Re: HP 652A Dial Calibration
I have a 331A that I bought and put on the shelf years ago. All this made me pull that and give it a better test than the first time (I don't think I knew exactly how to use it then). Turns out it works pretty well (dirty pots - again - and dirty switch contacts but does work.
To tie this to the Dial Calibration subject, I noticed that the gearing for the 331A differs from the 334A and the 652A I have. The 331A uses several extra gears and a friction clutch that works so much better than the little plastic "grabber" disc that the 334A and 652A (and others) use. Nice to see that.
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
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----- Original Message ----- From: "David Platt" <dplatt-groups@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2020 10:52:18 PM
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP 652A Dial Calibration
I agree, it's not a good idea to start bending plates on that big three-way
air variable capacitor.? Once done there's really no way to go back, and I
suspect you'd be likely to make things worse rather than better.
The HP 651 has a complex frequency-calibration procedure in the service
manual.? Adjusting the calibration on some bands requires changing out a
pair of selected-at-manufacture-time resistors on the bandswitch.? For some
other band there's an adjustment capacitor.? I believe that the 652 has the
same architecture, and I'd recommend following the manual instructions
carefully if you decide to do this.
One thing it would probably be good to do first... measure, record, and plot
the actual frequencies on each of the bands at each major digit position.
? By comparing the bands you may be able to see whether there's an overall
shift in the calibration affecting most or all of the bands (which would
point to a dial-positioning or main-capacitor issue) or whether some bands
are shifted differently than others (which might suggest that the
band-specific resistors or caps are out of whack).
The 651B is only spec'ed to 2% frequency accuracy on some bands and 3% on
others, so exact dial calibration can't really be expected.
Oh... make sure that you take your measurements with the cabinet lid and base
on and the screws tightened, as the manual advises.? There's a very
significant frequency and calibration shift if you take off the lid... the
parasitic capacitance from the active circuit to the case is part of the
equation!
Also, check the tuning cap for contamination (dust, etc.) - if there's any
present it could throw things off.? I bought a 651 which was quite balky and
wouldn't oscillate at all in some portions of the dial range (on any band).
? I found some dark gunk on the plates, and splashed in a few places around
the base of the capacitor... looked as if somebody had spattered Coca Cola
on it.? It took a good, careful water-wash to get it out (and then a spritz
with contact cleaner to flush out the water, and some blown air to dry it
properly) and now it oscillates and tracks nicely.? (It also had the "HP
grease turns to cement with age" problem, and I had to do a
strip-down/clean/lubricate much as you did.)
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Re: new File called App notes
On 4/19/2020 10:45 AM, Dave McGuire wrote: On 4/19/20 12:14 AM, Richard Knoppow wrote:
?? App notes mean Application notes. Publications that explained how to
use instruments. They varied from a single sheet to practically a book.
-hp- had some very good app notes on spectrum analysis and impedance
mesurement. General Radio also published ap notes on various techniques
such as sound measurement. These publications were often ahead of any
text book. They've never been restricted to being about how to use instruments.
Many are about how to perform measurements, and other
non-instrument-specific stuff. For example, the "bible" of that
mysterious "guard" terminal on high-end voltmeters: AN123, "Floating
Measurements and Guarding", from HP.
App notes also come from component manufacturers...usually (but not
always!) they are about applications for a specific component, but many
many of them are much more general. There's practically an EE degree's
worth of information distilled in the ones published by Linear
Technology over the years, for example.
?? I don't mean to take this away from Dave but its an example to me of
how once perfectly obvious meanings have been lost with time. Uhh...this is a very current term.
-Dave
You completely missed the point of my comment. -- Richard Knoppow dickburk@... WB6KBL
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Re: Jacks added to 6623A System PSU
On 4/19/20 9:07 PM, Jared Cabot via groups.io wrote: I have a 6644A, which is a little different, that I added front panel binding posts to. I 3D printed a holder that sits inside to position the binding posts correctly.
I also added a switch to select between internal sense connection or the external sense binding posts.
