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Re: 8662A output oddity

 

?Jim,
The low band IF for the 8569B is at 2050MHz.? You may be seeing IF feedthrough due to the second harmonic of the 8662A.? It might be generated by the 8662A or by the mixer on the SA.??
--John Gord


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 04:43 AM, Jim Miller wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 01:31 AM, jfphp wrote:
There is something wrong with the settings of the SA : VF is too narrow compared with the BW filter. Try with auto for all settings.
All settings on the SA were set to auto. This is the "full band" view of the 8569B for the 0.1-1.7GHz band.?

The problem is not with the SA, the problem I am asking about is in the 8662A: the 8662 generates tremendous broadband noise as it sweeps across 1024.8 MHz as shown in the pictures. At *all* other frequencies it generates a very pure tone as expected.

73, Jim N8ECI
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

On 3/18/19 7:03 PM, [email protected] wrote:
I recently purchased an 8664A signal generator with option 004 and 10.
Got a decent deal. Unfortunately, it appears that UPS dropped the box
and despite plenty of foam packing, the instrument sustained some pretty
severe damage.

1. Functionally, the instrument seems to be performing quite well. I
tested it on my 8566A spectrum analyzer. No issues here.
2. The right hand rack handle appears to have taken the brunt of the
damage. It's destroyed. The left handle is slightly bent, but not
broken.
3. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is
badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.


The seller is willing to work with me if I want to send it back for a
full refund, but in the meantime, I want to try to estimate what repair
work might cost me. I can get another set of 4u rack handles for $40 or
so on ebay, so that's not a real problem. My main concern is the RF
output and the front panel. I'd like to get into the instrument to
ascertain the damage, but I can't seem to figure out how open the case.
The service manual provided by Keysight talks about removing top and
bottom panels, but mine seems to have a 1 piece case that doesn't want
to just slide off.

To conclude, my major questions are:

1. Is it worth fixing the damage?
I would say so, yes. Those are, in my opinion, some of the finest
oscillators HP ever built. Handles are no big deal, if you actually
even want them on the machine. I'd replace, rather than try to repair,
the RF connect.

2. How do you open the case?
Remove the rear feet. Next, remove the long handles from the sides.
This will expose a row of screws running from front to back on each
side. They are usually Torx. Remove all of those, and the top should
come off by sliding it back slightly and then lifting up.

...and after typing that, I just re-read what you said above about it
being a one-piece case. The long handles on the sides cover the row of
screws that I described above; are you certain it's one piece?

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Also, on initial power up, it did the lengthy self cal routine (dead battery?) and when it finished it flashed up code 8043311 and had a message "hardware failure 8". I think this is related to frequency ref? Should I have plugged in an external reference? The error message disappeared and hasn't shown up again.
HP 8664A signal generator repairability

 

Hi everyone,

I recently purchased an 8664A signal generator with option 004 and 10. Got a decent deal. Unfortunately, it appears that UPS dropped the box and despite plenty of foam packing, the instrument sustained some pretty severe damage.

  1. Functionally, the instrument seems to be performing quite well. I tested it on my 8566A spectrum analyzer. No issues here.
  2. The right hand rack handle appears to have taken the brunt of the damage. It's destroyed. The left handle is slightly bent, but not broken.
  3. Unfortunately, it did not save the RF output N connector. This is badly bent. It's still connected inside as I'm getting output.

The seller is willing to work with me if I want to send it back for a full refund, but in the meantime, I want to try to estimate what repair work might cost me. I can get another set of 4u rack handles for $40 or so on ebay, so that's not a real problem. My main concern is the RF output and the front panel. I'd like to get into the instrument to ascertain the damage, but I can't seem to figure out how open the case. The service manual provided by Keysight talks about removing top and bottom panels, but mine seems to have a 1 piece case that doesn't want to just slide off.

To conclude, my major questions are:

  1. Is it worth fixing the damage?
  2. How do you open the case?

Thanks!

Sean

IMG_40F6F300CDCE-1.jpg

service manual 08110-91031

 

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Hi, I'm looking for service manual?08110-91031 for the 8110A pulse generator.?I searched but found nothing, if ever someone has a pdf copy or information that could allow me to get one, it would be very useful. Thanks you !

?

Regards

Yves

?
Re: HP 3563A (3562A) A9 FFT

morestainless
 

Chuck,

Thanks for that bit of wisdom.? I had checked filter caps, clock, and voltages before.? All within spec.? The electrolytic and bypass caps on the board are good.? I'll check all the fft signal waveforms then.? Guess that's why they are described in the manual.


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 1:08 PM, Chuck Harris
<cfharris@...> wrote:
Two things:

1) signature analysis can fail if clocks and dividers
? aren't working right.
2) clocks and dividers can fail if power supply bypass
? capacitors aren't low enough ESR.

