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Re: 00105-6013 HP crystal oscillator wanted

 

What happened to the 5360A counters? Not seen any for sale in the UK for years, I was warned they are very unreliable, but this doesn't put me off adding one to my collection.

David
Re: Opposite problem: disintegrating Old style Oval HP Receptacle ( ... was Old style oval HP power cords )

 

Some pictures for reference (not for sale), grounded shell versions from both Switchcraft & Tower, the bagged one is ungrounded one from Tower.





I've seen them broken from being shipped with the cord left in place, early 1970s IEC suffers the same fate.

David

Re: Opposite problem: disintegrating Old style Oval HP Receptacle ( ... was Old style oval HP power cords )

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

According to Tony D ¡®s schematics, the ground pin in the connector was a ground connection for the electronics. One would assume that the external metal case was connected to the electronics ground. I can¡¯t verify this for you at present but it¡¯s highly unlikely not to be.

DaveB, NZ

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of gren
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2024 09:24
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Opposite problem: disintegrating Old style Oval HP Receptacle ( ... was Old style oval HP power cords )

?

hi,

my disintegrated Old Oval receptacle in in an Hp 9100a Calculator.

it is so badly corroded and disintegrated that I can not tell if it was grounded or not.
The lower part of the 9100a case likely sat in water for some time.

rick
Re: Opposite problem: disintegrating Old style Oval HP Receptacle ( ... was Old style oval HP power cords )

 

hi,

my disintegrated Old Oval receptacle in in an Hp 9100a Calculator.

it is so badly corroded and disintegrated that I can not tell if it was grounded or not.
The lower part of the 9100a case likely sat in water for some time.

rick
Re: Reviving an old topic: E4406A

 

Well, apparently I've been living right because on a Hail Mary sweep through my various virtual machines I found a snapshot from what must have been the first failed update attempt, and its backup directory includes an EPROM1 file that is not zero length.

I copied that into the updater program backup directory (replacing the 0-length file that was there). Then I did the "failed instrument" procedure that reinstalls the OS and recovers the config. Following that I seem to have the coefficients back.

I have a sneaking suspicion that just doing the OS reinstall alone, without having backup files available, might do the same thing. The reinstall completely wipes and rebuilds the flash from nothing, so I wonder if in the process it pulls the cal data in from wherever it's stored in the machine.

There's a hint about that in the updater program help files which mention that a failed update won't affect calibration.

I don't have time to test that hypothesis right now, though.

John
----

On 1/4/24 12:36, John Ackermann N8UR via groups.io wrote:
After 18 months I'm getting back to my E4406A.? My problem was/is that a failed firmware upgrade attempt left me with no synthesizer cal coefficients -- a 0 byte EEPROM1 file in the backup created on the WinXP machine.
I now have the firmware successfully updated but still get the missing cal coefficients message.
Back when I was working on it before, Hardy sent me a set of files to put on a floppy and run on the analyzer to pull the configuration.? I tried that and the only thing that happens when I boot with that floppy is that the screen says "Installed.? Please remove disk and power cycle."? Doing that just leads to a normal startup, so I don't know quite what happened there.
There appears to be a utility disk for the 4406A.? That might be helpful.? Does anyone have a copy they could send me?
And is there any other guidance on this problem?? It's hard to believe that a firmware update failure could lose cal constants, so I am hoping the data might still be somewhere on the machine..? I just don't know how to get to it.
Any help appreciated!
Thanks,
John
Re: HP8510B Reading and writing A13 EEPROM, problem with Xicor x28256

 

First off, are talking about the EPROM on the CPU board or are we talking about the EEROMs on the program memory board.?

I have had some problems with the EEPROMs using Wayne's (ZL2BKC) reader/writer.? ?I have several EEPROM boards and have rewritten them all - one seems to work after writing, but fails some time later (days) - my conclusion is that one of the EEPROMs have a problem.? I have written the particular board multiple times with the same result (erased and rewritten).? What I have not done is to try to overwrite the EEPROM without erasing it.? Not sure of Wayne's code will do that, but I will eventually get back to the project and try to see if I can do that.