As for shorting links, I usually use these ones:
Standard binding-post spacing is exactly 3/4 inch. --doug
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Re: Jacks added to 6623A System PSU
I have a 6644A, which is a little different, that I added front panel binding posts to. I 3D printed a holder that sits inside to position the binding posts correctly.
I also added a switch to select between internal sense connection or the external sense binding posts.
As for shorting links, I usually use these ones:
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Re: Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
That is all well and good, but my experience predates all of this.? I dscovered it as far back as the 1940s.? A look at people like Sarnoff and Napoleon should prove that greed is nothing new.
We are taught not to be greedy, to share with the less fortunate, but those who preach those values are not examples of their own teachings.
Sometimes I am embarrassed to be a member of the human race.? Sure, people are basically honest, as long as they think they are being watched.
Bob
On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 05:39:47 PM PDT, Jim Ford <james.ford@...> wrote:
Yes, indeed.? Why do we need faster and faster hardware?? Slower and slower software, of course!? The problem is that software is getting slower and slower faster than hardware is getting faster and faster. :(
Jim Ford?
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message -------- From: Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> Date: 4/19/20 5:03 PM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
On 4/19/20 7:38 PM, Bob Albert via groups.io wrote: > I must say that I saw a pattern in my professional life.? Everywhere I > went, including the military, I was told that things were really nice a > while back, and I should have been there then.? Perhaps nostalgia isn't > what it used to be. ? This didn't just happen at random.? This, along with another major problem, software bloat, can be traced to just about the same time and the same type of attitude. ? Sometime in the 1970s, I think it was, some clueless economics professor in some ivory tower said something to the effect of "the sole purpose of any corporation is to make money by any means possible," all other considerations be damned.? Suits all over the world took this as if they'd just been released from some sort of prison (where many of them arguably belong) and they went absolutely wild.? It was then that the decline of these corporations, and the rise of extreme levels of sleaze at the executive level, began.? Enron, Worldcom, etc.? Crime no longer need take place in dark alleys and crack houses, it moved to the comfort of the boardroom!? We all get screwed daily by the result of this. ? Also sometime in the 1970s, another moron, probably related to the one described above, said "programmer time is more valuable than processor time".? This similarly caused the laziest programmers to act as if they'd be unchained, and the decline of computing efficiency, and caring about same, began.? This is why modern OSs require multi-GHz clock speeds and billions of bytes of memory just to boot, much less get any work done. ? If I ever get my hands around the neck of either of these men, they will have a difficult day. ????????????? -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Re: Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
Yes, indeed.? Why do we need faster and faster hardware?? Slower and slower software, of course!? The problem is that software is getting slower and slower faster than hardware is getting faster and faster. :(
Jim Ford?
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
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-------- Original message -------- From: Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> Date: 4/19/20 5:03 PM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
On 4/19/20 7:38 PM, Bob Albert via groups.io wrote: > I must say that I saw a pattern in my professional life.? Everywhere I > went, including the military, I was told that things were really nice a > while back, and I should have been there then.? Perhaps nostalgia isn't > what it used to be. ? This didn't just happen at random.? This, along with another major problem, software bloat, can be traced to just about the same time and the same type of attitude. ? Sometime in the 1970s, I think it was, some clueless economics professor in some ivory tower said something to the effect of "the sole purpose of any corporation is to make money by any means possible," all other considerations be damned.? Suits all over the world took this as if they'd just been released from some sort of prison (where many of them arguably belong) and they went absolutely wild.? It was then that the decline of these corporations, and the rise of extreme levels of sleaze at the executive level, began.? Enron, Worldcom, etc.? Crime no longer need take place in dark alleys and crack houses, it moved to the comfort of the boardroom!? We all get screwed daily by the result of this. ? Also sometime in the 1970s, another moron, probably related to the one described above, said "programmer time is more valuable than processor time".? This similarly caused the laziest programmers to act as if they'd be unchained, and the decline of computing efficiency, and caring about same, began.? This is why modern OSs require multi-GHz clock speeds and billions of bytes of memory just to boot, much less get any work done. ? If I ever get my hands around the neck of either of these men, they will have a difficult day. ????????????? -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Can anyone tell me if 1820-0757 and 1820-0759 are the same part.
