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What is your favorite solder for electronic kit building?? 63/37, 60/40? Silver content? Resin or activated flux? Diameter?? Manufacturer?
Many years ago I spent many hours a week converting, programing, moding and repairing arcade video games.? I used a Weller WTCP and .032 Multicore 63/37 with activated flux.? It did an excellent job.? I now have several irons and stations, both quality units and inexpensive and I have a good selection of tips.? I have several Radio Shack solders both 63/37 and 60/40.? Also a spool or two with silver content.? Mostly small diameters with both resin and activated flux.? I think I have some small diameter 63/37 Weller around the shop somewhere.? Also some of the cheap Chinese stuff from Amazon.? My QRP Lab kits will be my first builds since Knight and Heathkit radios many years ago.? I'm sure you guys have much kit building/homebrewing experience and favorite solders.? Your input is much appreciated.
Jim WB4ILP?
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Hi, Jim.
I used tin / lead solder for most of my life (since 1974), but about eight years ago, in the interest of not increasing my risk of early dementia, I switched to lead - free solder.
i have used Kester K100D to great success, including Hans' QMX build, which is challenging due to six layers, and lots of thermal plane sinking many pads.
The only thing you will have to get used to is running your soldering iron at a higher temperature, because the melting point of this K100D alloy is 227 degrees C as compared to 183 degrees C for the Multicore 63/37. If you stick with genuine Weller tips, the plating will hold up to the extra heat, but I find the plating on the? Chinese tips available on Amazon burns up very prematurely. There is likely lead free wire solder that has a lower melting point, as well. I work with solder paste and hot air reflow on SMT components just as much, and I have found a lead - free paste with a Bismuth - based alloy that is super easy to work with, because it melts at 137 C:
The tradeoff is that alloy is not as strong, and this probably isn't great for something that needs structural support, like a connector..
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Hey Brian, I've never used lead free but I think I bought a roll on closeout at Radio Shack.? I'll have to dig around the shop for it.? I heard from an engineer friend that it doesn't flow as well as standard tin/lead and hardens with a frosty look. He also said they had some problems with cold joints when his company switched to lead free for Rohs compliance.? He did tell me that they eventually worked through the issues with higher heat, etc.? I'll give it a test if I can find the roll I bought. Thanks !? Jim
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Let’s take a mental walk into a lead free production facility
No clean soldering is a big goal so gentler no clean flux means component life before assembly is more limited by oxidation on leads of loose parts?
Mechanical or thermally stressed joints need (and sometimes get :-)) great care as lead-free solder?
seems more prone to cracking.
Hand Made joints tend to look dull grey and often need a lot of flux and hotter irons to address the above issues?
Medical and military production can still use leaded solder as can repair of older devices
Bits in bags ?is a definite no-no in the big plants especially if a few years old (!) so while you CAN assemble a kit with leaded solder the main question is why would you given the choice to use leaded which is available to amateur producers?
The lead is an issue and so is the aggressive flux fumes from the more agressive grades of flux if used (as above more common in older leaded mixes) ?(Flux type is another whole world that many hams are blissfully unaware of while quoting alloy %s)?
I have leaded and lead free on my bench. ? With No and low clean and medium aggressive fluxes and syringe of no clean flux too
?wil will always try lead free on repairs /mods of equipment that was made with it but prefer leaded for anything involving a proportion of junk box parts or ‘tacked-together joints or needing a quick cool joint process?
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I wont use lead free for the same reasons the military wont. I used a 63/37 no clean on my last build with a no clean flux. Results were beautiful
That said, what ever you do, dont use that 20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box unless you want a mess of bad joints and sticky cleanup. I did that on my first qcx+ and the flux core was all dried up and made problems for me not to mention the clean up mess.
--
regards,
Bryan, N0LUF
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If you choose to work with solder that contains lead, 63/37 tin/lead is the alloy of choice. That alloy is eutectic; in other words, it goes directly from solid to liquid with no intermediate "plastic" state, making it easier to produce clean solder joints. You can make do with 60/40 if you already have it (buy 63/37 if you don't have any solder) but it does have a small temperature range where it is plastic. Kester 44 is the old standby and is still an excellent solder; it uses rosin flux. There are alternatives that use a no-clean flux instead. Avoid solder with water-soluble flux; that needs to be washed off with very hot water, which is difficult for the home builder to do. Get your solder from a reputable source, not an anonymous supplier that is likely in China and whose products are likely to be mislabeled. Kester is the long time favorite; Multicore/Loctite (Loctite bought Multicore and markets solder under both names) and ChipQuik are also quality products. AIM also appears to make good solder, but there isn't a lot of ham experience with it because it wasn't readily available in small quantities until recently. (Mouser now carries AIM products.) I don't know much about European or Asian solder manufacturers; I'm sure that some good solder is made in Asia, it's the no-name stuff on Amazon and eBay and AliExpress that I'm suggesting you avoid.
