Re: Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?
Dr. David Kirkby from Kirkby Microwave Ltd
There could be a case for treating it separately, if, once calibrated , it could be used with other 4285A instruments, so would need a separate cal certificate. At least administratively I think that would be the case.
The resistor could be used with any 4285A. There's no S/N on the resistor, so its not in any way tied to a particular instrument. But every other 4285A should have its resistor too - that said, many 4285As on eBay are sold without the resistor.
Dave
--
Dr David Kirkby Ph.D C.Eng MIET
Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Registered office: Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, CHELMSFORD, Essex, CM3 6DT, United Kingdom.
Registered in England and Wales as company number 08914892
Tel 01621-680100 / +44 1621-680100
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Re: HP 141T sn:1850A 16959, hp: 8556A sn: 1907A 04190 and hp 8552B sn:1841B sn:1841A15130
Can¡¯t give the location, they are still throwing stuff out. :-)
On Thursday, October 11, 2018, 10:48 AM, Daniel Koller via Groups.Io <kaboomdk@...> wrote:
Ok, this begs the questions:? Where?? What dumpster?? We can't help you until you tell us exactly where this dumpster is!? ;)
And there are places that still throw things in dumpsters?? Every source I have ever acquired stuff from in the past has long since switched to "property management" for disposal.? I haven't had a cool dumpster find in 20 years.
? Dan
On Wednesday, October 10, 2018, 8:22:35 PM EDT, George Fridrich via Groups.Io <george.fridrich@...> wrote:
Just saved the 141T from the dumpster, powered unit up and got no initial signal on Scope, found 1/4 amp fuse open, put fuse in, brought unit up without modules in and fuse did not blow, inspected both 855 units, found 8552B had a burnt component smell, removed A7 board and found R7 burned badly! ?Q2,3,4,6,712 & 18 ?open ( not working). I down loaded some manuals, I want to check voltages before repairing the board, not sure where the voltage test points are on the 141T, drawings are not very good. I would like to find replacement transistors & were to find R7 131ohm 1% resistor 1/8 watt. I would like to bring it back to life, it is so well made, a work of art! Any help would be appreciated.
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FS: AGILENT 33250A Function Generator AWG
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Condition: Working excellent Price: 1800$ or best offer. Payment: paypal after inspection
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4X6MU ISRAEL
email: ilan_4x6mu@...
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Re: Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?
There could be a case for treating it separately, if, once calibrated , it could be used with other 4285A instruments, so would need a separate cal certificate. At least administratively I think that would be the case. ?
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Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dr. David Kirkby from Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 11:10 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?? Never seen a clear policy on that. My feeling is if it¡¯s essential to the operation of the Instrument, it should be included in the Instrument Calibration. If it¡¯s an optional accessory then it should be separate.
That's my opinion too, but Keysight want extra to calibrate it. Looking on the find-a-part website, the resistor is only used with the 4285A. I really can't see any justification for charging extra to calibrate the resistor.?
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Re: Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?
Dr. David Kirkby from Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Never seen a clear policy on that. My feeling is if it¡¯s essential to the operation of the Instrument, it should be included in the Instrument Calibration. If it¡¯s an optional accessory then it should be separate.
That's my opinion too, but Keysight want extra to calibrate it.
Looking on the find-a-part website, the resistor is only used with the 4285A. I really can't see any justification for charging extra to calibrate the resistor.?
Dave.?
Dave.?
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Re: HP 141T sn:1850A 16959, hp: 8556A sn: 1907A 04190 and hp 8552B sn:1841B sn:1841A15130
Notice that he doesn't tell us where it is!?? :-)
Daun
On 10/11/2018 10:52 AM, bownes wrote:
My university has a special place for these sorts of goodies.
Worth walking past a few times a day. :)
On Oct 11, 2018, at 10:48, Daniel Koller via Groups.Io < kaboomdk@...>
wrote:
Ok, this begs the questions:? Where?? What dumpster??
We can't help you until you tell us exactly where this
dumpster is!? ;)
And there are places that still throw things in
dumpsters?? Every source I have ever acquired stuff from
in the past has long since switched to "property
management" for disposal.? I haven't had a cool dumpster
find in 20 years.
