Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car

?

The chassis number listed is: 23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)

?

I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!

?

开云体育

Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people. ?It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.

Best, ?Nick

Show quoted text

On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via <zjoaomx@...> wrote:

Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car

?

The chassis number listed is: 23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)

?

I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!

?

#3725

Everyone: note that there is no photo of AM # on cockpit center square tube.

Sure sign of a fake.

There are duplicate AM #'s around as well.

Do your due diligence.

Dean Collins

Show quoted text

From: "elanman39 via groups.io" <n_adams@...>
To: "L23Registry" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2024 1:05:13 PM
Subject: Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people. ?It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.

Best, ?Nick

On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via <zjoaomx@...> wrote:

Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car

?

The chassis number listed is: 23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)

?

I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!

?

#3726

It seems rather disingenuous to me that the advertisement states "Year of Manufacture: 1963" when it clearly is not based upon the reply previous to Dean's.

Brian Elkins

Show quoted text

On Wed, Nov 20, 2024, 2:55?PM Dean Collins via <collinsdean=[email protected]> wrote:

Everyone: note that there is no photo of AM # on cockpit center square tube.
Sure sign of a fake.

There are duplicate AM #'s around as well.
Do your due diligence.
Dean Collins

From: "elanman39 via " <n_adams=[email protected]>
To: "L23Registry" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2024 1:05:13 PM
Subject: Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people.? It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.

Best, ?Nick

On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via <zjoaomx@...> wrote:

Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car

?

The chassis number listed is: 23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)

?

I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!

?

#3727

开云体育

Whats the asking price it is obviously non genuine but some fool might get caught . MURRAY CHARNLEY

?

Show quoted text

From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Brian Elkins via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, 21 November 2024 6:04 AM
To: [email protected] Group Moderators <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

?

It seems rather disingenuous to me that the advertisement states "Year of Manufacture: 1963" when it clearly is not based upon the reply previous to Dean's.

?

Brian Elkins

?

On Wed, Nov 20, 2024, 2:55?PM Dean Collins via <collinsdean=[email protected]> wrote:

Everyone: note that there is no photo of AM # on cockpit center square tube.
Sure sign of a fake.
?
There are duplicate AM #'s around as well.
Do your due diligence.
Dean Collins
?
From: "elanman39 via " <n_adams=[email protected]>
To: "L23Registry" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2024 1:05:13 PM
Subject: Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871
?
Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people.? It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.
?
Best, ?Nick
?
On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via <zjoaomx@...> wrote:
?
Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car
?
The chassis number listed is: 23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)
?
I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!
?
?
?

#3731

开云体育

I didn’t say and wouldn’t say it’s not a genuine 23; I’m not rich enough to fight a law suit! ?What I can say is there is not enough proven history for the Lotus 23 register to be able to determine if it is a real car or what it’s identity was.??If you haven’t shared evidence of your cars history to us then we might well have to say the same about your car if we were asked.?The lack of a frame number doesn’t prove it’s not real, there are plenty out there missing numbers for perfectly legitimate reasons. ?Worryingly there are many more out there with duplicated, incorrect or incorrectly stamped frame numbers which in many ways concern me more than those that are just missing. Don’t forget there are twice as many claimed 23’s ?known to us than Lotus ever built!

If you want to check on what we know about your car or even better if you want to improve our knowledge of it then feel free to contact us any time either by a personal mail from this site or via the HLR website as below

Best, ?Nick

Nick Adams
Registrar, Lotus 23
Historic Lotus Register

DISCLAIMER
Introduction - Information regarding inter?alia cars, components, ownership or past?usage provided in good faith in whole or?in part by Historic Lotus Register Ltd?(HLR) and its officers may have been?collected from a variety of sources, some?or all of which may not be complete,?verified, verifiable or proven. ?HLR and?its officers do not warranty the ?accuracy,?completeness or originality that may?implied by the information provided or?the value of the information inferred by?the recipient. ?Information regarding?specific cars may be revealed at this?time or at any time in the future which?contradicts or raises doubts about?authenticity or originality. ?Other cars?claiming the same identity may exist or?appear at some stage in the future on?our records and HLR and its officers?disclaim any liability arising from this?information now or in the future.

?

The Terms and Conditions of the full?Historic Lotus Register Ltd. Disclaimer?takes precedence over this short?introduction ?and can be found on?o/HLR%20-%20Disclaimer.html?

Show quoted text

On 20 Nov 2024, at 23:27, Murray Charnley via <mnm_jaycogipsy@...> wrote:

Whats the asking price it is obviously non genuine but some fool might get caught . MURRAY CHARNLEY
?
From:?[email protected]?<[email protected]>?On Behalf Of?Brian Elkins via?
Sent:?Thursday, 21 November 2024 6:04 AM
To:?[email protected]?Group Moderators <[email protected]>
Subject:?Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871
?
It seems rather disingenuous to me that the advertisement states "Year of Manufacture: 1963" when it clearly is not based upon the reply previous to Dean's.
?
Brian Elkins
?
On Wed, Nov 20, 2024, 2:55?PM Dean Collins via?<collinsdean=[email protected]> wrote:
Everyone: note that there is no photo of AM # on cockpit center square tube.
Sure sign of a fake.
?
There are duplicate AM #'s around as well.
Do your due diligence.
Dean Collins
?
From:?"elanman39 via?" <n_adams=[email protected]>
To:?"L23Registry" <[email protected]>
Sent:?Wednesday, November 20, 2024 1:05:13 PM
Subject:?Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871
?
Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people.? It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.
?
Best, ?Nick
?
On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via??<zjoaomx@...> wrote:
?
Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car?
?
The chassis number listed is:?23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)
?
I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!
?
?
?