The story gets a bit more complicated if you choose to avoid using solder that contains lead, or live in a country where lead-based solder is no longer available. The majority of commercial products currently use the SAC305 alloy (96.5% tin, 3% silver, 0.5% copper); it's OK but can be a bit challenging to work with. I prefer a variant that adds a small amount of antimony, like the Special Blend solder that SparkFun sells (0.15% of the tin is replaced with antimony); the addition of antimony improves its wetting. I used a similar solder that I got at a hamfest for years, and recently switched to the SparkFun solder when I finally used up my roll.
There are also newer alloys that don't include silver, but do include trace quantities (under 0.1%) of other metals (referred to as dopants) that supposedly work well; I don't have personal experience with them. Another poster in this thread mentioned Kester's K100Ld, which is about 99.3% tin, 0.7% copper, plus trace amounts of bismuth and nickel. Another variation on the theme uses traces of germanium; that was pioneered by Nihon Superior in Japan as SN100C, but the patents have now expired so similar products are available from other companies as well. AIM Solder sells SN100C globally. ChipQuik's?CQ100Ge is a similar product (0.7% copper, 0.05% nickel, 0.006% germanium, and the rest is tin). These no-silver alloys are less costly than SAC305 because silver is expensive, though more costly than 63/37 because lead is cheap.?
Again, avoid water soluble flux for hand assembly. Your?home bench doesn't have the right equipment to remove it easily. Rosin or no-clean are better choices. Mildly activated rosin flux, the kind that is in most rosin-core solder for electronics, does not need to be removed in most applications, but removal is necessary in ultralow current applications where leakage matters. Rosin flux can be removed with isopropyl alcohol or with special flux remover chemical mixes.
On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 7:59?AM Bryan Curl < bc3910@...> wrote: I wont use lead free for the same reasons the military wont. I used a 63/37 no clean on my last build with a no clean flux. Results were beautiful
That said, what ever you do, dont use that 20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box unless you want a mess of bad joints and sticky cleanup. I did that on my first qcx+ and the flux core was all dried up and made problems for me not to mention the clean up mess.
--
regards,
Bryan, N0LUF
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I use Kester 44 37/63 which is available in multiple diameters from really thin .010"
to?greater than 1/16th inch..? General use on the bench if the .030" size.? I've used
this for more than 4 decades with good results.? I do a fair amount of SMT
(also SMT rework) and use the .020 for that.? There are other equivalent
brands.
I despise using the lead free solders as they rework poorly and etch the
soldering iron tips resulting in poor life.? In industry I had to use it for some?
contracts where it was spelled out.??
A note with kit building rework us not uncommon so that is a significant
factor unless you are highly experienced.? ?Lead avoidance for heath
is simple don't eat it, ventilation, and wash your hands.
--
Allison
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Post online only,?
direct email will go to a bit bucket.
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That said, what ever you do, dont use that 20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box unless you want a mess of bad joints and sticky cleanup. I did that on my first qcx+ and the flux core was all dried up and made problems for me not to mention the clean up mess. Random thoughts... My solders range from 25 years at the newest (Bought from Sandy's Electronics in 1998) to the early 1900's. So long as it's not a corroded oxidized mess, that is, looks as bright and shiny as the day it was created, and not like it's been floating around in a plumbers truck bed for a decade, no issues with any, as recently as a couple of weekends ago. I would think the issue is more, "20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box". All of mine is still sealed, whether wrapped in cardboard, paper, or plastic, and not opened until needed. The only issues I've ever had is with acid core solder, and it rarely survives just sitting there for more than a few decades anyway. My newest is probably 1960's, and I haven't had a need for it since the 80's, so not really an issue. For non-rosin solders, I made a quart of liquid rosin in the early 00's, and apply a drop to each joint with a small poly squeeze bottle, and blunt needle, the same technique used in prototyping SMT boards in the late 90's. Drop, drop, part, solder, solder. Kurt
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Yep, I use only Kester 44 in 63/37, .015" diameter for SMD and
other small stuff, and 0.31" for most everything else.
