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Hello everyone
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Hello all! I'm new to the group and wanted to introduce myself. My
family, Cholodecki, comes from Wolyn, my grandfather came from the village of Kudranka, which was between Luwipol and Kostopol. Most of my family was either from the Luck or Zytomierz administrative areas. My grandfather and the rest of the Cholodecki's fled Kudranka during the war in 1943, many were murdered and didn't make it. The Cholodecki's from around Zytomierz on the other hand were deported to Kazakhstan. I don't know the exact years, all I know is that it occurred anywhere between 1936-1945. I don't even know my exact relation to those Cholodecki's, but I do know that my grandfather traveled to visit them many times as a child. Currently I'm working up my family geneaology, but my grandmother in particular would like to invite the family from Kazakhstan (if any of it remains) back to her home in Poland. I've enquired but have so far been unable to obtain any info about whether, and in what place, any Cholodecki's exist in Kazakhstan, Russia or Ukraine. My father claims that in the early 90's he saw a list of people that were helped by donations in Kazakhstan and that a Cholodecki was on it. My last name is rather rare, so anyone with a Cholodecki last name is likely related to me. So that's a little about me, I've enjoyed reading many messages with interesting information in this group thus far! Lukasz Cholodecki |
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Hello Lukasz,
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Welcome to Kresy-Siberia!?
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Witold?Cholodecki is listed in the Index of the Repressed of
as having been murdered by the Russians in Charkow.? He was born in 1912, his father's name was Wladyslaw.? You can e-mail them at indeks@...? to tell them about your family's history and ask if they know how to locate your family in Kazakhstan...
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Also, see ? PAH stands for Polska Akcja Humanitarna=Polish Humanitarian Action (literal translation).? There is an English version? of the site with information on Kazakhstan where they also work.? They state that there are 70,000 Poles in Kazakhstan whom they help and who want to?immigrate to Poland.? I wonder if the list your dad saw came from that organization.? Their e-mail: ? pah@...???? I know nothing about them, just searched for 'Kazakhstan+Poles.'
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Please read my 1-19-03 message on Wolyn genocide and IPN.?
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For my personal information -- how did you decide on Milicz?? The reason I ask is that some of my paternal grandmother's family (surnames Szulc and Niemiec) came from 'beyond the Bug River' but I don't know where from.? All I know is that some?of my father's?cousins? were deported to the vicinity of Wroclaw?and lived in Dabrowa, powiat Milicz.? I've been told that they used to live in Dabrowa 'beyond the Bug River.'? Any geographic connection here?
milicz wrote: Hello all!? I'm new to the group and wanted to introduce myself.? My |
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Thank you very much for that information! I saw Witold on the Katyn
memorial wall, but now I guess that it is an inaccuracy then, or maybe two Witold Cholodecki's were killed in 1940? WW2/katyn_memorial_wall/kmw_C.html I think I have his family tree worked back accurately (to the 1600's), but I am still working on my side of the family, I know we're related, I just don't know exactly how. I went ahead and emailed both groups, hopefully they will get back to me. As for Milicz, yes, that is were my family resettled, or was resettled. In fact most Cholodecki's left in Poland are in close proximity to Milicz. As for Dabrowa beyond the Bug, well what about the village of Dąbrowa = in the district of Brześć nad Bugiem in Polesie? I'll have a loo= k at some old maps at home to see if the village is shown anywhere. Thanks for all of your great info! Lukasz --- In Kresy-Siberia@..., HJ Trevelyan <hjtrevelyan@s...> wrote: Hello Lukasz, as having been murdered by the Russians in Charkow. He was born in1912, his father's name was Wladyslaw. You can e-mail them at indeks@k... to tell them about your family's history and ask if they know how to locate your family in Kazakhstan... Humanitarna=Polish Humanitarian Action (literal translation). There is an English version of the site with information on Kazakhstan where they also work. They state that there are 70,000 Poles in Kazakhstan whom they help and who want to immigrate to Poland. I wonder if the list your dad saw came from that organization. Their e- mail: pah@p... I know nothing about them, just searched for 'Kazakhstan+Poles.' reason I ask is that some of my paternal grandmother's family (surnames Szulc and Niemiec) came from 'beyond the Bug River' but I don't know where from. All I know is that some of my father's cousins were deported to the vicinity of Wroclaw and lived in Dabrowa, powiat Milicz. I've been told that they used to live in Dabrowa 'beyond the Bug River.' Any geographic connection here? Dane osobowe Nazwisko:Cho?odecki滨尘颈ê:WitoldImiê ojca:W?adys?awaDataurodzenia: 1912represjiKrajWoj/Ob?astPow.Miej.r m d r m d 1. Mord 1940 04 Ukraina Charkowska Charków2. Obóz 1940 04 Ukraina ?uga?ska Starobielsk represjonowanych b?d? ich rodziny, zbiory O?rodka KARTA, sygnatura IR/ numer ankiety. IR /138932.Wykaz akt ewidencyjnych je?ców wojennych, którzy opu?cili obóz NKWD w Starobielsku, kopia w zbiorach O?rodka KARTA - pozycja. STAR /3502 My family, Cholodecki, comes from Wolyn, my grandfather came from theof my family was either from the Luck or Zytomierz administrative |
