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Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

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Sean,

?

Exactly the same thing happened to me with a HP8664A - no handles but with options in mint condition with a stated ¡°power supply¡± fault.

It was packed badly and sustained bad damage to the front lower left hand side front panel and had the two bottom rear base rubber stops damaged or broken off.

The Impact to the front bent the front edge of the outer case meaning I had to use force to get the case off.? I cut away the bent casting to straighten the face plate.

?

My familiarity with the same issue to failing tantalum capacitors in an HP8665A helped me sort that the power supply fault out.

and also replaced the backup battery.? Unfortunately at power on, the unit only seemed to frequency lock over a very small range.

From then on, the unit was a nightmare with errors from turn on until I realised they had left the internal switch in service mode and got nowhere because the display was not active.

All good now.? The internal oscillator takes time to warm up from when AC power is applied.? Using an external reference makes it good to go much quicker.

?

Fixing ?yours?

?

Your generator sounds like is it pretty good if you can fix the cosmetics. ?The handles protected the front keypads and the RF connector/ assembly can be replaced.

?

They are well worth the repair efforts.

Keep track of where you take out the screws from.? They use variations of length and tapering and there are lots of them.

?

Regards Noel

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, 19 March 2019 10:03 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP 8664A signal generator repairability

?

Hi everyone,

I recently purchased an 8664A signal generator with option 004 and 10. Got a decent deal. Unfortunately, it appears that UPS dropped the box and despite plenty of foam packing, the instrument sustained some pretty severe damage.

  1. Functionally, the instrument seems to be performing quite well. I tested it on my 8566A spectrum analyzer. No issues here.
  2. The right hand rack handle appears to have taken the brunt of the damage. It's destroyed. The left handle is slightly bent, but not broken.
  3. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.


The seller is willing to work with me if I want to send it back for a full refund, but in the meantime, I want to try to estimate what repair work might cost me. I can get another set of 4u rack handles for $40 or so on ebay, so that's not a real problem. My main concern is the RF output and the front panel. I'd like to get into the instrument to ascertain the damage, but I can't seem to figure out how open the case. The service manual provided by Keysight talks about removing top and bottom panels, but mine seems to have a 1 piece case that doesn't want to just slide off.

To conclude, my major questions are:

  1. Is it worth fixing the damage?
  2. How do you open the case?


Thanks!

Sean


Virus-free.

IMG_7883.jpg
IMG_7895.jpg
IMG_7878.jpg
IMG_7884.jpg

Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 05:03 PM, Thomas S. Knutsen wrote:
8644 had the same case for some options, I believe this was on the
later instruments? All I have seen says Agilent, instead of HP.

FWIW, Some instruments in that series was buildt by the now quite
famous "Screw murderer", and as such had screws threaded down at a
angle, stripping the threads and causing all kinds of havock when you
are trying to get them out, if they don't break in the hole.

BR.
Thomas.
Well, so far the front panel screws were all ok. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks!
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Dave, Option 10 is a 'reduced leakage' configuration that does away with the normal top and bottom panels and side handles we all know and love (certainly from the removal standpoint!) and replaces them with a solid sleeve case with said gazillion screws to reduce RF leakage.


Pics of the 8644B I have are at:





-Pat

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 07:58 PM, Dave McGuire wrote:

On 3/18/19 7:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am
familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is
different. See attached.
Wow, bizarre...I've never seen a case like that on an 866x. I see
someone else has gotten you fixed up. You might not be in such a bad
situation after all; maybe put the screws to the seller about the
shipping and get half of your money back. :)

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

8644 had the same case for some options, I believe this was on the
later instruments? All I have seen says Agilent, instead of HP.

FWIW, Some instruments in that series was buildt by the now quite
famous "Screw murderer", and as such had screws threaded down at a
angle, stripping the threads and causing all kinds of havock when you
are trying to get them out, if they don't break in the hole.

BR.
Thomas.