They both cross to 1DC4-0903.
This appears to be a HP internal number.
Thanks
Glenn
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Glenn Little ARRL Technical Specialist QCWA LM 28417
Amateur Callsign: WB4UIV wb4uiv@... AMSAT LM 2178
QTH: Goose Creek, SC USA (EM92xx) USSVI LM NRA LM SBE ARRL TAPR
"It is not the class of license that the Amateur holds but the class
of the Amateur that holds the license"
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Re: Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
I'll hold their hands behind their backs, to make sure you get the job done easily.
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On 20/04/20 12:03 pm, Dave McGuire wrote: If I ever get my hands around the neck of either of these men, they
will have a difficult day.
-Dave
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Decline, was Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
On 4/19/20 7:38 PM, Bob Albert via groups.io wrote: I must say that I saw a pattern in my professional life.? Everywhere I
went, including the military, I was told that things were really nice a
while back, and I should have been there then.? Perhaps nostalgia isn't
what it used to be. This didn't just happen at random. This, along with another major problem, software bloat, can be traced to just about the same time and the same type of attitude. Sometime in the 1970s, I think it was, some clueless economics professor in some ivory tower said something to the effect of "the sole purpose of any corporation is to make money by any means possible," all other considerations be damned. Suits all over the world took this as if they'd just been released from some sort of prison (where many of them arguably belong) and they went absolutely wild. It was then that the decline of these corporations, and the rise of extreme levels of sleaze at the executive level, began. Enron, Worldcom, etc. Crime no longer need take place in dark alleys and crack houses, it moved to the comfort of the boardroom! We all get screwed daily by the result of this. Also sometime in the 1970s, another moron, probably related to the one described above, said "programmer time is more valuable than processor time". This similarly caused the laziest programmers to act as if they'd be unchained, and the decline of computing efficiency, and caring about same, began. This is why modern OSs require multi-GHz clock speeds and billions of bytes of memory just to boot, much less get any work done. If I ever get my hands around the neck of either of these men, they will have a difficult day. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Re: Agilent 8753es Option 11 and TDR Measurements...
John,
That's become a way of life in the Los Angeles area with the TV re-pack going on and a lot of FM antennas having to be relocated and re-tuned - even in the daytime hours.? :)
Burt, K6OQK
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Re: new File called App notes
First, it was William Hewlett, a fine engineer who was affiliated with Terman, who helped him design the 200 oscillator.
I must say that I saw a pattern in my professional life.? Everywhere I went, including the military, I was told that things were really nice a while back, and I should have been there then.? Perhaps nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
Bob K6DDX
On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 04:32:13 PM PDT, Andy ZL3AG via groups.io <zl3ag@...> wrote:
On 20/04/20 11:25 am, Richard Knoppow wrote:
>? ?? I worked for -hp- a million years ago. While whatever expertise I had is probably completely obsolete it remains the best company I ever worked for.
"HP, as it was then, remains the best company I ever worked for"
FIFY, in case someone glances over that sentence and thinks HP2020 is anything like the fabulous company it was 40+ years ago.
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Re: new File called App notes
On 20/04/20 11:25 am, Richard Knoppow wrote: ?? I worked for -hp- a million years ago. While whatever expertise I had is probably completely obsolete it remains the best company I ever worked for. "HP, as it was then, remains the best company I ever worked for" FIFY, in case someone glances over that sentence and thinks HP2020 is anything like the fabulous company it was 40+ years ago.
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Re: new File called App notes
True. They don't make 'em like they used to. I've worked for quite a few companies that were much greater places to work in bygone days...
Jim Ford
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------ Original Message ------ From: "Richard Knoppow" <dickburk@...> To: [email protected]Sent: 4/19/2020 4:25:28 PM Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes Thanks Paul, I was afraid I was teaching my grandmother to suck eggs. Its not from being a newby so much as being an oldby. I grew up on -hp- Ap Notes and Bench Briefs (which are not underwear for the shop).