Before you condemn your board, do make sure that the
board's bulk bypass capacitors, and any filters that feed
them are good.

I have fixed several boards from this family of DSA's where
the only problem was bad electrolytic capacitors.

-Chuck Harris


morestainless via Groups.Io wrote:
> Anybody have a working A9 FFT board for this machine they would part with?? 3562A and 3563A? use the same board.? Signature analysis shows the global bus chips U511 - U518 are bad as are the two coefficient ROM's - U315 and U317.? Firmware images would also be a possibility as the interface chips are cheap enough.
>
>
>
>



Re: HP8563 HV supply repair

 

Hello,

Thanks. Do you mean that I should test the CRT itself? I disconnected it completely and still saw the same problem so I guess/hope so far I'm dealing with a HV supply issue (fingers crossed). How would you test the CRT, charging it up? If so, to what voltage and what to expect?

I have hade the very good fortune of being offered a replacement HV supply by a forum member so the overall chance of success has drastically increased thanks to him!?

I will still try to figure out what is broken though (intention). I do hope it's not the CRT also...?

Regards,
? Staffan

Virusfritt.

On Sun, Mar 17, 2019 at 9:13 PM paul swedberg <paulswedb@...> wrote:
Really great pictures and a fantastic job of removing the goop and cleanup. Its not uncommon for HV diodes to have a higher forward voltage drop as they are almost always internally made up of a series of diodes internally. At that has been my experience. The fact that they all match is also good.
Try ro see how the multiplier caps behave a small bit of leakage is enough to reduce the output. You can feed a reasonable 40 KHz signal into the multiplier and should see 9 X out from what I can tell. If that works it also tells you whats expected out of the transformer. Though from the thread you have a pretty good idea of all of these values.
Have you shorted out the crt usin a 1000 ohm resistor and measured the anode? It should look like a cap charge up and stop. Just thinking. same with the -2.45KV
regards
Paul


Virusfritt.

Re: HP 3563A (3562A) A9 FFT

 

Two things:

1) signature analysis can fail if clocks and dividers
aren't working right.
2) clocks and dividers can fail if power supply bypass
capacitors aren't low enough ESR.

Before you condemn your board, do make sure that the
board's bulk bypass capacitors, and any filters that feed
them are good.

I have fixed several boards from this family of DSA's where
the only problem was bad electrolytic capacitors.

-Chuck Harris


morestainless via Groups.Io wrote:

Anybody have a working A9 FFT board for this machine they would part with? 3562A and 3563A use the same board. Signature analysis shows the global bus chips U511 - U518 are bad as are the two coefficient ROM's - U315 and U317. Firmware images would also be a possibility as the interface chips are cheap enough.
Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

Yes, PNG is great for screen shots. The problem with the 8753D/ES graphics is that the firmware guys didn't do the best job. They added a graphics dump, but they only implemented jpg. To make it worse, you can't download it via GPIB, it has to be stored to a floppy. At least, I don't see a command to download the JPG via GPIB. If anyone here knows how, please let me know.

In order to make the process simple, I use John Miles' utility, but that one does not have PNG. It does have GIF and BMP (in addition to PCX). Next time, I will try a GIF. One of our forum members here sells a product which can do screen grabs via GPIB, but I haven't tried it. That almost certainly can produce a PNG. Anyway, I will stop here and we can discuss this in a new thread, if desired.

Vladan
Re: HP 3563A (3562A) A9 FFT

morestainless
 

Anybody have a working A9 FFT board for this machine they would part with?? 3562A and 3563A? use the same board.? Signature analysis shows the global bus chips U511 - U518 are bad as are the two coefficient ROM's - U315 and U317.? Firmware images would also be a possibility as the interface chips are cheap enough.??
Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

On 3/18/19 2:05 PM, pianovt via Groups.Io wrote:
Thanks, Daun. I posted the image in the .pcx format because of the small
file size and crisp rendering. It seemed fine at first, but now it looks
like an icon. I guess groups.io is not set up for pcx.
Your best bet is to use PNG for this.

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

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I was able to see Daun¡¯s image, thank you.?

The interesting thing is that my waveform starts somewhat higher. This may be very significant. I did verify that the analog bus is reading correct as the voltages shown match up within tight tolerance to my calibrated scope. I will know quickly when I receive that replacement phase lock board from Pete whether this is the root cause or not.?


Peter

On Mar 18, 2019, at 2:05 PM, pianovt via Groups.Io <pianovt@...> wrote:

Thanks, Daun. I posted the image in the .pcx format because of the small file size and crisp rendering. It seemed fine at first, but now it looks like an icon. I guess is not set up for pcx.

Vladan

Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

Thanks, Daun. I posted the image in the .pcx format because of the small file size and crisp rendering. It seemed fine at first, but now it looks like an icon. I guess groups.io is not set up for pcx.