Den tir. 19. mar. 2019 kl. 00:58 skrev Dave McGuire <mcguire@...>:


On 3/18/19 7:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am
familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is
different. See attached.
Wow, bizarre...I've never seen a case like that on an 866x. I see
someone else has gotten you fixed up. You might not be in such a bad
situation after all; maybe put the screws to the seller about the
shipping and get half of your money back. :)

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA


--
With Best regards, Thomas S. Knutsen.

Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

That case is Option 10...low leakage. I have one.... It is rare, indeed


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019, 4:58 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
On 3/18/19 7:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am
> familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is
> different. See attached.

? Wow, bizarre...I've never seen a case like that on an 866x.? I see
someone else has gotten you fixed up.? You might not be in such a bad
situation after all; maybe put the screws to the seller about the
shipping and get half of your money back. :)

? ? ? ? ? ? ?-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On 3/18/19 7:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am
familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is
different. See attached.
Wow, bizarre...I've never seen a case like that on an 866x. I see
someone else has gotten you fixed up. You might not be in such a bad
situation after all; maybe put the screws to the seller about the
shipping and get half of your money back. :)

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

IIRC I went and got my impact driver to take them out after doing a few by hand.? Mine had threadlocker on them for extra fun; I'd expect yours will, too.? (I put them back in by hand once the instrument was fixed.)

-Pat


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 07:53 PM, [email protected] wrote:

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 04:44 PM, Patrick Manning wrote:
Peel the decorative vinyl strips off of the collar just behind the front of the case.? Beneath them, you will find a gazillion screws.? (ok, that's a slight exaggeration - there are 48 of them.)? Remove said screws, along with the bumper feet on the back of the instrument (if present), and the sleeve case will then slide off.
OH, I see them now. Thanks!! This is going to be frustrating! The strips are peeling up already anyway, so good riddance.

Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 04:44 PM, Patrick Manning wrote:
Peel the decorative vinyl strips off of the collar just behind the front of the case.? Beneath them, you will find a gazillion screws.? (ok, that's a slight exaggeration - there are 48 of them.)? Remove said screws, along with the bumper feet on the back of the instrument (if present), and the sleeve case will then slide off.
OH, I see them now. Thanks!! This is going to be frustrating! The strips are peeling up already anyway, so good riddance.

Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Peel the decorative vinyl strips off of the collar just behind the front of the case.? Beneath them, you will find a gazillion screws.? (ok, that's a slight exaggeration - there are 48 of them.)? Remove said screws, along with the bumper feet on the back of the instrument (if present), and the sleeve case will then slide off.


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 07:34 PM, [email protected] wrote:

Dave,

Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is different. See attached.

Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 04:35 PM, Siggi wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 7:03 PM <[email protected]> wrote:
  1. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.
?
I recently fixed a HP8665A which had taken a faceplant, such that the output connector was MIA. I bought a replacement part from Keysight, but their "upgraded part" didn't match the original and didn't fit. I ended up buying a couple of these [] NOS replacement connectors off eBay (for less money than the supposed-original Keysight part).
I had to machine a new mounting bracket as mine was MIA. I used the CNC mill, but if the mounting bracket is too far gone, you can make a new one from angle iron (or alu) with a drill press and a file.
?
I worried about the output semi-rigid coax, which had taken some of the hit. The solder connection to the SMA connector had cracked, and there was a bit of a bend in the coax. I bent the coax back and re-soldered the shield and if there's any problem with the output line I can't measure it.
?
The battery message and self-cal are normal. The battery is a 3.6V NiCad that can only power the memory for a couple of weeks or so at best. I replaced the battery as it was only holding the memory up for a day or so, and I understand they can leak, which in turn can damage the motherboard.
As the pictures above show, I was able to at least get the front panel off. It appears that the mount you speak of took the brunt...the N connector and the hardline behind it look fine. I bent it back with the help of some scrap leather and heavy duty lineman pliers.

Thanks for the battery info!

Sean
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 7:03 PM <[email protected]> wrote:
  1. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.

I recently fixed a HP8665A which had taken a faceplant, such that the output connector was MIA. I bought a replacement part from Keysight, but their "upgraded part" didn't match the original and didn't fit. I ended up buying a couple of these [] NOS replacement connectors off eBay (for less money than the supposed-original Keysight part).
I had to machine a new mounting bracket as mine was MIA. I used the CNC mill, but if the mounting bracket is too far gone, you can make a new one from angle iron (or alu) with a drill press and a file.

