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Thanks for all the replies
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@Jules- thanks for the paper, interesting reading, and thanks for confirming about LDC ORTF
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I will probably forego dismantling the smaller mics, and use them more traditionally, I was getting a little ahead of myself, I have several pairs of micbooster clippys I can use in SASS or Olson half-sphere rigs.?
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I know there are some shortcomings in using LDC for ORTF but I figure it's worth a go
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cheers
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Damian
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MEant to include this in my email. ORTF does rely on the pattern of the microphone. With that?being said being able to change that in post really makes this technique shine.
ways of s?
On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 12:06 PM, Roger Gustavsson via Still, the as hoff-axis response of large diameeuter capsules will show up in an ORTF setup. Den l?r 22 mars 2025 kl 17:15 skrev Jules Ryckebusch w2h0 w2h0via w2h0via as zvia <rychoOo 9 936-661-6969kebusch= [email protected]>: ORTF works great with LDC’s infinite all the time. Especially with pattern adjustable dual output mics.? Best Regards,
Jules Ryckebusch? On Mar 22, 2025, at 11:11, Roger Gustavsson via <roger.krokavadet=[email protected]> wrote:
? ORTF is intended for small diaphragm?capsules. With large diaphragm?capsules the result may be a bit different.
Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
-- Best Regards,
Jules Ryckebusch
214 399 0931
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On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 12:06 PM, Roger Gustavsson via groups.io <roger.krokavadet@...> wrote: chu b Still, the as hoff-axis response of large diameeuter capsules will show up in an ORTF setup. Den l?r 22 mars 2025 kl 17:15 skrev Jules Ryckebusch w2h0 w2h0via w2h0via as zvia <rychoOo 9 936-661-6969kebusch= [email protected]>: ORTF works great with LDC’s infinite all the time. Especially with pattern adjustable dual output mics.? Best Regards,
Jules Ryckebusch? On Mar 22, 2025, at 11:11, Roger Gustavsson via <roger.krokavadet=[email protected]> wrote:
? ORTF is intended for small diaphragm?capsules. With large diaphragm?capsules the result may be a bit different.
Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
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Still, the off-axis response of large diameter capsules will show up in an ORTF setup. Den l?r 22 mars 2025 kl 17:15 skrev Jules Ryckebusch via <ryckebusch= [email protected]>:
ORTF works great with LDC’s infinite all the time. Especially with pattern adjustable dual output mics.? Best Regards,
Jules Ryckebusch? On Mar 22, 2025, at 11:11, Roger Gustavsson via <roger.krokavadet=[email protected]> wrote:
? ORTF is intended for small diaphragm?capsules. With large diaphragm?capsules the result may be a bit different.
Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
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Le 22/03/2025 à 14:34, damiandrohanphoto via groups.io a écrit?:
1. Is it possible to use cardioid capsules in a SASS type array? I know the pickup pattern would be different. My plan would be to have the mics dismantled as with the example above. Has anyone tried it?
When you flush-mount cardioid capsules, they are no more cardioid, they are more or less omni. But the tuning of cardioid and omni is different. The response may lack LF. You might like it, or not.
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ORTF works great with LDC’s infinite all the time. Especially with pattern adjustable dual output mics.? Best Regards,
Jules Ryckebusch?
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Show quoted text
On Mar 22, 2025, at 11:11, Roger Gustavsson via groups.io <roger.krokavadet@...> wrote:
? ORTF is intended for small diaphragm?capsules. With large diaphragm?capsules the result may be a bit different.
Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
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ORTF is intended for small diaphragm?capsules. With large diaphragm?capsules the result may be a bit different.
Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
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Depends how you choose to mount the boards. If there are no components on the other side and you mount them on the same surface as the capsules - say on the lid - it seems these wires should be long enough. But it depends also on stand offs you choose. You will determine it when putting it all together. There's no way to know beforehand. And from the photo alone ?
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A couple of final questions about this.
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First- my friend has the mics dismantled (photo attached), the mic capsule is connected to the pcb by two short wires (5cm) and I figure these might have to be extended to allow for mounting on the type of box suggested by @pmfalcman in the thread above. Thoughts and suggestions much appreciated.
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When I bought the pair of mics pictured, i also bought the smaller, cheaper "neat worker bee II". The construction is like a smaller bodied version of the mic above, with a slightly smaller capsule. I would like to do something with those capsules also.
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Here's a pic of the worker bee II:
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If I could ask what might be fairly naive questions- I have googled but didn't find definitive answers
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1. Is it possible to use cardioid capsules in a SASS type array? I know the pickup pattern would be different. My plan would be to have the mics dismantled as with the example above. Has anyone tried it?
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2. I spoke to Curt Olson a little while back, by email, most of you probably know Curt's winged and half-sphere stereo arrays:
Curt kindly answered my questions and indicated that cardioid capsules could be used in the half sphere array, albeit with a more directional stereo field. Looking at the mounting of the capsule in the headbasket of the mic, it's centered and a bit away from the edges, and if I understand how the winged and half sphere arrays work, the edge of the capsule needs to be flush or almost flush to the surface- because of the boundary effect?