? Dan
On Wednesday, October 10, 2018, 8:22:35 PM EDT,
George Fridrich via Groups.Io < george.fridrich@...>
wrote:
Just saved the 141T from the dumpster, powered
unit up and got no initial signal on Scope, found
1/4 amp fuse open, put fuse in, brought unit up
without modules in and fuse did not blow,
inspected both 855 units, found 8552B had a burnt
component smell, removed A7 board and found R7
burned badly! ?Q2,3,4,6,712 & 18 ?open ( not
working). I down loaded some manuals, I want to
check voltages before repairing the board, not
sure where the voltage test points are on the
141T, drawings are not very good. I would like to
find replacement transistors & were to find R7
131ohm 1% resistor 1/8 watt. I would like to bring
it back to life, it is so well made, a work of
art! Any help would be appreciated.
--
Daun E. Yeagley II, N8ASB
|
Re: Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?
Never seen a clear policy on that. My feeling is if it¡¯s essential to the operation of the Instrument, it should be included in the Instrument Calibration. If it¡¯s an optional accessory then it should be separate . ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dr. David Kirkby from Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 6:32 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?? The HP/Agilent 4285A LCR meter was supplied as standard with a 100-ohm resistor, P/N 04285-61001. It is a 4-terminal device with 4 BNC connectors on it. It is a furnished accessory, essential to use the 4285A properly, and is only used with the 4285A. (See photo from manual). I've sent the 4285A LCR meter to Keysight, but they want extra to calibrate the resistor. Does that seem reasonable, and/or normal practice? I don't know the specifications of the resistor, so can't calibrate it myself. Although I have a 6.5 digit multimeter, the RF properties of this resistor are probably important, as it is used to 30 MHz. -- Dr David Kirkby Ph.D C.Eng MIET
Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Registered office: Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, CHELMSFORD, Essex, CM3 6DT, United Kingdom.
Registered in England and Wales as company number 08914892
Tel 01621-680100 / +44 1621-680100
|
Re: HP 141T sn:1850A 16959, hp: 8556A sn: 1907A 04190 and hp 8552B sn:1841B sn:1841A15130
My university has a special place for these sorts of goodies. Worth walking past a few times a day. :)
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Show quoted text
On Oct 11, 2018, at 10:48, Daniel Koller via Groups.Io < kaboomdk@...> wrote:
Ok, this begs the questions:? Where?? What dumpster?? We can't help you until you tell us exactly where this dumpster is!? ;)
And there are places that still throw things in dumpsters?? Every source I have ever acquired stuff from in the past has long since switched to "property management" for disposal.? I haven't had a cool dumpster find in 20 years.
? Dan
On Wednesday, October 10, 2018, 8:22:35 PM EDT, George Fridrich via Groups.Io < george.fridrich@...> wrote:
Just saved the 141T from the dumpster, powered unit up and got no initial signal on Scope, found 1/4 amp fuse open, put fuse in, brought unit up without modules in and fuse did not blow, inspected both 855 units, found 8552B had a burnt component smell, removed A7 board and found R7 burned badly! ?Q2,3,4,6,712 & 18 ?open ( not working). I down loaded some manuals, I want to check voltages before repairing the board, not sure where the voltage test points are on the 141T, drawings are not very good. I would like to find replacement transistors & were to find R7 131ohm 1% resistor 1/8 watt. I would like to bring it back to life, it is so well made, a work of art! Any help would be appreciated.
|
Re: HP 141T sn:1850A 16959, hp: 8556A sn: 1907A 04190 and hp 8552B sn:1841B sn:1841A15130
Ok, this begs the questions:? Where?? What dumpster?? We can't help you until you tell us exactly where this dumpster is!? ;)
And there are places that still throw things in dumpsters?? Every source I have ever acquired stuff from in the past has long since switched to "property management" for disposal.? I haven't had a cool dumpster find in 20 years.
