Re: Troubleshooting a 8591e with opt 130
Marco, ? OK, I didn't know that Spectrum was full span. So 1800MHz/400points = 4.5MHz, but it's rounded to an integer value. If the marker moves from one point to another, there will be 4 to 5 MHz between the points. ? For a span of 10MHz, it's 25kHz. ? But if you activate the frequency counter, then it will be different: MKR CNT ON. ? So, everything is normal for now. ? If you look at 0Hz, the amplitude is about -12dBm... I would say not to touch the mixer diodes, unless you have already done so, and that is the final result. ? I see that the CORR mode is activated, and that the carrier at 300 MHz seems 2 dB too high... before you had 15 dB before. ? Am I wrong, it seems to be much better with this 8591E. ? Yves
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Hi Brad
I did a lot of work on the 1980B.? See? A bit of a pig to work on, but an interesting bit of history.
Regards Steve
On Friday, November 15, 2024 at 04:11:47 AM GMT, Brad Jackson <brad@...> wrote:
? on: Today at 04:09:39 am ?
Anyone have a good deal of experience fixing an HP 1980B Oscilloscope?
I¡¯ve just got one and it worked for 5 seconds after I got it then the screen and buttons faded out. I replaced all the defective caps in the unit and still no go on the screen.
I¡¯m able to manually adjust the LED¡¯s by inserting a voltage into the base of the front panel character transistor so I know they CAN work but at the moment not under their own strength.
The LED¡¯s get bright when I remove the module from the front of the unit. I have no control over the RPG control. When it boots up almost all of the LED¡¯s light up so it appears as if the front panel is not talking to the microcontroller.
I have a spare unit coming from eBay next week, but it¡¯s a little frustrating when you see that item that you just purchase work very briefly. I know that it can work. More than likely, some little component died while it was turned on.
I should mention that all test points for voltages are spot on. Also I reseated and cleaned every DIP package IC with deoxit.
Also, because I was able to adjust the LED brightness by manually adjusting the control voltage, it makes me wonder if the CRT is working perfectly fine. It¡¯s just that the control voltage that is just the car and Trace intensity be turned off?
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Re: Troubleshooting a 8591e with opt 130
Yves,?
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I actually have a picture from before bandpass alignment: 
and after alignment:
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both at 4.5MHz, both at full span though, could that be a resolution error?
I turned on the instrument this morning for a minute, so this is without proper warmup, also connected cal signal:
10MHz span, it sees the peak at 75kHz 
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This evening I'll have some time again to check after proper warmup, see if it shifts.
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Marco
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Re: Troubleshooting a 8591e with opt 130
Hi Marco, ? Your filter is indeed well aligned now. And the ripple in a 6MHz range will be less than 1dB. ? The fact that the 0Hz peak is at 4.5MHz is really very strange. The 0 Hz is mainly related to LO-RF leakage, or mixer balance. If you have -11.5 dBm, I would say wait before changing the diodes, but find the cause why the 0Hz is shifted to 4.5MHz. The DC offset caused by the mixer will always be 0Hz. So, if one of the PLLs is incorrect, you will have a frequency shift. ? For example: Here is a simulation of this problem with my 8591A. I replaced the 600 MHz source to the second converter, with my E4432B generator. The frequency of 600 MHz being multiplied by 3 to give 1800 MHz, an error of 1.5 MHz at 600 MHz, would give me an offset of 4.5 MHz...as shown in the image below. I set my generator to 600 MHz precisely and the center frequency of the 8591 is at 0 Hz. I set my generator to 601.5 MHz and I get an offset of 4.5 MHz. ? But if the external 10 MHz reference is disconnected, the offset would not be large enough to move 4.5 MHz, there could be up to 10 kHz or so, not counting the REF UNLOCK error message, so it would have to be the first LO¡counterlock problem? It¡¯s possible to measure first LO at J5 first converter. ? Send me a picture of this offset from 0 Hz to 4.5 MHz with and without CAL CORRECT. ? Yves ? 
? Your 8591E 
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Re: HP85102C documentation
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No, I haven't seen them. However I'm interested too.?
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I have *3* HP85102c that fail A20 self test.?
The PCB card serial number have evolved and I think you listed the later versions.
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Maybe they are buried in the 1000 page patents.? There's a little in a quick search.
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 ? 
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Re: Connector identification
Hi Gary,
I did quite a bit search before posting, couldn't find anything similar (perhaps used the wrong keywords) at Digikey, Mouser, Hirose, I-Pex, or Google search for miniature coax connectors.?