I worried about the output semi-rigid coax, which had taken some of the hit. The solder connection to the SMA connector had cracked, and there was a bit of a bend in the coax. I bent the coax back and re-soldered the shield and if there's any problem with the output line I can't measure it.

The battery message and self-cal are normal. The battery is a 3.6V NiCad that can only power the memory for a couple of weeks or so at best. I replaced the battery as it was only holding the memory up for a day or so, and I understand they can leak, which in turn can damage the motherboard.
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Dave,

Thanks for getting back. There are no long handles on the case. I am familiar with them because all my other HP gear has them. This case is different. See attached.

IMG_8DECE4367CC7-1.jpg
IMG_28925E247551-1.jpg

Re: 8662A output oddity

 

?Jim,
The low band IF for the 8569B is at 2050MHz.? You may be seeing IF feedthrough due to the second harmonic of the 8662A.? It might be generated by the 8662A or by the mixer on the SA.??
--John Gord


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 04:43 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 01:31 AM, jfphp wrote:
There is something wrong with the settings of the SA : VF is too narrow compared with the BW filter. Try with auto for all settings.
All settings on the SA were set to auto. This is the "full band" view of the 8569B for the 0.1-1.7GHz band.?

The problem is not with the SA, the problem I am asking about is in the 8662A: the 8662 generates tremendous broadband noise as it sweeps across 1024.8 MHz as shown in the pictures. At *all* other frequencies it generates a very pure tone as expected.

73, Jim N8ECI
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On 3/18/19 7:03 PM, [email protected] wrote:
I recently purchased an 8664A signal generator with option 004 and 10.
Got a decent deal. Unfortunately, it appears that UPS dropped the box
and despite plenty of foam packing, the instrument sustained some pretty
severe damage.

1. Functionally, the instrument seems to be performing quite well. I
tested it on my 8566A spectrum analyzer. No issues here.
2. The right hand rack handle appears to have taken the brunt of the
damage. It's destroyed. The left handle is slightly bent, but not
broken.
3. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is
badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.


The seller is willing to work with me if I want to send it back for a
full refund, but in the meantime, I want to try to estimate what repair
work might cost me. I can get another set of 4u rack handles for $40 or
so on ebay, so that's not a real problem. My main concern is the RF
output and the front panel. I'd like to get into the instrument to
ascertain the damage, but I can't seem to figure out how open the case.
The service manual provided by Keysight talks about removing top and
bottom panels, but mine seems to have a 1 piece case that doesn't want
to just slide off.

To conclude, my major questions are:

1. Is it worth fixing the damage?
I would say so, yes. Those are, in my opinion, some of the finest
oscillators HP ever built. Handles are no big deal, if you actually
even want them on the machine. I'd replace, rather than try to repair,
the RF connect.

2. How do you open the case?
Remove the rear feet. Next, remove the long handles from the sides.
This will expose a row of screws running from front to back on each
side. They are usually Torx. Remove all of those, and the top should
come off by sliding it back slightly and then lifting up.

...and after typing that, I just re-read what you said above about it
being a one-piece case. The long handles on the sides cover the row of
screws that I described above; are you certain it's one piece?

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Also, on initial power up, it did the lengthy self cal routine (dead battery?) and when it finished it flashed up code 8043311 and had a message "hardware failure 8". I think this is related to frequency ref? Should I have plugged in an external reference? The error message disappeared and hasn't shown up again.
HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Hi everyone,

I recently purchased an 8664A signal generator with option 004 and 10. Got a decent deal. Unfortunately, it appears that UPS dropped the box and despite plenty of foam packing, the instrument sustained some pretty severe damage.

  1. Functionally, the instrument seems to be performing quite well. I tested it on my 8566A spectrum analyzer. No issues here.
  2. The right hand rack handle appears to have taken the brunt of the damage. It's destroyed. The left handle is slightly bent, but not broken.
  3. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.