? Dan
On Wednesday, October 10, 2018, 8:22:35 PM EDT, George Fridrich via Groups.Io <george.fridrich@...> wrote:
Just saved the 141T from the dumpster, powered unit up and got no initial signal on Scope, found 1/4 amp fuse open, put fuse in, brought unit up without modules in and fuse did not blow, inspected both 855 units, found 8552B had a burnt component smell, removed A7 board and found R7 burned badly! ?Q2,3,4,6,712 & 18 ?open ( not working). I down loaded some manuals, I want to check voltages before repairing the board, not sure where the voltage test points are on the 141T, drawings are not very good. I would like to find replacement transistors & were to find R7 131ohm 1% resistor 1/8 watt. I would like to bring it back to life, it is so well made, a work of art! Any help would be appreciated.
|
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Show quoted text
On Oct 11, 2018, at 10:11 AM, Peter Gottlieb < hpnpilot@...> wrote: Let¡¯s see if a photo will make it:  On Oct 11, 2018, at 12:44 AM, pianovt via Groups.Io < pianovt@...> wrote: Peter, can you post a picture and/or PN of that bad YTO? I can actually recall at least three YTOs that were used in the 8970. The last version is a small one, Agilent standardized on that YTO for almost all their products. The earlier ones are much bigger.
Vladan
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Let¡¯s see if a photo will make it:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Oct 11, 2018, at 12:44 AM, pianovt via Groups.Io < pianovt@...> wrote: Peter, can you post a picture and/or PN of that bad YTO? I can actually recall at least three YTOs that were used in the 8970. The last version is a small one, Agilent standardized on that YTO for almost all their products. The earlier ones are much bigger.
Vladan
|
Re: HP8663A Firmware difference
Hi Askild
The contents of the EPROMS will be different for the various production batches which are identified by the first four digits of the serial number. ?The simple way of checking them is by using a signature analyser such as the HP5005 series or Tek 308.
The full service manual gives the signatures for the various production batches, in case you do not know the first two digits give the year of the batch and the second two the week.
The standard fault with the 8663A is the power supply.
73 George G6HIG
On Thursday, October 11, 2018 2:27 PM, Askild <megafluffy@...> wrote:
Hi all,
Short question is, do anybody know the difference in the 16 x 2516/2716(2k x 8) vs the 1 x 27256 (32k x 8)? firmware for the HP 8663A?
Long version :) I found a HP 8663A in a dumpster a while?back, it was missing top and bottom cover, as well as two of the pcb's in the psu. And it had been raining, so it was quite wet. Had also broken a few of the smc connectors on its travel to the dumpster. I have now done a complete disassemble, cleaned all parts for corrosion, replaced the broken connectors and started to reassemble it. I also found that the OCXO was toasted, quite crispy... So I have ordered and received on off ebay. I'm going to use lab power supplies to power it during testing to see if there is any hope for it, the linear regulator board was present in the psu, and it's OK, so I'm using that to regulate the 3 voltages that go trough it. So far I have tested that the OCXO I bought on ebay is OK, and I have tested the generator with only front panel and the digital boards. It seems to be OK, it responds to input via buttons and rpg. It does freeze if I set frequency to something? above 600MHz, but I wont worry about that before I have tested with all the analog parts. When doing this test, I did see that it draw about 6amps on the 5V supply, and after it had been running for a little while, I checked the temperatures on the different boards, and found that the EPROMs (TMS2516) was the hottest IC's. So I have ordered, but not received yet, a bunch of AT28C16, to try to get the power consumption down a bit. I checked my readout of my eproms vs what i found on KO4BB, and it seems to be good. I also checked and found out that the 32kB file is very similar, so I split it in 16, and checked each part vs the 16 x 2kB files, and many is equal, and many just a few bytes is different, and some have a lot of difference. So if I get everything up and running, I might try to load my 16 split of the 32kB firmware and see how that goes.. But there might be someone here that knows what the difference between the two is?
Serial: 2405A00359
Br Askild Eide
By the way, there is over 200? #4-40UNC? screws on each side of this instrument. I ordered new hex version, as mine was rusted and hard to get out.?
|
HP8663A Firmware difference
Hi all,
Short question is, do anybody know the difference in the 16 x 2516/2716(2k x 8) vs the 1 x 27256 (32k x 8)? firmware for the HP 8663A?
