On 4/21/24 15:07, rftek.ltd via groups.io wrote: Strange attude but typical for a HAM perhaps? I'm a design engineer. I've held a ham radio license since I was a teenager in the 1980s. I don't think that's relevant to this conversation. You'll find that most people with more than a passing knowledge of computing understand that Windows is a toy. ALL moden lab equipment from Keysight and R&S runs on windows, has done for years and will continue to do so. Yes I understand it's not good but makes the instruments simpler to manufacture and a greater profit margin obviously. Right...better for them, worse for us. I note that you said "yes I understand it's not good". There aren't any true 'Hardware only' instruments manufactured anymore to my knowledge. That's fine, and yes I'm well aware that the suits have really wrecked the industry. Real test equipment that I know I can depend on, and that I can maintain, will be available for the rest of my lifetime. This is important to me because I do it for a living. I won't risk my livelihood on a toy, because I've seen what happens when it fails. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Inertia.? Linux doesn't have critical mass.? ? ? ? Jim Ford?
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-------- Original message -------- From: Peter Gottlieb <hpnpilot@...> Date: 4/21/24 12:17 PM (GMT-08:00) Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] N9020A
It also gives easy network connectivity for screen capture and other file operations. I wonder why they choose Windows over something like Linux? On 4/21/2024 3:07 PM, rftek.ltd via groups.io wrote: > Strange attude but typical for a HAM perhaps? > > ALL moden lab equipment from Keysight and R&S runs on windows, has done for > years and will continue to do so. Yes I understand it's not good but makes the > instruments simpler to manufacture and a greater profit margin obviously. > > There aren't any true 'Hardware only' instruments manufactured anymore to my > knowledge. >
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Re: Re-capping an HP-130 Scopes
Thanks David, all precious suggestions. I'll get a light bulb of suitable wattage and start disconnecting the HV section. I am still confused about how to interpret the board connection on valve sockets, do you know if it's possible to start by first disconnecting all sections, save the CRT, to set up the power supplies by themselves?
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I've always used SOFTPLOT for screen capture, great for older equipment, vector captures so can overlay, reannotate etc.
Yes Linux would be fine, like HPUX on the older kit.
I guess everyone knows windows but admittedly its utterly useless, having to wait for the thing to boot, log in etc, most annoying..
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It also gives easy network connectivity for screen capture and other file operations.
I wonder why they choose Windows over something like Linux?
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On 4/21/2024 3:07 PM, rftek.ltd via groups.io wrote: Strange attude but typical for a HAM perhaps?
ALL moden lab equipment from Keysight and R&S runs on windows, has done for years and will continue to do so. Yes I understand it's not good but makes the instruments simpler to manufacture and a greater profit margin obviously.
There aren't any true 'Hardware only' instruments manufactured anymore to my knowledge.
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Strange attude but typical for a HAM perhaps?
ALL moden lab equipment from Keysight and R&S runs on windows, has done for years and will continue to do so. Yes I understand it's not good but makes the instruments simpler to manufacture and a greater profit margin obviously.
There aren't any true 'Hardware only' instruments manufactured anymore to my knowledge.
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Re: 5342A: sometimes counts, sometimes not
One of mine (running from an external ref) would fail because the
internal ref was too far off to lock to the external (GPS-derived)
one - adjusted the internal ref slightly and all was well. Also
IIRC, the external ref needed to be around +10dBm?
On 21/04/2024 18:36, RubenRubio wrote:
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Must spend some time reading about the principles of operation. In
the past, switching int/ext 10 meg source bring back the counting.
Now that doesn't work. I'll pull from that thread first, just in
case if there's a problem with freq reference.
I'll report here my conclusions and tests.
R.
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Hi Hardy
It may be the case that some people might not realise how good the MXA is. It is very close to being a high end spectrum/signal analyser. It should also be possible to use it with the Agilent/Keysight 89600 software to grab and process captured data. However, I've never tried this with an MXA. To get all this for just ?1600 is a really good deal. I assume the reason the price is so low is down to supply and demand (rather than anything to do with the Windows OS). There appears to be lots of them available in recent months
.?