Cheers!

Bruce
Reviving an old topic: E4406A

 

After 18 months I'm getting back to my E4406A. My problem was/is that a failed firmware upgrade attempt left me with no synthesizer cal coefficients -- a 0 byte EEPROM1 file in the backup created on the WinXP machine.

I now have the firmware successfully updated but still get the missing cal coefficients message.

Back when I was working on it before, Hardy sent me a set of files to put on a floppy and run on the analyzer to pull the configuration. I tried that and the only thing that happens when I boot with that floppy is that the screen says "Installed. Please remove disk and power cycle." Doing that just leads to a normal startup, so I don't know quite what happened there.

There appears to be a utility disk for the 4406A. That might be helpful. Does anyone have a copy they could send me?

And is there any other guidance on this problem? It's hard to believe that a firmware update failure could lose cal constants, so I am hoping the data might still be somewhere on the machine.. I just don't know how to get to it.

Any help appreciated!

Thanks,
John
Re: 00105-6013 HP crystal oscillator wanted

 

Hi? Morris,

That's the beast! I've two, recovered from 5360A counters, one I've repurposed as a general purpose 5MHz source and a spare, which I'll pass on to you if it suits.

If memory serves, two of the smb connectors are for the efc control and the other two are oscillator outputs. On the units I have, the pins near the smb connectors are +24V for the heater, +20V for the oscillator, +15V out for the efc pot and an output for the heater on/off light. The case is the power supply common and there is a blade screwdriver slot at the connector end for coarse frequency control.

The two pins at the other end are for the *117VAC* fast warmup heater and all the tapped mounting holes in the case are imperial.

Let me know if that will suit.

Regards,

Waz
Re: Agilent E4406A / 16700 CPU issue

 

Possibly unrelated, but I have an Agilent PNA? from about 2006.? It had a number of issues including a "non-functional" CPU board (according to Keysight).? Symptoms were similar to yours - 3 or 4 leds would light, but it would not boot or do anything. I tried a number of things (including removing, reflashing, and resoldering the EPROM), but in the end I discovered that when you replace the coin cell back-up battery, you have to short the "reset" pins that are positioned about 4" from that battery.? They are labeled on the board, but a possibly a bit tricky to find.? After I shorted these (with a pair of tweezers), it booted fine.? It is kind of insane to me that Agilent didn't catch this in when they quoted the job.? Note the battery in the upper right and reset pins in the lower left.

Capture.PNG

Re: HP 8593e Herotek GC100-169

 

Hello, thank you very much for your information I will see what I found on ebay
THANKS
Re: 410C VTVM Test Leads Coax Type Help

 

There may be some confusion about various cable requirements. If you're talking about just getting a signal into a VTVM, then almost any wiring should do - it's low frequency, high-Z, and no Z-matching is involved, so you don't care if it's 50, 75, or whatever ohms. It just should be low in leakage, which is almost guaranteed in modern wiring materials.

If you're talking about the RF probe (I forget the model name) that has a little vacuum tube detector diode in the probe head, then you need an extra conductor to supply the heater current, so a three-conductor scheme is needed, whether it's triax, or twisted-pairs, or other - remember the signal to the VTVM is still mostly DC/low frequency past the detector, so almost any three- or more conductor cable type will do. Even CAT-5 would probably work, but it feels better and more RF-like to use a coax form.

It's conceivable that various resonances over the cable length could cause errors due to VSWR in the VHF spec'd response range, and the particular CMRR of the structure, so it's probably safest to stick with a coax, so triax or twinax, or shielded twisted-pair (STP) in this case. This also helps to reduce any HF interference that might more easily get into a more open cable structure, but it's probably no big deal - depends on the RF susceptibility of the VTVM's input. You can confirm to your self how fancy things need to be with some simple experiments. Start with two wires or a piece of zip-cord, then work your way up until happy.