The seller is willing to work with me if I want to send it back for a full refund, but in the meantime, I want to try to estimate what repair work might cost me. I can get another set of 4u rack handles for $40 or so on ebay, so that's not a real problem. My main concern is the RF output and the front panel. I'd like to get into the instrument to ascertain the damage, but I can't seem to figure out how open the case. The service manual provided by Keysight talks about removing top and bottom panels, but mine seems to have a 1 piece case that doesn't want to just slide off.

To conclude, my major questions are:

  1. Is it worth fixing the damage?
  2. How do you open the case?

Thanks!

Sean

IMG_40F6F300CDCE-1.jpg

service manual 08110-91031

 

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Hi, I'm looking for service manual?08110-91031 for the 8110A pulse generator.?I searched but found nothing, if ever someone has a pdf copy or information that could allow me to get one, it would be very useful. Thanks you !

?

Regards

Yves

?
Re: HP 3563A (3562A) A9 FFT

morestainless
 

Chuck,

Thanks for that bit of wisdom.? I had checked filter caps, clock, and voltages before.? All within spec.? The electrolytic and bypass caps on the board are good.? I'll check all the fft signal waveforms then.? Guess that's why they are described in the manual.


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:08 PM, Chuck Harris
<cfharris@...> wrote:
Two things:

1) signature analysis can fail if clocks and dividers
? aren't working right.
2) clocks and dividers can fail if power supply bypass
? capacitors aren't low enough ESR.

Before you condemn your board, do make sure that the
board's bulk bypass capacitors, and any filters that feed
them are good.

I have fixed several boards from this family of DSA's where
the only problem was bad electrolytic capacitors.

-Chuck Harris


morestainless via Groups.Io wrote:
> Anybody have a working A9 FFT board for this machine they would part with?? 3562A and 3563A? use the same board.? Signature analysis shows the global bus chips U511 - U518 are bad as are the two coefficient ROM's - U315 and U317.? Firmware images would also be a possibility as the interface chips are cheap enough.
>
>
>
>



Re: HP8563 HV supply repair

 

Hello,

Thanks. Do you mean that I should test the CRT itself? I disconnected it completely and still saw the same problem so I guess/hope so far I'm dealing with a HV supply issue (fingers crossed). How would you test the CRT, charging it up? If so, to what voltage and what to expect?

I have hade the very good fortune of being offered a replacement HV supply by a forum member so the overall chance of success has drastically increased thanks to him!?

I will still try to figure out what is broken though (intention). I do hope it's not the CRT also...?

Regards,
? Staffan

Virusfritt.

On Sun, Mar 17, 2019 at 9:13 PM paul swedberg <paulswedb@...> wrote:
Really great pictures and a fantastic job of removing the goop and cleanup. Its not uncommon for HV diodes to have a higher forward voltage drop as they are almost always internally made up of a series of diodes internally. At that has been my experience. The fact that they all match is also good.
Try ro see how the multiplier caps behave a small bit of leakage is enough to reduce the output. You can feed a reasonable 40 KHz signal into the multiplier and should see 9 X out from what I can tell. If that works it also tells you whats expected out of the transformer. Though from the thread you have a pretty good idea of all of these values.
Have you shorted out the crt usin a 1000 ohm resistor and measured the anode? It should look like a cap charge up and stop. Just thinking. same with the -2.45KV
regards
Paul


Virusfritt.

Re: HP 3563A (3562A) A9 FFT

 

Two things:

1) signature analysis can fail if clocks and dividers
aren't working right.
2) clocks and dividers can fail if power supply bypass
capacitors aren't low enough ESR.

Before you condemn your board, do make sure that the
board's bulk bypass capacitors, and any filters that feed
them are good.

I have fixed several boards from this family of DSA's where
the only problem was bad electrolytic capacitors.

-Chuck Harris


morestainless via Groups.Io wrote:

Anybody have a working A9 FFT board for this machine they would part with? 3562A and 3563A use the same board. Signature analysis shows the global bus chips U511 - U518 are bad as are the two coefficient ROM's - U315 and U317. Firmware images would also be a possibility as the interface chips are cheap enough.
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