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I was hoping it is a common connector and easily recognizable by someone who used such connectors. It is used on motherboard of HP53131A (stuffed when HS timebase option is used) and HS timebase boards.?
Ozan
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On Mon, Nov 18, 2024 at 07:25 PM, Gary Hitchner wrote:
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It was suggested it may be a reverse.? There are variations of these small SM connectors, you may have to general search other than DK to find the correct connector.
When we used them on a project we did find SMA adapters and small test cables to SMA, etc.
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Gary
WA2OMY
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Thank you for the reply. U.fl connectors I can find at Digikey has 2mm diameter like this one:
Also in U.fl connectors cable side seems to slide over the PCB connector outer ring. In this HP connector cable side slides inside the outer ring of the SMD connector.?
On Mon, Nov 18, 2024 at 06:18 PM, Gary Hitchner wrote:
Yes, I think it¡¯s a U.Fl, used on many GPS receive engines, there are variations, but I think 2.4 MM was common.
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You can get adapters and cables for these if necessary.? Don¡¯t mate de-mate often, not very robust, can damage easily.
Gary
WA2OMT
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Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm.?
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Re: Connector identification
It was suggested it may be a reverse.? There are variations of these small SM connectors, you may have to general search other than DK to find the correct connector. When we used them on a project we did find SMA adapters and small test cables to SMA, etc. ? Gary WA2OMY
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From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Ozan Sent: Monday, November 18, 2024 9:35 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Connector identification? Thank you for the reply. U.fl connectors I can find at Digikey has 2mm diameter like this one: Also in U.fl connectors cable side seems to slide over the PCB connector outer ring. In this HP connector cable side slides inside the outer ring of the SMD connector.? On Mon, Nov 18, 2024 at 06:18 PM, Gary Hitchner wrote: Yes, I think it¡¯s a U.Fl, used on many GPS receive engines, there are variations, but I think 2.4 MM was common. ? You can get adapters and cables for these if necessary.? Don¡¯t mate de-mate often, not very robust, can damage easily. Gary WA2OMT ? ? Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm.?
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Re: Connector identification
Hi Gary,
Thank you for the reply. U.fl connectors I can find at Digikey has 2mm diameter like this one:
Also in U.fl connectors cable side seems to slide over the PCB connector outer ring. In this HP connector cable side slides inside the outer ring of the SMD connector.?
?
Ozan
?
?
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On Mon, Nov 18, 2024 at 06:18 PM, Gary Hitchner wrote:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Yes, I think it¡¯s a U.Fl, used on many GPS receive engines, there are variations, but I think 2.4 MM was common.
?
You can get adapters and cables for these if necessary.? Don¡¯t mate de-mate often, not very robust, can damage easily.
Gary
WA2OMT
?
?
Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm.?
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Re: Connector identification
This looks like the polarity is reversed from "normal" U.fl, though.
But you're right about the lack of robustness; the last U.fl connectors that I (hated to) design into a board were rated for 10 (yes ten) mating cycles.
-Dave
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On 11/18/24 21:17, Gary Hitchner via groups.io wrote: Yes, I think it¡¯s a U.Fl, used on many GPS receive engines, there are variations, but I think 2.4 MM was common. You can get adapters and cables for these if necessary.? Don¡¯t mate de-mate often, not very robust, can damage easily. Gary WA2OMT *From:*[email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *Ozan *Sent:* Monday, November 18, 2024 8:36 PM *To:* [email protected] *Subject:* [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Connector identification Hello, Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm. Thanks, Ozan
-- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
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Re: Connector identification
Yes, I think it¡¯s a U.Fl, used on many GPS receive engines, there are variations, but I think 2.4 MM was common. ? You can get adapters and cables for these if necessary.? Don¡¯t mate de-mate often, not very robust, can damage easily. Gary WA2OMT ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Ozan Sent: Monday, November 18, 2024 8:36 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Connector identification? Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm.?
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Hello,
Does anyone recognize what kind of a connector is J2? I also attached picture of the cable it mates to. This connector is on an HP 53131A HS oven option so somewhat relevant to the group. The dimensions are within ~ +/-0.1mm.?
Thanks,
Ozan
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Re: HP8753E -08753-60146 Intermittant source issue (low power, about 50 dB down, but sometimes OK)
Thank you Marcus, Matt, and Ed,
You were all right - it was indeed the attenuator.? I swapped it out for a good one for now.? I'm going to have to take apart that old one (33321Q) one of these days and see if I can figure out what is wrong with it.
