only tell that with a lot of detailed analysis to remove founder effects. These are very closely related haplogroups: as one progresses to more distantly related groups, the problem becomes harder due to drift in the very uncertain TMRCA dates. Comparing with haplogroups outside of R-U106 is even harder because I don't have this detailed analysis to determine a meaningful pathway, and I don't trust those out of other tools like Globetrekker, etc., to be as accurate as they would need to be. ? Brian: I'm progressing slowly through R-U106, working from the smallest haplogroups at each level to the largest ones. I've made an exception to deal with the R-Z301 minor clades before R-Z156, but R-Z156 will be next. Since this is going to take me a long time, I am releasing sections as I have time to write them. My available time to work on this is very limited and comes in chunks, so I don't know whether to determine these haplogroups as "near" or "medium" term goals. I've done 19% of R-U106 since Christmas if that helps. ? Gary: I'm not sure whether you're talking about your family or your haplogroup. I didn't mention your family because, with only four Big Y testers, it is not large enough to significantly bias the statistics. The other families are much larger (except the Estonian family, which biases the statistics because it makes up most/all of the Estonian component of R-Z154). For your haplogroup, I've gone as far down the tree as I can. The smaller the haplogroup, the less data there is to work with, and the more the interpretation spirals into the realms of guesswork and fantasy (a lot of what is there is knowingly - and hopefully clearly marked as - speculative). L259 now falls into the haplogroup R-Z155 at Family Tree DNA. The closest to your family I go is R-Z154 because this is the last haplogroup with sufficient data to make sensible inferences. ? Best wishes, ? Iain.
Gary Corbett All Messages By This Member #8550 Thank you sir.? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Mon, Feb 24, 2025 at 4:28 PM, Iain via groups.io <gubbins@...> wrote: Dear all, ? A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! ? Cheers, ? Iain.
[email protected] All Messages By This Member #8551 Iain, ? Truly, your dedication and work are greatly appreciated.? I feel I can safely say we all look forward to your updates, whether they are of personal benefit at the time is not an issue. ? Ed
Gary M. All Messages By This Member #8554 开云体育 Brian stated: I have to say that the U106 branches I’m most interested in fall under the Z156 and L48 clades.?Does the lack of your response on these particular clades mean that there are so many samples and sub-clades to deal with that you are unlikely to find the time to tackle these in the near future [?] Like Brian, I am hopeful about time being available for Iain to complete the section on L48 (and perhaps even L47??) in the relatively near future. I gather that he contemplates doing so, given the numbered sections identified in his beta version!? One can but hope?. -- GaryM.
Gary M. All Messages By This Member #8556 Thank you, Iain, for your response. to be clear, I certainly have no expectation that sufficient data presently exists to enable an analysis down to the level of my so-called terminal haplogroup. Not certain it ever will in my lifetime. I was only voicing my interest in seeing your analysis down to L-48, a future section that appears to be indicated in your draft … all when time permits of course. GaryM. -- GaryM.
GTC All Messages By This Member #8557 Another big thank you to Iain for this work, and another plea for some drilling down the L48 branch -- preferably to Z12 ;-)
Garron Zachary All Messages By This Member #8558 I've recently become pretty fascinated with the Ancient North Eurasians, from what I gather they are the ancestors of the Yamnaya pastoralists and of IE peoples in general. There even seems to be a genetic link between Europeans and Native Americans through these ancient migrations, does ANE ancestry exist in R1b individuals due to haplogroup P, is anyone here knowledgeable on this subject? Thanks.? toggle quoted message Show quoted text On Mon, Feb 24, 2025 at 5:28?PM Iain via <gubbins=[email protected]> wrote: Dear all, ? A very short update to my to include the minor R-Z381 clades. This is all of R-Z381 except R-Z156, R-S1688 and R-L48. In other words, it doesn't impact on most people, but it is hopefully valuable for the few folks that inhabit these smaller haplogroups! ? Cheers, ? Iain.
Herman All Messages By This Member #8560 Garron, ? I’m not an expert by any means but I have an amateur interest.? ANE ancestry is found in basically all Europeans and all Native American groups, as well as some west Asian populations, regardless of haplogroup. Haplogroups Q and R are believed to have originated with the ANE; after the ANE we see a general trend of R lineages migrating westward to form the EHG (eastern hunter gatherers) and Q lineages migrating across the Bering Strait to populate the Americas. ? If I recall correctly, the Yamnaya have been modeled as having about half of their ancestry coming from the ANE, while modern Europeans peak somewhere around 20-25% ANE ancestry, with a decrease towards southern Europe. Native Americans also have a significant amount of ancestry from the ANE; southern groups tend to have the most (~35%) while northern groups have less due to later migrations into North America from other Asian groups.? Keep in mind that I’m not an expert and this is a simplistic explanation, for example we see some EHGs, Yamnaya, and modern Europeans with yDNA Q.?

Previous Topic Next Topic