It's a bit like when the Agilent E4406A analysers flooded the market many years ago. There were so many available that prices on UK ebay dropped and dropped until they reached as low as about ?300.
Regards
Jeremy
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Re: 5342A: sometimes counts, sometimes not
Must spend some time reading about the principles of operation. In the past, switching int/ext 10 meg source bring back the counting. Now that doesn't work. I'll pull from that thread first, just in case if there's a problem with freq reference.
I'll report here my conclusions and tests.
R.
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Jeremy Yes its a very fine ?analyzer—just like when we got our fingers at E4406A—now its even better….and with the new options its great….just my point….and options??mail me Hardy ? ? ? To be fair to the MXA, it is classed as a mid range analyser, and was arguably the best in its class when first introduced. With this in mind, the phase noise performance is quite good for an analyser in this class. Other aspects of its performance nudge it towards the high end class, although the Keysight PXA and especially the Keysight UXA easily outperform the MXA.?
It's a shame the MXA models for sale are limited to 3.6GHz, but even with this limitation the ebay price seems incredibly low for an analyser with this level of performance.
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On a lot of Windows based test gear, there can be a ghost backup file on the HDD that was put there by the manufacturer. This allows a full factory restore if you keep a copy of this file. It's best to back all this stuff up including any calibration files. I've got several Windows based instruments here and that's what I have done with all of them. Back up the HDD and keep the instruments away from a network and I don't think there is much of a downside to having a Windows OS. I generally prefer using Windows based instruments.?
In my experience, it's usually the switch mode PSU or some RF MMIC device or something to do with an LO synthesiser that causes failures in 10-20 year old RF test gear from the big name companies.
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The software licensing or rather Keysight’s attitude needs to change. If they don’t want to give away the store, by giving away new features…I have no problem with that. I’m certain they’re not the only offenders.
I have serious issue with their unwillingness to play ball when it comes to preserving function (right to repair) and/or actively block paths to a user upgrading an operating system to make security patching viable.
I’d be happy to see lessors and lenders refuse to finance Keysight instruments (as well as any other brands pulling the same crap).
I’d be happy to see a national right to repair law that doesn’t have too many carve outs with a poison pill shutting companies out of government contracts, and prohibiting contractors from using instruments for which the company hasn’t fallen
into line with right to repair….retroactively.
I’d be happy to sit down and walk people through in non technical terms how it’s a national security threat, when a company becomes unwilling or unable to deal with security vulnerabilities in computerized instruments based on windows embedded
(or Linux). I’d be happy to show them the path that the supply chain is riddled with imported component. Bottom line: as various industrial embedded processor boards that have industry standard footprints become unavailable the companies reach a point where
they can no longer service an instrument still in use. That’s a problem if equipment fails while being used by defense industry, whether or not the supply chain fails as a result of sanctions or component age.
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On 4/21/24 10:37, jmr via
wrote:
> It's a shame the MXA models for sale are limited to 3.6GHz, but even
> with this limitation the ebay price seems incredibly low for an analyser
> with this level of performance.
?? The "Winstruments" rarely hold much resale value, whatever the
instrument type, compared to their predecessors.? My assumption has been
that people are aware of the hassles with Windows shitting the bed, PC
motherboard failures, etc often make these things more trouble than
they're worth, regardless of their performance when they're actually up
and running.
?? After reading all of the horror stories, I'd certainly never be
bothered with one.
?????????????? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
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For obvious security reasons, it's best to keep the older Windows based analysers away from networks, especially those with internet access, but apart from that, I think the Windows OS is a bonus on instruments like this.
If you want a few examples of Windows based instruments that can still hold a very respectable resale value, then consider the Agilent E5071 VNA, the E5052A SSA , the PXA N9030 signal analyser, the Tek RSA6114A RTSA and some of the Agilent Infiniium scopes.
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This is true . I’ve an N9020A I brought on 2007 and his price dropped down much more than I expected. The analyzers works very well but I never touched the Windows OS … no updates , no internet connection . Same treatment like an stand alone instrument. I know many people who has serious problems with windows failures. Many of them never baked up the calibration files … this is very bad.?
