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I just learned that the convenient Bishop Creek shuttle has been discontinued, presumably due to poor ridership. I was able to secure a Bishop Pass permit this morning for my trip this summer, if all goes as planned. I have hitchhiked many places in the Sierra Nevada but never from Bishop to South Lake. I assume it’s easy? Maybe more so if I make a sign and offer $20? My first night would be Dusy Basin so I don’t have to start super early and could wait a while for a ride. Hoping this isn’t an unusually hard spot to hitchhike. I’d prefer to not arrange a shuttle as my life is such that I can’t know if the trip is on for sure until maybe a week before it happens.
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I generally never pick up hitchhikers, but going up to South Lake from Bishop was one place that I did ~ they had a sign "Bishop Pass" and I collected them just on the way out of town.??
On Monday, March 4, 2024 at 11:11:58 AM PST, ravi_jmt2013 <ravi@...> wrote:
I just learned that the convenient Bishop Creek shuttle has been discontinued, presumably due to poor ridership. I was able to secure a Bishop Pass permit this morning for my trip this summer, if all goes as planned. I have hitchhiked many places in the Sierra Nevada but never from Bishop to South Lake. I assume it’s easy? Maybe more so if I make a sign and offer $20? My first night would be Dusy Basin so I don’t have to start super early and could wait a while for a ride. Hoping this isn’t an unusually hard spot to hitchhike. I’d prefer to not arrange a shuttle as my life is such that I can’t know if the trip is on for sure until maybe a week before it happens.
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It's a popular trailhead so I wouldn't think you would have any problems catching a ride.? I did a hike starting there in 2022 and the shuttle was very handy.? I think I may have been the only one that got off at the TH so you are probably correct about the reason they discontinued the route last year.? ?I'm doing a hike starting at North Lake this year and am planning on getting a shuttle, but hitch on the way down on my return.
On Mon, Mar 4, 2024, 11:11?AM ravi_jmt2013 < ravi@...> wrote: I just learned that the convenient Bishop Creek shuttle has been discontinued, presumably due to poor ridership. I was able to secure a Bishop Pass permit this morning for my trip this summer, if all goes as planned. I have hitchhiked many places in the Sierra Nevada but never from Bishop to South Lake. I assume it’s easy? Maybe more so if I make a sign and offer $20? My first night would be Dusy Basin so I don’t have to start super early and could wait a while for a ride. Hoping this isn’t an unusually hard spot to hitchhike. I’d prefer to not arrange a shuttle as my life is such that I can’t know if the trip is on for sure until maybe a week before it happens.
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Ravi-
I tried to persuade ESTA to keep the Bishop Creek Shuttle in place.? I was concerned that the reported numbers didn't make sense - If you divided the reported revenue by the reported number of riders, the average fare per rider exceeded what the full-distance fare was.? I felt I didn't get a good explanation for why that was.? Also, on the cost side, ESTA assigned a per hour figure about 150% greater than flatland routes due to the elevation change.
The executive director of ESTA has asked me to work with him to get Inyo NF to apply for FLAP (Federal Lands Access Program) money for shuttles up to the trailheads, I'm thinking Bishop Creek, Onion Valley, and Horseshoe Meadow, however the next round of FLAP money grants isn't for a couple of years.
Steve
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The $5 fare might have been too good of a deal. Even at $10-15 it would be a very valuable service for hikers and maybe that would help the economics.
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Ravi, I had the same thought regarding upping the fare for the shuttle as required to bring the cost in line with whatever metric ESTA needed to meet.? Although, without knowing the numbers it's hard to figure whether it would have been financially?viable for ESTA or potential riders.
It is unfortunate as it was very handy for me as have a number of the ESTA routes been as well.? Just remember some routes are M-F? or M-Sat only, which I just realized I overlooked on the trip I'm planning!
Curt
On Tue, Mar 5, 2024, 3:15?PM ravi_jmt2013 < ravi@...> wrote: The $5 fare might have been too good of a deal. Even at $10-15 it would be a very valuable service for hikers and maybe that would help the economics.