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Thanks again to all!
-scott
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N8973A Firmware Update issue
Dear All,?
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I am struggling to run a firmware update on my N8973A NFA running firmware version A.01.03.?
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According to the Agilent / keysight docs I have prepared six discs, however after cycling power on the NFA obviously does not recognize the "ESALOADR" Tool on disk 1 to start the firmware updater.
The disc is readable by the NFA when using the filemanager.?
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Does anyone have a clue ??
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Thanks and best regards, Olaf, DL8EBL
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Re: Troubleshooting a 8591e with opt 130
Yves,
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adjusting the bandpass while focussing on the 20MHz span around 321.4MHz with max hold worked better. Thanks for the advice.?
For now it seems good enough:
 ?
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The new mixer diodes are in so I'll try to get those in later this week. I figured it was good to first do the BP alignment again.?
I plan on using the method you described earlier:
"The method I used:
- I replaced cr1 and cr2
- I close the lid and I test, I see if the signal to the monitor at 0Hz, is lower than ideally, at the first division (upper left, picture 8591 LO leakage).
- If the diodes are not matched well enough, the carrier at 0Hz will exceed the first division at the top of the left screen"?
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I found from earlier bandpass alignment tries that the signal at 0Hz is influenced by the bandpass alignment, that's why I figured it had to be done first.
Currently the "0Hz" peak is at 4.5MHz -11.5dBm for my analyzer with the old diodes. Should I aim for an equivalent signal with the new diodes, or a different level?
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Marco
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Has anyone schematics of the HP85102C or HP85103A IF / Detector, specifically of the following modules:
A20 Sweep ADC ? ? ? ? ?85102C - 85102-60234 A23 Main Phase Lock ?85102C - 85102-60227
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I am looking for a working A22 Module.? It must pass CE-7 and 3-2 tests!
73,
Bill Riches, WA2DVU Cape May, NJ 609 425 8651
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Re: HP8753E -08753-60146 Intermittant source issue (low power, about 50 dB down, but sometimes OK)
Hi again,
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now I've read the original post thoroughly and have some comments and questions.
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Re bullet 1 So you are saying that you experience phase lock loss issues(red error message on the screen)? Given the symptoms you describe I assume that that is what you mean. Or is it the other way around, you do not have any phase lock issues?
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Re bullet 5
I think 3dBm directly at YIG output sounds too low, it ought to be over 10dBm. This goes for both fixed 3.8GHz YIG LO and the 3-6.8GHz YigTunedOscillator.
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I suspect that you have an issue with the mixer/amplifier/ALC-control module in the A3 source module, that might cause the ALC to drive the amplifier too hard due to the low YIG output.
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I would disconnect the YTO and test it separately,? search the file area for "8753 EYO" and "EYO J9" and you will find how to hook it up. Sweep it from around 60-160mA (or what is needed to cover the frequency range) on the main coil, put the SA on max hold. Also test the YIG LO.
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Best regards
Marcus
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Re: HP8753E -08753-60146 Intermittant source issue (low power, about 50 dB down, but sometimes OK)
Hi all,
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the attenuator can be exercised with the Operator test for port 1 & 2 (i.e. test 21 & 22).
All you need is to connect a short the port being tested. It should be enough to test one port in this case.
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Best regards
Marcus
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10MHz input board for Agilent 33220A/33250A
Dear friends, I am in the process of cleaning and tidying up my office. I found two remaining plug&play modules for the 33220A/332250A external 10MHz reference input. Board design was based on a original Agilent 33220-80001 board but slightly modified. Module have only 10MHZ BNC input connector, NO loop-back output! Input AC coupled, 50ohm (<-20dB S11), DC "isolated" from instrument housing (1Mohm) Input sensitivity better than -13dBm, input level for optimal jitter/phase noise 0 to 20dBm. Asking 75 USD/EUR each with shipment within EU. BTW, i don't have a nut for the BNC connector!
Milan
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Re: HP8753E -08753-60146 Intermittant source issue (low power, about 50 dB down, but sometimes OK)
Is there a band switching coaxial relay in there? I assume it has a high (fundamental) and a low (down-converted) band that are switched by relays or PINs. I don't have any 8753 stuff, but have had problems with the coaxial relays in SAs. Like Matt said check the attenuator - the mechanical contacts are the weak link. Likewise, any relays if present.
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Ed
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