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Expanded Topics Messages
Date
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

Hello Greg,
?
I took the option of powering the 3457A in the normal way, with an earth connection as usual. At the same time I floated the soldering iron by powering it from a car battery and a DC-to-AC converter (the type which is commonly used in campers and similar vehicles). Another option is to use line power and an isolation transformer, if you have one. A portable, battery-powered or soldering iron would work just as well.
?
Cheers,
Joel
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

Hello David,
?
What you are suggesting is obviously a good solution. However, it is WAAAAAY above what my "hobby budget" can afford. To make matters worse, Keysight will not do any business with private individuals, at least in Europe. You'd have to find and alternative calibration lab, which would calibrate the meter but would not probably not replace the battery since HP does not document this replacement.
?
Cheers,
?
Joel
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

Hi Razvan,
I used a Radiospares 185-4654 socket, which sells for one Euro or so. It turned out to be a no-brand Chinese import, you can find the same socket on Epay or other sellers. I could not find this type of socket from "premium" brands, like Keystone and others.
By the way, the same type of battery is sold as "ER14250" by some vendors, and is available from some vendors with leads and a 2-pin female connector. You may also want to investigate this type of solution.
Cheers,
Joel
Re: PN 1855-0064

 

I'm not sure if you were asking if these meet the spec but I wanted to clarify how your finding verify the earlier numbers (for myself as much as future readers).

I believe the spec of Idss@Vgs0 is 1mA "or greater". The Drain-Source current when fully on (Vgs=0) is a primary characteristic of a JFET. Being able to pass more current than specified is OK. So an IDss of 2.5 or 4.2mA exceeds the minimum specification.


On Tue, Apr 1, 2025, 1:43?AM John Warren via <johnwarren376=[email protected]> wrote:
Thank you both for chiming in.??
?
The unit is a 7562A, I apologize for the typo.
?
I pulled a couple from another board and measured one side of each package, presumption is the other is similar.
?
I was tweaking with the settings so some inconsistencies below.? ?The pinch off voltage range based on the two sets is between -1.6V and -2.2V.? IDSS 2.6 to 4.2mA at 10V VDS.
?
?
?
File Notifications #file-notice

Group Notification
 

The following items have been added to the Files area of the [email protected] group.

By: Adam R. Maxwell <amaxwell@...>

Description:
Additional 8620C scales drawn using LibreCAD for 86240B and 86290B option H08. Sized for US Letter paper.

The following items have been added to the Files area of the [email protected] group.

By: Adam R. Maxwell <amaxwell@...>

Description:
STL file for printing custom 8620C scales. Printed using Ender 3 with PETG, and PLA should work as well. Surface may require sanding before sticking/gluing a scale face on.
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

If one chooses to try the instrument power-up approach as you had mentioned make certain that you use a soldering iron that is not connected to third wire ground...
Or the other way round? Put the instrument on an isolation transformer.

cheers
Martin
Re: E5052A Power On Test (3.3V Bus Supply)

 

Hi all,
?
Great thread, lots of useful info including suspected power supply issues on the A3.
?
I recently picked up an E5052A at auction. I've worked on similar era Agilent boxes but new to this model.?
Unit was sold has having a known issue on startup. There is a strange startup message which I believe is related to the A3 DSP board:
?
?
This happens on power up. The analyzer will then show the following runtime error and exit; it never makes it to the measurement screen:
?
?
The first few things I did was to backup the original HDD (20 GB Travelstar) and set that aside.?
?
I used the ghost factory backup image in the recovery partition to make a new hard drive, which booted just fine.?
?
Same error message on power up with original FW version 2.00. Updating to 2.51 does not change anything.
?
I'm convinced that the error "m_pA3drv -> Initialize()" is likely a hardware error, telling us that the A3 ADC/DSP board fails to initialize.?
This is only a guess; I see that jmr has disassembled the firmware. Your software skills are far superior to mine; maybe this error message makes more sense to you?
?
What I'm working on now is to make a wiring harness so I can extend the 3 x 32 (96 position) header for the A3 ADC/DSP.?
This way I can power the board outside of the chassis and check things like power supply rails, clock distribution for the ADCs and FPGAs.?
?
By the way, is the A3 board a huge hassle to remove for anyone else? The board is wedged extremely tight in my unit. I had to use a screwdriver to pry against the metal shield bolted to the board. I did it very carefully so no damage... it was impossible to remove otherwise.?
?
Giving the A3 a once over with shield removed, are a few CPLDs and a tssop FLASH chip, probably for the Sharc DSP. Hopefully its not a data corruption issue on one of these factory programmed devices...?
HP 85047A test set on 8753A analyzer -- switch control board jumpers to retrofit for opt 009 (mechanical switch)

