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JS8 mode in QRP Labs
开云体育
Hi Hans and All,
I know from time to time modes such as FT8 and JS8 rate a mention. I will take this opportunity to push at least one of these modes back to the front of mind.
The QRP Labs gear can already do WSPR and this mode is great, but for tracking a moving object the resolution is limited to a 4 digit grid square or with inherent risks the extend mode can be used to get 6 digits.
JS8call being more of a conversional mode offers a wide range of Directed and Undirected messaging, catching my eye is the ability to send grid squares with up to 10 characters? and have them appear in APRS. This is done over two 15 second messages rather than
the 4 minutes it takes in WSPR. I quite like this option as it levers off a well established and stable APRS network plus as the focus of APRS is the location of the object rather than the signal path it displays a bit cleaner on the maps
I realise HF APRS is doable, but transmit power requirements and lack of interest has prevented any new development in years. Whereas modes like WSPR have continued to see developments with a range of modern designs available for everything from a radio in
the shack to a balloon being accommodated. ?Given there is no need for two way messaging a product like the U3S would be ideal as it already has the GPS, Band Switching in a compact form, of course the QMX would also be a great platform (or maybe better) with
the higher transmit power.
Whilst not mention in the documentation for the APRSIS CMD usage, JS8call will not only pass APRS messages, but any correctly formatted "APRS" transmission which includes the Telemetry transmission.
73,
Warren, vk3byd
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I have been living this year for three months in a territory in a state of civil war - New Caledonia - with several total failures of internet and telephone. With my Hermes Lite 2 and my QDX Hi-band, the JS8 mode with JS8Call were my only "emergency" mean of communication with the world outside and with only 5 to 6 Watt output I could chat on bands from 40M to 10M with stations at nearly 10,000 miles. YES JS8 is an excellent mode even if it is not very much used. Note that I use only FT8 softwares to check the actual propagation as this FT8 mode is much more in use than JS8.
73 - Pierre - FK8IH |
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Pierre and Muhsin are correct in the general usage of JS8, and I like JS8 a lot too, it's a very nice mode indeed.? But in case people did not realize: what Warren VK3BYD is requesting is not support for JS8 - QDX and QMX-series transceivers already support JS8, when the JS8Call software is used on a PC and connects to QDX/QMX USB sound card and USB Virtual COM serial ports.? What Warren is suggesting is standalone support for sending the correct JS8 messages that can be used for tracking purposes. In this use of JS8, an appropriate message is transmitted which activates the JS8 -> APRS gateway then the tracking point shows up on . In this mode you would be able to set QMX (say) in a location tracking mode and it would periodically extract its position from a connected GPS, and send the APRS?message via JS8. Any receiving stations then log this to APRS.? I think it's a nice idea and I am also interested in this. I have added it to my list but it will not be highest priority yet.? 73 Hans G0UPL On Mon, Sep 30, 2024 at 11:41?AM Muhsin TA1MHS via <muhsin.dogrular=[email protected]> wrote:
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Hi Muhsin abi > transmit the Telemetry,vs [after the SSB :)] I was thinking the same thing. Like many QRP Labs products, once the code is developed for one, it can be transferred across to another! 73 Hans G0UPL On Mon, Sep 30, 2024 at 1:29?PM Muhsin TA1MHS via <muhsin.dogrular=[email protected]> wrote:
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On Mon, Sep 30, 2024 at 12:26 PM, Hans Summers wrote:
I was thinking the same thing. Like many QRP Labs products, once the code is developed for one, it can be transferred across to another! So hardware is ready, just the porting of the software needed when ready :) All New QRP Labs products use the same family of CPUs (QDX, QMX, U4B, (ProgRock2?)) 73 DE muhsin TA1MHS |
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Hi Muhsin > All New QRP Labs products use the same family of? > CPUs (QDX, QMX, U4B, (ProgRock2?)) Yes. All STM32. QRP Labs products using STM32-series processors are:
73 Hans G0UPL On Mon, Sep 30, 2024 at 2:42?PM Muhsin TA1MHS via <muhsin.dogrular=[email protected]> wrote:
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I also find this use interesting.
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However, the increased size of the firmware might preclude the other planned extensions, such as the user programmable BASIC modification. Thinking back on a previous post, it seems to me that some sort of user load able module architecture would be useful. Such a provision could be limited to loading “official” QRPLabs firmware extensions, thus avoiding a host of issues.
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Personally I would prefer the JS8-APRS special message functionality over some other new features, but I’m for delivering what is already in the queue. The JS8-APRS special message feature would make the QMX the complete back country package without lugging another computer on the journey.
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So Hans; Yes, please add it to “the list”.
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Steve |
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Hi Hans,
Thank you for reading to the end of my message : )
And in hindsight I should have mentioned I can already use the QMX and my PC to do JS8, this is how I tested the APRS functionality and discovered I can pass ANY aprs transmission through from JS8.