I worked for -hp- a million years ago. While whatever expertise I had is probably completely obsolete it remains the best company I ever worked for.
On 4/19/2020 1:16 AM, Paul Bicknell wrote:
RE: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
Hi Richard
Thank you for your input butIthink theDave'swerehaving a laugh at myexpenseasIhade reducedApplicationnotes to a shortenedversion
Regarding being lost in time its meaning has changed to mean smallexecutableprogrammesas used on smartcell phones
Perhapsthe(apps on phones)executableprogrammesshould have been called EP¡¯snowIthink that would have confused thenewbie¡¯s
BestRegards Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Richard Knoppow
Sent: 19 April 2020 05:14
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
App notes mean Application notes. Publications that explained
how to use instruments. They varied from a single sheet to
practically a book. -hp- had some very good app notes on spectrum
analysis and impedance mesurement. General Radio also published
ap notes on various techniques such as sound measurement. These
publications were often ahead of any text book.
I don't mean to take this away from Dave but its an example
to me of how once perfectly obvious meanings have been lost with
time.
On 4/18/2020 1:56 PM, ArtekManuals wrote:
Paul I am not sure what you mean by an app note ..please give an example. In my world an App is just another word ( millennial speak) for a "program". A lot like Hz replaced Cycle. Since 95% of those on this list are old enough to remember cycles do you want us to load equipment related programs uyo your App folder? Dave PS: I sent you another private email earlier today to which you didn't respond ? On 4/18/2020 4:35 PM, Paul Bicknell wrote: new File called App notes
Hi all
Recently I have beenlookingat app notes for equipment
andrealisedwe do not have acollectionon the site
SoIn the File section I have made a File called *App notes*
CouldIask you all to helpwithputtingany App notes you have in
PDF format into the new file
Best Regards Paul
--
Richard Knoppow
dickburk@...
WB6KBL
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18
Internal Virus Database is out of date.
-- Richard Knoppow
dickburk@...
WB6KBL
|
Re: new File called App notes
Thanks Paul, I was afraid I was teaching my grandmother to suck eggs. Its not from being a newby so much as being an oldby. I grew up on -hp- Ap Notes and Bench Briefs (which are not underwear for the shop).
?? I worked for -hp- a million years ago. While whatever expertise I had is probably completely obsolete it remains the best company I ever worked for.
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On 4/19/2020 1:16 AM, Paul Bicknell wrote: RE: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
Hi Richard
Thank you for your input butIthink theDave'swerehaving a laugh at myexpenseasIhade reducedApplicationnotes to a shortenedversion
Regarding being lost in time its meaning has changed to mean smallexecutableprogrammesas used on smartcell phones
Perhapsthe(apps on phones)executableprogrammesshould have been called EP¡¯snowIthink that would have confused thenewbie¡¯s
BestRegards Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Richard Knoppow
Sent: 19 April 2020 05:14
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
App notes mean Application notes. Publications that explained
how to use instruments. They varied from a single sheet to
practically a book. -hp- had some very good app notes on spectrum
analysis and impedance mesurement. General Radio also published
ap notes on various techniques such as sound measurement. These
publications were often ahead of any text book.
I don't mean to take this away from Dave but its an example
to me of how once perfectly obvious meanings have been lost with
time.
On 4/18/2020 1:56 PM, ArtekManuals wrote:
Paul I am not sure what you mean by an app note ..please give an example. In my world an App is just another word ( millennial speak) for a "program". A lot like Hz replaced Cycle. Since 95% of those on this list are old enough to remember cycles do you want us to load equipment related programs uyo your App folder? Dave PS: I sent you another private email earlier today to which you didn't respond ? On 4/18/2020 4:35 PM, Paul Bicknell wrote: new File called App notes
Hi all
Recently I have beenlookingat app notes for equipment
andrealisedwe do not have acollectionon the site
SoIn the File section I have made a File? called *App notes*
CouldIask you all to helpwithputtingany App notes you have in
PDF format? into the new file
Best Regards Paul
--
Richard Knoppow
dickburk@...