One thing I don't recall is whether the 410 is a floating, shielded system. If so, then it could be be a three-wire interface, so triax or others are the way to go, where the outer shield is ground (or guard), and the inner lines are the low and high signals that carry the info - then you really would want a true three wire connection, although usually it would end up being hooked up as two where it finally connects to the circuit. The same principles apply as above - study and understand the system, and don't get fancier than necessary.

Ed
Re: Agilent E4406A / 16700 CPU issue

 

I've already tried removing both boards, and it didn't help.

I just noticed that there is a second flash IC. From probing the chip enable pins, it seems like the vast majority of the reads the CPU does are from that chip. The CPU seems to get stuck at a specific address on this chip. Address bits A7 and up appear to be constant (with the exception of a short pulse caused by the address data having to be shifted into flip flops). The CPU seems to do some sort of counting for the lower bits (A0 - A6). For example, the lowest address bit cycles between 0 and 1, and the highest address bit is constant at 1. This might be because I don't have the +/- 12 volts connected to the motherboard yet. I'll try it again and see with those rails connected.
Re: 410C VTVM Test Leads Coax Type Help

 

I see the triax on her page but I don't see the coax.? Maybe she does have it but not on the page?

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

From: "Jeff AC0C" <keepwalking188@...>
To: "HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 9:31:11 PM
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] 410C VTVM Test Leads Coax Type Help

Check out KISS.? Ashley has what you need.

73/jeff/ac0c
alpha-charlie-zero-charlie
On 1/3/2024 8:59 PM, Adam Attig wrote:
Dear HP Group

I'm starting a new restoration project and am need of any knowledge around the type of coax used on the test leads.? I've seen many videos (Curious Marc's was an excellent one), scoured the repair manual and read many posts here and elsewhere where they've been replaced, but find the type of coax that was used not mentioned.? As typical, mine are in need of replacing.??
Rough measurements show an outer diameter of around .125"/3.1mm.? The closest diameter to this i'm able to find is RG174 at 0.110"/2.79mm which would probably work, but may be quite loose fitting in the strain relief jackets they go through.? I'm also assuming a 50ohm coax would be needed.

Any insight would be appreciated.

-Adam

Re: 410C VTVM Test Leads Coax Type Help

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Check out KISS.? Ashley has what you need.

73/jeff/ac0c
alpha-charlie-zero-charlie
On 1/3/2024 8:59 PM, Adam Attig wrote:

Dear HP Group

I'm starting a new restoration project and am need of any knowledge around the type of coax used on the test leads.? I've seen many videos (Curious Marc's was an excellent one), scoured the repair manual and read many posts here and elsewhere where they've been replaced, but find the type of coax that was used not mentioned.? As typical, mine are in need of replacing.??
Rough measurements show an outer diameter of around .125"/3.1mm.? The closest diameter to this i'm able to find is RG174 at 0.110"/2.79mm which would probably work, but may be quite loose fitting in the strain relief jackets they go through.? I'm also assuming a 50ohm coax would be needed.

Any insight would be appreciated.

-Adam

410C VTVM Test Leads Coax Type Help

 

Dear HP Group

I'm starting a new restoration project and am need of any knowledge around the type of coax used on the test leads.? I've seen many videos (Curious Marc's was an excellent one), scoured the repair manual and read many posts here and elsewhere where they've been replaced, but find the type of coax that was used not mentioned.? As typical, mine are in need of replacing.??
Rough measurements show an outer diameter of around .125"/3.1mm.? The closest diameter to this i'm able to find is RG174 at 0.110"/2.79mm which would probably work, but may be quite loose fitting in the strain relief jackets they go through.? I'm also assuming a 50ohm coax would be needed.

Any insight would be appreciated.