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Curt/Ravi-
I encouraged ESTA to try raising the fare on the Bishop Creek shuttle, did a quickie facebook poll and found that most people were willing to pay $20, so I suggested that rate and that was what was adopted in 2022.? Looking at the reported 2022 ridership numbers I did the math, and dividing total Bishop Creek Shuttle fares collected ($5150) by the reported number of
passengers (155) yields an average $32.80 fare/passenger, when the maximum fare
charged in 2022 was $20. Obviously something was off.? I expressed my concern that the ESTA board was making a decision based on possibly spurious numbers, but only one board member voted to continue the service.? My other big concern was that the bus left each morning before a bus from Mammoth arrived in Bishop.
By all measures of bus productivity (riders per hour, revenue per hour) the Bishop Creek Shuttle would be in the lower quartile of ESTA services, but it is comparable or better to some services that they operate because they consider them to be essential transportation.? The BCS was not considered essential.? The cost to operate the BCS in 2022 was ~ $35,000.
However, the reality is a subsidy is required.? I think one possible interesting way to help out the service financially would be for it to bring hiker resupply boxes to the trailheads for a $20 fee and stuff it into bear boxes at the trailhead, but as I understand it, that is not allowed because of the exclusivity clauses in the packer's leases/commercial services permits.
I will be trying to work with ESTA and Inyo to get FLAP money for town-to-trailhead services, but that is a couple years down the road.
Steve
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Appreciate your advocacy?
On Wed, Mar 6, 2024 at 10:26?AM steve herr via <groundhogsteve= [email protected]> wrote: Curt/Ravi-
I encouraged ESTA to try raising the fare on the Bishop Creek shuttle, did a quickie facebook poll and found that most people were willing to pay $20, so I suggested that rate and that was what was adopted in 2022.? Looking at the reported 2022 ridership numbers I did the math, and dividing total Bishop Creek Shuttle fares collected ($5150) by the reported number of
passengers (155) yields an average $32.80 fare/passenger, when the maximum fare
charged in 2022 was $20. Obviously something was off.? I expressed my concern that the ESTA board was making a decision based on possibly spurious numbers, but only one board member voted to continue the service.? My other big concern was that the bus left each morning before a bus from Mammoth arrived in Bishop.
By all measures of bus productivity (riders per hour, revenue per hour) the Bishop Creek Shuttle would be in the lower quartile of ESTA services, but it is comparable or better to some services that they operate because they consider them to be essential transportation.? The BCS was not considered essential.? The cost to operate the BCS in 2022 was ~ $35,000.
However, the reality is a subsidy is required.? I think one possible interesting way to help out the service financially would be for it to bring hiker resupply boxes to the trailheads for a $20 fee and stuff it into bear boxes at the trailhead, but as I understand it, that is not allowed because of the exclusivity clauses in the packer's leases/commercial services permits.
I will be trying to work with ESTA and Inyo to get FLAP money for town-to-trailhead services, but that is a couple years down the road.
Steve
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Yes, thanks for your efforts and information on the status of this and other transportation options.? Funny, I don't recall what I paid in 2022, but it could have been $20.
I guess the good news is there are plenty of commercial private shuttles available.? Of course, at a much higher cost.
Curt
Appreciate your advocacy? On Wed, Mar 6, 2024 at 10:26?AM steve herr via <groundhogsteve= [email protected]> wrote: Curt/Ravi-
I encouraged ESTA to try raising the fare on the Bishop Creek shuttle, did a quickie facebook poll and found that most people were willing to pay $20, so I suggested that rate and that was what was adopted in 2022.? Looking at the reported 2022 ridership numbers I did the math, and dividing total Bishop Creek Shuttle fares collected ($5150) by the reported number of
passengers (155) yields an average $32.80 fare/passenger, when the maximum fare
charged in 2022 was $20. Obviously something was off.? I expressed my concern that the ESTA board was making a decision based on possibly spurious numbers, but only one board member voted to continue the service.? My other big concern was that the bus left each morning before a bus from Mammoth arrived in Bishop.
By all measures of bus productivity (riders per hour, revenue per hour) the Bishop Creek Shuttle would be in the lower quartile of ESTA services, but it is comparable or better to some services that they operate because they consider them to be essential transportation.? The BCS was not considered essential.? The cost to operate the BCS in 2022 was ~ $35,000.