Regards. ?Patricio? Ing. Patricio A. GrecoTaller Aeronáutico de Reparación 1B-349Organización de Mantenimiento Aeronáutico de la Defensa OMAD-001Gral. Martín Rodríguez 2159San Miguel (1663)Buenos AiresT:?+5411-4455-2557F:?+5411-4032-0072
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On 21 Apr 2024, at 12:04, Dave McGuire via groups.io <mcguire@...> wrote:
? On 4/21/24 10:37, jmr via groups.io wrote:It's a shame the MXA models for sale are limited to 3.6GHz, but even with this limitation the ebay price seems incredibly low for an analyser with this level of performance.
?The "Winstruments" rarely hold much resale value, whatever the instrument type, compared to their predecessors. ?My assumption has been that people are aware of the hassles with Windows shitting the bed, PC motherboard failures, etc often make these things more trouble than they're worth, regardless of their performance when they're actually up and running. ?After reading all of the horror stories, I'd certainly never be bothered with one. ?????????????-Dave-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZNew Kensington, PA
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On 4/21/24 10:37, jmr via groups.io wrote: It's a shame the MXA models for sale are limited to 3.6GHz, but even with this limitation the ebay price seems incredibly low for an analyser with this level of performance. The "Winstruments" rarely hold much resale value, whatever the instrument type, compared to their predecessors. My assumption has been that people are aware of the hassles with Windows shitting the bed, PC motherboard failures, etc often make these things more trouble than they're worth, regardless of their performance when they're actually up and running. After reading all of the horror stories, I'd certainly never be bothered with one. -Dave -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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To be fair to the MXA, it is classed as a mid range analyser, and was arguably the best in its class when first introduced. With this in mind, the phase noise performance is quite good for an analyser in this class. Other aspects of its performance nudge it towards the high end class, although the Keysight PXA and especially the Keysight UXA easily outperform the MXA.?
It's a shame the MXA models for sale are limited to 3.6GHz, but even with this limitation the ebay price seems incredibly low for an analyser with this level of performance.
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Re: HP 3325A VCO Adjustment - 60MHz?
Have you checked at the rear of the instrument, mine has an Auxiliary Output that does 60+ MHz !
2024-04-21 14:48 Tony wrote:
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I recently had to replace the A21 board in my 3325A when it developed a fault.
I'm going though the adjustments sections after putting in the new board but hit a snag with the VCO adjustment section in the manual.
it instructs the user in page 5-2 to set the frequency to 60MHz - (see attachment) which must be wrong as the 3325A output range only goes up to 21MHz.
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Re: HP 3325A VCO Adjustment - 60MHz?
Hi,
The manual is correct. There is an aux output for sine wave only on the rear, which can go up to 60Mhz?and fixed?at some level (0 dBm?) . The primary output only goes to 20 MHz.?
Szabolcs
I recently had to replace the A21 board in my 3325A when it developed a fault.
I'm going though the adjustments sections after putting in the new board but hit a snag with the VCO adjustment section in the manual.
it instructs the user in page 5-2 to set the frequency to 60MHz - (see attachment) which must be wrong as the 3325A output range only goes up to 21MHz.
i can’t find an errata in my or other manuals to cover this. Can anybody advise why the correct setting should be?
thanks
tony
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HP 3325A VCO Adjustment - 60MHz?
I recently had to replace the A21 board in my 3325A when it developed a fault. I'm going though the adjustments sections after putting in the new board but hit a snag with the VCO adjustment section in the manual. it instructs the user in page 5-2 to set the frequency to 60MHz - (see attachment) which must be wrong as the 3325A output range only goes up to 21MHz. i can’t find an errata in my or other manuals to cover this. Can anybody advise why the correct setting should be? thanks tony 
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Re: HP 8568A YTO UNLOCK repair
Did some testing this morning, my conclusion are that the YTO FM Coil is very likely to be failed. After looking at all the test point on the A22 board, i almost sure everything is working fine on that board. Next to test, is the A9 and A10 with a power meter, if they work perfectly fine, let's go for a YTO. 
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Dave McGuire
RubenRubio
Patricio A. Greco