Long version :) I found a HP 8663A in a dumpster a while?back, it was missing top and bottom cover, as well as two of the pcb's in the psu. And it had been raining, so it was quite wet. Had also broken a few of the smc connectors on its travel to the dumpster. I have now done a complete disassemble, cleaned all parts for corrosion, replaced the broken connectors and started to reassemble it. I also found that the OCXO was toasted, quite crispy... So I have ordered and received on off ebay. I'm going to use lab power supplies to power it during testing to see if there is any hope for it, the linear regulator board was present in the psu, and it's OK, so I'm using that to regulate the 3 voltages that go trough it. So far I have tested that the OCXO I bought on ebay is OK, and I have tested the generator with only front panel and the digital boards. It seems to be OK, it responds to input via buttons and rpg. It does freeze if I set frequency to something? above 600MHz, but I wont worry about that before I have tested with all the analog parts. When doing this test, I did see that it draw about 6amps on the 5V supply, and after it had been running for a little while, I checked the temperatures on the different boards, and found that the EPROMs (TMS2516) was the hottest IC's. So I have ordered, but not received yet, a bunch of AT28C16, to try to get the power consumption down a bit. I checked my readout of my eproms vs what i found on KO4BB, and it seems to be good. I also checked and found out that the 32kB file is very similar, so I split it in 16, and checked each part vs the 16 x 2kB files, and many is equal, and many just a few bytes is different, and some have a lot of difference. So if I get everything up and running, I might try to load my 16 split of the 32kB firmware and see how that goes.. But there might be someone here that knows what the difference between the two is?
Serial: 2405A00359
Br Askild Eide
By the way, there is over 200? #4-40UNC? screws on each side of this instrument. I ordered new hex version, as mine was rusted and hard to get out.?
|
Re: Off Topic : What is the 10 second accuracy of a Trimble 57963-D GPSDO?
Hi Donald --
The GPSDO is essentially a PLL that uses a crystal oscillator as a flywheel to smooth out the short-term noise of the GPS pulse.? The loop time constant depends on the quality of the XO used, but is usually a few thousand seconds.? So performance in the short term, certainly at ten seconds, is almost entirely that of the XO.
John
----
Hello Carsten. Interesting that you say that it`s the OXCO that is the determining factor, not ,for example, the number of satellites aquired, or something else. I shall store that snippet of information away:-). The OXCO in my unit [ I wish the builder had given it a model number] has TPN : 57964-80, this might mean Trimble Part No 57964-80,? "Sec Code: EP92-01321 H", and " D/C: 10/06 ". These codes are on a label stuck on the OXCO, by the Chinese builder, so He/She/They must have considered this important. The label that Trimble stuck on the OXCO states P/N 73090, serial number 468010-0114, and date code 0950. From this I guess that the Trimble PCB was manufactured in 1995, and the unit assembled in Oct 2006. Do you have the gen on this OXCO Carsen?, and hoping the foregoing information is of interest to you. No, I haven`t used Lady Heather to look at this unit, as I`m not sure how to connect the RS232 9-pin "D" connector to my computer [It has TxD, and RxD, and little else] . Wishing you well...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Donald.
On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 7:44 PM Carsten Bormann <
cabocabo@...> wrote:
For 10 s, that depends almost entirely on the OXCO in there.? You may find more info about that.? Which one do you have?
Did you try looking at it with a tool called ¡°Lady Heather¡±?? This one is amazing.
Gr¨¹?e, Carsten
|
Re: Off Topic : What is the 10 second accuracy of a Trimble 57963-D GPSDO?
|
Is it reasonable (or normal) to charge extra to calibrate an essential accessory supplied with an instrument?
Dr. David Kirkby from Kirkby Microwave Ltd
The HP/Agilent 4285A LCR meter was supplied as standard with a 100-ohm resistor, P/N 04285-61001. It is a 4-terminal device with 4 BNC connectors on it. It is a furnished accessory, essential to use the 4285A properly, and is only used with the 4285A. (See photo from manual).
I've sent the 4285A LCR meter to Keysight, but they want extra to calibrate the resistor. Does that seem reasonable, and/or normal practice?
I don't know the specifications of the resistor, so can't calibrate it myself. Although I have a 6.5 digit multimeter, the RF properties of this resistor are probably important, as it is used to 30 MHz.
-- Dr David Kirkby Ph.D C.Eng MIET
Kirkby Microwave Ltd
Registered office: Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, CHELMSFORD, Essex, CM3 6DT, United Kingdom.
Registered in England and Wales as company number 08914892
Tel 01621-680100 / +44 1621-680100
|
HP8656/8657 Hum sidebands
The close-in spectra of both my HP8656B and 8657B signal generators show 100Hz and harmonics sidebands at levels of -50 dBc, gradually falling away up to 3 kHz offset.