 

Working on a 85047A test set which needs to be retrofitted with mechanical switch 33311B, as it has dead solid state switch and will be used with 8573A analyzer (pre-dates the 85047A). Goal is to end up with an 85047A opt 009. This issue has to do with interaction of the switch control board (back panel) and the analzyer's port A(1) and B(2) switching controls.

The 8753A analyzer is working normally with an 85046A opt 009 (mechanical switch) which was retrofitted from solid state at some point in the past. The 8753A is on firmware 1.01.

The analyzer has never been tried with an 85047A since I've had it.

The switch control board (along back panel) has three jumpers defined - J3, W1 and W2. J3 is not discussed in the manual but is installed from factory. I've installed 0.025" square (typical wire-wrap style) pins on the back side of the board for J3, W1 and W2 so that they can be reconfigured without pulling the board from the chassis.

As built (with solid state switch)

J3 - present (not mentioned in manual)
W1 - absent
W2 - absent
Behavior - port B selected <1 second during power-up, never again.

As documented (with mechanical switch)

J3 - present (not mentioned in manual)
W1 - absent
W2 - present
Behavior - port B selected <1 second during power-up, never again.

Other experiments

J3 - present (not mentioned in manual)
W1 - present
W2 - absent
Behavior - port B selected ~3 seconds during power-up, never again.

J3 - present (not mentioned in manual)
W1 - present
W2 - present
Behavior - port B selected ~3 seconds during power-up, never again.

So, at this point I cannot get the analyzer to switch to port B (right hand port) when initiating a 1-port S22 calibration.

Any suggestions at this point?
Re: odd HP83651A error

 

I was only changing the low band module, because I got one from an other older generator. In the 8360 families, this low band module is the weak part. That's a very complicated part, I was trying to obtain solutions to know better how it is made inside to open and verify it but it seems it's very difficult to have some information. At the present moment, having got at least 7 different generators from this family, I already have in a corner 2 low band modules with problems. That's why I try to collect all generators from this family because we need so many parts to let them alive. That's the most recent family that we can repair and calibrate ourself without help of unobtainium software or hardware. Later products are PSG and nothing is possible without requiring Keysight services. From memory only, it was in beginning of 2018 that I was swapping this module. Once the swap made, the error disappeared, and few months later i already sold the 83630B because having replaced it with a 83640A. In this last one I replaced the VFD screen that was extremely dim. And I currently search to increase also the output power and to add an output attenuator. I don't remember what was the error on the second low band module that I needed to replace too, also for an 83630B.
Re: HP 53310A modulation domain analyzer memory upgrade

 

Hi Dave,
I sent you a direct message, please check your inbox.
Ozan
?
?
On Mon, Mar 31, 2025 at 02:43 PM, Dave Wright wrote:

Hi Folks,
?
On the hunt for a source for the RAM chips to expand the memory in my 53310A
?
The usual Googling around has yet to yield 4 pieces from a single source.
?
Do any of you have 4 that you would be willing to part with..?

Candidates are: Cypress CY7C194-25PC, Hitachi HM6708P-25, ?Motorola MCM6208P25, ?or equivalent.
?
Located ?Louisville, KY 40206 USA
?
Re: PCB CAD used and/or sold by HP ?