WB6KBL
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18
Internal Virus Database is out of date.
--
Richard Knoppow
dickburk@...
WB6KBL
|
Re: new File called App notes
Sad but true. :(? The HP name went with the computers, printers, servers, etc back in 1999, and Walter Hewlett fought it, but money talks.? Then the Agilent name (no great loss there; a former coworker who had worked there called it Agilen't!) went with the non-test-equipment part of the business in 2014.? Ironic that the group that started it all ends up getting marginalized time and again.? Almighty dollars and suits that can see only them once again.? Don't get me started about how HP Semiconductor became the abomination Avago Technologies, who swallowed up AT&T Microelectronics/Agere, LSI Logic, Broadcom (while I was there), and God knows what else.? God help us!? Bright side is, He will!
Jim Ford?
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
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-------- Original message -------- From: "Stuart Landau via groups.io" <stuartl73@...> Date: 4/19/20 3:05 PM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] new File called App notes
I suspect that most at Keysight have little or no idea of the legacy that came before them as Hewlett Packard and Agilent. They most likely couldn't care less. Stuart K6YAZ Los Angeles, USA
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Re: new File called App notes
On 4/19/20 6:00 PM, Stuart Landau via groups.io wrote: Well written application notes are some of the best educational tools
available; whether they are instrument specific or more general.
?
I prize the General Radio, Boonton, Wiltron and Hewlett Packard app
notes. They have been a source of a great deal of my practical education. Hmm, I don't think I've ever seen any Wiltron app notes. Got any pointers? (or maybe a tar file?) -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Re: new File called App notes
On 4/19/20 6:05 PM, Stuart Landau via groups.io wrote: I suspect that most at Keysight have little or no idea of the legacy
that came before them as Hewlett Packard and Agilent. They most likely
couldn't care less. I'm sure they don't. It's often said, and I've seen this borne out in company after company, that management and marketing types generally don't even have to know what the product is. And the higher up in the management hierarchy they are, the more they focus on the bottom line...meaning literally the line at the bottom, the profit margin. Anything else is incidental, a low-level detail for "lesser" people, and can just as easily (and probably should be) just be farmed out to China. One thing that we've forgotten in this society is that execute management is positions are *overhead* positions. Any sane organization seeks to minimize overhead, but that's not the way we do things anymore. Is it really any wonder that it's all going to shit? -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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HP-3421A Service Manual is required.
There is one HP-3421A that does not turn on (+15, -15, + 5V is dead).
The measured value of C708 where oscillation is occurring inside the capacitor is 495(0.205).
C708(25V, 470uF) was replaced.
And when you turn on the power, +16.9V is measured in TP700, +7V in RT700, and +6.6V on top, regardless of S502(Switch).
However, +15V, -15V, and +5V cannot be measured.
I suspect the U702(LM393N, Dual Differential Comparator), but it is not easy to analyze because there is no circuit diagram.
If the ¡°Wakeup Logic¡± on the left side of the figure can be related to S502, the problem is complicated, so I need a schematic.
Please tell me where to buy the service manual schematic(pdf, jpg). ?
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Re: Jacks added to 6623A System PSU
On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 11:09 AM, Michael Dunn wrote:
Does anyone know a source for pre-made ones
Well... I haven't seen (doesn't mean they don't exist)... but, I haven't seen the ones stamped out of sheet steel lately, and hardly the ones stamped out of brass ever. But Pamona makes what they call "Stackable Shorting Double Banana Plug" with the banana plugs centered at 0.75 inch... that fit my HP 6111A, et. al. power supplies. Jameco, and others sell them. See. Best regards.
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E4418B modification information for the stand by battery
Hi all
Can anyone help me with the modification information
for the E4418B
to stop the stand by battery from draining
?
I know it exists as I had it a few months
ago / last year but unable to find in my HP manuals
Regards Paul ?
?
?
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Jared Cabot
Dave McGuire
Burt K6OQK
Paul Bicknell