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Scratch what I wrote, it is the same Witold, Starobielsk was one of
the camps from which those murdered in Katyn came from, so it all makes sense. Lukasz --- In Kresy-Siberia@..., "milicz" <milicz@y...> wrote: Thank you very much for that information! I saw Witold on theKatyn memorial wall, but now I guess that it is an inaccuracy then, orto me.Dąbrowa = have a loo= k at<hjtrevelyan@s...> wrote:inHello Lukasz, 1912, his father's name was Wladyslaw. You can e-mail them atthey know how to locate your family in Kazakhstan...ThereHumanitarna=Polish Humanitarian Action (literal translation). is an English version of the site with information on Kazakhstane- mail: pah@p... I know nothing about them, just searchedojca:W?adys?awaData urodzenia:samych1912represjiKrajWoj/Ob?astPow.Miej.r m d r m d 1. Mord 1940 04 represjonowanych b?d? ich rodziny, zbiory O?rodka KARTA, sygnaturazbiorach O?rodka KARTA - pozycja. STAR /3502theMy Mostvillage of Kudranka, which was between Luwipol and Kostopol. ofmy family was either from the Luck or Zytomierz administrative |
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Hi Lukasz,
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You're welcome and thanks for the Dabrowa locations.? I'd appreciate your looking further at your detailed maps.
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There's probably no mistake re Witold? Cholodecki's place of death since over the years Poles have come to refer? to several?locations collectively as Katyn.?? Those are the locations where Russians committed genocide of Polish intelligentsia (most often Polish military and police officers, civil servants, etc) with the specific aim of depriving Poland of its future leaders.? Some of the places collectively called KATYN are Katyn, of course, but also Charkow, and Twer.? Almost the entire Polish intelligentsia was wiped out, under the Geneva Conventions such an act is?considered genocide.
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You may also want to?e-mail? the Polish Red Cross=Polski Czerwony Krzyz at: biuro.poszukiwan@...? They are obligated to search for the fate of victims of WWII and family members divided by the same.? Be patient, they're so underfunded that it took them 6-8 months to get back to me.
Their address: Polski Czerwony Krzyz Zarzad Glowny 00-561 Warszawa ul. Mokotowska 14, skr. poczt. 47 Polska/Poland ?
You can also try Centralne Archiwum Wojskowe=Central Military Archives and ask for the military records of any family members who were in the Polish military in Poland (you go to the (British) MOD if they had been with the Western Allies).?? address and e-mail:
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Since you're interested in a genealogical search,?I'll list?what?was provided for my great uncle, Adam Ludwik Krycinski: ?his service record, pay record, marital status, wife's name, year of marriage, dependents, schools as far back as?elementary school, parents' names and address, and birth date and place.? My great uncle was murdered by the Russians?in the?Katyn Forest Massacre.? He was a captain in the Korpus Ochrony Pogranicza,?had been?in Haller's Army in France, and had fought in the Polish-Soviet War.? CAW informed us that Russia has not provided Poland with all of the records on Katyn (here I'm talking about the actual Katyn, not the collective Katyn, though I don't believe that Russia has provided the other records either).
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Best regards,
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Halina
South Pasadena, CA, USA
Lukasz wrote: I saw Witold on the Katyn memorial wall, but now I guess that it is an inaccuracy then, or maybe two Witold Cholodecki's were killed in 1940? |
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Amelia Remmert
开云体育Halina Trevelyan,? California,
USA
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I
can't help but notice the name Szulc in your message.? This is the same
name that my cousin who is Czech has in her family lineage.? The Szulc
family came to the US in about the early 1900's.? Not sure on exact
date.? With the borders changing so often back in those days I wonder if
they may have live in Czech territory before the borders
changed.
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Amy
Remmert
Kalamazoo? MI?
acremmert@...
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Hi Amy,
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I appreciate the information.?? Like your cousin's family my paternal side also came to the United States?in the early 1900s.? In looking for my Szulcs (my grandmother's sister's six children)?I found out that? in the early 1990's there were 25,697 Szulcs in Poland!?
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Cordially,
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Halina
California, USA
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Amelia Remmert? wrote:
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