#3732

Hello

?

I restore a early car - comes to germany in 1964/65 with a 1100 ccm Cossy and a Renault box - imported from the Behnke Brothers ( Behnke Condor cars ) in Munich
They install a BMW M10 - 2 LTR and a Colotti - later a MK 8 - so this 23 never had a Twin Cam

I rebuild it with a proper Nerus BMW Engine and a MK8

On the Blade between the seats stamped MK23/9

Sadly, the rear end from the engine area was later modified - so the AM Number was lost ( Any chance to find the AN number with the MK 23/9 number ? )

?

regards? Karl / Germany

Gesendet: Donnerstag, 21. November 2024 um 18:55

Von: "elanman39 via groups.io" <n_adams@...>

An: [email protected]

Betreff: Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

I didn’t say and wouldn’t say it’s not a genuine 23; I’m not rich enough to fight a law suit! ?What I can say is there is not enough proven history for the Lotus 23 register to be able to determine if it is a real car or what it’s identity was.??If you haven’t shared evidence of your cars history to us then we might well have to say the same about your car if we were asked.?The lack of a frame number doesn’t prove it’s not real, there are plenty out there missing numbers for perfectly legitimate reasons. ?Worryingly there are many more out there with duplicated, incorrect or incorrectly stamped frame numbers which in many ways concern me more than those that are just missing. Don’t forget there are twice as many claimed 23’s ?known to us than Lotus ever built!

If you want to check on what we know about your car or even better if you want to improve our knowledge of it then feel free to contact us any time either by a personal mail from this site or via the HLR website as below

?

Best, ?Nick

Nick Adams
Registrar, Lotus 23
Historic Lotus Register

DISCLAIMER
Introduction - Information regarding inter?alia cars, components, ownership or past?usage provided in good faith in whole or?in part by Historic Lotus Register Ltd?(HLR) and its officers may have been?collected from a variety of sources, some?or all of which may not be complete,?verified, verifiable or proven. ?HLR and?its officers do not warranty the ?accuracy,?completeness or originality that may?implied by the information provided or?the value of the information inferred by?the recipient. ?Information regarding?specific cars may be revealed at this?time or at any time in the future which?contradicts or raises doubts about?authenticity or originality. ?Other cars?claiming the same identity may exist or?appear at some stage in the future on?our records and HLR and its officers?disclaim any liability arising from this?information now or in the future.

?

The Terms and Conditions of the full?Historic Lotus Register Ltd. Disclaimer?takes precedence over this short?introduction ?and can be found on?o/HLR%20-%20Disclaimer.html?

Show quoted text

On 20 Nov 2024, at 23:27, Murray Charnley via <mnm_jaycogipsy@...> wrote:

Whats the asking price it is obviously non genuine but some fool might get caught . MURRAY CHARNLEY

?

From:?[email protected]?<[email protected]>?On Behalf Of?Brian Elkins via?
Sent:?Thursday, 21 November 2024 6:04 AM
To:?[email protected]?Group Moderators <[email protected]>
Subject:?Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

?

It seems rather disingenuous to me that the advertisement states "Year of Manufacture: 1963" when it clearly is not based upon the reply previous to Dean's.

?

Brian Elkins

?

On Wed, Nov 20, 2024, 2:55?PM Dean Collins via?<collinsdean=[email protected]> wrote:

Everyone: note that there is no photo of AM # on cockpit center square tube.

Sure sign of a fake.

?

There are duplicate AM #'s around as well.

Do your due diligence.

Dean Collins

?

From:?"elanman39 via?" <n_adams=[email protected]>
To:?"L23Registry" <[email protected]>
Sent:?Wednesday, November 20, 2024 1:05:13 PM
Subject:?Re: [L23Registry] Strange Chassis number? 23-R-871

?

Hi Joao, we can discuss when you call me tomorrow but the 23R871 number was put on this car by it’s owner when he built it and then wanted to sell it abroad ( probably the first car he built in 1987!), so he just invented a number for the customs people.? It is not in any way an original Lotus chassis number.

?

Best, ?Nick

?

On 20 Nov 2024, at 15:48, zjoao_mx via??<zjoaomx@...> wrote:

?

Still on my quest to buy a 23, found this car?

?

The chassis number listed is:?23-R-871 (checked plate in photos)

?

I couldn't find information on Lotus 23s with R in their chassis number. Can anyone help? Thanks!

?

?

?

?