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I'm sorry if these questions are a bit naive, it's hard to find information on these things when your test case is so specific. I'm really keen to understand.?
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@pmfalcman, thanks so much, that's really helpful. I'll take a proper look at the photos.?
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Headbaskets are intentionally moved to the front (not centered width wise) to minimise sound reflections from the top of the body.
It would be advisable to 3D print own capsule mounts from rubbery/elastic filament with conical base. In order to help dampen vibrations and minimise noxious sound reflections.
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I made rough drafts (xlr connectors and "headbaskets" are to scale), top and side view, to facilitate imaging.
Still the PCB dimentions are crucial.
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/18pz4p1at7qr97Um7Ffhj6YhLFSVrt8FO/view?usp=drivesdk
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iYOMNjkhv7n4JZZrXlGtK5Msmp8EklxE/view?usp=drivesdk
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On Mon, Mar 3, 2025 at 10:07 AM, <damiandrohanphoto@...> wrote:
@pmfalcman thanks again. Hope it's not asking too much, would you be happy sharing photos of the full rig? It would be very helpful. Damian
I'd love to. Unfortunately I don't have it yet. Not even in loose parts.
I said this before - it's an idea at the moment and at first I plan to make two separate mics in these small enclosures from the photos.
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If you provide PCBs dimentions (height as well) I'll gladly help you with preliminary measurments to see if it's even feasible to squeeze everything in this enclosure.
There are also the XLR sockets to take under consideration. How far they'll protroude inside the enclosure.
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@pmfalcman thanks again. Hope it's not asking too much, would you be happy sharing photos of the full rig? It would be very helpful. Damian
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I'm not sure mine's better solution but I want a self contained unit. A "brick", well... sort of.
A sturdy piece of gear.
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And it's easier to fashion up some extra wind protection if need be. Couple of bent wires can be relatively easily affixed to the enclosure. The sides are sufficiently thick.
Same goes for a tripod mount.
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@pmfalcman - thanks so much, the photos area really useful. I might have to rethink my original idea. I'm not even sure how large the PCBs are. There's nothing to lose really, the mics were heavily discounted, so I can't go too far wrong.
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appreciate it,
Damian
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I sorted the issues with acces to the linked photos. I hope...
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Just in case, properly shared links:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aR5222DfDs89NxsWGcSC8mYvCznFt6FC/view?usp=drivesdk
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aFRbW-710wc8I24SKNS16ffLtLFbQ2kL/view?usp=drivesdk
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aUM_UPkMXWLYYr8vKYLoxDXVdRcXwy66/view?usp=drivesdk
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Sorry.
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As I like ORTF a lot I was cunningly planning to make myself a handy, self-contained unit, mostly for the reasons you stated above.
I came upon Magnusson's and DIY Perks' solutions long time ago but they seem too cumbersome to me.
DIY Perks' hack job is painful to watch ? and while Magnussons' work is good and proper (shielding!) the outcome is still large and cumbersome and the amount of work doesn't translate into compactness. It's only my feeling(!).
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Since the mic has to be dismantled then why not enclose the PCBs in a separate box and have the freedom to position capsules exactly as needed?
Here's the illustration of the idea:
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aFRbW-710wc8I24SKNS16ffLtLFbQ2kL/view?usp=drivesdk
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The box is obviously too small for NT1's PCB but I deal with OPIC circuit which fits in, I plan to build 2 separate mic at first and have no larger box at the moment. But you get the idea.
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Aluminium Hammond boxes (or their copies) are great for this and come in various sizes.
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aR5222DfDs89NxsWGcSC8mYvCznFt6FC/view?usp=drivesdk
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275x70x45 mm. Capsules in soft 3D printed mounts inside original headbaskets mounted at 110 deg at 17 cm distance fit with room to spare.
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Microphones' PCBs sandwiched inside on common motherboard standoffs:
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aUM_UPkMXWLYYr8vKYLoxDXVdRcXwy66/view?usp=drivesdk
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And one can use individual furry windshields for moderate winds or build smalker, individual blimps for stronger winds.
Sure, there's a question of elastic suspension (handling noise) but since I use a tripod anyway it wasn't a concern for me. One can fashion a "noise cancelling handle" for this.?
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@Kennjava good suggestions thanks.?
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@Heinz, thank you. His approach is interesting.? Didn't realise the photos had detailed captions.
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I think overall I'll be fine if I take my time. The mics were cheap, so there's only so much damage I can do :)
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On Sat, Mar 1, 2025 at 09:50 AM, Heinz wrote:
Hi Damian
Magnus Bergsson shared a photo album about his NT1a approach.
You'll find it here:
Heinz
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I forgot to mention that if you scroll through the photos of the album and click once on the little "i" (information) circle in the top right corner of the screen, you will get useful descriptions for some of Magnús Bergsson's photos.
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John Thaden
Roger Gustavsson