Side note: why 63/37 and not 60/40?
63/37 is eutectic solder, meaning there is essentially no state
where it's not either a solid or liquid.? 60/40 has a "plasma"
state (for lack of a better term) between solid and liquid states
that CAN be the cause of solder bridges and other assorted messes
if one isn't careful.? No such issue with 63/37.? As long as you
know what you're soldering and your work is stable, 63/37 works
great.
And the "other stuff" that's lead-free, usually uses antimony,
and I don't care for it one bit.? The solder joints aren't as
clean or as strong as leaded solder, IMHO.
There ya go.
73,
Russ Hines
K8UYM
On 11/8/2023 11:33 AM, ajparent1/kb1gmx
wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
I use Kester 44 37/63 which is available in multiple diameters
from really thin .010"
to?greater than 1/16th inch..? General use on the bench if the
.030" size.? I've used
this for more than 4 decades with good results.? I do a fair
amount of SMT
(also SMT rework) and use the .020 for that.? There are other
equivalent
brands.
I despise using the lead free solders as they rework poorly and
etch the
soldering iron tips resulting in poor life.? In industry I had to
use it for some?
contracts where it was spelled out.??
A note with kit building rework us not uncommon so that is a
significant
factor unless you are highly experienced.? ?Lead avoidance for
heath
is simple don't eat it, ventilation, and wash your hands.
--
Allison
------------------
Post online only,?
direct email will go to a bit bucket.
|
Kester 63/37 is my choice.?
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Using leaded solder does not cause dementia.?
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An elmer gave me a new (big) roll of rosin core that he used at NJ Bell when I got my novice in
the mid '70s.
It built dozens of Heathkits, Coax connectors, and several QRP labs units lately. (It was a BIG roll, on a metal spool)
Still using it, and it is just fine!
....Dave? KD2E
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On 11/8/23 11:51 AM, Facility 406 wrote: That said, what ever you do, dont use that 20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box unless you want a mess of bad joints and sticky cleanup. I did that on my first qcx+ and the flux core was all dried up and made problems for me not to mention the clean up mess. Random thoughts...
My solders range from 25 years at the newest (Bought from Sandy's Electronics in 1998) to the early 1900's.? So long as it's not a corroded oxidized mess, that is, looks as bright and shiny as the day it was created, and not like it's been floating around in a plumbers truck bed for a decade, no issues with any, as recently as a couple of weekends ago.
I would think the issue is more, "20 year old rosin core laying around in the junk box".? All of mine is still sealed, whether wrapped in cardboard, paper, or plastic, and not opened until needed.
The only issues I've ever had is with acid core solder, and it rarely survives just sitting there for more than a few decades anyway.? My newest is probably 1960's, and I haven't had a need for it since the 80's, so not really an issue.
For non-rosin solders, I made a quart of liquid rosin in the early 00's, and apply a drop to each joint with a small poly squeeze bottle, and blunt needle, the same technique used in prototyping SMT boards in the late 90's.? Drop, drop, part, solder, solder.
Kurt
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>>>Using leaded solder does not cause dementia. <<<
After over 53 years in electronics, and building stuff for a
decade before that I haven't had issues nor do I know of
anyone that had.? ?But I've watched people go through
contortions to avoid lead because "they were told" and
generally its not an issue.?
Of cases I've read about.. most the sources were
leaded pipes, as in really old plumbing.
As to special cases back in the day Tektronix and HP
repairs did require a lead/tin/silver? solder especially
around the plated ceramic terminal strips.
--
Allison
------------------
Post online only,?
direct email will go to a bit bucket.
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I would point out that anyone born before 1978 has a lead level within their body. The lead mainly gets deposited in the skeletal structure. Sources of this lead are primarily leaded fuels and leaded paints. Trying to remove that lead by chelation will often cause the lead to be re-deposited in the heart, liver, and brain, so these chelation therapies are often a real bad idea.?
Allison is correct; For us, lead solder is generally safe for occasional use, provided we make the effort to maintain proper ventilation and we wash our hands post-use. In other words, use some common sense. In a full-time soldering facility, you follow the OSHA rules and do the air monitoring and provide positive ventilation so you keep levels low.?
Lee KX4TT
P.S. - I am a toxicologist by training, and I DO USE lead solder (with proper positive ventilation).??