However, the reality is a subsidy is required.? I think one possible interesting way to help out the service financially would be for it to bring hiker resupply boxes to the trailheads for a $20 fee and stuff it into bear boxes at the trailhead, but as I understand it, that is not allowed because of the exclusivity clauses in the packer's leases/commercial services permits.
I will be trying to work with ESTA and Inyo to get FLAP money for town-to-trailhead services, but that is a couple years down the road.
Steve
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Do you have names of private shuttles from bishop to South Lake by chance?
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On Mar 6, 2024, at 12:55?PM, Curt Kinchen <ptcurt@...> wrote:
? Yes, thanks for your efforts and information on the status of this and other transportation options.? Funny, I don't recall what I paid in 2022, but it could have been $20.
I guess the good news is there are plenty of commercial private shuttles available.? Of course, at a much higher cost.
Curt Appreciate your advocacy? On Wed, Mar 6, 2024 at 10:26?AM steve herr via <groundhogsteve= [email protected]> wrote: Curt/Ravi-
I encouraged ESTA to try raising the fare on the Bishop Creek shuttle, did a quickie facebook poll and found that most people were willing to pay $20, so I suggested that rate and that was what was adopted in 2022.? Looking at the reported 2022 ridership numbers I did the math, and dividing total Bishop Creek Shuttle fares collected ($5150) by the reported number of
passengers (155) yields an average $32.80 fare/passenger, when the maximum fare
charged in 2022 was $20. Obviously something was off.? I expressed my concern that the ESTA board was making a decision based on possibly spurious numbers, but only one board member voted to continue the service.? My other big concern was that the bus left each morning before a bus from Mammoth arrived in Bishop.
By all measures of bus productivity (riders per hour, revenue per hour) the Bishop Creek Shuttle would be in the lower quartile of ESTA services, but it is comparable or better to some services that they operate because they consider them to be essential transportation.? The BCS was not considered essential.? The cost to operate the BCS in 2022 was ~ $35,000.
However, the reality is a subsidy is required.? I think one possible interesting way to help out the service financially would be for it to bring hiker resupply boxes to the trailheads for a $20 fee and stuff it into bear boxes at the trailhead, but as I understand it, that is not allowed because of the exclusivity clauses in the packer's leases/commercial services permits.
I will be trying to work with ESTA and Inyo to get FLAP money for town-to-trailhead services, but that is a couple years down the road.
Steve
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The only paid shuttler I have ever hired was Lone Pine Kurt but, as his name implies, he's far south of Bishop so I'm not sure his rates would be great for Bishop to South Lake. His email is? LonePineKurt@...in case you want to try. East Side Sierra Shuttle is another popular shuttler although I've never used them.?
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fabramhall@... Anne is shuttle driver Recommend by Lone Pine Kurt.
Heather L McCoy @mermaidlovesmountains
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On Mar 11, 2024, at 7:57?AM, ravi_jmt2013 <ravi@...> wrote:
?The only paid shuttler I have ever hired was Lone Pine Kurt but, as his name implies, he's far south of Bishop so I'm not sure his rates would be great for Bishop to South Lake. His email is? LonePineKurt@...in case you want to try. East Side Sierra Shuttle is another popular shuttler although I've never used them.?
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There's a list here of the various shuttle services and transit options.
fabramhall@... Anne is shuttle driver Recommend by Lone Pine Kurt.
Heather L McCoy @mermaidlovesmountains On Mar 11, 2024, at 7:57?AM, ravi_jmt2013 <ravi@...> wrote:
?The only paid shuttler I have ever hired was Lone Pine Kurt but, as his name implies, he's far south of Bishop so I'm not sure his rates would be great for Bishop to South Lake. His email is? LonePineKurt@...in case you want to try. East Side Sierra Shuttle is another popular shuttler although I've never used them.?
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Parchers Resort recommended Wayne Stone, cell 909-562-6549. I have not used him before, but will be using him in August. Wayne promptly responded to my texts.
?