 

In '88 and for a few years later, for the 360 and greater (more powerful), HP sold CAE tools such as DCS (schematic layout), DVI (design verification using GenRad's HILO logic/fault simulator), and PCDS (PCB layout). I used the first two to create test pattern files for circuit board testing on our HP3065AT functional tester. See attached slide re DCS and PCDS interface.
?
In addition, a mechanical drawing package called ME10 was available, created at HP Germany, IIRC.
?
As (IBM) PC's were becoming more powerful and improving graphics capabilities, and third party tools were improving and targeting the PC market, HP eventually bowed out of the CAE market.


---------- Original Message ----------
From: "alan victor via groups.io" <avictor73@...>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] PCB CAD used and/or sold by HP ?
Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2025 06:44:01 -0700

Here is a link to EGS and some history.?
?
https://www.hewlettpackardhistory.com/item/a-new-dimension-to-design/

DCS-PCDS.jpg

HP 53310A modulation domain analyzer memory upgrade

 

Hi Folks,
?
On the hunt for a source for the RAM chips to expand the memory in my 53310A
?
The usual Googling around has yet to yield 4 pieces from a single source.
?
Do any of you have 4 that you would be willing to part with..?

Candidates are: Cypress CY7C194-25PC, Hitachi HM6708P-25, ?Motorola MCM6208P25, ?or equivalent.
?
Located ?Louisville, KY 40206 USA
?
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

Hello Dr. Kirkby,

This would work in the case you can send it via some company. Keysight
is not working with private persons anymore and I didn't find other labs
that work with private persons at least in the EU.

I tried to get some calibration services for a few power sensors and
nobody wanted to work with me as a private person. Also, I tried to
order from them the test leads for a multimeter and they requested a VAT
ID and a company name. You don't have that you cannot order services or
parts.

Best regards,
Razvan

On 31/03/2025 13:18, Dr. David Kirkby, Kirkby Microwave Ltd via
groups.io wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2025 at 17:00, Joel Setton via groups.io <
groups.io> <setton@... <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:

I did it ! I replaced the memory battery in my 3457A.
My used 3457A was built in the late '80s and still had its original
lithium battery, with a 1989 date code on it. This battery obviously
needed replacement.


Another option is to ignore trying to save the calibration constants,
replace the battery and send it to Keysight and let them calibrate it.
Then it will be as good as you will get it. I did that, and they
replaced the battery. There were before and after measurements - they
made no attempt to save the constants. So everything was better after
calibration. In contrast if you send it there are calibration constants
about right, if it's in spec they will not adjust it. In contrast, by
putting them all wrong, everything needs adjustment.
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

Hello Joel,

I was thinking it is the version with 4 holes. I found the same design
in 2 of my Meinberg GPS167 units. One had a battery holder with 2 pins
and one had a battery with 3 pins.

I looked around for 4 months for a battery holder for the BR2/3A or
CR1/2AA with 3 pins for my E4418B and found nothing. The Agilent EPM
series have the same battery type BR2/3A but the PCB only has 3 holes
exactly how the battery is. There is no 4th hole between the two (+) pins.

Can I ask which model of the battery holder you bought? Do you have a link?

Thanks for the pictures and details.

Best regards,
Razvan

On 31/03/2025 10:48, Joel Setton via groups.io wrote:
Hello Razvan,
You are right, the original battery has 1 pin on the (-) end, and two
pins on the (+) end. However, I found that the PC board has three plated
holes on the (+) side including one in the middle, which makes it
perfect for a standard battery holder with 2 wires. Please see the
attached pictures.
Have a great day !
Joel
Re: 3585B Spectrum Analyzer

 

开云体育

This is a link for service manual version A, This might be useful to you.

?

/g/HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment/files/All%20HP,%20Agilent%20and%20Keysight%20instruments%20in%20folders%20by%20part%20numbers/3000%20to%203999/3585A%20and%203585B%2020%20Hz%20to%2040%20MHz%20spectrum%20analyzers

?

?