On Wednesday, November 8, 2023 at 12:55:28 PM EST, ajparent1/kb1gmx <kb1gmx@...> wrote:
>>>Using leaded solder does not cause dementia. <<< After over 53 years in electronics, and building stuff for a decade before that I haven't had issues nor do I know of anyone that had.? ?But I've watched people go through contortions to avoid lead because "they were told" and generally its not an issue.? Allison
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60/40 and 50/50 tin lead solder have a “plastic” state between liquid “hot” and solid “cold” states where any movement in the joint will cause the cooling solder to crystallize and fracture into a “cold solder joint” that functions poorly at best. ?That’s why everyone in the know uses 63/37.
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Show quoted text
On Nov 8, 2023, at 12:09, Russ Hines <russ@...> wrote:
?
Yep, I use only Kester 44 in 63/37, .015" diameter for SMD and
other small stuff, and 0.31" for most everything else.
Side note: why 63/37 and not 60/40?
63/37 is eutectic solder, meaning there is essentially no state
where it's not either a solid or liquid.? 60/40 has a "plasma"
state (for lack of a better term) between solid and liquid states
that CAN be the cause of solder bridges and other assorted messes
if one isn't careful.? No such issue with 63/37.? As long as you
know what you're soldering and your work is stable, 63/37 works
great.
And the "other stuff" that's lead-free, usually uses antimony,
and I don't care for it one bit.? The solder joints aren't as
clean or as strong as leaded solder, IMHO.
There ya go.
73,
Russ Hines
K8UYM
On 11/8/2023 11:33 AM, ajparent1/kb1gmx
wrote:
I use Kester 44 37/63 which is available in multiple diameters
from really thin .010"
to?greater than 1/16th inch..? General use on the bench if the
.030" size.? I've used
this for more than 4 decades with good results.? I do a fair
amount of SMT
(also SMT rework) and use the .020 for that.? There are other
equivalent
brands.
I despise using the lead free solders as they rework poorly and
etch the
soldering iron tips resulting in poor life.? In industry I had to
use it for some?
contracts where it was spelled out.??
A note with kit building rework us not uncommon so that is a
significant
factor unless you are highly experienced.? ?Lead avoidance for
heath
is simple don't eat it, ventilation, and wash your hands.
--
Allison
------------------
Post online only,?
direct email will go to a bit bucket.
|
On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 07:59 AM, Bryan Curl wrote:
I wont use lead free for the same reasons the military wont
Google "tin whiskers", I have seen them inside of failed assemblies, they are scary..?? As to tin-lead's safety, I worked in a lab where blood tests to check for lead were performed, and my levels were always low, even though I used lead-bearing solders daily without extraordinary precautions aside from not having food or drink in the lab and washing my hands before eating.? No exhaust systems used.?? I have several different diameters of 63/37 solders, most from Multicore (a favorite) and Kester.? I have a lot of different tips, too.? I might use 3 different ones on a project.? Having the right size solder and tip helps immensely to get good joints. 73, Don N2VGU
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On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 12:55 PM, ajparent1/kb1gmx wrote:
As to special cases back in the day Tektronix and HP
repairs did require a lead/tin/silver? solder especially
around the plated ceramic terminal strips.
Which, by Tek at least, was provided on a spool internal to the instrument, to be used for future repairs. 73, Don N2VGU
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Donald,
When did Tek and HP do this and any particular equipment?? I don't recall seeing this but may have been all used up before the equipment got to me.
73, Tim KB2MFS
On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 4:34?PM Donald S Brant Jr < dsbrantjr@...> wrote: On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 12:55 PM, ajparent1/kb1gmx wrote:
As to special cases back in the day Tektronix and HP
repairs did require a lead/tin/silver? solder especially
around the plated ceramic terminal strips.
Which, by Tek at least, was provided on a spool internal to the instrument, to be used for future repairs.
73, Don N2VGU
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"Having the right size solder..."
My trick has been .031" diameter rosin core.
I pull it out in 10' lengths at 3, or 7 strands, put a weight on the end, then twist them with a drill motor.
This gives me three different sizes from one roll, at 1, 3 and 7 strands.
I then cut at 3", and fill a little box on the bench, one per size. When the fat little working strand gets too short to hold with the fingers, about 1/2", I use stainless tweezers, or a small hemostat.
Kurt
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I think Tek stopped in the mid to late 70s.
--
Allison
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Post online only,?
direct email will go to a bit bucket.
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Brian KN4RDF
Bruce Akhurst
Shirley Dulcey KE1L
Randy Ott
Lee
Donald S Brant Jr