The 8657B, which is somewhat older than the 8656B shows these sidebands at somewhat higher level. ?
I recall some posts on this forum about replacing electrolytic capacitors in these signal generators.
What was the recommendation and are there particular capacitors I should check?
Thanks, Alwyn?
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Re: Off Topic : What is the 10 second accuracy of a Trimble 57963-D GPSDO?
The reason the 10 s stability is dominated by the OCXO is that the GPS feedback loop is much slower, so it won¡¯t do anything useful at this rate.
People have been characterizing 73090 OCXOs, e.g., , or more generally,
However, the individual units vary widely in performance, so what one person measured for theirs may not apply to yours. (I have two of the 57964s and the OCXO in one is *much* worse than the other.) But OCXOs are relatively inexpensive: buy a half dozen and characterize them against each other, and you will quickly know which are the good ones. Then you can characterize your GPSDO against those. (Then repeat the exercise with half a dozen Rubidium clocks :-)
The best way to connect the GPSDO to a recent PC for running Lady Heather is a simple usb-to-serial cable; these are available with the right ¡°DB9¡± connector (e.g., ¡ª there are also fake ¡°RS232¡± cables available that exhibit TTL levels on the DB9 instead of using proper RS232/V.28 level converters, don¡¯t use those).
Gr¨¹?e, Carsten
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Re: Off Topic : What is the 10 second accuracy of a Trimble 57963-D GPSDO?
PS : The builder states that this unit runs Lady Heather in it`s firmware
Hello Carsten. Interesting that you say that it`s the OXCO that is the determining factor, not ,for example, the number of satellites aquired, or something else. I shall store that snippet of information away:-). The OXCO in my unit [ I wish the builder had given it a model number] has TPN : 57964-80, this might mean Trimble Part No 57964-80,? "Sec Code: EP92-01321 H", and " D/C: 10/06 ". These codes are on a label stuck on the OXCO, by the Chinese builder, so He/She/They must have considered this important. The label that Trimble stuck on the OXCO states P/N 73090, serial number 468010-0114, and date code 0950. From this I guess that the Trimble PCB was manufactured in 1995, and the unit assembled in Oct 2006. Do you have the gen on this OXCO Carsen?, and hoping the foregoing information is of interest to you. No, I haven`t used Lady Heather to look at this unit, as I`m not sure how to connect the RS232 9-pin "D" connector to my computer [It has TxD, and RxD, and little else] . Wishing you well...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Donald.
On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 7:44 PM Carsten Bormann < cabocabo@...> wrote: For 10 s, that depends almost entirely on the OXCO in there.? You may find more info about that.? Which one do you have?
Did you try looking at it with a tool called ¡°Lady Heather¡±?? This one is amazing.
Gr¨¹?e, Carsten
|
Re: Off Topic : What is the 10 second accuracy of a Trimble 57963-D GPSDO?
Hello Carsten. Interesting that you say that it`s the OXCO that is the determining factor, not ,for example, the number of satellites aquired, or something else. I shall store that snippet of information away:-). The OXCO in my unit [ I wish the builder had given it a model number] has TPN : 57964-80, this might mean Trimble Part No 57964-80,? "Sec Code: EP92-01321 H", and " D/C: 10/06 ". These codes are on a label stuck on the OXCO, by the Chinese builder, so He/She/They must have considered this important. The label that Trimble stuck on the OXCO states P/N 73090, serial number 468010-0114, and date code 0950. From this I guess that the Trimble PCB was manufactured in 1995, and the unit assembled in Oct 2006. Do you have the gen on this OXCO Carsen?, and hoping the foregoing information is of interest to you. No, I haven`t used Lady Heather to look at this unit, as I`m not sure how to connect the RS232 9-pin "D" connector to my computer [It has TxD, and RxD, and little else] . Wishing you well...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Donald.
On Thu, Oct 11, 2018 at 7:44 PM Carsten Bormann < cabocabo@...> wrote: For 10 s, that depends almost entirely on the OXCO in there.? You may find more info about that.? Which one do you have?
Did you try looking at it with a tool called ¡°Lady Heather¡±?? This one is amazing.
Gr¨¹?e, Carsten
|
bownes