Yves

De?: [email protected] <[email protected]> De la part de crowbarkev via groups.io
贰苍惫辞测é?: 31 mars 2025 09:53
??: [email protected]
Objet?: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] 3585B Spectrum Analyzer

?

Hello everyone.

Please help.

I have a 3585B that wont power up.

I need a copy of the service manual, can anyone help??
Feet for ESG style instruments. 3D model.

 

I have modelled a simple foot that I use for the ESG series generators.
It is just tall enough for the instrument chin to hover over the desk surface.
Leo
?
Here goes nothing:
?

ESG Foot.step
ESG Foot.step

Re: 3585B Spectrum Analyzer

 

Hello everyone.
Please help.
I have a 3585B that wont power up.
I need a copy of the service manual, can anyone help??
Re: PN 1855-0064

 

Thank you both for chiming in.??
?
The unit is a 7562A, I apologize for the typo.
?
I pulled a couple from another board and measured one side of each package, presumption is the other is similar.
?
I was tweaking with the settings so some inconsistencies below.? ?The pinch off voltage range based on the two sets is between -1.6V and -2.2V.? IDSS 2.6 to 4.2mA at 10V VDS.
?
?
?
Re: Tricks and thoughts about the 3457A battery

 

My standard approach for replacement of batteries that support NVRAM containing instrument calibration , etc. is to connect either another battery or external power supply **with floating outputs** through a 1K ohm resistor to the PWB traces elsewhere on the board, usually after a reverse flow blocking diode in the battery circuit if it is present. Then removal of the old battery is easy without losing the contents of the RAM. The 1K resistor is just a precaution to keep from drawing high currents or other possible issues if you happen to connect to a wrong part of the circuit with the external power supply.

If one chooses to try the instrument power-up approach as you had mentioned make certain that you use a soldering iron that is not connected to third wire ground or has the tip grounded otherwise or else you will short out the battery and kill the RAM contents. Use of a battery powered soldering iron also allows safe removal of the battery. But that offers no help if a vacuum desoldering iron is required of which it frequently is.

Greg
Re: HP6209B component location layout

 

Just FYI, you can use the (much shorter) www.hpwiki.org hostname in that URL.

-Dave

On 3/29/25 19:02, Hugh Gilbert via groups.io wrote:
I think you will need to select R38, (~30k) section 5-45, it sets the meter zero by canceling the programming current that passes through the current sense resistor. R53,(3k) may need to be changed also.
Check here for a manual with schematic.
<>
Hugh Gilbert
Hugh Gilbert
On Sat, Mar 29, 2025 at 4:52?PM Alex via groups.io <> <hpagilentgroup@... <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Correction to my previous post: meant to say MINIMUM OUTPUT VOLTAGE
after adding the 47K resistor in series with R10 is about 160V,
maximum output is still about 320V.
I am checking some voltages around the current meter circuit: the
-3V shown on the schematic to be present at one side of R38/R53
measures only -2.29V. Same value at the cathode of CR8 in the bias
supply where this voltage originates. Cathode of CR7 has +1.77V.
CR7 is a 1N4830 "stabistor" 2.4V @ 100mA. Guessing some sort of
reference voltage or early zener diode. On the other hand CR8 is
listed as 1N3828 and seems to be a regular silicon small signal
diode. The way they are connected in series in the bias supply (for
among others temperature stability) I would expect the -3V output to
be the sum of the CR7 voltage, plus about 0.6-0.7V additional drop
of CR8, so indeed about 3V. But in real life CR8 seems to have a
drop of only 0.5V as measured, so do I have a bad CR7 that has gone
low from the original 2.4V to only 1.77V?
The other bias supply voltages: +43V is at +37.5V, and the +16V is
correct at +15.98V.
And at the reference regulator, the +6.2V (33) measures 6.43V, the
+12.4V (37) measures 12.66V, and the -6.2V (31) measures -6.22V.
All voltage readings referenced to +S (same as positive/red output
binding post with correct rear jumpers in place).
All other rear jumpers where also verified earlier to be in the
standard configuration as shown on the schematic.
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
181 - 200 of 150823