As mentioned elsewhere in this thread the U4B would be a good candidate for JS8, I had left it out of my email as I felt it was a little too QRP for terrestrial usage when compared to the 250mW QRO of the U3S.
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I look forward to the day when this makes it to the top of your list : )
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73,
Warren.
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Hello Steve > However, the increased size of the firmware might preclude >? the other planned extensions, such as the user? > programmable BASIC modification I believe there is plenty of space for both.? 73 Hans G0UPL On Mon, Sep 30, 2024, 15:27 Steve W6WU via <w6wu.ars=[email protected]> wrote:
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Hello Warren > As mentioned elsewhere in this thread the U4B would be a > good candidate for JS8, I had left it out of my email as I felt it > was a little too QRP for terrestrial usage when compared to > the 250mW QRO of the U3S. One reason why my telemetry-over-WSPR development was so useful and has been widely adopted by other picoballoon trackers is that the network of WSPR monitoring stations is extensive and provides very good global coverage. Furthermore the 1.46Hz tone bandwidth provides very high SNR. Together these reasons make WSPR perfect for such a low power (~25mW), globally travelling device. The probability of a transmission being copied is very high. With JS8 there are many fewer receiving stations and the 6.25Hz tone bandwidth also means it has lower SNR. Therefore in the U4B application it is likely to be less effective than WSPR telemetry.? Note regarding U3S there wouldn't be space in the code to add this, and any further substantial development on U3S firmware is extremely difficult.? I think the best place for JS8 APRS standalone would be QMX! 73 Hans G0UPL On Tue, Oct 1, 2024, 00:00 Warren vk3byd via <vk3byd=[email protected]> wrote:
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Thanks, Hans, for the compassion between WSPR and JS8. The QMX likely has less telemetry options compared to a balloon, but I would be keen to have the ability to send the Supply Voltage. Rather than the longer Telemetry format it could just be sent as an APRS Status message, i.e. @APRSIS CMD :>DDHHMMz09.1V Whilst a bit longer with the day and time included, I feel it has added benefits when looking at the data later. ? The only drawback (IMHO) with the QMX for this role as a location beacon is its need to be turned on manually, it would be very handy if it turned on (and went into beacon mode) when power was applied. Of course, there are ways to get around most things and I already have a couple of options in mind to start/stop the beaconing without removing power from the radio : ) ? 73, Warren |
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Hello Warren BASIC will solve anything you want to do with automatic beacon on power up etc. SO don't worry, it will all come, in time 73 Hans G0UPL On Tue, Oct 1, 2024 at 2:10?PM Warren vk3byd via <vk3byd=[email protected]> wrote:
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On Mon, Sep 30, 2024 at 10:52 AM, Hans Summers wrote:
That would be fantastic Hans... I think this would be a really cool addition to the QMX, and once the most important things are sorted, I would also be keen to see this improvement. ?
While you are at it, it would be nice to also allow SOTA/POTA selfspotting via APRS. The idea would be that you would just need to adjust the clock, enter your SOTA/POTA summit number, your QRG / mode and the QMX would then send the right APRS sentence via JS8 to self spot.? That would be really useful for activations without cellphone coverage.
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My club is keeping on the air 24/7 (when things go right!) a JS8Call station : so that people can use it as a mailbox. I realise this is a lot more work for you as on top of coding to JS8 you would need to sort out the decoding, but it would be very nice if a QMX could be used to send / receive messages to a 24/7 JS8 station. We are not the only ones, there are quite a few 24/7 stations around and some kind of rudimentary "communication through mailbox" would become possible.
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73,
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Yannig - F4IUJ
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Hello Yannig
I think this would be quite feasible and not particularly more difficult than the APRS message for map tracking. If you know what the right?APRS sentence for self-spotting is? Any info on this??? ?
Nice! When I get my antenna back up, I will see if I can contact it!? ?
There are several orders of magnitude of computational complexity between encoding a mode like JS8, FT8, WSPR and decoding it. In other words very much greater computational resources are required for the decoding. I rather doubt that QMX will ever be able to do standalone decoding (meaning, internally with no attached computer - of course it can already do JS8 now with an attached host computer running JS8Call).? 73 Hans G0UPL |
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I agree, muhsin, and I'm very pleased to find that KW3KW is still making videos! IIRC, several months ago he announced in a video that he was fighting health problems and he didn't know how long he could keep producing them.
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I intend to finish watching all of his JS8 videos:
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73,
Cal -- AD8Q |
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Hi Hans,
This link covers spotting SOTA via APRS,
Another option is Sotamat, it uses the suffix on you callsign sent via FT8. The suffix is converted to a SOTA or POTA spot by a look up table in the Sotamat system. I am yet to test it via JS8, but the information with the app states it's not stuck to FT8 but any digital mode that PSK Reporter does not strip the Suffix from call signs should work, e.g. RTTY, PSK and maybe others. Sotamat will also send pre-programed SMS's and Email via the same lookup table system.
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73,
Warren |
Pierre - FK8IH
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