Vladan
Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

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Hi Peter

It's an image file.? I was able to open it with Irfanview.?? I just saved it as a JPG for you.

Daun

On 3/18/2019 1:41 PM, Peter Gottlieb wrote:
What is the file you sent? ?Neither my iphone nor Win10 machine knows what to do with it.?


Peter

On Mar 18, 2019, at 1:35 PM, pianovt via Groups.Io <pianovt@...> wrote:

I checked the YO drive on a couple of 8753ES (Opt 006). Both are very similar. The unit below has a alightly lower voltage at the start. The other one is right at 3.5V.

Vladan


<YO Coil Drive Test.pcx>

--
Daun E. Yeagley II, N8ASB

YO Coil Drive Test-1.jpg

Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

What is the file you sent? ?Neither my iphone nor Win10 machine knows what to do with it.?


Peter

On Mar 18, 2019, at 1:35 PM, pianovt via Groups.Io <pianovt@...> wrote:

I checked the YO drive on a couple of 8753ES (Opt 006). Both are very similar. The unit below has a alightly lower voltage at the start. The other one is right at 3.5V.

Vladan


<YO Coil Drive Test.pcx>
Re: I'm officially lost now with this 8753ES

 

I checked the YO drive on a couple of 8753ES (Opt 006). Both are very similar. The unit below has a alightly lower voltage at the start. The other one is right at 3.5V.

Vladan


YO Coil Drive Test.pcx
YO Coil Drive Test.pcx

Re: 8662A output oddity

 

Hi Jim
I have not seen anything like this on my 8663A (not exact same instrument, but very similar).
These generators has a are very modular build, with lots of cables between the boards. So it should be easy to find the source of the noise.?
Get the service manual, and follow the signal, by measuring the signal between each model in the signal path, until you find the bad module/board.

Had to do this to find what board generated spurs at certain temperatures in my generator.?

Br,
Askild


On Mon, 18 Mar 2019, 12:43 Jim Miller, <hpagilent@...> wrote:
On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 01:31 AM, jfphp wrote:
There is something wrong with the settings of the SA : VF is too narrow compared with the BW filter. Try with auto for all settings.
All settings on the SA were set to auto. This is the "full band" view of the 8569B for the 0.1-1.7GHz band.?

The problem is not with the SA, the problem I am asking about is in the 8662A: the 8662 generates tremendous broadband noise as it sweeps across 1024.8 MHz as shown in the pictures. At *all* other frequencies it generates a very pure tone as expected.

73, Jim N8ECI

Re: My $25 "In Poor Shape" 3468A has arrived

 

John and others following this,
The AZ(auto zero function) and Manual/Auto? functions are two different animals.

The AZ function shorts the input to the DC conditioning amplifier, U101, before each measurement of the customer's input to determine any residual offset of the input due to thermal drift and subtract that offset value from the input being measured.? ?So in principle if the input offsets drift over changes of time and temperature with a shorted input, the display will continue to read ZERO.?

Internal switches inside the input hybrid U102 are called? ? ?MZ -measure ZERO? and? MC -measure CUSTOMER (input)

With Auto Zero ON,? two readings are made for each measurement registered on the display:
[1]:? measure the offsets:? ?(MZ switch ON,? ?MC-measure customer switch OFF)? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

[2]:? ?measure the customer input:? ?(MC switch ON, MZ switch OFF)? ? ? ? ? ??

[3}:? subtract [1]? from [2] and display the value

If the AZ function is turned OFF, the input remains static with the input constantly applied to the input of U101.? The reading rate in this condition is effectively doubled because the MZ and MC switches are no longer being toggled and all measurements are a measure customer with no new offsets being measured.? The ZERO from the last time AZ was active is subtracted from the customer input until AZ is turned on again.? So if you have AZ turned OFF, it is a good practice to turn it on periodically to get a new ZERO reading if the environment is unstable that may cause the input offsets to drift.

Manual range and Auto ranging is independent of the AZ function.? ?The meter can stay fixed on a given range or auto range with or without the AZ function turned ON.
Hope this helps you,

George? ? ? ? March 18, 2019? ? 11:02 am
Re: E8357A upgrade questions

 

Caesar

I am interested in getting the CPU and hard drive. Sent a PM.

1. Is there anything special I need to do for the install? I thought I read somewhere that my front panel needs to be changed? I assume the Bios on the new CPU will be OK.

2. Can I easily revert back if I have an issue??

Tom
Re: 5385A error 52

 

In a few day , I will able to check the hp5386 with the Nationa GPIB PCMCIA card . I suppose the hp5386 is very similar to your counter.
Im not shure to understand very well the problem : you must wait the time out to get response from the counter ?.
If that is your problem / question , there is something not working properly or the setup is not ok , like the string terminator for example.
Best regards
Maurizio
56481 - 56500 of 151545