-Adam
Re: Old style oval HP power cords

 

Like others, I prefer to change these to regular IEC sockets and plugs on gear that I expect to keep for a long time. It's not too difficult to make the conversion. mostly needing a nibbling tool, a drill, and some files. That is, if there's enough room (panel area, depth, and clearance to internal parts). I think I've only had the space problem on a couple of pieces over the years, where you just have to leave it original. Another option is to just delete it and hard-wire a cord with a Heyco or grommet type attachment - the most compact and simple form of all. I prefer detachable, but I have plenty of gear that came with those dangling cords anyway, so it's not that big a deal.

I have a few of these old cords I keep for testing, and for a few pieces of gear that use them, until their turn comes up to get converted. My most recent was a HP741A, which had plenty of area, but the connector had to penetrate the outer cabinet and inner isolated shield structure, only contacting the right parts, so it was a bit tricky to work it over and get the required clearances. I always try to do it without major disassembly, relying on tricky methods instead.

Ed
Re: Opposite problem: disintegrating Old style Oval HP Receptacle ( ... was Old style oval HP power cords )

 

On 1/3/24 09:42, gren wrote:
-? Does anyone have a?? spare,? good condition ? or?? NOS? hp Oval receptacle ?
This one's in good shape. If you can stand the extra parts that come with it. $15 incl postage.
--
John

HP-oval-receptacle.jpg

Re: Wtb: power switch for 3335A or front panel

 

Edit: clarification¡­the aluminum casting is the panel part other than the switch that I need, as there is a chunk missing from the edge of mine. For a reasonable price I don¡¯t mind buying a whole panel and paying it forward and providing switches or keys to others cheap or free from the one it replaces.
Wtb: power switch for 3335A or front panel

 

I have a 3335A with a broken power switch. I have the key cap, and just need a compatible switch or for a reasonable price, a front panel. Does anyone have something around they¡¯d like to part with?

I¡¯m in Minnesota (US) and I can provide a prepaid shipping label you can print and tape to a box to make it quick and easy.
Re: Old style oval HP power cords

 

After you set up your pins/sockets on a nice new power cord, you can then use hot glue all around them to mold a new plug.? Coat the receptacle with a bit of grease for form release first, inject, let the hot glue solidify and then unplug your new cord....? Fairly safe, easy way to replicate unobtanium sockets for tubes, other things such as PMTs, etc.

On Wed, Jan 3, 2024 at 1:36?PM Jeremy Nichols <jn6wfo@...> wrote:
I have, in an emergency, crimped individual Molex-style female pins to the power cord wires, added shrink-tubing insulation, and then pushed the female pins onto the male pins of the connector in the HP chassis. This obviously requires knowledge of which wire goes to which pin, and I'd be nervous about letting anyone other than myself use that equipment¡ªbut it does work. I suppose you could also cast or 3D print a plug to surround those pins, thus duplicating the lost original cord.

Jeremy
N6WFO


On Wed, Jan 3, 2024 at 9:44?AM Greg Muir via <big_sky_explorer=[email protected]> wrote:

If you have the power cords with reversed hot/neutral that were commonplace for use on Friden calculators simply cut off the AC plug end and install a new one wired in reverse.? I seriously doubt if anyone will take the time to disassemble the cord and look for wire color errors in regards to the modification.

?

Simplicity at its best.

?

Way back when the word was starting to circulate that Belden was going to discontinue manufacturer of these cords I made a quantity buy.? And at that time the amount of HP and other equipment that was coming onto the surplus market was rife with these style power receptacles. Over the 45 years or so I have slowly eaten up the supply and now have only a couple left.? But the ~$6 per cord at that time was easy on the pocketbook.

?

Use of a modified IEC power cord is rather Draconian given the mis-fit of the round versus flat contacts.? Brute force when mating such an arrangement will most probably result in damage to the contacts or even break them away from their mounting inside the equipment receptacle.

?

Greg
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