Mike Sherman
On 03/11/2024 9:12 AM CDT Randy <rpsatterfield@...> wrote:
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Do you have names of private shuttles from bishop to South Lake by chance?
Randy Satterfield?
On Mar 6, 2024, at 12:55?PM, Curt Kinchen <ptcurt@...> wrote:
Yes, thanks for your efforts and information on the status of this and other transportation options.? Funny, I don't recall what I paid in 2022, but it could have been $20.
?
I guess the good news is there are plenty of commercial private shuttles available.? Of course, at a much higher cost.
?
Curt
Appreciate your advocacy?
On Wed, Mar 6, 2024 at 10:26?AM steve herr via <groundhogsteve= [email protected]> wrote:
Curt/Ravi-
?
I encouraged ESTA to try raising the fare on the Bishop Creek shuttle, did a quickie facebook poll and found that most people were willing to pay $20, so I suggested that rate and that was what was adopted in 2022.? Looking at the reported 2022 ridership numbers I did the math, and dividing total Bishop Creek Shuttle fares collected ($5150) by the reported number of passengers (155) yields an average $32.80 fare/passenger, when the maximum fare charged in 2022 was $20. Obviously something was off.? I expressed my concern that the ESTA board was making a decision based on possibly spurious numbers, but only one board member voted to continue the service.? My other big concern was that the bus left each morning before a bus from Mammoth arrived in Bishop.
?
By all measures of bus productivity (riders per hour, revenue per hour) the Bishop Creek Shuttle would be in the lower quartile of ESTA services, but it is comparable or better to some services that they operate because they consider them to be essential transportation.? The BCS was not considered essential.? The cost to operate the BCS in 2022 was ~ $35,000.
?
However, the reality is a subsidy is required.? I think one possible interesting way to help out the service financially would be for it to bring hiker resupply boxes to the trailheads for a $20 fee and stuff it into bear boxes at the trailhead, but as I understand it, that is not allowed because of the exclusivity clauses in the packer's leases/commercial services permits.
?
I will be trying to work with ESTA and Inyo to get FLAP money for town-to-trailhead services, but that is a couple years down the road.
?
Steve
?
?
?
?
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Thank you.? Sent from my mobile phone. Please excuse any misspellings.?
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On Mar 11, 2024, at 11:34?AM, Curt Kinchen <ptcurt@...> wrote:
? There's a list here of the various shuttle services and transit options.
fabramhall@... Anne is shuttle driver Recommend by Lone Pine Kurt.
Heather L McCoy @mermaidlovesmountains On Mar 11, 2024, at 7:57?AM, ravi_jmt2013 <ravi@...> wrote:
?The only paid shuttler I have ever hired was Lone Pine Kurt but, as his name implies, he's far south of Bishop so I'm not sure his rates would be great for Bishop to South Lake. His email is? LonePineKurt@...in case you want to try. East Side Sierra Shuttle is another popular shuttler although I've never used them.?
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These are the shuttles permitted by Inyo to operate on FS land.?
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Thanks for the info, Inga!
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To clarify my previous comments, Parchers' recommendation was to shuttle me to their resort, not the trailhead.
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I highly recommend checking Yelp reviews on any shuttle service permitted by Inyo National Forest.? Not all businesses permitted have good service reputations.? I, along with many others I have spoken to, have had very bad experiences resulting in additonal costs and safety concerns.? It is unfortunate that the forest service does not vet the firms they allow to be permitted.
Phil Westmoreland
These are the shuttles permitted by Inyo to operate on FS land.?
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Paul at Eastside Sierra shuttle is a good guy.?
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On Mar 12, 2024, at 6:40?PM, Phil <tresninos120@...> wrote:
? I highly recommend checking Yelp reviews on any shuttle service permitted by Inyo National Forest.? Not all businesses permitted have good service reputations.? I, along with many others I have spoken to, have had very bad experiences resulting in additonal costs and safety concerns.? It is unfortunate that the forest service does not vet the firms they allow to be permitted.
Phil Westmoreland These are the shuttles permitted by Inyo to operate on FS land.?
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ravi_jmt2013
Andrew Paisley
Inga